Theoretically speaking, could the Warrior of Light...

... simply choose not to die? The alternative being they continue existing either as a standalone soul (e.g Unukalhai, Cylva/Cyella) or an Ascian-like being (e.g Minfilia, ...Zenos?)?

Maybe they're not at that level of Echo "mastery" yet (like Zenos boasts before the Shinryu fight) but... if Minfilia could do it then I don't see a reason our own character couldn't, right?

And I say theoretically because anyone reaching the end of their natural lifespan is so hilariously irrelevant in this game where time just has no meaning. But I'd been wondering...

Leaving aside the issue of plot armor, and how the WoL will never be in serious danger of getting killed off because of the nature of the game.....

Unukalhai, Cyella, Ardbert's team, and the Sahagin high priest (remember him?) all learn how to body surf from the Ascians (directly from Elidibus, except for possibly Cyella; I don't remember if it's ever stated who taught her). Presumably, if we were to learn how, we could do it too. The problem is that the only living Ascians we know of right now are Gaia and Fandaniel. Gaia rejected her Ascian side and probably wouldn't go for it, and Fandaniel is nuts.

Zenos is.....an odd example. By all indications, he didn't know he would survive his suicide either. We'll probably need more info on just what the hell he is now before we can figure out if his method would work for us. (We could debate that his Resonant power isn't quite the same as our Echo, but it's probably close enough to fall under most of the same rules.) Maybe being the descendant of an unsundered Ascian had something to do with it.

Minfilia's soul survived by the direct intervention of Hydaelyn, so she's not really comparable here.

Are Cyella and Unukalhai actually body surfing at all? I was under the impression they're both like the Scions were on the First, souls without bodies

As for the topic itself I wasn't even thinking like in a violent context, just... one day the WoL decides they don't want to die of old age or whatever lol

Technically the echo IS us refusing to die. We saw a future that killed us, and got stronger, and did something else instead.

The Warrior of Light does not, inherently, have any ways to cheat death. But they have a lot of ways to make a few calls.

Since Ardbert's soul joined with ours, we may be able to live on as a soul reflexively, if we had to do it. It's ultimately, and intrinsically, a power of the Echo. Our body would still die, but we could at the very least pull an Ardbert. Tangible soul body able to channel to the Echo to restore vitality unless overwhelmed with aether ala Blade of Light or similar power... Blade of Alisaie.

We could even snatch bodies like an Ascian, since that too is a power of the Echo. We just wouldn't because we're the good guy.

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Originally Posted by Vyrerus

Since Ardbert's soul joined with ours, we may be able to live on as a soul reflexively, if we had to do it. It's ultimately, and intrinsically, a power of the Echo. Our body would still die, but we could at the very least pull an Ardbert. Tangible soul body able to channel to the Echo to restore vitality unless overwhelmed with aether ala Blade of Light or similar power... Blade of Alisaie.

We could even snatch bodies like an Ascian, since that too is a power of the Echo. We just wouldn't because we're the good guy.

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We actually may not have the power of possession, since that seems to be one of the various 'relatively special abilities' of the Echo that not everybody has. We've seen people with the echo die and not live on as a spirit (RIP Ysayle, who deserves much better), it's actually only the Sahagin Priest and Zenos that actually have the powers of possession. Also, if every Echo-user had the power to live on as a spirit, just by law of large numbers we'd have at least a couple more non-Ascian immortal spirits kicking around.

Of course, the question of if any Echo-user that hasn't already died has the power of possession is... kinda unanswerable, because I don't think anyone wants to run the only test that would work for that!

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

We actually may not have the power of possession, since that seems to be one of the various 'relatively special abilities' of the Echo that not everybody has. We've seen people with the echo die and not live on as a spirit (RIP Ysayle, who deserves much better), it's actually only the Sahagin Priest and Zenos that actually have the powers of possession. Also, if every Echo-user had the power to live on as a spirit, just by law of large numbers we'd have at least a couple more non-Ascian immortal spirits kicking around.

Of course, the question of if any Echo-user that hasn't already died has the power of possession is... kinda unanswerable, because I don't think anyone wants to run the only test that would work for that!

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Minfilia also had the power of possession, but she liked to give her hosts choice and autonomy while giving them her power. If she were evil and self-serving she could have taken Ryne's body for herself.

As far as having other, non-Ascian spirits live on... see Tenzen. See Ramza. We do have them. They're just not common, as befits something special.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

We actually may not have the power of possession, since that seems to be one of the various 'relatively special abilities' of the Echo that not everybody has. We've seen people with the echo die and not live on as a spirit (RIP Ysayle, who deserves much better), it's actually only the Sahagin Priest and Zenos that actually have the powers of possession. Also, if every Echo-user had the power to live on as a spirit, just by law of large numbers we'd have at least a couple more non-Ascian immortal spirits kicking around.

Of course, the question of if any Echo-user that hasn't already died has the power of possession is... kinda unanswerable, because I don't think anyone wants to run the only test that would work for that!

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You're right, Ysayle did deserve so much better....

As to your other point though, Cyella's managed to live in Norvrandt for like a century after the whole Shadowkeeper business without anyone catching on seemingly, so who's to say there aren't non-Ascian immortal spirits kicking around?

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Originally Posted by Vyrerus

As far as having other, non-Ascian spirits live on... see Tenzen. See Ramza. We do have them. They're just not common, as befits something special.

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... oh I hadn't thought of them, good point! Even if they used it to become padlocks I guess it's still the same power, right?

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

We actually may not have the power of possession, since that seems to be one of the various 'relatively special abilities' of the Echo that not everybody has. We've seen people with the echo die and not live on as a spirit (RIP Ysayle, who deserves much better), it's actually only the Sahagin Priest and Zenos that actually have the powers of possession. Also, if every Echo-user had the power to live on as a spirit, just by law of large numbers we'd have at least a couple more non-Ascian immortal spirits kicking around.

Of course, the question of if any Echo-user that hasn't already died has the power of possession is... kinda unanswerable, because I don't think anyone wants to run the only test that would work for that!

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I mean, Ysalye didn't have anyone to teach her. I think it's an aspect of the Echo that you have to be taught to use.

And if it's a power level thing, Azem was a Convocation member, so I would assume WoL's Echo power level is roughly equivalent to the other sundered Convocation members, and more then strong enough to possess people, assuming they knew how and wanted to for some reason.

Even the weaker black masks can possess corpses.

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Originally Posted by atheistcanuck

I mean, Ysalye didn't have anyone to teach her. I think it's an aspect of the Echo that you have to be taught to use.

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Then who taught Zenos? Because nobody likes that guy. And him keeping on with it was a surprise to Elidibus, who I have to imagine is generally keeping track of things.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

Then who taught Zenos? Because nobody likes that guy. And him keeping on with it was a surprise to Elidibus, who I have to imagine is generally keeping track of things.

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Zenos is not normal in any stretch of the imagination.

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Originally Posted by atheistcanuck

Zenos is not normal in any stretch of the imagination.

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So, you're saying that Zenos had an innate technique for possession rather than it being a default thing everyone with the Echo can do.

Which is, you know. The thing I said.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

So, you're saying that Zenos had an innate technique for possession rather than it being a default thing everyone with the Echo can do.

Which is, you know. The thing I said.

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there's a difference between 'can do automatically' and 'can do with training'

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

Then who taught Zenos? Because nobody likes that guy.

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To offer an answer probably more ingenuous than your question warrants, perhaps Aulus mal Asina?
Though he does seem surprised when the WOL manages to take back their body in his boss fight.