How to fix Zenos one dimentional character

So as a lot of people know compared to what drives the unsundered Ascians vs what drives Zenos it is like comparing Lord of the Rings trilogy to Dr. Suess.

We are missing some SERIOUS backstory to Zenos so all we see is....hunt yesss the hunt more hunt yeahhhh. Compared to Emet or Elidibus it is a waste of a character.

How to fix
So if the plan is to keep this guy around we need a quest chain somewhere involving the echo showing how Zenos went from an innocent kid to sadistic psychopath. Not sure how you want to do it but if we go from the fine wine that is Shadowbringers back to one dimensional huntboy Zenos for an expansion we are going to have problems.

I mean you guys took Elidibus from a side character with not much backstory to a fully fleshed out hero/villain in one patch. Zenos needs this same justice done so he is not wasted and quickly forgotten and generic enemy #1.

Something tells me he was the kind of child that killed small animal just for fun lol....

I just cant picture him as innocent, misguided maybe, but not that.

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Originally Posted by Puremallace

we need a quest chain somewhere involving the echo showing how Zenos went from an innocent kid to sadistic psychopath.

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Zenos doesn't need to be made sympathetic.
Every character doesn't need a tragic backstory.
There are other ways to make a character more rounded.

Just kill him off and try again. Problem solved. Would be great if Greg did it and the weird horn noise you hear when Zenos shows up slowly swaying his hips played when Greg shows up from then on.

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Originally Posted by ItMe

Zenos doesn't need to be made sympathetic.
Every character doesn't need a tragic backstory.
There are other ways to make a character more rounded.

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Well if we are going full Valens with the guy then I need him to start killing off some jedi kids to get stronger with the dark side because all of the crazy stuff they say he does is off camera. If we are not going full sympathy for the guys we need to pick up the level of crazy.

I don't think Zenos is one dimensional.

I think he works well as a foil to the WoL. They're the two strongest warriors of their age, going beyond the impossible, but one only reluctantly fights out of necessity, while the other fights for self exaltation. One doesn't dedicate all their time exclusively to fighting, doing other things like having fun with friends and crafting, while the other has devoted their entire life to the path of destruction.

I don't want to see a tragic Zenos backstory. I like how he is a self made man, one who had a vision and dedicated his life towards attaining that vision. Through his own hard work, he has attained mastery. We already have too many villains in FFXIV with tragic backstories. If there is a Zenos prequel, I want to see him working hard to learn new techniques and overcoming foes, like in that short story in the Enclyopedia.

It is my hope that when Zenos and the WoL duel again, that Zenos wins. It makes sense. Zenos simply has devoted more time in his life to becoming stronger than the WoL. The strength in the WoL is not in his martial power, but in his convictions and his friends, things that Zenos does not have. So ofcourse the WoL and 7 other friends will beat Zenos in a trial (hopefully this trial can be a trust with the Scions on the first time, like the Varis fight). And the WoL is also a crafter, a builder, which I would hope would be relevant in the true end goal of the story: fixing the Sound (which I hope isn't just another JRPG god monster we kill).

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Originally Posted by MoofiaBossVal

It is my hope that when Zenos and the WoL duel again, that Zenos wins. It makes sense. Zenos simply has devoted more time in his life to becoming stronger than the WoL. The strength in the WoL is not in his martial power, but in his convictions and his friends, things that Zenos does not have. So ofcourse the WoL and 7 other friends will beat Zenos in a trial (hopefully this trial can be a trust with the Scions on the first time, like the Varis fight). And the WoL is also a crafter, a builder, which I would hope would be relevant in the true end goal of the story: fixing the Sound (which I hope isn't just another JRPG god monster we kill).

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No, Zenos will probably lose. My only hope is that instead of a Trial, he's given a solo instance 1v1 fight with the WoL...that later gets exaggerated into an actual extreme trial.

Zenos already has a 'sympathetic' type backstory, he has been experimented for a long time, most likely since he was a child, based on the dreams he supposedly has had all his life, his father despised him and treated him as a monster for who knows how long, and his mother is somewhere dead or alive idk.

I just don't care for Zenos because the character he is meant to be and the character he has been shown as are different.

Zenos is meant to be the antithesis to the WoL, a huge force of nature character who gets stronger as we do.

What went wrong was having him live, for so long doing next to nothing.

He has suffered the Minfilia effect of stuff that be great showing how twisted he is, what he is willing to do, it is all off screen, what we get on screen has been slain daddy and sit on throne thinking menacingly, riveting for a force of nature character.

Force of nature characters are simple by design because their actions are the spectacle that keeps you engaged with them. Zenos has no ham, no cheese, does nothing but sit on his butt thinking of senpai, and he has been around since 4.0 over 2 years and he suffers because of that.

They cannot fix Zenos at this point, he has had far far too much time to be made better. I give Flandaniel a pass for now because he is recently introduced AND he actually does stuff to cause us concern. Zenos is unfixable to me, I dread any scene he will show up in and I just want to permanently kill him off already.

There's a lot of common misconceptions in regards to Zenos' childhood. He wasn't mistreated - his father went off to war, yes - but that's pretty standard in this sort of setting and hardly something limited to Zenos' situation. He wasn't left without people to interact with. He pushed them away willingly because they 'bored' him. The experimentation he engaged in was also by his own choice and violation. In fact, his father was against Aulus' experiments and had him banished from Garlemald. Zenos simply took an interest in the guy and teamed up with him later on. When he was younger, he pushed crystals into his own flesh in an attempt to get around his inability to manipulate aether.

Yoshi-P is also on record as also stating that Zenos isn't intended to be sympathetic in any way - he's just a monster with no sympathetic qualities and doesn't care about anyone or anything beyond the thrill he gets from fighting the Warrior of Light. Granted, I do think there are ways in which he could have been handled better and made to be more interesting but he really just seems to be a walking, talking plot device at this point.

There is a short-story about a "typical" incident in Zenos' childhood and... he definetly doesn't have a "tragic backstory". At least, not the way the term is usually thrown about. For all that Varis doesn't seem to be around, he seems to have provided Zenos with a good education and everything one could reasonably expect a prince to want. Zenos just... is really messed up in his head. Even back then. He was already finding everything too easy and wanted more of a challenge and wanted to get stronger (via any method possible). And he was definetly as board already as we see him in Stormblood. His character in Stormblood is... pretty much unchanged from that; he's just got more power and people to terrorize now. Granted, finding out he was seeing dreams/memories of the Last Days of Amarot since forever definetly explains a lot about why he could have been that messed up. But I don't see how Zenos turned out being the only way someone going through that could turn out either.

The biggest change to Zenos' character was... finding out someone like the WoL existed. Someone who really was at his level and was capable of defeating him fairly. It changes his perpetual board state into an obsession that revolves about a person. And the thing is, Zenos acknowledges he could do something different than obsessing over the WoL once he doesn't die; he just doesn't want to.

He's certainly one of the most self-aware, self-made villians I've seen in a very long time. He also is really board to watch as he hasn't really been doing anything in ages and his rational for what he does is so obvious and uncompelling.

I really want Zenos to get kind of a Vegeta arc. Minus the wife and kids, because I just can't ever see Zenos mellow out that much. XD I would love to have him as an eternal rival, someone who might even team up with us against a common threat, but only so he can fight us again, because he wants nobody else to get the kill.

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Originally Posted by Barachim

I really want Zenos to get kind of a Vegeta arc. Minus the wife and kids, because I just can't ever see Zenos mellow out that much. XD I would love to have him as an eternal rival, someone who might even team up with us against a common threat, but only so he can fight us again, because he wants nobody else to get the kill.

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My current head canon is that in 6.0 we will have our big fight and we are equally matched and both beat eachother enough to tire ourselves out and fandanny swoops in and takes both zodi and hydaelyn for himself and we team up with zenos in the end because no one gets to beat he WoL except him

I am curious as to exactly what they intend to do with him now that they're suggesting he's another reincarnated Ancient of import (Though as far as individuals outside of the Convocation go, Venat or Hythlodaeus are the only known possibilities at present).

He's definitely not the sort of person who would be influenced much by his memories of the past...though I do see him as someone who might opt to do something benevolent on our behalf after we've defeated him again.

SPOILERS

for one we fought him like 3 times in stormblood, fought him again in 4.5 and again in 5.3 he blatantly should’ve died ages ago his father made a much better character and was iced and for no real reason (that I’m actually crossing fingers that he somehow survived and plots revenge) he’s a absolute bore and his motives are lackluster for a Main villain.

We went from Gaius the conquerer ft Lahabrea in ARR, to Ishgarde elite with the archbishop with such tangled beef with the dragons that it’s hard to explain in a summary to the dragons themselves with said beef for man, to a tortured wench and Garleon sympathizers in SB and Zenos boring ass himself, to the main unsundered ascians in SHB to back to Zenos?

It just all feels incredibly regressive yea Danny boi is a villain too but he’s worse Acians have this amazing allure to them and it’s impressive to make that uninteresting as they have but since he’s new and 5.5 still unclear I’ll give him a pass it’s Zenos who just stays far too long in the main villain chair with the blandest motives that don’t even make sense. Ran’jit was more interesting the most interesting thing about him is his Fake Echo that that he used to Body hop and to take control of Shinryu that he artificially gained. I don’t even hate him like Vaulthry it just baffles me with a game filled with interesting characters this is the one they’ll end the Zodiark Arc with?

As far as "absolutely crazy and just wants a sick death" goes Danny at least comes off as far more entertaining than Zenos. Frankly his only good scenes were with WoL at the end of 4.0, and I'm not really sure what they can do with Zenos that isn't just having those exact same moments again. I want to think Ishikawa can do something interesting with him but it seems like the very core concept of his character is so fixed that even if he somehow got some really tragic backstory I don't think he would even care if it was brought up in the present day. I mean this is a guy who had a second chance at life and just decided "Yeah I'll do it all again but even bigger this time."

I really question why they even brought him back. If it was just for WoL to have a rival some new character could be invented that's a better fit, right? People say he's like the perfect foil in that he's kind of the opposite of WoL in every way, but surely an inverse-WoL would work better than an anti-WoL, right? Someone that's more like him in ways that aren't just "yeah he's super strong too". I mean given none of the remaining sundered Ascians have any established character any of them could be made to fit the bill. This is originally what Ardbert and the Warriors of Darkness were, but they were wrapped up (as antagonists anyway) fairly quickly.

I don't know. I like Zenos in some ways, but if the big resolution to the story is just WoL fighting him while he's mantling Zodiark and beating him just concludes the primary plot, that'd be pretty lame and one-dimensional. They'd need to have a frankly ludicrous execution to pull that off and justify it.

Zenos has a few ticks that have lead me to this conclusion: Zenos has an ancient equivalent that journeyed with Azem.

1. Zenos has dreams of the final days, so this is evidence he has a least a fragment of an ancient's soul.

2. He has this weird way of calling us "his friend" pretty consistently. Now I know on the surface that's to show he values competition in combat and only sees those who can challenge him as equals. But its also set the stage for duplicitous meaning in the sense that "we were real friends" in a past life.

3. As a significant plot hole to the Ancient narrative revolves around what was "Azem" actually doing since they didn't join the Hydaelyn or Zodiark faction, but then appears in god mythos of cultures across the star, some of which has Azem with followers. This sets up that post-sundering, Azem wandered the star fixing the woes of the world with his friends/companions (resulting in "The 12"). I would assume we'll find that fragments of "The 12" have been reincarnated as the Scions and few other key main characters, which Zenos can now be one of them. (Sorry this one isn't great evidence, but is more conjecture filling in what we don't know with what we do know).

4. Since Fandaniel has been shown to have every intention of betrayal to Zenos; this comes from his rhetoric of "loyal" "faithful" and "in want of a new master" but then takes the body of person whose last name is "Brutus". These are all foreshadowing betrayal set ups. And when Fandaniel ultimately stabs Zenos in the back because Fandaniel got what he wanted, where does that leave Zenos?

5. To avoid the Stormblood conclusion, taking into account point 4 (above) and the high potental of losing to the WOL again (I mean we're the hero; we win in the end), Zenos would see no other recourse then to do what he did in Stormblood after we defeat Shinryu, which is take his own life. UNLESS, he is called to a higher calling informed by knowledge gained by points 1, 2 and 3 and joins us to save the star.

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Originally Posted by Veloran

As far as "absolutely crazy and just wants a sick death" goes Danny at least comes off as far more entertaining than Zenos. Frankly his only good scenes were with WoL at the end of 4.0, and I'm not really sure what they can do with Zenos that isn't just having those exact same moments again. I want to think Ishikawa can do something interesting with him but it seems like the very core concept of his character is so fixed that even if he somehow got some really tragic backstory I don't think he would even care if it was brought up in the present day. I mean this is a guy who had a second chance at life and just decided "Yeah I'll do it all again but even bigger this time."

I really question why they even brought him back. If it was just for WoL to have a rival some new character could be invented that's a better fit, right? People say he's like the perfect foil in that he's kind of the opposite of WoL in every way, but surely an inverse-WoL would work better than an anti-WoL, right? Someone that's more like him in ways that aren't just "yeah he's super strong too". I mean given none of the remaining sundered Ascians have any established character any of them could be made to fit the bill. This is originally what Ardbert and the Warriors of Darkness were, but they were wrapped up (as antagonists anyway) fairly quickly.

I don't know. I like Zenos in some ways, but if the big resolution to the story is just WoL fighting him while he's mantling Zodiark and beating him just concludes the primary plot, that'd be pretty lame and one-dimensional. They'd need to have a frankly ludicrous execution to pull that off and justify it.

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They could just kill off Zenos now and nothing of value would be lost. He's at best a lever for Fandaniel, which could be written in other, alternative ways, if they so chose. Which isn't to say I think they'll have Fandaniel outlast him, but between the two, the latter is at least engaging. Zenos both lacks any depth and any charisma and together it makes scenes with him into a slog. I agree with you about inserting a backstory. It sometimes works, for some characters where there may already have been a basis for it, but in his case it will come across as forced and inauthentic. If they were going to recycle a character as a nemesis, they could've just as easily had Lahabrea do it and use the Eyes of Nidhogg as the vehicle for how he restored his full power and goes a little bananas (as opposed to just appearing that way) - that route was always available to them, technically. As things stand, Emet-Selch made for a better "old friend" enemy, as an actual champion of darkness. I see Zenos as little more than a caricature of a certain type of gamer and even so such "meta" things don't do much to amuse me by themselves.

Restoring Zenos was a mistake, as far as I'm concerned. I'm just hoping they find it in themselves to kill him off rather than dragging him out... there's multiple ways they can level up someone like Fandaniel to become a great threat in power terms, especially when we're supposed to believe Ran'jit was one. Maybe find his remaining shards, become unsundered and steal Zodiark's power for himself, or something.

The entire purpose of Zenos is his one-dimensionality.

Every other character we have fought has some motivating factor behind them that causes them to cross our path. The Griffin wanted to force the Alliance to get involved with the war for Ala Mihgo. The Ascians wanted to restore the sundered world. The Archbishop wanted to bring law and order to the world.

Zenos serves the same function as the Joker does in the Batman series, a foil. His backstory is irrelevant. He is what he is because of what others did to him. He has no motive or concern beyond fighting the WoL. He's not really evil or good, as he doesn't care about power, wealth, or status. (He is sadistic.) He is a slow-moving force of nature. You may not like his personality, but it's crucial to his character. In his mind, he is so powerful that nothing interests him; everything is a bore.

I think Fanadiel was a mistake. Another Ascian? Who cares? We've defeated every Ascian we've come across. His shtick is that he's like Thanos, an insane nihilist. He's going to do crazy things like summon towers and primals. Big deal. Zenos just cuts everything down.

I'm also reading people say Zenos is like us? In theory, everyone is like us, a sundered soul. They made that clear. Zenos was never awakened like we were by Hydaelyn/Zodiark. A big part of Stormblood's story was they Zenos's "Echo" is artificial and that the process that granted him the Resonance drove him insane. (Fordola has the Resonance as well, but not to the degree Zenos does and she received it later). This further drives home the point that he is our counter.

The WoL travels the world helping others because we want to. Our strength comes from others.
Zenos travels the world seeking combat, his strength is all internal.

The WoL is a "friend to all", an empathetic caring person. Zenos is utterly isolated.

The WoL received his/her Echo "naturally" from Zodiak/Hydaelyn, and it has grown with us as we have traveled. Arguably it has increased our compassion to others as we glimpse parts of their story that shows us their motivation. Zenos received his power artificially and was driven insane by it.

The MC has defeated everything they've come across, including Zenos. So at this point he's as much of a "who cares". We've already defeated him, he already took his life. Against the unsundered Ascians (well mostly Elidibus and Hades, since Lahabrea wore himself out), and especially Hades, that victory was aided much by the Blessing of Light (the borrowed power of a primal), which he even makes clear during the fight. On top of that there was all that stored up Lightwarden aether. It took an awful lot to defeat him - more than it did Zenos's original fight, at a point where the MC's soul was more "rejoined" than when he faced Zenos. At this point it isn't so much Zenos's own power that is the focal point, but his willingness to skinride Zodiark... to up the ante. I'm sure the Blessing factored in with Zenos, and particularly Shinryu, but the point is he too has already been defeated once, hence the plan to draw on Zodiark's power for a more "epic" fight.

The reason they brought in Fandaniel is because Zenos is utterly boring. We keep having to be told in English 101 terms why he's such a brilliant character conceptually, but I'm afraid even so, I still find him disposable and uninteresting. There's plenty of ways they can augment Fandaniel's power, if they so chose. Even the Resonance is just a magic mcguffin in the end.

In a way, the fact that Zodiark is a Primal with a "heart" - or a host - makes him that much more disposable. It's not even a case of taking control over him, if such is even possible. Using his aether and becoming his heart would mean becoming Zodiark. If it's a matter of having a strong enough soul to do so, there's enough plot devices to enable Fandaniel - or anyone else - to do it. All that distinguishes Zenos - until Fandaniel came along - is his pure wanton destructiveness in pursuit of his goal.

When people say he's similar to "us", they mean he's a caricature of a certain type of tryhard gamer - it's not so much the in-universe stuff, which is fairly malleable and a case of "make it up as you go along".

I say all this as someone who liked Zenos in Stormblood, but now he's just over-stayed his welcome, and the sooner he goes, the sooner I'll regain my interest in the story, at least partially.

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Originally Posted by Delily

Zenos serves the same function as the Joker does in the Batman series, a foil.

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This maybe true and I am ok with that if you find me one Heath Ledger to finally play him correctly out of 20+ prior iterations that noone really remembers. If they are going full one dimensional driving force narrative like goblin wanting the ring then they need drop the comic book villain stuff and have him start icing some friends.

Zenos needs to show up and take out Krile or something straight up Sephiroth style and right then and there make you realize his goal is to drive you crazy with rage to become like him. At that point you take the high road and take him out like Luke Skywalker.

Maybe have him become Zodiarks new heart.

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Originally Posted by Delily

Zenos serves the same function as the Joker does in the Batman series, a foil.

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I just want to clarify the Zenos is foil theory.

The setup shows that Zenos is a foil, but that only comes to fruition if the interaction with Zenos actually causes the WOL to change their behavior when they recognize the similarity. As a literary term this can only analyzed properly from the end of the story.

Until that is achieved, its only setup to be that way and may not go that way at all. So until we get the fight Zenos is jonesing for and it fundamentally changes the WOL they aren't "foiled" yet.

Zenos is the only villain we fight that doesn't have a sympathetic back story. We need that sometimes, you can't have us feeling sorry for every guy we defeat. His personality makes him unpredictable, so you don't know where his story is gonna go.

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Originally Posted by TheRealQuah

Zenos is the only villain we fight that doesn't have a sympathetic back story. We need that sometimes, you can't have us feeling sorry for every guy we defeat. His personality makes him unpredictable, so you don't know where his story is gonna go.

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Although I agree with what you're saying, Gaius didn't have a sympathetic backstory until recently. In fact if you're not super forgiving, you could argue he wasn't sympathetic until well into Sorrows of Werlyt.

So Zenos wasn't the only one.

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Originally Posted by TheRealQuah

Zenos is the only villain we fight that doesn't have a sympathetic back story. We need that sometimes, you can't have us feeling sorry for every guy we defeat. His personality makes him unpredictable, so you don't know where his story is gonna go.

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He already has a frame of a backstory as a coddled prince who was given everything he needed or desired, but was completely cut off from associating with others outside of those grooming him to be the next heir to the throne (Who were not exactly the nicest people), which is why he ended up becoming a battle-crazed sociopath.

I'm not really expecting him to change much at all by the end of 6.x unless the dormant memories within him are somehow awakened and start to influence him.

I don't think he needs a tragic backstory. It's trite if every villain has one.

He needs to be made more interesting by his present-day actions. I think they really missed a chance by not having him learn or re-evaluate anything from his death. He seemed aware and in denial of a chance for repentance in 4.3 when he first reappeared; now he just seems to be back in the same routine and everything is too easy and boring for him again.

Give him a sob story, y'all fall for those immediately.

People keep complaining that Zenos shows up and does nothing, and he does that for an awful lot of scenes... Well, recently sure, but he's not even had the same amount of scenes where he shows up and basically does nothing as compared to the older Ascians, like Elidibus. Elidibus showed up in 2.1 in a big way, and then was our stand in for meanwhiles and erstwhiles and end scenes where he'd say something vague, stare at the planet, and not do anything beyond that.

The only difference for Zenos is that we know what he wants as his end goal, the mystery is in what Fandaniel's cooking up instead. Something that's mildly interesting is that until recently, Zenos hasn't even bothered training or anything, then again, how often do villains get training montages? He is off to find a new sword, and I'm curious to see if he's going to go and get Susano summoned in order to take that blade, cause he has the Susano and Shinryu blades in Dissidia. I don't expect something truly cool or insane, but it'd be cool if he fought the Auspices for a new katana.

As far as fixing him goes... he doesn't need it. There's enough of an allure with his Ancient memories, and how that will tie into our own. He's definitely still a foil for the WoL and the player. I do wonder if he will last into 6.0 or not. I'll be fine whatever they decide to do with him, I'm sure it will be cool. Just as we don't need every villain to have a relatable/sympathetic backstory, we don't need every villain to be deep or engaging outside of the fights either. Most really weren't, honestly, anyway. I think people just by and large like to rag on Zenos.

Personally, I'd like to see him last, and I'd like to see Fordola get wrapped back into the MSQ along with Arenvald. It'd be cool to see her fight against him, even if she was fated to lose. Resonant vs. Resonant.

Also, one more thing.

After he slit his own throat, he achieved immortality. Zenos will need to be killed just like an Ascian, so for all intents and purposes, he is one. I find it likely that we may defeat him, kill him, only to find that he can just come back and we need White Auracite type workings. Unless, of course, he disappoints Fandaniel, and Fandaniel does something that can kill beings like that.

Zenos is a rare character who can just sit there menacingly and still give me a spook.
I actually like where he is TBH...

I actually liked one dimensional Zenos whose only goal was to fight and kill the strongest enemies while caring little to nothing for those around him. I found that motivation strangely... honest for lack of a better term. There were no deeper plans or motivations, no plans to recreate the word, distort the balance. No he wanted us to get stronger and kill us because he saw us as a powerful opponent.

The end of launch Stormblood shouldn’t have been Shinryu, it should have been a 1v1 duel with Zenos where we beat him and he ends his own life having found fulfillment in an opponent he cannot beat. That’s as far as his story should have gone in my opinion.

Zenos is fine as he is. They are very clearly setting up something involving him in the future. I can see at least 2 paths he may go down, and neither of them involves changing him.

I'm very story focused on pretty much everything so I'm able to easily see where things may potentially go. Based on that, Zenos is fine as he is.

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Originally Posted by Puremallace

So as a lot of people know compared to what drives the unsundered Ascians vs what drives Zenos it is like comparing Lord of the Rings trilogy to Dr. Suess.

We are missing some SERIOUS backstory to Zenos so all we see is....hunt yesss the hunt more hunt yeahhhh. Compared to Emet or Elidibus it is a waste of a character.

How to fix
So if the plan is to keep this guy around we need a quest chain somewhere involving the echo showing how Zenos went from an innocent kid to sadistic psychopath. Not sure how you want to do it but if we go from the fine wine that is Shadowbringers back to one dimensional huntboy Zenos for an expansion we are going to have problems.

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Zenos can't be fixed. It does not matter what his backstory is - he will remain a one-dimensional psychopath.

That people gained some sympathy for Elidibus and Emet-Selch was not so much because we learned their backstory but because we finally understood their motive for all their actions, and that this motive (restore the ancient world) was a quite sympathetic and understandable motive.

We already know Zeno's motive for his actions, and it is neither sympapthetic nor easily understandable.

Zenos doesnt need to be fix because, as many pointed before, he's the antagonist to the WoL and he works. Is he a good one? No. Is he bad because he's one-dimensional? He doesn't have to.

The best part of Zenos was when he was in the Elezen body doing something. Now all he does is being bored in throne while Fanandiel (weird name, wont bother) tries way too much to carry the scene.

Having Zenos motivation being having that transendent moment with the WoL is fine he should work more towards it or be more "active" like Emet and Elidibus were.

Honestly Im more intrigued in Fananandiel and what to fight him way more than zenos.
I want

I don't want Zenos to be sympathizing or understandable. The Ancients are more than enough of it.

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Originally Posted by EgilTheStressedMage

I don't want Zenos to be sympathizing or understandable. The Ancients are more than enough of it.

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Can we sympathize with the Ancients? We don't know what originally brought about the "end days" in the first place other than Emet claiming it was their own hubris. Furthermore, the being we are reincarnated from didn't participate in summoning Zodiark or Hydaelyn, implying that neither solution is the "right" choice. And they genocided half of their people to fuel summoning Zodiark.