Redesign of Skill speed and Spell Speed into Haste

This is feedback/redesign is coming from World of Warcraft.

First, Is to merge Skill Speed and Spell Speed into a new stat call Haste. This would reduce the amount of materias in the item data base, and 2nd would already serves its purpose for what it is doing right now reducing GCD Cast Time and Recast.

The second part of this, which would make this new Haste stat interesting to some jobs, is to make it effect Dots and Hots. This is idea is from WoW. This would make Haste reduce the damage intervals of the Hot or Dot effect, ei, if you have 10% haste it would make your DoT or HoT tick down to 2.7 instead of 3 seconds. This essentially increases its "stat weight" while making it interesting

I agree with the idea of combining them however unlike wow ffxiv sks and sps increases the damage of your dots instead of reducing the time between ticks. How much it actually increases I have no idea but if it were significant you’d probably see bards stacking it.

Spell Speed already increases DOT damage, though by a rather minor amount.
It does not decrease the tick interval, and that'll probably never change.

I wouldn't mind a merge between skill and spell speed, we are long past the days when one class might require a bit of both.
Haste already exists as a stat, so it's implementation in the normal game mechanics should be easy, right? Perhaps SE wants to reserve it for places where you can become an unstoppable force if you grind the right gear? Eureka and Bozja both feature it and you can become rather uniquely powerful there, though I wouldn't say it's due to haste specifically.

Something to think about I guess, but I'd like to at the very least just have skill/spell speed be merged to uh... "speed" I guess.

Would definitely fix the BS Paladins have to go through having 8 spells every 60s unaffected by one substat.

Ill add on top of this though:
> similar to how dots do more damage at higher speed values, GCDs at the cap speed (1.5s) should instead increase the damage dealt by such actions rather than doing nothing.
[Affects] MCH Hypercharge, RDM Melee combo 1+2, RPR Enshroud combo, SGE Eukrasia spells

Agreed. There's no need for skill and spell speed to be separate stats at this point.

To be honest, SpS/SkS is a problematic stat in this game. It's either avoid like the plague because it misaligns elements of your rotation, or stack it to reach a specific breakpoint. It has the widest tier gaps, so you could have 80 stat wasted without realizing because you're just short of the next tier breakpoint. Too much of it creates double weaving issues, especially with poor latency.

I'm surprised they haven't removed it and replaced it with a new stat.

They teased us with a Haste stat back in Eureka.

I suspect that there's a technical limitation for this, but the interim fix would be to make it such that all actions on a single job are either classified as exclusively 'Weaponskills' or exclusively 'Spells'.

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First, Is to merge Skill Speed and Spell Speed into a new stat call Haste.

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Haste isn't really a new stat in FF - it's been around since FF3 (if I remember correctly) and was used in FF11 (the other FF MMO for those of you unaware of it) so I'd hardly say it's "coming from WoW" as something new. (I think some mobs also cast Haste on themselves in-game already too).

I do agree Haste would be a better stat that Spell Speed/Skill Speed. It would certainly be easier to manage but as noted, there is likely some technical reason why it's not used - possibly the way it would affect spells/skills? Maybe cause some strange imbalance? Who know's? (Well, the dev's I'm guessing).

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

To be honest, SpS/SkS is a problematic stat in this game. It's either avoid like the plague because it misaligns elements of your rotation, or stack it to reach a specific breakpoint. It has the widest tier gaps, so you could have 80 stat wasted without realizing because you're just short of the next tier breakpoint. Too much of it creates double weaving issues, especially with poor latency.

I'm surprised they haven't removed it and replaced it with a new stat.

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Certainly glad they haven't, though. It's the only stat, exempting Crit solely on Monk, that has any effect on our gameplay.

It needs just two things:

1. A third decimal point for GCD manipulation.
2. To affect anything not directly affected by an accelerated GCD at the same rate as Determination does. That includes both DoT damage and oGCDs that aren't generated through GCD-affected gauge, etc.

The benefits to merging the stats don't really seem like they outweigh the work involved on the dev's end, tho. Like. None of the arguments for it are really so convincing that they should change what they're doing. At worst, it's a minor inconvenience.

Not to go all slippery slope, but I'mma slippery slope here.

Why have STR/DEX/INT/MND when everything could just be "attack"?
Why have Crit/Det/DH when it could just be "extra attack"?
Why have the extra damage stats at all when they could be rolled into the base stat?
Why have the speed stats at all when you could roll the variance into base attack?



To a certain extent, some/much of this is simply designed to give the illusion of complexity. Sometimes it's just not very wise to look under the hood and break that illusion.

You don't think PLD and DRK being punished for absolutely no reason other than fluff compared to the other jobs available is worth merging the stats together...?

Honestly I'm of the mind that we probably SHOULD get rid of them wholesale, though. By in large they're just a noob trap and the tools the game gives you in game aren't really robust enough to make informed decisions about it regardless.

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Originally Posted by Icecylee

Honestly I'm of the mind that we probably SHOULD get rid of them wholesale, though. By in large they're just a noob trap

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So is Crit until X threshold and then anything but Crit thereafter. Let's not go the route of outright removing anything and everything presently non-optimal, let alone that which allows for a degree of actual gameplay customization, just to forgo the (very basic, in SkS/SpS's case) required effort of balancing them.

Extra crit's still giving you *something* though, even it's not optimal. Where as excess or too little skillspeed don't really do anything at all, other than potentially fucking up your rotation by desyncing the GCD from your cooldowns. I just don't think they really add anything meaningful to the game, as they are right now, and only really add annoyances to contend with. There's of course room for changing them in a way they *don't* do that, but given it's been this way since 2.0 I'm not super hopeful about it.

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Originally Posted by Icecylee

Extra crit's still giving you *something* though, even it's not optimal. Where as excess or too little skillspeed don't really do anything at all, other than potentially fucking up your rotation by desyncing the GCD from your cooldowns. I just don't think they really add anything meaningful to the game, as they are right now, and only really add annoyances to contend with. There's of course room for changing them in a way they *don't* do that, but given it's been this way since 2.0 I'm not super hopeful about it.

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Ideal, imo, would be the old Junctioning system suggestion (which goes back as early ARR): Have only 3 secondary stats, Haste, Determination, and Critical Hit, but allow them to be applied, by player choice, towards any of multiple purposes. Tenacity and Piety, for instance, would both be ways of using Determination, Critical Hit could be set towards Crit rate or Crit multiplier (preferable, generally, to those with auto-crits and less significant crit procs), separately, and one could set their Haste to give a certain GCD value (within reach) and put the rest of its affect towards DoT damage as not to push beyond that chosen value, with no effect on manipulable cooldowns or oGCD damage, etc. Etc., etc. Return crit proc mechanics to all jobs and, voila, you have secondary stats that actually offer some degree of customization, rather than just numbers.

That being said, SkS was also meta for top-end Monks in 2.x and SpS a plenty competitive option for BLMs despite expansions adding increasingly more damage to BLM's kit that doesn't scale with SpS. Its largest pitfall has merely been that it never got any sort of Crit treatment (in making it able to affect skills previously unaffected by crits, since its Det-lite scaling for areas not affected by the GCD was only ever applied to DoT damage, not to any oGCD damage) and MP/TP ticks not scaling with the GCD. They buffed Crit in HW. They buffed Det in EW. Only Sks/SpS have been left intentionally gutted for most jobs.