What's with this talk about Warrior outhealing healers in dungeons?

Seen some videos and read a couple claims of this happening and this sounds something that discourage people to play healers. Have SE by any chance already responded to this problem?

well, it seems warrior is the long awaited dmg healer

L M F A O.

SE solved the WHM 24 hr glare window issue.

There are plenty of things that discourage people from playing healers and I assure you WAR's self healing isn't even in the top 10.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rewd

There are plenty of things that discourage people from playing healers and I assure you WAR's self healing isn't even in the top 10.

---

This.

But yeah. WAR self healing is up there, going into dungeons without healers is pretty accessible.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LitheSuxman

Seen some videos and read a couple claims of this happening and this sounds something that discourage people to play healers. Have SE by any chance already responded to this problem?

---

Every healers prefer tanks like WAR because they don't need to heal them

WAR's have great self-sustain but they can't come close to actually outhealing any sort of semi-decent healers.

The biggest issue is dungeons hit like wet noodles when you aren't making mistakes and getting hit by mechanics, so even tank sustain is plenty to stay alive. This has been the case for a while now and PLD has been soloing dungeon bosses for years, it's just being highlighted more now that other tanks can do it.

Healers only exist to mop up after mistakes. Not to have fun or play an engaging and exciting role, that's for dps. Outside of that they just exist to be on standby incase a mistake happens so dps can continue to have fun. Sometimes everyone except the tank dies but the tank doesn't make mistakes and therefore doesn't need the healer to babysit.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

WAR's have great self-sustain but they can't come close to actually outhealing any sort of semi-decent healers.

The biggest issue is dungeons hit like wet noodles when you aren't making mistakes and getting hit by mechanics, so even tank sustain is plenty to stay alive. This has been the case for a while now and PLD has been soloing dungeon bosses for years, it's just being highlighted more now that other tanks can do it.

Healers only exist to mop up after mistakes. Not to have fun or play an engaging and exciting role, that's for dps. Outside of that they just exist to be on standby incase a mistake happens so dps can continue to have fun. Sometimes everyone except the tank dies but the tank doesn't make mistakes and therefore doesn't need the healer to babysit.

---

Drk would say other wise about dungeon enemies hitting like wet noodles. And War has been soloing trials for years.

I’m glad we have alternatives to 0 damage whm now

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IdowhatIwant

Drk would say other wise about dungeon enemies hitting like wet noodles. And War has been soloing trials for years.

---

F's in the chat for DRK.

Poor, poor DRK.

This simply isnt true, just level a healer, Bloodwhetting CD is 25 seconds and only lasts 4GCD meaning any dmg outside of that they could die from and from trash thats pretty quickly. When I heal a warrior I get a break for like 4 glare casts then they need to be spam healed like every other tank. The only time they can self sustain is on bosses with weak attacks between tank busters.

oh no. WAR are self sustainable on :gasp: dungeons, the most difficult and important content of them all. how could they have launched EW with this game breaking balance issue.

In the situation where Warrior is the only one left, or together with another tank who knows how to use his migitations, as long as there is not something that just outright one-hit the Warrior or deal too much damage within a 25s window, the Warrior will continue to live till the inevitable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LitheSuxman

Seen some videos and read a couple claims of this happening and this sounds something that discourage people to play healers. Have SE by any chance already responded to this problem?

---

I don't know about WAR outhealing healers in dungeons where the dps would constantly stand in shit (i.e, where there was actually a fair bit of healing required), but if I trusted the DPS, then I didn't bother bringing healers to dungeon spam when leveling a Warrior, if that's any indication.

With some good DPS, yourself, and the WAR. You don't really need to heal too much on trash pulls in comparison to other tanks. Mostly you can just freely spam holy, and the like. Outhealing the whole dungeon? Not really, since you have to still heal everyone during boss fights.

It's good way to show how the devs don't know what the jobs even are. Pal need 5o be a self healer and war top dps of tank. DRK to be top aoe and Gb fastest and having more long range. But we got some stupid things like self healing war.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SamsaraTrickstar

But we got some stupid things like self healing war.

---

Warrior literally started as the self-sustain tank. It's always been the self-sustain tank. It's never been defined by being "top dps" (its OT damage was less than PLD's in ARR, and it still had very little lead in HW once gaining its non-tanking bonus stance), only by being the hardy self-sustain tank.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Genbe197

This simply isnt true, just level a healer, Bloodwhetting CD is 25 seconds and only lasts 4GCD meaning any dmg outside of that they could die from and from trash thats pretty quickly. When I heal a warrior I get a break for like 4 glare casts then they need to be spam healed like every other tank. The only time they can self sustain is on bosses with weak attacks between tank busters.

---

spam heal? i have leveled 3 healers to 90, sch, whm and sage (working on astro now) as well as leveled tank. the only time i had to “spam heal” a tank is when they didn’t use any CDs. not even a drk do i have to spam heals. in fact, i rarely have to heal the tank at all outside of OGCD heals. if you have to spam heals, there is another issue you either don’t see or refuse to see

edit: i also play healers in EX trials and still rarely heal tanks lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Genbe197

This simply isnt true, just level a healer, Bloodwhetting CD is 25 seconds and only lasts 4GCD meaning any dmg outside of that they could die from and from trash thats pretty quickly. When I heal a warrior I get a break for like 4 glare casts then they need to be spam healed like every other tank. The only time they can self sustain is on bosses with weak attacks between tank busters.

---

I will say this when my friend leveled their warrior they opted out to not have us bring a healer and we did fine. Healers are optional.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Genbe197

This simply isnt true, just level a healer, Bloodwhetting CD is 25 seconds and only lasts 4GCD meaning any dmg outside of that they could die from and from trash thats pretty quickly. When I heal a warrior I get a break for like 4 glare casts then they need to be spam healed like every other tank. The only time they can self sustain is on bosses with weak attacks between tank busters.

---

Shake it off does aoe heal now, and equilibrium gives regen as well. EW boss's tank buster only take 1/4 of hp bar with cd. Still viable to solo.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LitheSuxman

Seen some videos and read a couple claims of this happening and this sounds something that discourage people to play healers. Have SE by any chance already responded to this problem?

---

It does discourage healers from playing. I'm a healer main. Been one for years. I despise doing dungeons. I actually don't do them almost at all. Because I'm usually with a tank who just heals themselves with no problems and there's no point in being there. I'm a healer. I'd like to heal. This game severely limits what I can even do if I want to heal. If I wanted to dps all the time I'D BE A DPS.

Healers have DPS and healing spells. If you get a tank that is able to keep him/herself alive then this means you can DPS more.

Let's be honest how often do you not get to heal when playing with randoms?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Laerune

Healers have DPS and healing spells. If you get a tank that is able to keep him/herself alive then this means you can DPS more.

Let's be honest how often do you not get to heal when playing with randoms?

---

far too often unfortunately. The average is estimated to be 60-85% of all spells cast by a healer to be damage spells. The higher, the lower difficulty of the duty

Did panademonium and zodiark extreme yesterday blind both times. Neither time me or the other healer had to heal the tank until they fudged a mechanic. Kardia and paladin/warrior sustain is that good. Any healing I had to do to them was raidwide stuff that required an ogcd then back to dosis spam.
Even when we were having to constantly pick up stupid dps off the floor, I still barely healed the tank. The only time I did heal the tank was when I got a dark knight vs zodiark. Even then that was a mere ixochole once every 30s
One of those fights i actually forgot to put kardia on. The Warrior did not need healing even as all the dps and the other healer kept dying over and over again

levelling dungeons? well i did need to heal when the gnb fat fingered superbolide.


As another poster in this thread said earlier, there's lots of reasons not to play healer in ff14 nowadays and the fact that healers basically aren't needed speaks volumes.

I'm confused as to why people are bringing it up now.
You could do the same as a War in ShB.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LitheSuxman

Seen some videos and read a couple claims of this happening and this sounds something that discourage people to play healers. Have SE by any chance already responded to this problem?

---

Bloodwhetting needs a nerf tbh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NightHour

Bloodwhetting needs a nerf tbh.

---

I mean sure, nerf it to the state NF was in in ShB, you'll see not much changes we've had that kind of selfsustain for a while now and no one complained. It's actually WARs identity for a long time now.
I think the real culprit ist that DRK right now sucks with their defensives, so rather than asking to nerf another tank how about we stick with buffing DRK defensives because they desperately need it.

At some point we'll need to accept that jobs are not balanced around dungeons. Casual content just doesnt need job balance, it's ex trials and up where job balance becomes necessary. So yes, warrior is op in dungeons but that is also not very relevant.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Saraide

At some point we'll need to accept that jobs are not balanced around dungeons. Casual content just doesnt need job balance, it's ex trials and up where job balance becomes necessary. So yes, warrior is op in dungeons but that is also not very relevant.

---

warrior and pld have op healing in ex trials too, hydaelin ex has been completed without healers the healing is so strong

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Recon1o6

warrior and pld have op healing in ex trials too, hydaelin ex has been completed without healers the healing is so strong

---

I mean ucob was cleared with all tanks. Stuff like this extends back to HW. I don't know why some players want us to be able to do less cool stuff though. To stupid stuff like that is part of the fun.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Caurcas

I don't know why some players want us to be able to do less cool stuff though. To stupid stuff like that is part of the fun.

---

Probably because doing it within two weeks of the expansion launching makes a role that already has some serious issues feel even worse to play. It's like rubbing salt in the wounds.

Healers have had their complaints/issues be largely ignored for the last expansion by the devs, and now two weeks after the expac drops people are clearing EX trials without them, showing that the complaints continued to be ignored in the fight's design process.

It's especially bad given the following:

Quote:

---

“We have been trying to make it so that healers are required to perform more heals. The content damage that you are receiving becomes a little more intense, so that healers are a bit more busy,” said Yoshida in the interview, via a live translator. “We are trying to make it so that healers are working a bit harder to do more heals in a battle encounter for sure, and that is kind of the trend that we are trending towards.”

---

Imagine if in the last expansion:

• You got heavily nerfed the last expansion (removal of DPS abilities across the board)
• The devs skip over your slide in the live letter
• You're given abilities you didn't need more of (more healing spells we don't really need to use)
• You're told you couldn't get a new class because they couldn't balance your role properly (again)
• The devs ignore any/all your complaints in live letters
• The one time they do bring it up it's for a passing mention while DPS classes gets slides and minutes of discussion about their woes

And now for this expansion, when they promise harder healing so you can finally feel like a healer instead of a gimped DPS you have people clearing EX trials within two weeks without you. It just feels demoralizing.

in dungeons, warriors basically have invicibility for 6/8 seconds on a 25 cooldown.

To be fair, tanks should be out mitigating healers. Healers really shouldn't have to heal very much at all if the rest of the team is playing properly.

A healers job is to heal unavoidable damage and heal through what the tank can't mitigate. It's not to babysit the team that can't or won't do mechanics.

A tank with healing mitigation should have more overall healing than a healer. It means they're doing their job.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Saimeren

To be fair, tanks should be out mitigating healers. Healers really shouldn't have to heal very much at all if the rest of the team is playing properly.

A healers job is to heal unavoidable damage and heal through what the tank can't mitigate. It's not to babysit the team that can't or won't do mechanics.

A tank with healing mitigation should have more overall healing than a healer. It means they're doing their job.

---

If that's the case, imagine how it feels to have only 3 DPS buttons.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rewd

There are plenty of things that discourage people from playing healers and I assure you WAR's self healing isn't even in the top 10.

---

Not sure how you can assure that. Looking at FF logs warrior is over double from the non-healer second place. Healers are all above it, obviously, but it's far ahead of the rest.

*Sad DRK noises*

It's fine, let us keep doing cool off the wall stuff. Nothing is going to take your role away given the average player skill in 14.

I queued into smiledon the other day, and after loading in I started sneezing and needed to blow my nose. When I got back to the game the warrior tank had done a W2W by himself and was healing himself to full the entire time. I just kind of stood there for a second and thought to myself "why am I even here?"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shalan

[*]You're told you couldn't get a new class because they couldn't balance your role properly (again)

---

It should be obvious to everyone by now that he only tells you half-truths, but busting out with Sage did sting a little.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by godvivec

Not sure how you can assure that. Looking at FF logs warrior is over double from the non-healer second place. Healers are all above it, obviously, but it's far ahead of the rest.

---

Because it doesn't matter if our tanks were a GNB and DRK, who are the the lowest on tank healing on fflogs, we'd still be spamming our 1 dps button over and over and healing with a few oGCD's because nothing does damage unless the group are making mistakes.