I think Holy should lose it stun and Gravity should have a stun!!

I believe this is a good thing because I hate having to give cards out when I need to AOE in a dungeon. What do you guys think?

I'm not sure why this means holy should lose its stun

Remove from Holy but create an aoe role action for healers with a stun instead? I mean no reason to leave SCH out of this, or any potential future healer hmm.

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Originally Posted by Kurando

Remove from Holy but create an aoe role action for healers with a stun instead? I mean no reason to leave SCH out of this, or any potential future healer hmm.

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Good idea. And I feared after they took Sleep from WHM and placed it into the role skills section there would be nothing left to take from WHM and give it the other healers in the next expansion.

Or just give Art of War a silence and Gravity a slow.

Honestly gravity should get bumped up to 150 or 160 potency since it has no CC on it. Making holy the weakest of the three potency wise is a nice balance because it's the only one with CC.

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Originally Posted by Greensai

I believe this is a good thing because I hate having to give cards out when I need to AOE in a dungeon. What do you guys think?

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No. I play Healer roles, and Holy has a lore reason to have a stun. Gravity has no lore reason to have one, and frankly being a lazy player is no reason to remove something from one job and giving it to another. Do I think Astrologian needs an AOE crowd control, yes, however, Astrologian has more AOE damage with AOE heals than the other two Healer jobs, plus Astrologian has the option to swap between shields or regen, plus the cards give great buffs. Honestly, a master with Astrologian is the best healer in the game. Which is balanced out but how easy White Mage is to play, and having an auto healer pet with Scholar.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Or just give Art of War a silence and Gravity a slow.

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This.
Hell I'd settle for a Heavy for Gravity, but ot needs some kind of CC.

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Originally Posted by Tint

snip.

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Eh don't worry, WHM will still have the super useful unique action that is Fluid Aura! No other healer wants that as it is for sure!

Speaking as someone who has played all three healers, eh, no. whm should keep its holy stun, AST is fine the way it is.

So, take a niche away from one healer to give it to the already best healer in the game... ?

Art of War and Gravity create weave windows. If they ever changed it, they'd simply remove stun from Holy, make it instant cast and give AST and SCH nothing and we could all be copies of each other.

However, they could probably increase the radius of gravity a little. I'd find that a more welcome change than CC.

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Originally Posted by Kurando

Eh don't worry, WHM will still have the super useful unique action that is Fluid Aura! No other healer wants that as it is for sure!

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Fluid aura used to be useful when it had its pushback lol.

NO, thanks.

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Originally Posted by Gothicshark

Honestly, a master with Astrologian is the best healer in the game. Which is balanced out but how easy White Mage is to play, and having an auto healer pet with Scholar.

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https://thumbs.gfycat.com/AcademicOp...tl-max-1mb.gif

Ease of play and complexity isn't a means of balance... Also, lmao at the scholar comment :D

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Originally Posted by SummerScorcher

Ease of play and complexity isn't a means of balance... Also, lmao at the scholar comment :D

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ikr?

Meanwhile I'm over here all, "Whatever you say dmg buff turret!" ;p

I am of the opinion that healers have lost too much to be attempting to steal what few options they have left. and as such I am also of the option that they should return Stella for the Heavy (and the CC option) and a potential interaction with the cards.

Meanwhile WHM should keep Holy stun and get back Areo III!

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Originally Posted by Chrriiisss

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/AcademicOp...tl-max-1mb.gif

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My sentiments exactly, Eos/Selene heals have been gutted for a while. As of now their only significant benefit over other healers is being able to execute heals and fairy skills from a different position from your player character, which can be useful in doing some niche mechanics, I guess.

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Originally Posted by Hanayome

My sentiments exactly, Eos/Selene heals have been gutted for a while. As of now their only significant benefit over other healers is being able to execute heals and fairy skills from a different position from your player character, which can be useful in doing some niche mechanics, I guess.

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The fairy heal, while a shadow of a shadow of their former glory, are still incredibly useful. She now spams it until all party members are 100% hp and it's delay time is now much shorter. Then when paired with with sch's oGCD heals she is still surprisingly effective. I can't tell you how many bosses I usually only have to use physik or lustrate once or twice. Between fairy heal, her HoT, Indom, and excog it's usually enough to keep people topped off enough that fairy can handle slapping little band-aid heals left and right until the next round of damage. Not to mention Seraph is just hilarious because stacking shields.

Biggest no to this, Give Ast its stun back, it wasn't game breaking it was unfairly removed and you know what, sch can get again its heavy status ailment back via miasma 2 or on Art of War.

Stop looking to strip the healers even more, Whm does not need its stun removed because others healers can't stun, novel idea give the other healers something equivalent.

Gravity can be done at a range, holy is centered on your position though, so yeah stun makes more sense in holy since you are in the thick of the mobs and cant really move while spamming it.

No, at best AST should get their ocgd stun back. I'd also take a slightly larger range of gravity since its centered on a target rather than the player. Sch is ok with no cast time for weaving.

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Originally Posted by Bsrking5

No, at best AST should get their ocgd stun back. I'd also take a slightly larger range of gravity since its centered on a target rather than the player. Sch is ok with no cast time for weaving.

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Yeah Collective Unconscious makes more sense to have a stun. Does a stunning ranged attack even exist? because it does sound kinda OP on paper (OTOH Sleep does the same thing in practice and its usually inflicted by ranged spells)

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

Yeah Collective Unconscious makes more sense to have a stun. Does a stunning ranged attack even exist? because it does sound kinda OP on paper (OTOH Sleep does the same thing in practice and its usually inflicted by ranged spells)

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You mean Celestial opposition?
Outside of blu with bomb toss. Theres ranged silences thou which are lesser but similar to stun. Bomb toss isnt really OP. Faze is better for a longer stun but its a cone.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Or just give Art of War a silence and Gravity a slow.

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This 210%!

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Originally Posted by Bsrking5

You mean Celestial opposition?
Outside of blu with bomb toss. Theres ranged silences thou which are lesser but similar to stun. Bomb toss isnt really OP. Faze is better for a longer stun but its a cone.

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Yeah, got the two mixed up.

Maybe Gravity could have a Slow for CC (Heavy or Bind would make more sense, but Slow is more useful), and Art of War a... idk, Blind? The point is to give each healer something unique, not to take away and make them more generic

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Originally Posted by Greensai

I believe this is a good thing because I hate having to give cards out when I need to AOE in a dungeon. What do you guys think?

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or you know give gravity a heavy or slow debuff.

this thread should have been in healer forums

and no, celestial opposition should get its stun back, holy should keep it, gravity and art of war should get some cc on them and all 3 need a small damage boost

No. Unless you're willing to have Gravity require the Healer to be surrounded by mobs and use the full GCD cast time (basically making it so you can't use oGCD's in between casts like Gravity already can) and for WHM's Holy to now be a ranged spell with a shorter cast time.

I feel the reason why Holy has CC at all is because it requires the WHM to stand amongst mobs and use the entire GCD to cast it, whereas the other AoE Healer spells don't have that same limitation. SCH's is instant cast (and does 160 potency damage instead of 140) and AST's allows them to be at range and even has a shorter cast time (but shares the same damage potency as Holy).

Give AST's Celestial Opposition its stun back. Problem solved.

Yeah, why don't we just give all healers the EXACT same kit as WHM (but leave out the crap like Cure I or Fluid Aura), while all other healers still keep what makes them unique...

I mean, we almost have all that already, so please let the healers keep that tiny little bit that makes them unique to each other. Especially WHM, which is already almost SCH without fairy/AF/shields or AST without cards/oGCDs/shields.

To play your cards during large pulls you have that shorter cast than recast time on Gravity, which works really well. Not that AST can't get some crowd control. Slow maybe. Or give Celestial Opposition back its stun. But Gravity doesn't need to become Holy, especially not if Holy gets kind of deleted.

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Originally Posted by Greensai

I believe this is a good thing because I hate having to give cards out when I need to AOE in a dungeon. What do you guys think?

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We're not card-slinging that many cards with sleeve draw anymore as of 5.3, and 'Draw' is 1 card every 30s. You have plenty of time to use 1 card in-between a gravity cast, if used with lightspeed, that's 2 card buffs you can potentially throw without clipping your next gravity cast.

The ONLY way WHM adds RDPS to their group is through their own damage. Both SCH and AST provide RDPS in the form of their buffs while also being able to contribute damage themselves.

It would be unfair for the other healers to have those buffs while ALSO having the utility of a stun too, especially when AST is so much more friendly when it comes to weaving abilities meanwhile WHM has to clip GCDs just to heal. While SCH might not provide the stun or party buffs that AST does, it at LEAST has a buff for bosses. A small increase for dungeons but it's better than literally nothing.

In fact I wouldn't be against SCH having even higher potency on AoW to make up for the fact that their aoe has no stun and they don't provide any sort of aoe offensive buff themselves. But to give AST anymore would be ridiculous.