probably stop making multiple threads about the same topic

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A certain forum user is resurrecting old threads in order to disrupt the forums - sadly it means that a new player or casual forum viewer just sees a a very distorted view of the forum as a result.

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Originally Posted by usernameuwu

i also find it hilarious that a lot of these old threads get necrod. i havent used forums in a long time but i thought those older ones get deleted after a while??

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Aside 1.0 version of the game, nothings been locked.
It allows free discussion on anything you want if it's already been discussed.

So what do you want? Old topics to get locked or to combine everything into larger discussions?

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Originally Posted by Bearded

A certain forum user is resurrecting old threads in order to disrupt the forums.

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And there's nothing we can do about it.

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Originally Posted by Haruka_R

And there's nothing we can do about it.

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To be fair, this is one of those situations where the answer is literally just "don't be upset."
He's not really breaking rules. A disruption is only because people feel disrupted, not that there was any actual disruption in using the site or fourms.
If you stop feeling disrupted, there's no disruption.

How long as "don't feed the trolls" been a rule? It's like Internet 101 here guys.

It IS a disruption, and a blatantly bannable one at that consdiering how much damage it is doing to the OFFICIAL FORUMS for the game. He is pushing all new, pertinent threads down and off the front page in order to fill the forum with old controversial threads that HE has decided he wants people to post in. It's becoming increasingly difficult to actually talk here about what's happening in the game NOW because of this. The forums are a dumpster fire right now and it's honestly unbelievable, even by SE's piss poor forum moderating standards, that nothing is being done. This guy is using level 80 accounts. He doesn't have an endless supply of them, so ban them as soon as they pop up and he will go away sooner or later. I've been reporting every single necro post I see him make and marking them as Trolling, and if everyone else that is being bothered by this did the same, maybe we'd see something done.

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Originally Posted by Espritduo

It IS a disruption, and a blatantly bannable one at that consdiering how much damage it is doing to the OFFICIAL FORUMS for the game. He is pushing all new, pertinent threads down and off the front page in order to fill the forum with old controversial threads that HE has decided he wants people to post in. It's becoming increasingly difficult to actually talk here about what's happening in the game NOW because of this. The forums are a dumpster fire right now and it's honestly unbelievable, even by SE's piss poor forum moderating standards, that nothing is being done. This guy is using level 80 accounts. He doesn't have an endless supply of them, so ban them as soon as they pop up and he will go away sooner or later. I've been reporting every single necro post I see him make and marking them as Trolling, and if everyone else that is being bothered by this did the same, maybe we'd see something done.

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I've also been putting in a report against this user every time I see a necro thread with their name on it.

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Originally Posted by Arngrim_Greyashe

I've also been putting in a report against this user every time I see a necro thread with their name on it.

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There are quite a few people doing this systematically. I guess we'll know within the next couple of weeks how good/bad the forum moderating is. He's been posting on 5-6 accounts so far. Helps to include all his account names in the reports.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

How long as "don't feed the trolls" been a rule? It's like Internet 101 here guys.

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And yet its the most Foreign concept ever

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Originally Posted by Canadane

To be fair, this is one of those situations where the answer is literally just "don't be upset."
He's not really breaking rules. A disruption is only because people feel disrupted, not that there was any actual disruption in using the site or fourms.
If you stop feeling disrupted, there's no disruption.

How long as "don't feed the trolls" been a rule? It's like Internet 101 here guys.

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How do you just "don't get upset", though? Let's be real here. Even if you posted nothing about it, acting as if you ignored it, he knows it disrupts other people, because getting upset about not being properly able to use something is natural, and you can't just "hide" it from the troll, because he still knows it bothers people and if people don't complain and nothing is done about it, he wins. But that's the issue in this situation. It's not just about the troll himself anymore, it's about the measures taken (or lack of them in this case). At this point is more about the frustration from the moderating team not doing something about it, when it's blatant. You can't be so blind to just say "he's not breaking the rules", because he is:

Posting a number of posts with the same content.
Posting aimed to create a negative impact on the community or its members.
Posting seeking to damage or disparage Square Enix, the forum, FINAL FANTASY XIV, or others.
Doing anything that obstructs the use of the forum or FINAL FANTASY XIV for other users.
Attempting to harm or obstruct the operation or use of this forum.

^Taken from FFXIV forum guidelines.

You can't just stop feeling disrupted. We're humans, not robots. That's like someone being in the middle of the road obstructing traffic and telling people to not get upset about it and just wait there waiting for the troll to just move along. Nah, you get the proper authorities to deal with them, but again, that's what is NOT happening here, which is the issue more than the troll himself.

This whole thing shows two possible scenarios.
1) The moderators are aware but not acting upon it for some reason, which is already bad on its own.
2) He's friends with moderators and getting a free pass, which I don't think I would have to explain why that's a bad thing.

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To be fair, this is one of those situations where the answer is literally just "don't be upset."
He's not really breaking rules. A disruption is only because people feel disrupted, not that there was any actual disruption in using the site or fourms.
If you stop feeling disrupted, there's no disruption.

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???

"[says something blatantly offensive]"
*people get offended*
"well I did nothing wrong; it's your own fault for being so offended!"

Necrobumping a bunch of old threads specifically to be disruptive is disruptive. Stop making excuses for it.

Consider that there is a post limit for a moment and how many people post on these forums. If people actually ignored the necrotroll and didn't post in those threads then they would be quickly bumped off the first page by topics that people do care about and want to post in. Necrotrolls literally can't disrupt this forum unless others help him...so literally don't feed the troll and its not a problem.

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Originally Posted by Alien_Gamer

Consider that there is a post limit for a moment

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Consider that there is a moderating team for a moment. Funnily enough, they seem to be moderating people discussing about it, but not the problem itself. People shouldn't have to be fighting this troll like this to begin with. Also he has several accounts to bypass that limit. Even if his necro threads were ignored, he's bumping them constantly to front page and pushing everything out, or making his own troll threads copy pasted from past ones. Players have to constantly check other pages and sometimes the bumped threads to know it's not a necro from the already known troll. Ignoring it doesn't make it go away.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

To be fair, this is one of those situations where the answer is literally just "don't be upset."
He's not really breaking rules. A disruption is only because people feel disrupted, not that there was any actual disruption in using the site or fourms.
If you stop feeling disrupted, there's no disruption.

How long as "don't feed the trolls" been a rule? It's like Internet 101 here guys.

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From the rules themselves "Please do not make a simple post just for the purpose of "bumping" a thread."

This individual is very clearly breaking this one.

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Originally Posted by Alien_Gamer

Consider that there is a post limit for a moment and how many people post on these forums. If people actually ignored the necrotroll and didn't post in those threads then they would be quickly bumped off the first page by topics that people do care about and want to post in. Necrotrolls literally can't disrupt this forum unless others help him...so literally don't feed the troll and its not a problem.

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That requires people to actually look at the date the thread was created, and when the most recent comments(yes, plural as in the last page, maybe two worth) were. But good luck having people read anything.

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Originally Posted by Alien_Gamer

Consider that there is a post limit for a moment and how many people post on these forums. If people actually ignored the necrotroll and didn't post in those threads then they would be quickly bumped off the first page by topics that people do care about and want to post in. Necrotrolls literally can't disrupt this forum unless others help him...so literally don't feed the troll and its not a problem.

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For that to work, the volume of other discussion across different threads has to outweigh the number of bumped threads.

This additionally is a self-feeding problem because the bumped threads make it harder to see the actual active discussions (or making people avoid the forums entirely, at least until things settle), making it less likely for people to post.

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Originally Posted by Espritduo

It IS a disruption, and a blatantly bannable one at that consdiering how much damage it is doing to the OFFICIAL FORUMS for the game. He is pushing all new, pertinent threads down and off the front page in order to fill the forum with old controversial threads that HE has decided he wants people to post in. It's becoming increasingly difficult to actually talk here about what's happening in the game NOW because of this. The forums are a dumpster fire right now and it's honestly unbelievable, even by SE's piss poor forum moderating standards, that nothing is being done. This guy is using level 80 accounts. He doesn't have an endless supply of them, so ban them as soon as they pop up and he will go away sooner or later. I've been reporting every single necro post I see him make and marking them as Trolling, and if everyone else that is being bothered by this did the same, maybe we'd see something done.

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There's this thing called page 2.
There's even more pages, if the legends are to be believed.

Go find topics you're interested in and post in them, stop fretting over topics you don't want to post in.

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Originally Posted by M0rrigan

How do you just "don't get upset", though? Let's be real here. Even if you posted nothing about it, acting as if you ignored it, he knows it disrupts other people, because getting upset about not being properly able to use something is natural, and you can't just "hide" it from the troll, because he still knows it bothers people and if people don't complain and nothing is done about it, he wins.

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Here's how you don't get upset at it:

I was actually going to just end the post there but I figure if I don't spell it out for people it may not get across correctly.
Chill out. Stop putting too much investment over this activity. It's not the core of your existence at stake here. And you typing up a large post such as you did is completely counteracting your goal of stopping it. Again, Internet 101.

Regardless of whether or not you can ignore it, it's still actually breaking the rules he's not promoting discussion, he's actively suppressing it by forcing threads off front page by spamming 9 threads from 2018.

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Originally Posted by Kiurai

Regardless of whether or not you can ignore it, it's still actually breaking the rules he's not promoting discussion, he's actively suppressing it by forcing threads off front page by spamming 9 threads from 2018.

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For the record, I have never said this guy shouldn't be punished.
I've just been anti-anti-necro for the longest time and well, now's the shining example I suppose. I'm not saying trolls shouldn't be punished.
But also there are more than one page, I often peruse multiple pages of new posts before finding something I'd like to comment on. Just because the first page is his (and 9 out of 25 isn't a whole page) doesn't mean you can't find other places to discuss things.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

From the rules themselves "Please do not make a simple post just for the purpose of "bumping" a thread."

This individual is very clearly breaking this one.

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Usually a bump is to one's own thread, and usually just a blurb like bump- they however usually write a short sentence that is vaguely (if not more) on topic.

I'm not saying people are not allowed to be annoyed, or that he is clearly owning the front page some days lol, but if he called someone a name or wrote literally bump to a post, and that was all, I imagine he'd have a far swifter punishment.

The irony being that ive seen this exact thread topic pop up a few times over the years...

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Originally Posted by Shougun

Usually a bump is to one's own thread, and usually just a blurb like bump- they however usually write a short sentence that is vaguely (if not more) on topic.

I'm not saying people are not allowed to be annoyed, or that he is clearly owning the front page some days lol, but if he called someone a name or wrote literally bump to a post, and that was all, I imagine he'd have a far swifter punishment.

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"blah blah funding FF16" on every thread they bump is not "on topic". When you reply to EVERY THREAD with the same garbage it's obviously bumping. The hilarious part is someone called him out on it and within a day the 2 threads made to call them out were deleted. So we're starting to see that the mods are there.. they just for whatever reason do not feel like enforcing all their rules.

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

"blah blah funding FF16" on every thread they bump is not "on topic". When you reply to EVERY THREAD with the same garbage it's obviously bumping. The hilarious part is someone called him out on it and within a day the 2 threads made to call them out were deleted. So we're starting to see that the mods are there.. they just for whatever reason do not feel like enforcing all their rules.

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Repeating yourself isn't against the rules. . . I know what you're saying but.. calling someone out, in the manner they did at least, is against the rules. Repeating yourself on topic and across different topics, reviving old posts, such like that.. it's not.

All I'm saying, at least generally, is that they're not simply typing bump to a thread and even more particularly not reviving their own threads with little "bump" "/10char" etc. Since bumping your own thread isn't even against the rules if you do it with purpose and content.

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Originally Posted by Shougun

Repeating yourself isn't against the rules. . . I know what you're saying but.. calling someone out, in the manner they did at least, is against the rules. Repeating yourself on topic and across different topics, reviving old posts, such like that.. it's not.

All I'm saying, at least generally, is that they're not simply typing bump to a thread and even more particularly not reviving their own threads with little "bump" "/10char" etc. Since bumping your own thread isn't even against the rules if you do it with purpose and content.

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Two rules from the rules thread on the top of the GC that this user is most definitely breaking:

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Please do not post false, fabricated and/or fictitious information. It is unconstructive and will only confuse others. Please be careful with what you post and keep in mind that your words can affect others more than you may expect.

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Please do not make a simple post just for the purpose of "bumping" a thread.

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While I agree the accusatory threads were "witchhunting" to a degree, it's funny that they were actioned before the user that has been regularly breaking multiple rules for several days with nearly every post they make.

It's surprising the amount of people making concessions for someone who's historically been a troll and continues to do so consistently and unapologetically across many accounts.

Do you really feel that "yadda yadda funding FF16" is contributory? Relevant?
bumping threads is against the rules.

Not making a concession, just noting that the rule leaves interpretation that they've not broken it (on the bump rule). Also bumping in so much that you've brought alive your own post, if you did it with a reason beyond just the bump- is not against the rules. If you simply bump, yes. I suppose if it's with purpose someone might not count it as a bump then, so maybe I guess that doesn't count lol.

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Originally Posted by Shougun

Not making a concession, just noting that the rule leaves interpretation that they've not broken it (on the bump rule). Also bumping in so much that you've brought alive your own post, if you did it with a reason beyond just the bump- is not against the rules. If you simply bump, yes. I suppose if it's with purpose someone might not count it as a bump then, so maybe I guess that doesn't count lol.

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Do you have doubts as to their reasons? Is it not obvious what they're doing , over and over, account after account? Is it not obvious to every single forum user? Why is it not obvious to the people whos jobs it is to enforce these rules?

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Originally Posted by usernameuwu

if a topic wants to be discussed again, a new one should be made. nobody on those threads from 2013 is probably even around anymore.

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I've mentioned this before, but a fourm is more than just a place to discuss things between people. It's public, and offers information to people looking for it. Message boards are not just about the conversation, they're also about providing a growing searchable database of Q&A, tips, etc. It doesn't matter if the original posters are still here to communicate further with.
Instead of creating a new topic to post in, I'd advocate to continue using an old one.

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Originally Posted by Shougun

Usually a bump is to one's own thread, and usually just a blurb like bump- they however usually write a short sentence that is vaguely (if not more) on topic.

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You are thinging about self bump which is generally more frowned upon in forum communities.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

I've mentioned this before, but a fourm is more than just a place to discuss things between people. It's public, and offers information to people looking for it. Message boards are not just about the conversation, they're also about providing a growing searchable database of Q&A, tips, etc. It doesn't matter if the original posters are still here to communicate further with.
Instead of creating a new topic to post in, I'd advocate to continue using an old one.

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And as with a lot of software, a lot of those tips and hints ends up being deprecated. Most notably class/job discussion and technical issues.

Seriously, the individual you so dumbfoundly is trying to protect pushed a 3 and another 6 year old thread about latency issues to the front page. Half of his posts are literally about bumping dead and decomposed threads. I've counted!

Is it upsetting? Not really, because as i mentioned he is breaking the rules and as such should be banned. What is upsetting however are people who gives this troll a "free" feeding ground by going around and telling others that he is doing no wrong, which only servers to agitate the community.

Should bumping be ok? Yes obviously, if it actually servers to forward the discussion as indirectly mentioned in the rule.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

Seriously, the individual you so dumbfoundly is trying to protect pushed a 3 and another 6 year old thread about latency issues to the front page. Half of his posts are literally about bumping dead and decomposed threads. I've counted!

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I don't think they're arguing it the best way in relation to the troll, but the overall defence of keeping forum threads open is valid.

The solution to the current problem is not to enforce thread locking but to stop the individual who is maliciously resurrecting threads.

I don't revive old threads very often but it has occasionally been useful to do so, and I don't want that ability restricted just because one person is determined to break the rules. I don't want to be forced to create a second thread if the discussion in the old one is still relevant and valid - especially in the slower forums like the Lore forum.

If we had a discussion six months ago on [obscure thing] and I want to further discuss the thing, it's likely to be more useful to fish that thread out than to start the discussion over. 90% of the people there will be the same people that were there for the original discussion and we can pick back up where we left off. It's also easier to quote the earlier discussion if we have new insight on old statements.

The current bumping needs to be stopped, but I don't agree with the calls to resolve it by locking down the forums.

Just to be clear I'm not giving anyone free tickets lol, I just don't really want to see something spoiled because of one specific issue. We've never had this problem, like this at least, until this specific series of incidents.

That I think they might not be breaking the rule on bumping since they add context was just to say what I think is going on behind the scenes. I'm confident if they witch hunt, name call, or other obvious rules we see enforced that something would happen to them.

It was not a free pass, it was a dispassionate reading of the rule and saying I can see how it would take a while to do something. Need to prove malice and pure troll over just someone with a wildly different communication style and desires. I remember long ago someone was labeled a forum troll and having talked to them, in game, firmly believed it was just the forums not liking them and that person just having their own special way going about things. Name started with an R if that's enough to go by lol.

In general I read rules, for people to live by, more forgiving and free than I read rules for fun lol (Not as in strict game rules but like I push and brush against them as I find it fun). Game says I need to go north means I go south. Says I can't do something now I want to find out how to do it, lol. In real life I tend to go for more chaos and freedom, clearly we are eating the chaos daily right now in a buffet.

It would be interesting to have a GM let us know what they think, maybe they are talking about it now, maybe it's all going as intended and they think people are sensitive, who knows, it would be nice to be able to talk to our lords sometimes lol.

LOL He literally took over the forums. He's M.Bison on nerdrage.

TBH I used to visit and enjoy reading the valid discussions in the General Forum - however now it's just pointless due to this person.

Make ur mind up either multiple or necro... also maybe someone we doesnt know it has been posted before.. and even if they did and they reply with w,e they would have posted youd scream necro.

Thats kinda a double end scenario u know right

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Originally Posted by AncientWillow

Make ur mind up either multiple or necro... also maybe someone we doesnt know it has been posted before.. and even if they did and they reply with w,e they would have posted youd scream necro.

Thats kinda a double end scenario u know right

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It's different. The issue is not, in itself, that an old thread has been brought to the top of the forum because someone wants to continue the conversation. That is not what is happening here.

The problem in the current situation is that it has been done by someone who has no actual intent to actually discuss the old thread - just to pull it up and leave it there to get in the way. And then do it again and again until the forum is full of threads that nobody actually is interested in engaging with.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

It's different. The issue is not, in itself, that an old thread has been brought to the top of the forum because someone wants to continue the conversation. That is not what is happening here.

The problem in the current situation is that it has been done by someone who has no actual intent to actually discuss the old thread - just to pull it up and leave it there to get in the way. And then do it again and again until the forum is full of threads that nobody actually is interested in engaging with.

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Thing is, in this case, no rule is being broken, at let be honest, the guy is a big spender with so many accounts. SE is not going to ban him unless is there no other way around it. Pretty much similar to the housing hoarding "problem", no matter how much injust/annoying or whatever anyone thinks that situation is. If this guy doesn't break the current TOS, nothing will be done.

Additional to this, I think even when someone is genuinely engaging with an old post, there are times where it is and is not "appropriate" to raise a thread. Not severe enough that it should be a rule, but an idealistic "best forum-user's practice" sort of thing.

If the new poster wants to engage in further discussion on the same subject, that's a good reason to bring up a discussion again, especially if the situation hasn't changed and the subject is still relevant.

If it's just to say "that's funny" or "I agree" without adding anything new to the discussion, it's probably not worth waking the thread up just for that.

And if people are talking about the lack of an obvious feature you know is in the game, it's really important to check the date before you helpfully inform them that it exists.

The tentative good news is that he appears to only be using the one account within the last 24 hours so only 10 threads got necro'd today. The reports appear to be having some degree of success.

Edit: Scratch that. He started posting later than usual with one of his accounts. Ah well.

Edit edit: All the posts they made on a couple of their accounts between the 27th and the 29th inclusive have now been removed by the mods.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

no rule is being broken - snip - If this guy doesn't break the current TOS, nothing will be done.

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But he is, that's the thing. Read a couple pages back or check the forum rules/guidelines. He is actually breaking them and for some reason getting away with it. He's not getting action taken against his malicious intent, but the people discussing his actions are. This is the more frustrating part, more than the "troll" himself. These threads are not left unmoderated, they're deliberately left unchecked.

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Originally Posted by M0rrigan

But he is, that's the thing. Read a couple pages back or check the forum rules/guidelines. He is actually breaking them and for some reason getting away with it. He's not getting action taken against his malicious intent, but the people discussing his actions are. This is the more frustrating part, more than the "troll" himself. These threads are not left unmoderated, they're deliberately left unchecked.

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Can you please point me to what rule he is breaking and in what post?

Note: and no. I'm not defending this person. However, on a personal level, I think this situation has been blown out of proportion. At this point just encourage this user to keep doing it. IMO is not that hard to ignore any post bump by him, particularly if you are going to replay "Hello Titanmen" or creating posts "around him". I will be more understanding with people asking for a feature that closes any topic in this forum after X amount of time without activity or any change to current TOS to make crystal clear what's necro.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

Can you please point me to what rule he is breaking and in what post?

Note: and no. I'm not defending this person. However, on a personal level, I think this situation has been blown out of proportion. At this point just encourage this user to keep doing it. IMO is not that hard to ignore any post bump by him, particularly if you are going to replay "Hello Titanmen" or creating posts "around him". I will be more understanding with people asking for a feature that closes any topic in this forum after X amount of time without activity or any change to current TOS to make crystal clear what's necro.

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https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post5436447

And for reference as well, the FFXIV forums guidelnes:
https://support.na.square-enix.com/r...la=1&tag=forum