Idea for drop rates + instanced content.

instanced content should have a long re enter timer or a limit for x amount of times a week depending on what it is.
Reasons for doing this:
>Higher drop rate on items
>Content is lasted longer(you can't spam it, there for you cant figure out hwo to beat it the first night)
>You can make an easy LS scheadul
>Did I say higher drop rates?
>Don't have to do the same thing 200 times to get the piece of armor/weapon you want.

If they would put timers on dungeons say, 2 times a week you can enter an instanced(AV,CC,DH). Maybe 5 times a week(do it all in one or spread it out during the week) for ifrit/moogle. I think that would be just great.

That would easily fill your week with stuff to do and it wont get tiring from spamming it 24/7.
This would also lead to more open world stuff, once you are done for the night you go out and have an adventure or do stuff in the open world(reason for making more open world content).

Note: I would be fine with CF if things were done this way.

Two dungeons a week? How horrible.

I mean, really. With what we currently have I wouldn't mind like an hour lockout on victory for increased drop rates - do one dungeon, do the other, maybe kill a primal, take a short break, repeat. We already kind of do this to avoid the 15 minute timer, but, again, it'd be nice to be nearly guaranteed a blue item from a clear. It'd work well with more dungeons in the future as well since you can just rotate through them while your timers are resetting.

Having your lockouts be so harsh just kills pickup groups hard as well - why would you ever waste your timer on a PUG when you're more likely to get the loot you want with people you know? You might not like it but PUGs are important for MMORPGs - they let you meet new people and play at times that your friends might not be on.

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Originally Posted by Brannigan

Two dungeons a week? How horrible.

I mean, really. With what we currently have I wouldn't mind like an hour lockout on victory for increased drop rates - do one dungeon, do the other, maybe kill a primal, take a short break, repeat. We already kind of do this to avoid the 15 minute timer, but, again, it'd be nice to be nearly guaranteed a blue item from a clear. It'd work well with more dungeons in the future as well since you can just rotate through them while your timers are resetting.

Having your lockouts be so harsh just kills pickup groups hard as well - why would you ever waste your timer on a PUG when you're more likely to get the loot you want with people you know? You might not like it but PUGs are important for MMORPGs - they let you meet new people and play at times that your friends might not be on.

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Well we have to think about the future >.> That is what I'm doing.
PUGS will still happen, when 2.0 comes out CC/AV/DH are really not going to be done much unless you wanna do it for fun than you just do a /shout.

also the bottom part was an example, if you read the top part I put an X there and or a longer re enter timer.

Another thread about drop rates. Sheesh.

Bravo, Mr. Brannigan, my thoughts exactly.

Long lockouts also screw with people that have inconsistent schedules/changing schedules (like with school), as if the rest of the group gets locked out doing content on their own they are unable to help the odd man out if the entire group can't be on at the same time as him.

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Originally Posted by Denmo

Another thread about drop rates. Sheesh.

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Sorrry, no it's not just about drop rates.

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Originally Posted by Estellios

Bravo, Mr. Brannigan, my thoughts exactly.

Long lockouts also screw with people that have inconsistent schedules/changing schedules (like with school), as if the rest of the group gets locked out doing content on their own they are unable to help the odd man out if the entire group can't be on at the same time as him.

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Well there's your pick up group.
You can set a scheadul post it online, if you can't make it to one of the events, oh well, you don't make it. Also if you have a big ls, finding people wont be a problem you can set multiple times for people.

Also, there should be more to the game than these instanced raids >.>

I think the high lockouts wouldnt really work, for new content, it is not to bad, its fresh, new, exciting, people want to do it, so it is all fun. But then when it comes to 3-4th month and you've received nothing, that is when it begins to get depressing, some people get everything and gtfo, not helping anyone. Some others are stuck waiting, or shouting for pickups, and then having horrible experiences, those who have yet to complete said content will be in the worse situation as they likely wont win an awful lot at first and always be SOL.

The whole, no change to Ifrit is bullshit, its old content and should not still have these harsh benefit rates. It almost seems like they will die, with AF Weapons and Garuda Weapons, who is really going to be doing Ifrit/Moogle if those weapons are nothing but luxery items now.

That said, some people (like myself) are a little happy the gear will become a bit dated so I dont have to go through that hellish soul sucking fight to get all the pieces, as I will just stick to the new stuff and keep on track from there on.

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Originally Posted by viion

I think the high lockouts wouldnt really work, for new content, it is not to bad, its fresh, new, exciting, people want to do it, so it is all fun. But then when it comes to 3-4th month and you've received nothing, that is when it begins to get depressing, some people get everything and gtfo, not helping anyone. Some others are stuck waiting, or shouting for pickups, and then having horrible experiences, those who have yet to complete said content will be in the worse situation as they likely wont win an awful lot at first and always be SOL.

The whole, no change to Ifrit is bullshit, its old content and should not still have these harsh benefit rates. It almost seems like they will die, with AF Weapons and Garuda Weapons, who is really going to be doing Ifrit/Moogle if those weapons are nothing but luxery items now.

That said, some people (like myself) are a little happy the gear will become a bit dated so I dont have to go through that hellish soul sucking fight to get all the pieces, as I will just stick to the new stuff and keep on track from there on.

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You know, that "new content" will have to be done 100 times over as well just to get a piece. So why not cut that down to 20 times and make it last 2 months and add other things to the game? That way you wont get tired of it by the time it gets "dated"

This kind of idea was fine for endgame dynamis runs in FFXI, because there was so much other content to be doing.

As it stands right now in XIV, not so much. Locking players into X number of instances per week is a little harsh, when those instances are just about all they have to do at the moment. Maybe later when the game is more developed.

Edit: As for drop rates, it's been said before. Drop rates of DL gear have been calculated so that players will keep playing until the next patch comes out.

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Originally Posted by Denmo

This kind of idea was fine for endgame dynamis runs in FFXI, because there was so much other content to be doing.

As it stands right now in XIV, not so much. Locking players into X number of instances per week is a little harsh, when those instances are just about all they have to do at the moment. Maybe later when the game is more developed.

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As I said, we have to think about the future, that is what I'm doing.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

Well there's your pick up group.
You can set a scheadul post it online, if you can't make it to one of the events, oh well, you don't make it. Also if you have a big ls, finding people wont be a problem you can set multiple times for people.

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No, fuck that.

"Hey guys my class was cancelled today I can play tonight!"

"Sorry we did the dungeon yesterday we can't enter for 3 days"

"Oh I guess I have nothing to do then."

Most of us like playing with our friends even if they aren't able to be on all the time, and no one should ever have to bend over backwards to schedule for a game.

We are missing an important part of these dungeons....

It's not all about getting the goodies.

Some of us may actually want to repeat it more often for some legitimate reasons:
1) Fun... we may like doing it!
2) Practice... we may want to get better at doing it, perhaps try it with different jobs.
3) Training.. we may want to take LS mates or other people who have not done it and help them.

I.e: LS Tank has done this many times, and wants to train up a few other LS tanks who have not.. he could do 3-4 runs that nite and teach lots of LS members how to tank and otherwise do the dungeon.

This suggestion would exclude that possibility.

There is more to this world than the shiny stuff hiding in the chest.... especially since it hides so well ^.^;

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Originally Posted by Estellios

No, fuck that.

"Hey guys my class was cancelled today I can play tonight!"

"Sorry we did the dungeon yesterday we can't enter for 3 days"

"Oh I guess I have nothing to do then."

Some of us like playing with our friends even if they aren't able to be on all the time, and no one should ever have to bend over backwards to schedule for a game.

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As I also said, there should be more to a game than instanced content, and with Content Finder being implemented they can find a group easy.

But if we are available and willing to help our friends when they are on why shouldn't we be able to?

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Originally Posted by Asiaine

We are missing an important part of these dungeons....

It's not all about getting the goodies.

Some of us may actually want to repeat it more often for some legitimate reasons:
1) Fun... we may like doing it!
2) Practice... we may want to get better at doing it, perhaps try it with different jobs.
3) Training.. we may want to take LS mates or other people who have not done it and help them.

I.e: LS Tank has done this many times, and wants to train up a few other LS tanks who have not.. he could do 3-4 runs that nite and teach lots of LS members how to tank and otherwise do the dungeon.

This suggestion would exclude that possibility.

There is more to this world than the shiny stuff hiding in the chest.... especially since it hides so well ^.^;

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Ya I under stand that, that's what these threads are for are to discuss.
Maybe a 5 hour time limit on re entering?

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Originally Posted by Estellios

But if we are available and willing to help our friends when they are on why shouldn't we be able to?

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What do you think would be fair?

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Originally Posted by Rokien

What do you think would be fair?

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Short lockouts like we have now that don't completely fuck you out of helping friends/doing PUGs?

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Originally Posted by Rokien

Ya I under stand that, that's what these threads are for are to discuss.
Maybe a 5 hour time limit on re entering?

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Would make it hard to do 2-3 training sessions as part of an LS Event.

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Originally Posted by Brannigan

Short lockouts like we have now that don't completely fuck you out of helping friends/doing PUGs?

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Content finder?

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Originally Posted by Asiaine

Would make it hard to do 2-3 training sessions as part of an LS Event.

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They could make it you can enter as many times as you want as long as you don't win.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

You know, that "new content" will have to be done 100 times over as well just to get a piece. So why not cut that down to 20 times and make it last 2 months and add other things to the game? That way you wont get tired of it by the time it gets "dated"

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Add other things to the game? Do you think they are just holding back and not adding content for the sake of letting other content dry out? No they cant add other content, it will be 2 months doing it 20 times and the other times you'd be standing around doing nothing because there is no other exciting content, unless you go back and do the old, who wants to do that.

I dont think you read my post, people dont really care how many times they do things over n over when its new, fresh and exciting, its when that becomes the only worthwhile thing to do and has a bad setup.

No one really complains about the Dark gear, its epic gear, shouldnt be easy, they just jelly some can get it in 2 runs others cant, but at least you can pass it around, its not forced into your loot.

Primals force stuff into your loot meaning you have to keep going n going until you get it into your loot or you get enough totems, wouldnt be so bad if. Higher Totem droprate or dont force shit into inventory and make it go to a tradable lootlist.

You some how confuse "lots of attempts" vs "a long time."

It is not the lots of attempts that is the problem, its the long time its taking against the amount of attempts. You could do Dynamis every 3 days at one point, doesnt meant you had a good chance at THF AF2 or RDM Chaps!

No thanks. I've done that in almost every previous MMO I've played and I don't want to again organize my real life around a specific time on the specific day in the week, run from work to home just so I could raid. If other people want that sort of commitment that's fine. I however do not.

I would not mind a few instanced dungeons of 'proper endgame' to have this timer, but leaving that idea till 2.0 and am definitely against longer timers on all instanced content.

Just another Rokien thread. I like helping ffriends so to hell with this idea, the only thing tthis idea eencourages is member eexclusivity in an LS, due to lockout u'd want to play with the best possible members for winng, this will certainly left some people hanging dry be it due to skills, schedule, or timezone.

Hell to the no.

This idea will only work for large scale content.

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Originally Posted by Nuinn

No thanks. I've done that in almost every previous MMO I've played and I don't want to again organize my real life around a specific time on the specific day in the week, run from work to home just so I could raid. If other people want that sort of commitment that's fine. I however do not.

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This happens in any MMO when you are playing with other people regularly, IE an LS, you make a schedule and everyone is supposed to turn up on time.

I think this game is lacking some kind of structure for instanced content mostly in the form of lock outs, once a day sounds about right to me.

If they only allowed Primals to be done once a day and a guaranteed token dropped, that would require 10 days to get a weapon. (would only lock a player out on a successful kill)

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Originally Posted by Firon

They could make it you can enter as many times as you want as long as you don't win.

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Yup this !

P.s. I can't believe I actually agree with Rokien for once .. shoot me now !

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Originally Posted by Jinko

This happens in any MMO when you are playing with other people regularly, IE an LS, you make a schedule and everyone is supposed to turn up on time.

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For bigger instances it's ok, as I've said (perhaps in 2.0). Right now with the current ones, or future such instances we're allowed more flexibility. Besides, I can drop out from a party after a few runs in favour of some other LS mate who wishes to do it.

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Originally Posted by Nuinn

For bigger instances it's ok, as I've said (perhaps in 2.0). Right now with the current ones, or future such instances we're allowed more flexibility. Besides, I can drop out from a party after a few runs in favour of some other LS mate who wishes to do it.

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Well you would drop out after one run, assuming you are successful.

Or you could do Ifrit > Moogle > Garuda all in one evening.

Chances are you turn up online at a similar time most evenings, at least most people do, so you just base your schedule when everyone is on.

Obviously in 2,0 we get content finder so being able to come on at any time and just getting a random group will much easier also.

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Originally Posted by Firon

They could make it you can enter as many times as you want as long as you don't win.

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So you are suggesting:
Okey team, we have the final mob down to 2% so it looks like we got this strategy down correctly... now let's all die so we can re-do it!

Umm..............

No thank you! This was the same issue we had with leves back in the day. Wierd schedules, content not available. Causing players to only login during their scheduled times. Let's keep moving forward and not moving backwards.

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Originally Posted by Asiaine

So you are suggesting:
Okey team, we have the final mob down to 2% so it looks like we got this strategy down correctly... now let's all die so we can re-do it!

Umm..............

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How on earth !!! seriously ?

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Originally Posted by Delmontyb

No thank you! This was the same issue we had with leves back in the day. Wierd schedules, content not available. Causing players to only login during their scheduled times. Let's keep moving forward and not moving backwards.

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You are forgetting that content is not leves and with each patch we are getting more and more to do, spamming the same content is boring and monotonous, providing direction to do many different types of content is much better, its extends life expectancy of content and also encourages variety, more variety = less boring and people leaving.

http://i.imgur.com/SwvAN.png

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Originally Posted by Jinko

This happens in any MMO when you are playing with other people regularly, IE an LS, you make a schedule and everyone is supposed to turn up on time.

I think this game is lacking some kind of structure for instanced content mostly in the form of lock outs, once a day sounds about right to me.

If they only allowed Primals to be done once a day and a guaranteed token dropped, that would require 10 days to get a weapon. (would only lock a player out on a successful kill)



Yup this !

P.s. I can't believe I actually agree with Rokien for once .. shoot me now !

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I pretty much agree with this here. I like the idea of a lock out coupled with increased drop rates, but I wouldn't want the lockout to be TOO long.

In regards to the argument that LS might not be able to run together if some are locked out, well even without a lockout I think this kind of happens anyway. If you miss the scheduled event, then you will just have to wait for next time. Luckily for you, we will have a Content Finder in 2.0 (in whatever form it ends up taking, let's not start that up here!).

not a bad thread Rokien, of course your name will bring hate regardless. I think most people would find it ok if like you suggested increased drop rates and a lot more dungeons to choose from

I would be fine with what jinko said. Once a day or so.

If you have more than 8 members in a ls, people are going to be left out no matter what.
"K GUYS WE DOING IFRIT RUNS TODAY WHO WANTS TO JOIN?"
"ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME"
Ooops who you going to leave out today?

With this low man content people are going to be left out ALL the time, its not till we get something big like Hamlet Defence battles. Though, that is not an instance(hopefully).

You guys can't be happy with spamming AV 10 times a day with nothing to show? I mean how boring is AV now, I limit my self to once twice a week right now because I do not wanna do the same instance over and over again. If I wanna do that I'd go play vindictus.

@Krausus
Ya, well right now we don't have much content that I understand. Once we get closer to 2.0 I would like them to move towards this setup for instances.

@Wolfie Keep on trucking

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Originally Posted by Rokien

I would be fine with what jinko said. Once a day or so.

If you have more than 8 members in a ls, people are going to be left out no matter what.
"K GUYS WE DOING IFRIT RUNS TODAY WHO WANTS TO JOIN?"
"ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME"
Ooops who you going to leave out today?

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This may not be the case with all LSs... i'm in some where it is:

Okey, who wants to do Ifrit, show up.
Okey, there are 12 of us. 8 will go in, the other 4 can farm tapers. Then we will swap 4 and go in again. Then we will swap 4 again and go in again.

That way everyone gets a turn.

Your option would exclude that possibility and really leave 4 people out in the cold who would then turn to content finder and wonder what the benefit of an LS is ; ;

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Originally Posted by Asiaine

This may not be the case with all LSs... i'm in some where it is:

Okey, who wants to do Ifrit, show up.
Okey, there are 12 of us. 8 will go in, the other 4 can farm tapers. Then we will swap 4 and go in again. Then we will swap 4 again and go in again.

That way everyone gets a turn.

Your option would exclude that possibility and really leave 4 people out in the cold who would then turn to content finder and wonder what the benefit of an LS is ; ;

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Isn't that what the content finder is for? Hey don't wanna wait! LETS DO THIS NOW! People don't like waiting on this game(as you can see on the forums, if need be I can give you TONS of quotes).

some of you guys are to complex all im saying.

clone ffxi's avatar fights reward system for the primal fights.

raids need a similar system either choose one reward after a win or collect 100% win items 1 for each person every win to trade in for a reward after you get enough for a item. this way you wont be wasting time and have motivation to keep doing them.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

Isn't that what the content finder is for? Hey don't wanna wait! LETS DO THIS NOW! People don't like waiting on this game(as you can see on the forums, if need be I can give you TONS of quotes).

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Umm... I did indicate in my suggestion that people would end up going to Content Finder.. I'm just not sure that an LS should end up alienating its own members and sending them to Content Finder for random pickup-up-groups because SE decide to impose a timer on how frequently adventurers go into the dungeons, so they don't tire themselves out.

As for people who do not wait..... Just last nite one of my LS officers waited from doing CC so she could do it with her whole LS. I cancelled all other plans that nite so I could do it with my LS. There may be those who are impatient and only want things 'now now now', but let us not suggest that applies to everyone. Not all of us are impatient or have succumbed to the instant-gratification-world as many others have.

On a side note: the idea of limited number of 'runs' per day (by means of a spawn rate of 6 or 36 or what not hours) may have worked in FFXI, but keep in mind... the entire LS could show up. There was no 'limit' of 8.

What you are suggesting may be fine for those 'who want equipment' but it is decremental to those 'who want to have fun with friends'. The latter is why many of us are here ^.^

If you want to restrict the number of farm clears per week without screwing anyone over, put raids on an allowance system. Every player gets raid allowances replenished at a certain rate, and only 1 player has to spend an allowance to start a raid. Miss out on a night of raids? No problem, you still have your own allowances, so you can host more raids for your LS that by definition you can't miss. It would help LSes include more of their entire roster when they have more than 8 active members.

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If you have more than 8 members in a ls, people are going to be left out no matter what.
"K GUYS WE DOING IFRIT RUNS TODAY WHO WANTS TO JOIN?"
"ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME" "ME"
Ooops who you going to leave out today?

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one reason we need more open world stuff to to counter the stuff you cant do right now thats instanced that way you dont need "X" number of people to do stuff.