What would you love to see in the next "infinite tower/dungeon"?

I have always liked PotD and HoH. I never really cared about Eureka or Ballzja but did them anyways. PotD and HoH is reminiscent to the times that I would play older RPGs including Star Ocean and go beyond the final boss, to truly challenge myself.

Personally I'm not sure what I would love to see in a new dungeon but could easily see how a dungeon of "creations" magick would come into play. What are your thoughts the next "infinite dungeon" will be like / what you would like to see? Of course this is assuming there will be one but let's assume there will be for the sake of discussion.

Personally I'd like some form of progression (beyond aetherpool). Perhaps not like leveling but like a macro progression of some kind. Perhaps an action system similar to bozja where you can have a load out of skills you take with you. I think they should be experimental with it. It's very similar to PotD/HoH, I'd probably just pass on it.

All I would like is to be able to purchase potions with gils instead of having to do any sort of "pre-farming".

Less floors. Slash them in half again and remove the boring middle section entirely. HoH was a step in the right direction, remove another 50 and it will be perfect.

Adding something akin to Lost Actions from Eureka/Bozja could be a cool addition.

Unlock them via. certain challenges/discoveries/puzzles/bosses etc. in the dungeon. Can mix and match what we take, different actions have different aetherpool costs, maximum amount of actions limited by overall aetherpool armor.

Not interested in carrying over the grinding/buying/selling them aspect of the Eureka-type areas though.

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I definitely don't want it to take place in Elpis or involve the Ancients. Ideally I'd like it to be in Ultima Thule and have the different sets of floors involve exploring more recreations of the dead worlds. Would let them add some potentially crazy Lost Actions too.

Something to allow more than just MCH, RDM, and the like to solo prog higher. Lost Actions could fill that purpose pretty well, though I'd rather they be entirely active, fun, and fairly minimalistic in the number of choices (not so many choices, but all good ones).

Some actual trash mechanics. More, and more varied environmental mechanics. More to progression that just unlocking a portal to the next floor.

Move away from the dull grid system. Fewer, larger, and far more unique floors.

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Originally Posted by Azuri

Less floors. Slash them in half again and remove the boring middle section entirely. HoH was a step in the right direction, remove another 50 and it will be perfect.

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To me I feel different. I always wanted a true feeling of an "infinite dungeon" where you would just get progressively stronger and stronger and reach higher and higher floors where no one has reached before. Of course, what is the point of going 1000 floors up I wonder? That I don't have an answer but I always had that kind of fantasy of trying a game like that to see how it would play out. Would at some point the floors look all glitchy and weird like you're breaking the matrix? Would the skills you have start to warp around and become overpowered and underpowered? Would there be crazy strategies needed to get passed such floors? We need something like "necromancer" for bragging rights but crazier. I think in the form of a trophy as well that you can put in your yard like "wow, whoever lives here is an insane player"

Would be cool to reuse the

Aetherscope and make that the deep dungeon.
We would dig deeper and encounter more lost souls and the "X0" floor boss can be the spirit of a previous enemy/NPC we have encountered, can be a friend testing our strength or a foe out for revenge. can be like we are finally putting the souls to rest. Throughout the floors we can be aided by the souls of comrades and the special polymanders can summon the souls of our lost friends while the normal ones can stay the same but add a few different effects such as one that enacts that same buff we get fighting Zenos at the end of MSQ a regen/raise that lasts the current 10 floors but you can only ever carry 1.

just some ideas

Agree that they could use something like the Bozjan lost actions instead of Pomanders, to give every job a fair chance on solo play.

Thematically, since PotD is going down and HoH is going up, this new one could be some sort of shifting horizontal labyrinth or something like that...

Personally after having many frustrating runs I'd like the following

-dcing when solo does not make you lose
-agreed with earlier statements in the thread. Make it so that soloing has a fair chance on every job, preferably with permanent upgrades as another form of progression
-traps and accursed hoards cannot be in the same room
-timer increased proportionately to the number of players and/or boss hp scaled to the number of players. Or some method of pausing the run like a limited save option.
-secret rooms with bonus items and no mimics. Think binding of isaac angel rooms
-make it so when solo reraise does not reset boss health
-potions buyable with gil
-guarentee an aetherpool upgrade every set of floors
-bestiary so as you progress you can learn what mobs do and learn scraps of lore for the deep dungeon.
-A coffer reroll pomander so you dont have a floor full of bronzes
-no more being targeted through the walls thanks

my personal preference, transformation and magicite, I'd like something equally strong to these. I absolutely loved them for the sense of power you got that you never quite got anywhere else in the game. Marching over traps like they were nothing as a manticore to bitch slap trash away, aoe vuln up as a succubus. Any magicite when you found a 4th and already had 3.
The odin magicite especially was pure catharsis, especially when you get to see Onra cleaved in half by zantetsuken after the previously mentioned death when soloing caused him to regain all his 2.4 million health (pre ew)
Whatever these super actions are, I'd like them to be effective vs bosses too.

I like the secret rooms and bestiary ideas, Recon.

Accursed hoard chests being replaced with secret room portals would be cool. Maybe the portals can have slightly different appearances as a hint of what lies beyond. Puzzle room, treasure room, boss room, etc.

I would like a mix of both PotD and HoH
bosses are good in potd but the enemies are kinda meh
while in HoH the bosses are dull and the enemies are insane especially the mimics

a little more rogue like stuff
probably move away from pomanders for most buffs and do something like Risk of rain or isaac where you just get infinitely stacking items

Logos idea is cool

Id also like it if you die you can re enter the set of floors you died on just to make prog a little easier forfeit sacks,aether levels and achievement of course

and yes PLEASE just let me buy the regen potions with Gil its not so bad with Potd by the time you get 99/99 and when you get to real floors you are rolling in them but HoH will suck you dry with regen potions and lesser potsherd rate

I think this idea might have been better for PotD but instead of magicite or manticore could summon NPC/Trust to help clear floors or bosses and some could have certain effects
like a Tank,Healer,A DPS/Debuffer
lets say its like a dark souls style summon sign you see on the floor occasionally

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Originally Posted by Recon1o6

-dcing when solo does not make you lose

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probably will never happen because it will be abused

Ugh those stupid Mimics... Mimics are super annoying! It's an RNG mechanic, not skill based. You could avoid having Mimics for the entire duration of your playthrough or you could always get them. It's not a good game design idea. It should at least be discernible. I agree, disconnecting is the worst part about PoTD and HoH. You could reach floor 179 and then poof, disconnected. Maybe your internet went out or the server had a hiccup. There goes like 4hrs of your time.

Chests should be organized by 9 floors. A total of x Bronze, x Silver and x Gold chests are scattered throughought said floors. That way, no more RNG on whether you had a good run or bad. Whether you get something good out of it is an entirely different story.

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Originally Posted by Eriane_Elis

Ugh those stupid Mimics... Mimics are super annoying! It's an RNG mechanic, not skill based.

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Those two things aren't mutually exclusive if there is even a single factor of context.

Is getting the mimic chance-based? Yes.
Did you unnecessarily take that chance when at low HP? Well, then that's also a skill issue to some degree.

I want a tower climb based off of the Floating City of Nym.

For starters, I'd like to borrow two ideas from Persona 3's Tartarus climb. First, you need a soundtrack that gradually intensifies as you get to higher floors. Second, you need a mob that shows up when players have spent too much time on a floor to chase them around, similar to P3's Grim Reaper. Nym has the perfect answer to that: the beloved Tonberry Stalker. Naturally, if he catches you, he stabs you and either kills you instantly or turns you into a tonberry, ending the run.

Rather than having floors and rez points open up from killing mobs, you can utilize Wanderer's Palace's system of using lantern oil as a 'currency' to open doors and activate devices. Perhaps, rather than carrying around stacks of buff items, a few of these could be linked to devices that give you a party buff (i.e. do I use 5 lamp oil to activate a station to give everyone a damage up buff for five minutes, or do I activate a different station elsewhere on the map that allows us to safely respawn?) In keeping with the theme, you could have a debuff floor that is 'low light' where you can only see short distances ahead, until you activate the lights for the floor. Nothing would be more terrifying than to go searching for the light, only to see an ominous small lamp turn on just behind you, revealing a Tonberry Stalker. Frantic chase ensues.

As an alternative to levelling up from scratch each run, they could opt for something similar to Lufia II's Ancient Cave's mechanic with temporary and permanent gear upgrades (i.e. have temporary in instance stat boosts that you get from drops and chests for the duration of the run, as well as the occasional permanent one that you get from special chests that can be used on subsequent runs as well).

As a reward for going for a solo hardmode run, there should be a unique boss guarding the final floor that you don't encounter under other difficulty settings.

Not losing when getting disconnected while solo would be nice, had to give up on trying for Necromancer because my internet is too unreliable.

Less RNG. i'm not a huge fan of pomanders, I'd rather have some kind of progression system where you can learn or buy spells and not have to worry about finding what you need every time. Traps that aren't entirely random, there could be obvious traps blocking awesome items or ways to disable them via exploration or puzzle solving.

More mechanics. They come up with all sorts of unique and interesting mechanics for raids, some could be used in a deep dungeon. There could be segments of walls that if you get too close will put a chain on you which debuffs you and requires moving far away to break which could lead you into a trap if not careful. Maybe a room with colored floor tiles and an indicator that tells you when a certain color or colors will explode. Lasers coming out of walls or bullet hell style hallways like in the Nier raid. There's a lot they could do.

Also exploration mechanics - find keys or levers or glyphs or codes to help you progress or get more loot, solve puzzles, etc. I'd rather have a much smaller focus on clearing floors in time and more focus on figuring out how to clear them, though there could be specific floors where it's all about rushing too just not all the time.

I think they should just almost entirely axe the Aetherpool system, currently it makes it so that doing even party clears early-on is exceedingly difficult but party clears later (once everyone has high/near max Aetherpool) just feel way easier, it kinda causes Heaven-on-High in particular to feel really underwhelming because it makes only the very top floors any real threat - the Aetherpool grind is especially miserable and tedious in Palace of the Dead

I'd like it a lot if there was a split Normal/Savage version with the former being solo-oriented and the latter being more party-oriented, somewhat like Palace of the Dead 1-100 vs. 101-200

also hope that if we get more leveling floors then they're designed more like Palace of the Dead 1-50 rather than 51-60 or Heaven-on-High 21-30, spamming the same ten floors over and over again for leveling is just absolutely miserable

As long as it has a challenging solo challenge I will like it :p

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Those two things aren't mutually exclusive if there is even a single factor of context.

Is getting the mimic chance-based? Yes.
Did you unnecessarily take that chance when at low HP? Well, then that's also a skill issue to some degree.

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No, because as a WHM you can't defeat a mimic without getting the debuff. You can't interrupt, you can only put things to sleep and mimics aren't affected by sleep or stun. Instead, WHM can heal more than before but at the cost of I think it was the water attack interrupt (was it an interrupt?). Interrupt is critically important in PotD particularly due to RNG moments. There is also the issue that you just defeated an entire monster treasure room and you get a mimic with no loot. Sometimes it's a mimic inside a mimic inside another mimic with no loot. Now that is awful luck!

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I digress....

I want to see less RNG overall where RNG is based on the layout of the floors. Maybe even, bigger floors! Perhaps a labyrinth type of environment? Make it more interesting than just "here's a room with maybe an enemy or a cast of enemies". Add traps that aren't just hidden away somewhere but things you can physically notice like a stepping stone or pressing the wrong wall switch etc... Make it more puzzle based fun.

Dungeons like these are meant to be like big adventures with friends or on your own but yet they never take full advantage of it. Anime has more interesting dungeon mechanics in the isekai genre than mmo's actually do. We need checkpoints, shops, things to discover, puzzles and other creative things! Just doing the same PotD and HoH isn't going to be appealing. And for the love of all that is good, give us 4 save slots! I'm tired of juggling between 2!