About BLU

Why isn't BLU allowed in duty finder as a DPS? You do allow WHM that didn't went to do their job quests to go in without regen.

You cannot even do PoTD with BLU. Or even join your grand company team to go on your own.

So why the BLU discrimination?

Because while whm may not have regen (which is really bad to rely on anyway), blu could ultimately have a single attack and that's it. Even at max level.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

Because while whm may not have regen (which is really bad to rely on anyway), blu could ultimately have a single attack and that's it. Even at max level.

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And the other way around too: even synced, BLU still have access to all their spells, which could make them extremely powerful compared to other DPS in low level dungeons.

Regarding PotD, the way BLU unlock spells is probably one of the reasons why they did not allow it. (either that, or the same excuse they used for not allowing BLU in Ultimate : "It would be unfair for those who took the challenge with standard jobs", which I think is not a good excuse.)
Other jobs going in PotD start at level 1, and learn their spells as they level up and progress through each floor.
They would need to change the system a little bit for BLU to fit in there.
They could do a BLU-specific version of PotD, where you would learn the spells from the monsters? Or they could just give you access to your whole spellbook from level 1.
I'd be fine either way, but I would like them to consider doing something about it indeed.

The bottom line answer is "because they chose to".

Whatever all reasons you want it this way or that way or think it's best on a Tuesday upside down with R0, it's because this is what they decided. Of course they could have done xyz to for q result, of course many people could suggest ways to balance it or that are often players who fail to do job quests or just fail to play their actual job, so "what about" "if this" - bottom line is they just chose not to.

;/

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Originally Posted by Shougun

The bottom line answer is "because they chose to".

Whatever all reasons you want it this way or that way or think it's best on a Tuesday upside down with R0, it's because this is what they decided. Of course they could have done xyz to for q result, of course many people could suggest ways to balance it or that are often players who fail to do job quests or just fail to play their actual job, so "what about" "if this" - bottom line is they just chose not to.

;/

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I'm pretty sure it's because of what Canadane said. You could literally unlock blue, get boosted levels by your friends, and queue up with ONLY the starting spell. It's definitely the way it was implemented, where you have to fight monsters in the wild to get their spells. That is understandable for the majority of the spells, but they could have also done it so that there are core spells that you learn doing job quests, same style as any other job, and then the really powerful spells you have to learn in the wild/dungeons/trials/raids.

BLU, despite having a red icon, is not considered a DPS job but rather a limited job that has the ability to become a DPS, Healer, or Tank with the right abilities.

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Originally Posted by Avatre

I'm pretty sure it's because of what Canadane said. You could literally unlock blue, get boosted levels by your friends, and queue up with ONLY the starting spell. It's definitely the way it was implemented, where you have to fight monsters in the wild to get their spells. That is understandable for the majority of the spells, but they could have also done it so that there are core spells that you learn doing job quests, same style as any other job, and then the really powerful spells you have to learn in the wild/dungeons/trials/raids.

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I didn't mean to suggest Canadane was wrong, I meant to say the bottom line reason is this is what they wanted to do. They could have done other things, they just didn't. They could have had other designs, they didn't- this is what they wanted.

I don't even say that like "yaaay this is what they wanted, I love it don't touch it!" lol (I don't, not that others are not allowed to like it, this might be exactly what someone else wanted, opinions and all are free to have lol)- it's just clear while they could have done x y z and any reason why they didn't is honestly just superficial, as in the reason they don't do it now is not because it's an unimaginable solution - it's that they didn't want to make that sort of content, you could construct around Canadane's given issue, of course more work but you could do stuff (and if you were designing form the beginning rather than after the fact you wouldn't even have to "design around" it since you could have had it be a key part of the design in the first place; a priori vs a posteriori). Even you yourself make examples of ways they might have done what OP wanted without the issues mentioned by others. Ultimately as I said "this is what it is because this is what they chose to do".

It's different than perhaps they create something and an unintentional consequence happened because of this, this is they made a content that performs exactly how they designed it to perform and so the answer as to why it doesn't do other things while you might be able to point out challenges at the end of the day it's because it's doing what they made it do. Why are Trust members not part of your squadron? Because they decided they didn't want to do that. You might come up with other reasons why that add challenges, but in that situation it was clear it was a design choice not a failure of thought. Blue Mage does what it was designed to be, of course you can like or not like that and ask or not ask for changes- but I mean to say "why is it the way it is now" and my answer is "because this was their vision" you might suggest issues which may be hurdles they'd have to consider (as with the implementation of almost literally anything, always challenges to consider), but in the end "this is what they were making because this is what they wanted to make".

Which you can also back up by the fact that in ARR beta, long long long ago, Yoshida had already detailed out some thoughts on what blue mage would be (a side content / mini game with a fairly large spell book), it's not like they arrived to this job after long periods of hard challenging deliberation and technical impossibilities, it was thought to be this way since before ARR was even published. They could have done something different, they didn't, and it was by choice.

So if it was looking like I was trying to tell them their answer was bad or something then that wasn't my intention.

Given that you could either go into Sastasha with an array of high-end primal spells, or go after Alexander Prime with nothing but Water Cannon, it's kind of impossible to balance it properly.

Then at least place all the spells either in the world or the carnival. Instead of locking them behind dungeons. It also does not explain why your personal party that you get by being captain of a grand company cannot be used to do so.

I dislike pestering people in the FC to complete the spell book. I also dislike waiting several hours to form a party of volunteers. I leveled up all jobs to 80 except for BLU to 60. But I am stuck getting the remaining magics. I guess I should give up trying to do so and wait for the BLU patch to see if things change. Somehow I doubt they will.

Blu needs to stay out of duty finder. It’s fantastic as it is.

They honestly wrecked blu with powerleveling early on. You don’t need to find a powerlevel for it either; you simply need to learn spells along the way.

If any matching system is to be added, we’ll need more limited jobs first and that matching system needs to work only with limited jobs. Until then, be social with blu via pf or a blu community or enjoy leveling a different job to 80 you’ll likely ditch as soon as you hit cap anyway.

If you want to roulette blu to level, you don’t understand blu. Perhaps mentor roulette, but only after obtaining all blu spells.

Also block anyone that doesn’t have a job stone equipped from any queue past 29.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

Also block anyone that doesn’t have a job stone equipped from any queue past 29.

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I still feel like the ARR revamp in 5.3 missed an opportunity to include a "get your job stone" quest in the Company of Heroes chain leading up to Titan. But that's drifting off topic.

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Originally Posted by rxantos

Then at least place all the spells either in the world or the carnival. Instead of locking them behind dungeons. It also does not explain why your personal party that you get by being captain of a grand company cannot be used to do so.

I dislike pestering people in the FC to complete the spell book. I also dislike waiting several hours to form a party of volunteers. I leveled up all jobs to 80 except for BLU to 60. But I am stuck getting the remaining magics. I guess I should give up trying to do so and wait for the BLU patch to see if things change. Somehow I doubt they will.

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This. No BLU spells should require going into a dungeon. Or at the very least, all BLU spells from dungeons and trials should 100% learnable even when unsynced.

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Originally Posted by Styrmwyda

This. No BLU spells should require going into a dungeon. Or at the very least, all BLU spells from dungeons and trials should 100% learnable even when unsynced.

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This is asinine. The whole point of blu is going to the most out-of-the-way locations and forgotten content to get new spells. If anything, a proper blu would require clears on content all the way up to ultimate to 100%.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

This is asinine. The whole point of blu is going to the most out-of-the-way locations and forgotten content to get new spells. If anything, a proper blu would require clears on content all the way up to ultimate to 100%.

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"Proper blu" is such a meaningless phrase, how to get different skills, the learn method and the ease of acquisition changes dramatically from game to game.

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Originally Posted by rxantos

It also does not explain why your personal party that you get by being captain of a grand company cannot be used to do so.

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This I'll agree with. Squadron Missions affect no one but you, there's no reason to not let us lead them as BLU.

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

"Proper blu" is such a meaningless phrase, how to get different skills, the learn method and the ease of acquisition changes dramatically from game to game.

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And in this game, you’ll need to have access to a wide variety of party content.

You can unsync it or you can form a party for a guaranteed drop.

If you refuse, then you’ve decided to not participate.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

This is asinine. The whole point of blu is going to the most out-of-the-way locations and forgotten content to get new spells. If anything, a proper blu would require clears on content all the way up to ultimate to 100%.

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Problem is, it can be hard to find enough people who want to group up.

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Originally Posted by Styrmwyda

Problem is, it can be hard to find enough people who want to group up.

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That’s fine, not everyone is going to be willing or able to get every spell.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

If anything, a proper blu would require clears on content all the way up to ultimate to 100%.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

That’s fine, not everyone is going to be [...] able to get every spell.

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Ultimates rewards are useless things: a title and glamour weapons (sure, they're BiS for, like, a patch, but that's beside my point).
Would Ultimates give a useless novelty BLU spell then? Can't put anything with a relevant function in a place not everyone is gonna be able to get it.

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Originally Posted by ItMe

Ultimates rewards are useless things: a title and glamour weapons (sure, they're BiS for, like, a patch, but that's beside my point).
Would Ultimates give a useless novelty BLU spell then? Can't put anything with a relevant function in a place not everyone is gonna be able to get it.

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I could certainly see the "important" skills being obtainable easily, but blu does work best when there's just a few rare skills. If everyone has every skill, we need more better-hidden skills.

Missile is a good example hidden behind a long quest chain. Perhaps we could hide others behind chocobo racing or triple triad. Perhaps Doman Reconstruction.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

blu does work best when there's just a few skills that few people have.

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Does it?
Why is this?

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Originally Posted by ItMe

Does it?
Why is this?

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Fun little rewards scattered throughout the entirety of the game. BLU is something you traditionally need to go high and low to gather abilities for.

That's not something everyone likes, but it's a nice break from the very ironclad rigid list we get for most jobs in XIV.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

I could certainly see the "important" skills being obtainable easily, but blu does work best when there's just a few rare skills. If everyone has every skill, we need more better-hidden skills.

Missile is a good example hidden behind a long quest chain. Perhaps we could hide others behind chocobo racing or triple triad. Perhaps Doman Reconstruction.

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Still, a catch-up mechanic would be nice. If you don't jump on the BLU hype train in the first few weeks/months, getting all the spells can get difficult; not because they are rare or hard to get, but just because it can be tedious to find a party.
So I think making more skills available via the carnival would be nice.
As for spells locked behind racing or TT.....why?....If they ever do a Gambler job or something like that, sure, why not....but Blue Mage?
Locking a spell behind Ultimate fights would be a bad idea too IMO. Part of the fun from the blue mage spell book is to work on it like any other checklist in the game (TT cards, orchestrion rolls, fishing log). If you tell me that I will never be able to complete the checklist because I am not good enough to complete Ultimate, I might as well not hunt for any of the spells. (Unless they do what I suggested earlier and make the spell available in the carnival a few patches later)
If any BLU-specific thing should drop from Ultimate, it should just be the usual title/weapon.