Hello, long story short I'm spending the last couple of months before expac gearing and leveling SAM as I will be maining it in EW. I'm currently 77 and still have to get shoha at 80 and I'm feeling button bloat. Is there any useful macros that can help with this?
SAM macros?
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10-05-2021, 01:30 AMRinaBSAM macros?
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10-05-2021, 02:11 AMArkdraNo. Macro's are almost always a detriment and while there are a couple of exceptions, none of them apply to samurai.Quote:
Originally Posted by RinaB
The problem with combat macros is that they don't buffer. Buffering means that the game can kinda pre-register your input to make sure it goes off the exact split-second it becomes available. This is also the thing that enables slide-casting. Macro'd abilities do not buffer. As such, anything you macro builds inherent delay and leads to dps loss.
The couple of exceptions for this were dropping ground targetted aoe's centered on your target and maybe the odd mouseover macro. I used to have a mouseover macro for Goad back when that was still a thing and I do still have a shukuchi macro on nin, but that's it. -
10-05-2021, 02:22 AMRinaB
Hmm...that's unfortunate as I play on ps4p.
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10-05-2021, 03:21 AMKahnomI play on ps4 as well and yes, SAM got a bit of buttons bloat but still manageable.Quote:
Originally Posted by RinaB
You might not have enough room for some self-heal role actions but that's ok.
Also don't put merciful eyes on your hot bar. that skill is even more useless than MNK's Anatman.
And to answer your question, Don't use Macros. -
10-05-2021, 04:36 AMDarkstride
As the other person said, macros for combat abilities as DPS are typically going to be detrimental.
Are you using the expanded cross-hotbar options? I find that to be sufficient for all of my jobs. -
10-05-2021, 07:34 AMJiyuni
As a fellow controller player I have no issue with button space for SAM. As Darkstride pointed out, you have expanded cross-hotbar and double tap for what you cant fit on the two normal cross hotbars. Work to Game on youtube has great controller setup guides.
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10-05-2021, 09:56 PMHollyJollyMacros are good
I have macros for all my jobs except white mage.
You won't find a guide on them really since majority of ppl will just tell you "macros in combat are bad" and if you pursue it further they become enraged for no reason.
I use macros because instead of having 9 buttons to push I'll combine the ones that can be combined together to make 1-2-3 buttons.
My monk went from 16 buttons down to 5 buttons for damage attacks.
I macroed fan dance into my dancer's buttons so everytime fan dance is up itll cast itself automatically without me having to push a button.
I macroed my dark knights attacks so I only have 3 buttons, 1 for melee, 1 for range and 1 for aoe. With the shields and stuff combined into 2 other buttons so I just have 5 buttons I need to push to tank.
Its so much easier then having so many buttons, but people hate you if you do it because they are haters for no reason.
Macros follow a 1 second design meaning ur macros can only be in full seconds. 1, 2, 3, 4 seconds before it will start the next skill.
So if my skill speed is 2.5 then I need to macro the next ability to 3. Don't forget to account for server lag, which might make ur 2.5 actually a 3.5, but it varies you can test them to find out what works best.
My alternative to using macros for skills was to just not use the skill. Basically anything over an 8-10 button range and I'd just not push it because really who cares.
So using macros for me means instead of not pushing it, the macro automatically pushes it for me when its ready so I think thats better. Also I seem to do alot more damage now then before so people don't really complain to me when I'm in a group.
Anyway, they are really useful, but I couldn't find guides on it so I had to work it out on my own. Makes the game more fun for me since I'm not always looking at what buttons I have to push and getting hit by everything :)
Also like to add I got the idea of macroing skills together from the PVP buttons where sometimes they do 2 skills together, which really made alot of sense. -
10-05-2021, 10:02 PMRinaB
Its def notba cross bar issue for me its mostly about optimization. I have separate bars to monitor my other crossbar cds etc. I removed merciful eyes as stated above because the heal is such trash and im typically topped up pretty quick after an aoe so that helped a bit. Shoha feels underwhelming but im obviously gonna use it and keep it. I suppose I will just keep playing and slowly move some buttons around into the most optimal positions for myself.
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10-05-2021, 10:26 PMGarnixPeople online will basically never encourage sub-optimal playstyles. On most forums about pretty much any game, people will encourage playing optimally. And yup, that means: no macro.Quote:
Originally Posted by HollyJolly
I am sure you can have a better DPS output with macros than some bad players do without macros to be honest.
That said...I would be very curious to see your macros. How do they handle downtimes and things like that? -
10-05-2021, 10:44 PMAcece
Unless you have a mod macros feel terrible to play with. Would not recommend.
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10-05-2021, 10:58 PMssunny2008Nobody is a hater, but there are a bunch of reasons why macros are bs.Quote:
Originally Posted by HollyJolly
You´ll lose a bunch of time where you clearly don´t do anything, which means you´re losing DPS. This means that any boss, add, whatever takes way more time to die. This means you might fail a quest or hinder the whole grp.....
There is no reason to use a macro outside of crafters. Even rezz macros don´t work properly sometimes.
Tbh... i just did a short spy action and you´ve only like 60% GCD uptime on DNC / MNK. And both with multiple mistakes like "Bootshine was not used from behind or was unbuffed", the strongest skill on MNK. Or your standard finish on DNC was only up like ~50%. If that´s your macro-play, then you shouldn´t play any DPS class. It´s always better to practice a job at a dummy instead of losing like 30-40% DPS for a lazy reason.
And seriously, i´ll never get that "it´s so much easier" attitude. What´s the point in playing games, when you just press one button meanwhile watching how your character performs 10 skills in a row?
Ppl don´t complain, because they either have no ACT running or just because of the reason, that you can get banned if you moan about others DPS.Quote:
Originally Posted by HollyJolly
It´s up to you, if you´re fine with it. But you do nothing else but hindering yourself from getting better and all others who play with you. (And the 2nd part is everything else but fair. 100% some guys sitting in Discord like "Uuuhh she is not doing any damage. 10minutes more in this dungeon, really thx.") -
10-05-2021, 11:30 PMHollyJollyThis guy complaining about buttons, not damage. Macros gonna help with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by RinaB
You guys with ur imaginary % numbers and stuff are just making things up to hurt people who genuinely ask for help with a problem that can easily be fixed with a macro. -
10-05-2021, 11:57 PMssunny2008Facts you can research are no imagination. And to fix such an issue, you need to practice.Quote:
Originally Posted by HollyJolly
I´m pretty sure you or the OP could get ride of half the skills on the bar. You would do more damage with 123-456 repeat or 123 procc -123 procc and a rolling GCD than using macros across the whole board, just because you want to use everything. In case of SAM on PS4 you need only 14 buttons to perform well. Everything else is just on top / aoe spam. It shouldn´t be too hard to bring them on 2x8 bars you can swap with one button. All you need is to practice the button flow.
If you feel hurt by the truth or clear facts, then i don´t know... -
10-06-2021, 12:07 AMDarkstrideNo one is being "haters for no reason". Because of the combat design, macros are fundamentally inferior to using the abilities as intended. Can you use macros? Sure. But you're doing a disservice to yourself if you care at all about playing your job well. The fact that you said you're alternative to macros is to just not even use more than 10 skills is pretty enlightening.Quote:
Originally Posted by HollyJolly
You're of course entitled to your opinion, and you can play the way you want. However, peddling macros as a viable way to reduce your button presses to less than 10 is just reckless and misleading for people who genuinely want to learn and play their jobs well. -
10-06-2021, 12:36 AMHollyJollyPretty sure research u research and dont share is fake news.Quote:
Originally Posted by ssunny2008
And I already said my damage with macros is more then it was before.
You guys just hating still. -
10-06-2021, 12:43 AMMikey_R
Then you should practice without macros and you will do even better.
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10-06-2021, 12:46 AMssunny2008https://www.fflogs.com/character/na/...lly%20jollycatQuote:
Originally Posted by HollyJolly
https://xivanalysis.com/fflogs/b6PMgR42kQZtcWNr/5/67
https://xivanalysis.com/fflogs/Yzy6kMT1ZqcKhnWr/1/15
I don´t think that those are fakenews. And i don´t blame you for whatever reason you cry about imo. That macros cause a huge disadvantage is a fact. And imo you should try to play the core rotation without a GCD loss. Delay all off gcd´s if it´s too much. I´m convinced it´s more damage and still "easier to play" than using macros. -
10-06-2021, 01:30 AMRinaB
I think I should clarify some things before this simple thread turns into a war of macro opinion. I started playing in the fall of 2018, got to 70 as ninja and switched to tanking by about early spring 2019. I've been tanking ever since and for personal opinion reasons I have decided to stop. I mained DRK and GNB(if I wanted a change of pace) and I never felt button bloat. I had all my mitigators grouped nicely and conveniently located and the only macro I needed was my salted earth macro. I dont like Alts so I really dedicate myself to my job and my HUD/Buttons. SAM has a lot going on and I actually quite like the pace of it even though I'm still improving as I hit 80 last night. I try and use feint every tank buster I can and I use true north and second wind all the time so I'm not missing out on extra kinky gauge. Like HollyJolly said it's a button issue not a rotation or class issue but off the top of my head I can't really think of how to make things smoother atm which is why I was asking, this is not about macros optimizing dps it's about quality of life lol.
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10-06-2021, 01:50 AMssunny2008Nobody is talking about optimization. It´s more about "How worth are Macros?" and they aren´t worth anything, unless you want to waste your and your groups time.Quote:
Originally Posted by RinaB
As i´ve said, you can perform well as SAM with 14 buttons. Even less if you don´t use stuff like Meikyo anyway. Feint, True North, Third Eye, etc... it´s all not needed if you don´t want to be a pro. But that you actually use such stuff says that you seem to care about your performance (DPS) in some way. Macros will cause a huge loss in DPS and the overall gameplay-experience.
It´s up to you, but i would still recommend to practice at a dummy. Take care about the "not needed" stuff after you´re fine with the 14 core-keys. -
10-06-2021, 02:06 AMMikey_R
Are you making use of the expanded and/or W crossbars? There is enough space for all jobs on 3 crossbars and the vast majority can be done on just 2. From there, it is a case of finding a setup that suits you. For me personally, I only use the Expanded Crossbars for most things and I use the fact I don't need to see the cooldown of everything to know when I can use it. EG. since all GCD actions share a cooldown, I can 'hide' some in the hidden crossbar and still know the timing for them. Then there are some things like Shinten that essentially only has the Kenki restriction, so that can go in the back as well.
It isn't hard to make some sort of layout to use, the challenge is finding something that is comfortable to use, so never be afraid to move things around if you feel it would be better suited somewhere else. -
10-06-2021, 02:21 AMHollyJolly
Before I have to go back to class just thought I'd also share.
I macro my monk to use skills that look the coolest, not how much more damage they will do if I use this instead of that.
So if your going to tell me not to macro because I'm losing damage because I'm not using 14 buttons instead of 5 or whatever I'm not going to change what I'm doing so you can save 2 minutes of ur life in a raid.
Have a great day! -
10-06-2021, 04:20 AMCKNovel
I don't use macros because they're frustrating to use.
BUT, there is 2 macros to help me manage my hotbar for SAM.
AoE:
/micon Ôka
/hotbar action "Fûga" 1 1
/hotbar action "Mangetsu" 1 2
/hotbar action "Ôka" 1 3
Single Target
/micon Hakaze
/hotbar action "Hakaze" 1 1
/hotbar action "Jinpû" 1 2
/hotbar action "Gekkô" 1 3
Those two change your 1 2 3 between aoe and single target.
I find it usefull since you barely use your AoE GCD anyway and since it's instant, there is no downside. -
10-06-2021, 05:24 AMAndy_T93That's fine you do you but you really shouldn't be coming in to topics giving advice when you aren't very good at the game is allQuote:
Originally Posted by HollyJolly
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10-06-2021, 06:58 AMHollyJolly
Lol excuse me?
I'm probably the games best player lol
Don't let these haters get u down lol -
10-06-2021, 08:34 AMRongwayThis macro can switch you between two different bar sets for any job or class, so you can have, e.g., an AoE barset and a single target barset.Quote:
Originally Posted by CKNovel
It requires bars 1,2,3 are not shared; bars 7,8,9 are shared. The one macro will switch back and forth between the two barsets, hiding the inactive set under your shared bars.Code:/mlock
/hotbar copy current 1 share 1
/hotbar copy current 7 current 1
/hotbar copy share 1 current 7
/hotbar copy current 2 share 1
/hotbar copy current 8 current 2
/hotbar copy share 1 current 8
/hotbar copy current 3 share 1
/hotbar copy current 9 current 3
/hotbar copy share 1 current 9
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10-06-2021, 11:54 AMDarkstrideNow this just sounds like trolling.Quote:
Originally Posted by HollyJolly
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10-06-2021, 12:05 PMRinaB
Ok ok guys stop. So I played more tonight and moved some stuff around. It feels good. I wanted to ask if I'm garbage for only buffing shoha when I have the meter for it otherwise I just use it when it's up? It's 400....kinda not worth it when I can spend the meter to buff something with much higher potency.
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10-06-2021, 12:11 PMAceceShoha is an oGcd Kaiten doesn't buff it, only use kaiten on laijustsus. At least that's what I'm thinking you're saying, and yes it's worth it. you can get up to up to 11 on a fight so if you ignore it it's 4400 pot.Quote:
Originally Posted by RinaB
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10-06-2021, 11:14 PMRinaB........sob.....I didn't read the tool tips close enough. Well this makes my life easier and smoother.Quote:
Originally Posted by Acece
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10-07-2021, 12:13 AMMyrhn
I use macro for some ocd cooldowns for all my year playing and i have never seen anyone told me my dps was too low and it have been even higher than some "macro are bad" people
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10-07-2021, 12:18 AMMikey_R
Macros for oGCDs aren't as bad as for GCDs because the queuing issue is mitigated, it could prevent some double weaving (without GCD clipping), but only on faster jobs.