Increase allowed time to obtain rewards after primal fights.

Ok so I am sure this has probably happened to more then just myself here.

Was doing Ifrit, Had no issues the whole fight. Both WHM's got stung by unlucky cracks in the last 2% of the battle. Ifrit fell to the ground the same time WHM's did. Immediately the BLM's switched to THM (why they were not on THM to begin with I dont know) and it was a race against the timeout clock & the raise recast (upon changing jobs) for a few people in our party to obtain rewards.

Simple math shows that this just isn't possible under the current circumstances. 5 min timeout counter vs. 5 min raise recast timer.

While a handful of people are going to reply and say "well your BLM should have been on THM" or "both your WHM's shouldn't have died" - well stuff happens so move on.

Still believe that it was wrong to defeat a primal with no issues and 80% of your party still standing - yet those people cannot obtain the rewards on defeat due to waiting for a recast timer.

A few solutions would be-
a) Increase the post-fight time out to 7-10 minutes, instead of 5 minutes (so it is easily possible for someone to change jobs and raise if required).
b) Automatically open the chest for characters that are KO'd.
c) Reduce raise timer (Which I doubt will happen).

Anyway, my preferred option would quite simply increase the post-fight duration to 10 minutes, which gives people easily enough time to cast Raise at least once after their timer is reset.

Defeating a primal and it not literally possible for those KO'd to obtain rewards in this particular situation is just stupid.

In saying this - it goes for all current & future primal / battlefield style fights, not just the current ones. I am sure that fights are going to become more challenging as time goes on and that extra 5 minutes post battle will be a huge advantage.

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Originally Posted by Altena

well stuff happens so move on.

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This is the only suitable response to what you said, so i quote you against you! (You dont lose your lamp, just go back in again)

easy fix if anyone is dead when the primal is dead raise everyone as long as there 1 person alive while the primal is dead i don't see a issue giving everyone a raise.

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

easy fix if anyone is dead when the primal is dead raise everyone as long as there 1 person alive while the primal is dead i don't see a issue giving everyone a raise.

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The issue is if no one has raise, you cant switch, the cooldown is 5 minutes.

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Originally Posted by Altena

(why they were not on THM to begin with I dont know)

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You need thm to win Ifrit with no wipes? You are pro!

/tosses dead person a Phoenix Down


Why cant we have these again??
Gives alchemists more useful recipes rather than chain crafting fish/sand/etc
People would sink money into these (aka gil sink)
Saves frustration

Yeah so I knew this would spark up a few of the undesired posts. Well :

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This is the only suitable response to what you said, so i quote you against you! (You dont lose your lamp, just go back in again)

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Ok let's assume new content is released... Hmm Bahamut - You take 3 weeks fight after fight after fight trying to defeat him. You then finally defeat him but a similar situation like this happens. Would you be impressed that you didn't recieve your reward because of the inability to be raised after the fight is over?

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The issue is if no one has raise, you cant switch, the cooldown is 5 minutes.

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^ This. It would not be a difficult or "overpowered" solution to allow more time for raises / post-battle lobbying. If the jobs that happen to have raise are dead, the only option is for another class to switch. Raise timer being 5 mins, lobby timer being 5 mins - it isn't possible to get someone up and recieve rewards.

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You need thm to win Ifrit with no wipes? You are pro!

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It is not about needs, it is a known fact that THM is more effective in the fight then a BLM.



Why are people contesting this? It is going to happen more then this "special" case, if it hasn't already happened. In Ifrit, Moogle, Garuda - and ANY other battlefield event to come. Losing rewards after victory because of a spell timer is dumb. Not to mention this *doesn't* affect you if it doesn't happen to you - so why would you care / fight for the post-fight lobby time not to be increased?

Easiest way to fix this that people seem to ignore:

Remove the Recast on Raise when not in combat.....why it needs a Recast out of combat situations seems stupid to me, but whatever!

I do agree with this, timeout should be higher than rase racast just incase, but you could also ask your members to bring raise potions from GCs incase this happens. I have seen something similar and members loosing drops because of it as well.

As Blaize said, the REAL issue here is Raise recast being reset every time you equip/unequip.
They should make it so recast timer only starts if you cast the spell. To prevent abuse of other abilities, Raise could be the only spell that works like this.

Your WHMs shouldn't have died. Simple as that.

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Originally Posted by Koryu

Your WHMs shouldn't have died. Simple as that.

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People should always carry Company-Issue Tonic/Expectorant, like I do. Simple as that.

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Originally Posted by Raldo

People should always carry Company-Issue Tonic/Expectorant, like I do. Simple as that.

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I agree, wholeheartedly, with this man. Why people are walking around without at least -one- Company Issue Tonic (or at least an Expectorant, though it's not guaranteed) for pinch situations like this, is beyond me.

They are only 200 company seals.

I don't see the devs buckling into the pressure of this when they've provided a means for people to raise beyond being a class or WHM. Use your resources, people.

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Originally Posted by Blaize

Easiest way to fix this that people seem to ignore:

Remove the Recast on Raise when not in combat.....why it needs a Recast out of combat situations seems stupid to me, but whatever!

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This wouldn't work out, people would exploit the same mage not in combat mechanic that let's us currently have full time Refresh, so swap raise in cast swap it out. If they come up w/ a functional way to tag ppl as "in combat" even when they don't have weapon drawn something says Refresh "in combat" will go away.

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

easy fix if anyone is dead when the primal is dead raise everyone as long as there 1 person alive while the primal is dead i don't see a issue giving everyone a raise.

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This solution can work for all instanced content, if someone is dead but the content is cleared auto-raise.

But really bump the pst fight lobby to 10 mins is (assuming the code isn't a disaster) a 2 min fix, change a var from 300 to 600 and your done, it'd take longer to find the Var than to swap a 6 for a 3.

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Originally Posted by Enfarious

This wouldn't work out, people would exploit the same mage not in combat mechanic that let's us currently have full time Refresh, so swap raise in cast swap it out. If they come up w/ a functional way to tag ppl as "in combat" even when they don't have weapon drawn something says Refresh "in combat" will go away.

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There is a difference between in combat and active/passive. In combat = atleast one mob nearby has green or higher emnity agaisnt you. active and passive is just a toggle for auto attack and you are still out of combat with your weapon drawn as long as you take no action against anything or on someone who is fighting anything in your group.

I am glad some people have some common sense. I mean sure, the company item option is there, but people shouldn't suffer for other people's lack of ability to bring a single item. It really would not be hard to increase the post-battle lobby time to 10 mins, nor would it hurt or delay anyone that never comes across this situation.

Sure the WHM's shouldn't have died in the last 2 seconds of the fight, but it happened. Even though the fight was a "success", those that were dead were unable to receive the reward. The "auto-reraise" is one quick fix that would work. However the suggested 5 min increase in lobby time seems like the most simple fix for this situation.

Anyway going to ignore the rest of the posts that go along the lines of "your WHM's shouldn't have died bro" or anything in that regard. Stuff happens - and in this situation, succeeding in a fight should warrant rewards - no matter who is standing or KO during post-battle lobby time.

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Originally Posted by Altanas

/tosses dead person a Phoenix Down


Why cant we have these again??
Gives alchemists more useful recipes rather than chain crafting fish/sand/etc
People would sink money into these (aka gil sink)
Saves frustration

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Uh...we have phoenix downs in this game, they're just not called Phoenix down.

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Originally Posted by Altena

I am glad some people have some common sense. I mean sure, the company item option is there, but people shouldn't suffer for other people's lack of ability to bring a single item. It really would not be hard to increase the post-battle lobby time to 10 mins, nor would it hurt or delay anyone that never comes across this situation.

Sure the WHM's shouldn't have died in the last 2 seconds of the fight, but it happened. Even though the fight was a "success", those that were dead were unable to receive the reward. The "auto-reraise" is one quick fix that would work. However the suggested 5 min increase in lobby time seems like the most simple fix for this situation.

Anyway going to ignore the rest of the posts that go along the lines of "your WHM's shouldn't have died bro" or anything in that regard. Stuff happens - and in this situation, succeeding in a fight should warrant rewards - no matter who is standing or KO during post-battle lobby time.

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I'm actually somewhat offended by this. So the people planning ahead and bringing items in the rare instance that something like this happens are the ones without the common sense?

Well, I wash my hands of this issue.

Those who plan ahead = common sense as some people understand the concept of "shit happens, best be be prepared."

Altho it does indeed suck and have been in a party victim to such an event, I highly recommend that every player (not just in this group, but in EVERY group) carry a Company-Issue Tonic/Expectorant to offset this. (even the White Mage in case both Raises are down)

That and maybe having the Paladin and Bard seeing more action.

Would prefer C) personally if I had to choose ~ reduced Raise cooldown.

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Originally Posted by Tahldon

I'm actually somewhat offended by this. So the people planning ahead and bringing items in the rare instance that something like this happens are the ones without the common sense?

Well, I wash my hands of this issue.

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I think they were saying that taking them is common sense, the people that are saying "Umm don't die?" are the ones without common sense.

I'm all for the auto re-raise its already in game so to speak. The battles for Jobs when completed with dead people in group the dead are revived and move on with their seemingly happy lives.

Add this to primal battles upon completion or make it so once one person cracks the box everyone gets their loot. (adjustments needed for people who may DC at end of battle)

There are Grand Company tonics that can raise people, however they cost and you can only have one at a time. Having each person in the party with one could help avoid these situations.

Every time I kill Ifrit, it says we have 15 minutes until we get kicked out.... Guess I'm lucky.

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Originally Posted by Keith_Dragoon

There is a difference between in combat and active/passive. In combat = atleast one mob nearby has green or higher emnity agaisnt you. active and passive is just a toggle for auto attack and you are still out of combat with your weapon drawn as long as you take no action against anything or on someone who is fighting anything in your group.

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There's the problem I was trying to point out, if others in party are fighting as long as 1 person doesn't aggro mob they can sit and raise all day w/ no recast, so we end up w/ 7 active members and 1 raise spammer as a new form of stacking.

Edit: this whole line is all bass ackwards :If/when they fix it so that if any pt member w/in a given range flags you as in combat regardless of your aggro level or active/passive status this would lead to easy exploiting.; I meant until they fix it.

Since dead players drop off the hate list as long as the raiser doesn't actually do anything other than raise they'll never get on the hate list.

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Originally Posted by viion

The issue is if no one has raise, you cant switch, the cooldown is 5 minutes.

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no i mean the game itself give you a raise if everyone is dead but the boss is dead also should justgive you a raise if anyone is dead.

I guess this is where I'll mention how WoW does it for comparison's sake. If you wipe during a boss fight and you rez at a graveyard, you can run back into the instance so long as other members, alive or dead, are still inside (provided everyone is out of combat and no enemy is engaged). In the case your last party member died a microsecond after the boss' HP hits 0, you can still go back in and loot, again provided you have someone inside the instance.

I still remember that thread made by that guy whose group's last member (BLM) died at the same time Ifrit died. Under other rulesets, someone could have stayed behind, one could have raised/HPd and come back to the instance to raise people and start looting.

I'll admit that I'm far from the appropriate level to do these fights, so I don't know how you guys actually zone into areas for Ifrit and such. Just wanted to present an alternative outlook on instances.

Going to stop reading my own thread (once again) because people have started what I consider the "trolling". Seems that the XI official forum crowd rub off into this forum as well..

In summary - Regardless what classes are alive or KO at the end of the fight - if a primal or instanced boss is dead, and one or more players are still standing, all members who participated in the event should still be able to claim their reward. Everyone participated and I am sure played their part in the entire fight until the end otherwise you just won't defeat the boss. Under this circumstance, the current system does not allow for this slight mess-up. Believe me I will always be carrying a GC item with me from now on, although I can't say the same for everyone else in this game, so I believe that either the time should be increased to 10 minutes (to allow for raise cooldown) or all players in the instance should be given a raise (as is already in place for final AF quests).

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Originally Posted by Arcell

There are Grand Company tonics that can raise people, however they cost and you can only have one at a time. Having each person in the party with one could help avoid these situations.

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I mention this every time a similar situation happens.

And I have never bought one lol.