Which fight Should be the 5.4 Unreal?

We got Shiva for 5.3 Unreal, so which fight should be next for 5.4? One of the few I'm hoping for are Titan, Odin, Leviathan, or Ultima Weapon, though I think Titan is more likely to be chosen.

I think they'll work backwards through ARR ex primals, so I think we'll get Ramuh next.

Good King Moggle Mog, Good King Mog,
Fights in trial unreal!
Good King Moggle Mog, Good King Mog,
Many players he’ll kill!

;P

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Originally Posted by Packetdancer

Good King Moggle Mog, Good King Mog,
Fights in trial unreal!
Good King Moggle Mog, Good King Mog,
Many players he’ll kill!

;P

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http://memegenerator.net/img/instances/43385045.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/DPnkB1t_d.jpg?ma...&fidelity=high

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Originally Posted by Packetdancer

Good King Moggle Mog, Good King Mog,
Fights in trial unreal!
Good King Moggle Mog, Good King Mog,
Many players he’ll kill!

;P

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https://media2.giphy.com/media/LOEI8...dJYvhJ/200.gif

We don't speak the name of that ultimate evil in this house.

So I take it no one will be interested in my idea for a future “Red Choctober (Unreal)” either, then...

If people found shiva hard then i want titan to come and remedy that

Ultross and Typhon.

Fight me.

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Originally Posted by HeulGDarian

If people found shiva hard then i want titan to come and remedy that

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With the current, better, Netcode Titan is actually way easier then Shina, also quite a bit shorter.

With devs saying they weren't happy with Shiva Unreal clears rate I will say next will be another primal with simple mechanics accompanied with a less tight DPS check. Probably Sophia.

Ultima would be fun. You can't cheese the Tank Swap.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

With devs saying they weren't happy with Shiva Unreal clears rate I will say next will be another primal with simple mechanics accompanied with a less tight DPS check. Probably Sophia.

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I am not quite sure what they could actually do. Shiva has like 3 simple mechanics.
Levi or Garuda maybe?
Also Sophia would destroy usual PF groups at min ilvl.

Would like to see Ravana

Hmm, if they're unsatisfied with Shiva clear rates, I imagine they're comparing the Unreal clear rates for one whole patch duration to the Extreme clears from one whole patch duration. Maybe they thought they gave us the easiest primal, but they couldn't be sure or aren't taking the terrible reward system into consideration.

Hmmm, easier than Shiva Extreme... Hmmm.... I know tons of people beat the smack out of Leviathan Extreme with almost no trouble at all. I'd assume him to be next then. Especially since they recently tightened up his Tidal Wave vs. the Magitek forcefield generator.

Maybe it'd be easier to list which ones we know would be too hard if revisited.

No Way in the 7 Hells list:
Sephirot Ex
Nidhogg Ex
Thordan Ex
Zurvan Ex (there will be no skipping Soar)
Titan Ex
Moggle Mog Ex (Phew)
Shinryu Ex
Tsukuyomi Ex

I think everything else is fair game, but regardless of what they pick, I don't think they'll see a pop-up in clear numbers because the rewards just make doing it not worthwhile.

Judging by my experiences in Mentor Roulette, Titan won't be the killer, Moggle Mog won't be the killer - it will be Ramuh that turns out to be the real problem.

The coordination to clean orbs while keeping some available for tanks, along with players needing to shock folks out of stun without giving them TOO MUCH shock, tanks needing to occasionally dip into Overcharge to leave orbs for chains - Ramuh requires cooparation and coordinaiton more than any other ARR primal. It's the only ARR primal that I can't reliably clear in Mentor roulette.

Yes, bring on the screams from people forgetting that the middle is not a safe zone and just died to delta attack again. I'm so glad the moogles didn't drop a pony and just a super rare crafting mat.

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Originally Posted by Flay_wind

I am not quite sure what they could actually do. Shiva has like 3 simple mechanics.
Levi or Garuda maybe?
Also Sophia would destroy usual PF groups at min ilvl.

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Attention levels scale up and down to the fight. An example of that would be Shiva's column knockback attack. It comes during bow phase. Everyone knows it comes during bow phase. Everyone is DPSing away as she mostly auto attacks in this stance, and then boom! 3-6 players get blasted out of nowhere. It is called tunnel visioning.

I would not be surprised if a mechanically more difficult fight is actually cleared at a higher rate than Shiva Unreal.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

With devs saying they weren't happy with Shiva Unreal clears rate

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It's their own fault. Shiva unreal is very simple on mechanics. The "difficulty" is in the enrage timer. It requires you do a reasonable rotation and know your class moderately well before stepping into endgame. Sounds fair, but somehow it's a stumbling block.

The devs have spent years fostering a hand-hold mindset that does everything to avoid asking the player to know their class or learn a proper rotation. All the MSQ and all instances right up to and including lv80 can be completed doing below 50% of your potential. Even in EX and the first 3 Savage bosses you can scrape though with some subpar players and multiple deaths, as long as a few have gear, play well and can carry. I've seen e5s with no damage healers, or healers beating most of the dps and still managing to scrape a clear, and let's not start on 15 death Ruby EX clears.

Unreal Shiva just highlights how bad it has become.

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Originally Posted by Ceasaria

Would like to see Ravana

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I second this one.

Shiva again, but the music is slightly different.
We haven't fought enough Shivas.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

With devs saying they weren't happy with Shiva Unreal clears rate

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Are they really unhappy or just surprised? I don't remember what the unofficial translation said and it doesn't look like the English digest has anything to say about it beyond stating that the difficulty has been balanced for both veteran and newer players to be able to work together to clear.

The question that's bothering me: Is it low clear rates because players are not forced to learn their job in any meaningful capacity throughout shb and sb, or is it because there's bugger all reward?

I personally believe its both, but which one they focus on correcting will be important. I seen many people complain that its "hard" (its one of, if not the easiest ARR ex primal mechanics wise, granted the enrage trigger is quite fluid)
But then again, there's an abundance of players who think that you shouldn't do mechanics and instead go for uptime which is completely wrong, ask any healer.

The lack of reward though is also a huge factor. The ribbon and mount can be acquired through WT and the rest of it is materia and there's better ways of getting it.


I hope for Ultima or Odin. I know its unlikely to be Titan because they said he would be traumatic. Ultima had some fun mechanics but ilvl cheese came too quick

Wouldn't a clear rate be estimated against total attempts? If there is a lack of participation, that's a different metric.

thats my point, we don't if devs define clear rate as a duty completion percenntage or as a numerical value- Ie they want 40% of all attempts to succeed, or do they want 200000 clears a week across the world?

The former is lack of playerbase skill, the latter is lack of rewards incentivising attempts

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Originally Posted by Recon1o6

thats my point, we don't if devs define clear rate as a duty completion percenntage or as a numerical value- Ie they want 40% of all attempts to succeed, or do they want 200000 clears a week across the world?

The former is lack of playerbase skill, the latter is lack of rewards incentivising attempts

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Well, here's what the English digest provides:

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The difficulty of Unreal trials is balanced in a way so that newer players and veteran players can work together to clear.
On the other hand, we’ve received feedback that the rewards are a little lacking, so we’re looking into doing something about it.

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So maybe we can take the first sentence as a response to people saying it's too hard and the second sentence as a response for people saying it's not rewarding enough.

So both issues are referenced, but do not seem to be directly related. So if Yoshida did say something about it being difficult, I think it's only talking about people who attempted it (and possibly wanting it nerfed) and thus they gave a statement that people should be able to work together to clear even with newer players.

Spice things up a bit and make it Unreal Savage fight. Godka please.

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Originally Posted by Jennah

We haven't fought enough Shivas.

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"Hey, anyone want to run Titan to help someone clear it?"
"Sure, a sprout need a clear? That one's easy."
"No, not that Titan, the other Titan."
"Ugh. I don't know if I want to try an E4S clear party tonight."
"No, not that Titan, the other other Titan."
"This is confusing. Can we do something else?"
"Sure. Want to fight Shiva?"
"..."

All my joking aside, there's a part of me that genuinely would like to see Thornmarch Ultimate; it's a fight that seems so easy and silly at first take, the mechanics are awfully straightforward, but it still actually requires a little bit of coordination if you do it right. I'm genuinely curious what would happen. (Please make any revisiting of Thornmarch an ultimate and not a savage; after what happened to Ramuh in Eden, I'm half-terrified to see the WoL's unconscious take on His Most Mog-nificient Majesty.)

But if we're only drawing from ARR, then yeah, Leviathan would also be an excellent choice. If we can pull from anywhere... I'd love to see Ravana, Lakshmi, or Sophia get the Unreal treatments.

Now, my true nightmare for an Unreal trial would be if they gave us "The Steps of Faith (Ultimate)"...

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Originally Posted by Packetdancer

All my joking aside, there's a part of me that genuinely would like to see Thornmarch Ultimate; it's a fight that seems so easy and silly at first take, the mechanics are awfully straightforward, but it still actually requires a little bit of coordination if you do it right. I'm genuinely curious what would happen. (Please make any revisiting of Thornmarch an ultimate and not a savage; after what happened to Ramuh in Eden, I'm half-terrified to see the WoL's unconscious take on His Most Mog-nificient Majesty.)

But if we're only drawing from ARR, then yeah, Leviathan would also be an excellent choice. If we can pull from anywhere... I'd love to see Ravana, Lakshmi, or Sophia get the Unreal treatments.

Now, my true nightmare for an Unreal trial would be if they gave us "The Steps of Faith (Ultimate)"...

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After pugging thormach ex so many times i learned how to get everyone on the same page the easiest.


The Fight works like this, we need to get the moogles low and kill them at the same time thrice. The third time the boss enrages.

Then i explained the 2 mog tanks , the blm and holy , the ranger aoe and the instakill that needs to be esuna'd


Seems that explaining the first thing is much more important than explaining its individual thing. People just get overloaded

Odin. Everybody has forgotten about him. Give him weapon drops for Unreal, let him remind all why you should fear Zantetsuken.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Odin. Everybody has forgotten about him. Give him weapon drops for Unreal, let him remind all why you should fear Zantetsuken.

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...you know what? Yes. I'm changing my answer. Odin Unreal needs to happen.

Cape Westwind (Unreal). Check through the old chatlogs in there and pick the 15 most common meme attacks people made up, put those in the game - and have him pick one by random, instead of a fixed script.

Odin, Thornmarch or

The Landslides... oh gods, the Landslides...

First 2 because I really want to feel the punishment.

The other because memes.

Steps of Faith Unreal. Feel the salt. Taste the salt. Be the salt.

Ultima's Bane please! Didnt try ff14 on launch so this fight is a mystery

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

Steps of Faith Unreal. Feel the salt. Taste the salt. Be the salt.

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https://www.dropbox.com/s/87ufu5fldk...ernal.gif?dl=1

If they want an easier difficulty than Shiva EX can't go lower than Bismark or Lakshmi EX, better rewards is just simple boost amount of faux levels you get given so done in like 8 weeks of 2 attempts a week for the mount.

But honestly I wanna see Ifrit EX and watch the death and carnage from healers going:

https://images.app.goo.gl/wf6zHh5KS54vj6op9

I sincerely do not know what they are going to pick that is easier than Shiva, considering she is one of the easiest primals. Like Crushnight said, I really only think Bismark/Lakshmi/(maybe) Garuda would be easier...

I just really hope it's not Bismark or Leviathan. Those were going to be the only two I ever skipped. I hope at some point they will rotate them out weekly instead of by patch because when they land on something as unpopular as Bismark, Unreal will be deader than a doornail.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Odin. Everybody has forgotten about him. Give him weapon drops for Unreal, let him remind all why you should fear Zantetsuken.

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It's kinda funny. I've been soloing him since Stormblood, but now that we have the HP to live through Zantetsuken, I wanted to see what he would do. So I beat him down, stood there, and it does 99,999 to you. Then he just stands there, because they didn't program anything after that. If you don't kill him in 10 or so seconds, the fight resets for no reason lol.