The UGLY side of FFXIV

Pickup groups for Ifrit.


That is all.

I had so much fun getting kicked from PUGs for not living long enough...

And then I turned down my background graphics, drawing quality, and shadow effects under the FFXIV Config Launcher and got all my ifrit weapons promptly there after.

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Originally Posted by Kijimuna

Pickup groups for Ifrit.


That is all.

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dont you mean pickup groups in general

then again, that can be said about any moo, alwaysugly to run with random people

heheh I've never been kicked. I just hate to see all the mudslinging and tempers flaring. Egos and attitudes can really ruin a good game

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Originally Posted by Kijimuna

Pickup groups for Ifrit.


That is all.

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It might just be me, but I've been fairly lucky with pick-up groups. My main problem is that they tend to end too fast.

I used to ride into the cave and demand a pt from the players standing around waiting on timer.

This actually worked on a number of occasions and one of the pt's that invite me gave me what is now my primary AV speed run end game linkshell.

There is always a glimmer of hope.

Matsume, that's awesome!

On Ifrit? Heck I just silence PT chat completely and go in with no gear on.

pick up ANYTHING for ANYTHING is awesome provided its a blm burn. hard to fuck up a blm burn.

Most parties I do are at least half pug because sometimes it's hard to get a full 8 LS people together for one thing. Some pugs are good though, even better than LS groups I've had.

lol...I can't help myself

All pugs are equal, but some pugs are more equal than others...

I can't stand pick up groups. In my experience, if the first time you try something with a pick up group and you don't win, half the group ends up leaving. I'll wait for hours to get a whole group of LS mates before I'll think about forming a pick up group.

Are players gimp if they choose not to join endgame linkshells? Am I to be labeled with the worst if I'm not part of some elite group?

Not all players you pick up in PUGs are bad players, so let's dispel that myth please.

I find it kind of funny to label randoms as anything.

Aren't we all randoms to each other? Labeling it as "certain something" (good or bad) just doesn't make sense...

So you partied with some randoms and lost? So what? It's just a game, try again and see that you will do better no matter who you party with.

If someone doesn't play as good as you why not teach them?

I love partying with randoms and NEVER did I run into an "evil random who ruined my game"...
I guess I'm just lucky!

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Originally Posted by Kijimuna

heheh I've never been kicked. I just hate to see all the mudslinging and tempers flaring. Egos and attitudes can really ruin a good game

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I've had some awesome PUG's but yesterday I had the worst one I have had in any MMO I have played, not because we couldn't complete Hamlet, but because one elitist D**** decided to blame everyone else (mudslinging came quick and fast after the first insult was thrown).

It was both funny and annoying at the same time.

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Originally Posted by Razzle

I find it kind of funny to label randoms as anything.

Aren't we all randoms to each other? Labeling it as "certain something" (good or bad) just doesn't make sense...

So you partied with some randoms and lost? So what? It's just a game, try again and see that you will do better no matter who you party with.

If someone doesn't play as good as you why not teach them?

I love partying with randoms and NEVER did I run into an "evil random who ruined my game"...
I guess I'm just lucky!

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To be fair, there are some serious sociological ramifications to going with an established group and a random group that have nothing to do with the individual skills of the players. Established groups will have a predetermined hierarchy, while random groups will vie for power. Similarly, established groups will have a sense of group loyalty. Namely, they know that there are consequences to their behavior. While in a random group, those consequences are less easily defined.

That isn't to say you won't find the occasional horrific linkshell group, or spectacular random group. I myself tend to go with random groups more often than not, since my schedule is chaotic and I often cannot make it to linkshell events. But there are valid reasons why pick up groups tend to be less competent.

That being said, I happen to agree with you more than the OP. Pick up groups are the life blood of any MMO, otherwise there is only stagnation.

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Originally Posted by Denmo

Are players gimp if they choose not to join endgame linkshells? Am I to be labeled with the worst if I'm not part of some elite group?

Not all players you pick up in PUGs are bad players, so let's dispel that myth please.

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I WILL ostrecise you sir!

I did enjoy the one pickup we got for our Ifrit run(7 LS 1 Random). Guy came in calling shots telling people what to do and when to do it and was saying "I don't want this to be a complete fail!" At the end of the fight the grand result was NOBODY in the run except said guy was hit by anything aside from vulcan burst and 2 hr. He died a total of 3 or 4 times.

Even after that he continued to spew out orders and try to tell us what to do. :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Denmo

Are players gimp if they choose not to join endgame linkshells? Am I to be labeled with the worst if I'm not part of some elite group?

Not all players you pick up in PUGs are bad players, so let's dispel that myth please.

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Its not that they are bad players, its just that they are almost always a bad team. In a linkshell teamwork is basically required, but in a pug individuals have a hard time working as a team because they cannot acknowledge a leader. Everyone is smarter than everyone, and everyone knows how to play everyone's job better than everyone else, so any possible adjustments an ls could easily make are simply arguments and flame wars for pugs. This is why ppl say pugs are generally terrible. There is no cohesion precisely because no one wants to be told what to do by someone else. When you are a part of a linkshell, you all have that guy who will give orders and you accept that. Its part of running with a linkshell, a hierarchy. There is no hierarchy in pugs, so its just a flame-war filled with "ima do it my way." Too much hubris leads to no teamwork, that is a pug's most common affliction.

That being said ive had some great pugs, but I have ppl in my ls who swear up, down, and sideways they will never touch a pug ever again.

yesterday i did a pug and it was a mess.. but.. it was also extreme fun, the fight became so challenging i was having a lot of fun in a fight i usually farm with my LS and nothing goes wrong. felt new. PS we won anyways

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

Its not that they are bad players, its just that they are almost always a bad team. In a linkshell teamwork is basically required, but in a pug individuals have a hard time working as a team because they cannot acknowledge a leader. Everyone is smarter than everyone, and everyone knows how to play everyone's job better than everyone else, so any possible adjustments an ls could easily make are simply arguments and flame wars for pugs. This is why ppl say pugs are generally terrible. There is no cohesion precisely because no one wants to be told what to do by someone else. When you are a part of a linkshell, you all have that guy who will give orders and you accept that. Its part of running with a linkshell, a hierarchy. There is no hierarchy in pugs, so its just a flame-war filled with "ima do it my way." Too much hubris leads to no teamwork, that is a pug's most common affliction.

That being said ive had some great pugs, but I have ppl in my ls who swear up, down, and sideways they will never touch a pug ever again.

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It's easy for those who have the option to swear PUGs off. Those outside of endgame linkshells must fend for themselves however.

From my experiences, everyone looks to the party leader to expect to know what he/she's doing. If you form a group and don't know what you're doing, your group tends to fall apart even if everyone is helpful from the beginning. But if you know what you're doing, take charge, and threaten those that would rather act like buttholes with a swift /kick from the group, generally things go more smoothly.

I say, put up with PUGs. But don't put up with assholes. Eventually they'll learn their lesson after the Nth time getting kicked from a group. FFXI forced players to learn the hard way. XIV not so much, which is why it's up to the party leader to take a hard stance if the situation calls for it. Don't reward bad players.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

Its not that they are bad players, its just that they are almost always a bad team. In a linkshell teamwork is basically required, but in a pug individuals have a hard time working as a team because they cannot acknowledge a leader. Everyone is smarter than everyone, and everyone knows how to play everyone's job better than everyone else, so any possible adjustments an ls could easily make are simply arguments and flame wars for pugs. This is why ppl say pugs are generally terrible. There is no cohesion precisely because no one wants to be told what to do by someone else. When you are a part of a linkshell, you all have that guy who will give orders and you accept that. Its part of running with a linkshell, a hierarchy. There is no hierarchy in pugs, so its just a flame-war filled with "ima do it my way." Too much hubris leads to no teamwork, that is a pug's most common affliction.

That being said ive had some great pugs, but I have ppl in my ls who swear up, down, and sideways they will never touch a pug ever again.

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This!

I'd also like to add that ls parties usually have better communication tools such as vent and mumble which help when giving out orders. But PUG's that can get organized usually fair well and is a great way to meet new people!

Yes. I know I'm not a good tank, but how can I get better if I don't experience it.

I run screaming from them. Sure there can be good players in pickup groups, but there never seem to be eight of them.

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Originally Posted by Gramul

Yes. I know I'm not a good tank, but how can I get better if I don't experience it.

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I know it is a hard learning curve for tank if he had to do the content with PUG. My best advice is get a LS and ask them to do the content so you can learn tanking it.

pickup groups are horrid. I got kicked from my group cause i wasnt a black mage and apparently it was my fault everyone was dying lol.

Was just in an exp PUG.

It seemed pretty lousy to start. We were a noob group getting guided through Natalan to the wolf camp, many for the first time. Not to mention one of our members couldn't speak english. We died several times just trying to get to the camp. and then when it started no one seemed to know what was going on save for 2-3 people.

BUT it turned into something pretty good! The group leaders - the ones who knew what they were doing - were fairly patient with us learners and gave instructions when someone was doing something wrong, rather than spouting insults. After a while we all got adjusted to the pacing and what was expected of us. Gained around 4 levels each in our late 40s.

This just adds to my belief that with patience, instructions, and good leadership, even the worst PUG can turn around for the better.

Edit: Oh, and I learned an ass-ton about endgame tanking, too. Thanks Marth~~~