A question about Belias, famfrit, Hashmal, Adrammelech, etc

Im a huge Fan of FF12, and after seeing the return to ivalice quests I well just loved to see those espers, more seeing later Adrammelech in castrum lacus litore, and cuchulain in the latest patch video, but now wondering, what are they actually in the ffxiv lore ¿ demons?, ¿primals? I know that persons can transform into primals such as Ysaile, and that certain objects have the power to summon a primal(susano)...but wondering that as it doesnt saeem to say anything, about them just that they are created by a person holding an aureacite, and bad desires (but we know that such desires and emotions can create primals too, like tsukuyomi)

I don't know about the Cúchulainn in the patch trailer, but Void Ark's Cúchulainn is a corrupted Warrior of Light from the Thirteenth reflection.

that round thing jumping with its belly on second 45 of the 5.5 trailer is the ffXII cuchulain summon

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thel_Eruyt

that round thing jumping with its belly on second 45 of the 5.5 trailer is the ffXII cuchulain summon

---

I know what you're talking about; but I'm saying I don't know who or what it is yet.

There has already been one Cúchulainn, whom you can fight on the Void Ark, and the lore books state that scholars believe he is one of the Warriors of Light who fought primals on the Thirteenth using auracite, but were corrupted by the auracite. The corrupted Warriors of Light, hungry for aether, started a war that brought about the Flood of Darkness that all but destroyed the Thirteenth.

We don't know who XII!Cuchulainn is yet because he's likely going to be someone in Zadnor and that doesn't release until 5.55. However, the Espers/Lucavi seem to be creations held inside Auracite, much like the Primals were in the Thirteenth, with the Auracite's power, and people can also turn into such beings, such as Argath and Ba'Gamnan and, later, Albeleo (from a completely different Matsuno series, by the way!)

Ultima, however, seems to be an alien being who descended upon Hydaelin, more like JENOVA from FF7. However, she was trapped in the Virgo Auracite by Ramza Beoulve. Other than that, however, I'd have to replay the quests.

There also seems to have once been a Primal version of Belias summoned some time in the distant past, as the original SMN quests involved the summoning of a Belias-Egi (which was just a purple pallete-swapped version of Ifrit-Egi). No further information was given as to it's origins or meaning - Tristan just literally pulled it out of thin air basically after being infused with a bunch of SMN Soul Crystals and was presumedly drawing on the memories from them in his summoning of a 'forgotten Egi' (although it was presumed the black-masked Ascians were behind it, given they were the ones who infused him with the Soul Crystals).

Bare in mind though this was long before the 'Return to Ivalice' raids were even considered to be added so it may have just been a fanservice reference with no deeper lore meaning (and is now something of a plot hole).

well, yeah everything I see is that they are in some weird grey area, Yet even I would love to see a summoner, summoning those, and some domans ones, as in to have regional summons (sadly I know suzaku, byakko and such are not really primals)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

We don't know who XII!Cuchulainn is yet

---

I have a feeling it might possibly be Daguza - the Seeq who is involved in a handful of FATE's throughout the Bozjan Southern Front.

I think it'd be cool if someone on our side (ie, someone in the Resistance) used Auracite to turn into an Esper and fought with us against the IVth Legion. Or maybe it could be a solo-duty, like the G-Warrior. But IIRC according to the lore on Ivalician auracite in FFXIV, it drives you insane, so I guess that's a no-go.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thel_Eruyt

Im a huge Fan of FF12, and after seeing the return to ivalice quests I well just loved to see those espers, more seeing later Adrammelech in castrum lacus litore, and cuchulain in the latest patch video, but now wondering, what are they actually in the ffxiv lore ¿ demons?, ¿primals? I know that persons can transform into primals such as Ysaile, and that certain objects have the power to summon a primal(susano)...but wondering that as it doesnt saeem to say anything, about them just that they are created by a person holding an aureacite, and bad desires (but we know that such desires and emotions can create primals too, like tsukuyomi)

---

It's explained somewhere in Return to Ivalice, either in the quests dealing with Ridorana or from an NPC aboard the Prima Vista, I forget which.

Basically Ultima's auracite feeds on peoples' aether, making their desires stronger and run out of control, and then it warps their aether and physical body to turn them into monsters that can fulfill those desires. Argath became Duma so he could be king, Ba'Gamnan became Yiazmat so he could kill Garleans, etc.

It's not always negative; Ramza and his friends became good Lucavi in the Orbonne Monastery raid because their desire was protecting Ultima's seal so she couldn't escape.

It should be noted that the trio of bosses fought before Ultima (Mustadio, Agrias, and The Thunder God) are the result of heroic individuals using Ultima's auracite. Much like the zodiac stones they were adapted from, they're not inherently evil things, but rather their effects are dependent on the user's intentions and possibly willpower. And likewise, Ultima's auracite went on to be the basis of "trigger weapons"—devices designed to streamline the process of summoning primals—made by the Allagan Empire. That provides a definite link between Ultima's auracite and primal summoning, and could suggest that Belias and friends are also primals in a fashion.

Or they could be voidsent. Or voidsent primals.