The Case Aganast roleplaying as the Warrior of Light

Alright, here I try to discuss the reasons why I think RPing as the WoL (at least ingame) is usually considered taboo. Bear in mind that I'm not involved with any RP communities, nor am I an expert on the topic, so any corrections and discussion on this would be appreciated.

Let's start with the not quite as obvious. The Warrior of Light & Darkness is the protagonist of the story. I argue that one of the points of an RP is being the hero of their own story, one that isn’t crafted by the writers of the game’s.

Now for the real meat of the post. Ahem, I'm also arguing that the other point of an RP is to usually to "live" as part of the relatively mundane world and put simply, the Warrior of Light is too detached from that as they are currently one of a kind in many respects.

1. Let’s start with the Job Crystals. I’m willing to argue that having even a single Job Crystal is a mark of someone special, and that while there can be work arounds for RP characters to have one (Hidden acolyte, theft, an Abin Sur scenario), they are still powerful relics containing ancient forbidden knowledge. Roleplaying as a Black Mage means having to contend with the population of Thanalan not trusting you, roleplaying as an Astrologian means having to explain why Sharlayan didn’t put a hit out on you, etc. But again, workarounds exist. And one might not be seen as a problem by the RP communities. However there is another wrinkle here. The WoLis also capable of mastering multiple if not all Jobs. The Shadowbringers Trailer already established him to be able to use the Soul Crystals of BRD, WAR, DRG, MNK, SAM and DRK. And theJobs are not only esoteric, most of them are usually built on years if not decades of learning, even with a Soul Crystal, and the WoL can master them all.
   • For those of you wanting to point out the RPers with multiple 80s, let me remind you that not everything the player does with that character is canon to their RP
   • The Crafting and Gathering side of things also deserves a mention, despite the standardized gameplay (Fisher notwithstanding), they usually require different skill sets. Blacksmith, Goldsmith and Armorer all work with metals yes, but the metals they work with and how they do so are vastly different. Likewise there is a difference between striking a vein of ore in the middle of a cave or cavern and going “haha Saw go timberrrr” or cutting up plants. Yet again the WoL can use all of these skill sets. Grated this is probably a case where one of the DoL/H could be taken as a hobby in tandem with the Job.
2. Moving onm I must address something, retcons. AFAIK in 1.0-3.0 there were mentions of multiple Warriors of Light, contemporary to the shard of Azem. But since then mention of these supposedly myriad paragons are fewer and farther in between,until the point where the role is ultimately one of a kind and any other claimants to it are either assumed dead inhabitants or another dimension, or both in the case of Ardbert and co.
3. Now with that said. Let’s talk about the Echo. We had recently established that it is not gifted to us by Hydaelyn, but instead something innate that enables us to even hear her.,this on top of the existing benefits of being immune to tempering and one superpower chosen at random (the PC’s is basically Cypher from the X-men without the computer language aspect). This isn’t public knowledge yet (I’ll get to that later), so its not as much of a problem. And just because you can avoid being a husk possessed by a primal doesn't mean you are capable of slaying it, only that you are slightly more likely to. It will take some skill with a weapon or magic to finish the job. But the issue is that it's still a rare ability regardless.
4. Now then. Location, location, location. The Warrior of Light has been to many places beyond the scope of normal adventurers. Places that are usually blocked off,sealed or otherwise inaccessible more mundane folk. (kinda throws a wrench into the "RPs in dungeons" stereotype :P) Among which are…
   • A sacred burial grounds of Dragons, as well as what lies beyond that.
   • Several hard to access Allagan ruins, including the Crystal Tower (well warded), Azys Lla (ditto) and Dalamud (which has the issue of getting tempered by Bahamut for everyone else)
   • An entire alternate universe
   • A recreation of a primordial universe within said alternate universe
   • An undersea palace and village accessible only by those that can breathe underwater (not a common skill)
   • The largest church in Ishgard that is usually inaccessible to the smallfolk bar certain occasions
   • The Void (actually another alternate dimension)
   • A Cyberspace in the Interdimensional Rift
   • An island that was recently emerged and warped by the Lifestream
   • And a gauntlet in the Azim Steppe that is usually done alone.
5. The WoL is also well connected compared to normal adventurers. Think about it, the head of a large tech firm, multiple heads of state, powerful or legendary warriors and monsters. And of course the entirety of the First. Show me someone who lives next door and has claimed to meet celebrities or traveled to other worlds and I’ll show you a chuuni or a liar. See the problem there? And a fair amount of the people they meet tend to revere them.

All of this means that the Warrior of Light is a power fantasy. Which is not always the cup of tea of Roleplayers, but they are also a few steps removed from outright godhood. Which is a problem for people playing with others. And also an issue when writing about said characters. Superman works because people were willing to explore what a godlike individual living among mortals would be like, and how to craft tension despite that (hint: it involves green rocks and exploiting his love for others by hurting them), but that is also because the comics industry by nature if able to writers with the requisite amount of skill needed to make them work, the people that would be seen as the 10% under Sturgeons’ Law (though even that is debatable). In contrast when dealing with amatuer writers onthe internet, you get everything including the 90% who would inevitably fail to do such a problematic premise justice.

Which brings me to the final point, RP is a collaborative effort not everyone is willing to go along with some arrogant jerk’s power fantasy. Not everyone wants to RP as demigods and not everyone wants to be seen as this special paragon who people of moral fiber unanimously loves, has access to the secrets of the universe and can more easily get you an audience with Nanamo. As such you have to consider others’ feelings in the manner and that means you have to avoid archetypes that warp the RP around you.

Thanks for coming to my TED talk. I appreciate any insight into the matter from RPers.

Sorry, I like my power fantasy. lol. My WoL is a WoL for roleplay purposes outside the game [I don't generally rp in game so it doesn't much apply anyway there.] Out of game, WoL rp is actually relatively common [twitter/tumblr/etc.]

Many good points there, but I think the real reason roleplaying as the WoL is discouraged is much simpler:
* You obviously cannot have everyone (in the RP community) roleplaying as the Warrior of Light - that would wreak havok with the canon.
* If only one person, or at most a few, get to RP as the WoL or their close companions, then who would that be? Expecting such a loosely organised community as the RP community to be able to agree on that is really out of the question.
* So the easiest solution is to have nobody RPing as the WoL: Solves a whole lot of problems.

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Originally Posted by MistakeNot

Many good points there, but I think the real reason roleplaying as the WoL is discouraged is much simpler:
* You obviously cannot have everyone (in the RP community) roleplaying as the Warrior of Light - that would wreak havok with the canon.
* If only one person, or at most a few, get to RP as the WoL or their close companions, then who would that be? Expecting such a loosely organised community as the RP community to be able to agree on that is really out of the question.
* So the easiest solution is to have nobody RPing as the WoL: Solves a whole lot of problems.

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I already addressed that in the OP namely the "too one of a kind bit" as well as the bit on retcons.

But yeah in hindsight, it does seem like the mostly likely reason, Occams's razor and all.

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Originally Posted by MistakeNot

Many good points there, but I think the real reason roleplaying as the WoL is discouraged is much simpler:
* You obviously cannot have everyone (in the RP community) roleplaying as the Warrior of Light - that would wreak havok with the canon.
* If only one person, or at most a few, get to RP as the WoL or their close companions, then who would that be? Expecting such a loosely organised community as the RP community to be able to agree on that is really out of the question.
* So the easiest solution is to have nobody RPing as the WoL: Solves a whole lot of problems.

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Otherwise this, though, yeah, in game at least. As I said above, out of game [twitter/tumblr/discord] this rule really does not apply because everyone's WoLs usually have their own cliques they rp with.

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

I already addressed that in the OP namely the "too one of a kind bit" as well as the bit on retcons.

But yeah in hindsight, it does seem like the mostly likely reason, Hanlon's razor and all.

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For the WoL case, yes.

However, the points you bring up touches on certain other character concepts that are typically discouraged within the RP community
* Overly powerful characters, or characters with who have lots of jobs unlocked. (Unlocked in-character that is. Nobody cares how many jobs you have unlocked out of character)
* Characters with close ties to any of the NPCs in the game

Of course, if it is just a few persons doing all the RP within their own circle, they can RP as whatever they agree upon without anyone outside objecting or caring.

Counterpoint: Shadowbringers affirms that multiple WoLs exist.

As for being the WoL, even the story allows for multiple interpretations. Which city did the WoL start their adventures? Was the WoL present in Eorzea before the Calamity? What job(s) did the WoL learn? Etc.

So if you want to RP as a (or even the) WoL, and other people also want to RP as a WoL, just make sure your stories allign. Maybe each of the Scion brought along a WoL, so there were multiple all along. (It gets trickier with Azem's portion, but meh, you could get creative with that too.)

As for being overpowered, the key is relative power. If everyone has the same power level, then that's fine. If one person is doing all the work because they're that powerful and the other people are like the unused TRUST who join after the duty is over, then what's the point?

There's ways to do it honestly. This game has shown over many adventures that there's been many WoL. In my head and my canon I am the WoL of many. My WoL has a very different story then yours or theirs and hell even the main plot of the game itself. The key thing to remember is you can RP the WoL who kills primals and saves the day as often as you like within your group of friends and have it not effect anything really. It's not like you're rping with the entire game all the time anyway. The difference is noone is rping the ACTUAL main character of the game's plot. I think that's where the issues come into play. But long as people are making their own canon that's not the main game's one it's fine. Sides have you been to Ul'dah quicksands? There's like a million chats happening at once. And most people rp within parties so long as everyone in that group agrees you're good. :D

Not saying you don't bring up good points because they are, and are VERY good points on how not to make an OP character who isn't fun to RP with. Good Ted talk.

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

[...]
Moving onm I must address something, retcons. AFAIK in 1.0-3.0 there were mentions of multiple Warriors of Light, contemporary to the shard of Azem. But since then mention of these supposedly myriad paragons are fewer and farther in between,until the point where the role is ultimately one of a kind and any other claimants to it are either assumed dead inhabitants or another dimension, or both in the case of Ardbert and co.
[...]

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As far as my understanding of things goes (note that I am not into RP in this game) there's two kinds of Warriors of Light here.

The original Warriors of Light, the adventurers present at the battle of Carteneau, so essentially characters from 1.0.
Nobody can recall what they looked like, the only thing left in people's recollection are these shining figures - hence the name. As far as I recall of the game touching on the matter the identity of these Warriors of Light has faded into obscurity, and nobody* has made a claim of being one of them.
*except for the tie in to the second kind of WoL as a legacy character, where after finishing 2.0 Minfilia recalls your involvement in the events of 1.0 through her Echo

The Warrior of Light, as in the protagonist of the game starting with ARR.
The adventurer who picks up the mantle of the Warriors of Light of old and, in the process of saving the world time and again, is granted the moniker Warrior of Light because they're a big damn hero.

There have been multiple of the legendary Warriors of Light, this has never been retconned, it's just that pretty much nobody knows what became of them after the calamity.
There's only ever the one contemporary Warrior of Light, the protagonist. (Who may or may not be one of the Warriors of Light of legend as well because the game will twist its lore to conform to your choices just like it does with your starting city and other things.)
As far as the Source goes anyway. Events on the First have shown that all the shards may have their own contemporary Warriors of Light but as far as RP goes saying you are the WoL from a shard that is as of yet unexplored by the game's lore holds just as many issues as roleplaying as the WoL.
There might be some wriggle room here for roleplaying as a 1.0 adventurer who was teleported 5 years into the future (but is not the new WoL) but that's a concept I wouldn't touch with a 10 foot pole. Not for public/ad-hoc RP anyway. In a private RP group anything the members can agree on goes, naturally.

long time RP'er here, although the last few years I've kind of stopped, although I still enjoy the immersive feeling of the RP community.

Ohhh Kayyy, good post, a couple of spoilers in it, FYI some people haven't done 5.3, 5.0, or even 4.0 content yet, just remember when making these kinds of posts, would a new player ie in the last year, without boosts have seen this content. Because the headline will attract new players who happen to be RP players, in fact, I can guarantee it.

on to your points and you make a lot of good ones that the RP community, in many MMORPGs have figured out.

First important bit:

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Now for the real meat of the post. Ahem, I'm also arguing that the other point of an RP is to usually to "live" as part of the relatively mundane world and put simply, the Warrior of Light is too detached from that as they are currently one of a kind in many respects.

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Many Role players do this, they RP as a Fisherperson, a botanist, or like Marielle I RP her as a Mage (a well-studied mage, and master of the arcane arts.), in this game, I've been apart of an RP Sky Pirates FC way back in Heaven's Ward, and frankly, I've kind of kept that RP as her core income earning profession. I do not RP her as THE WOL, but she was there counted amount the number of Warrior's of Light during the fall of Dalamud. But the game lore kind of stated that almost every adventurer was there as a WOL, but only the cinematic trailer dude is THE WOL. Which is why I make sure to make the distinction, was Marielle there to witness the 7th calamity, yes, although in character like everyone else she has foggy memories of it. At the same time, she has been called to fight alongside The Warrior of Light, as I will RP being one of 4, one of 8, and one of twenty-four adventurers to do a thing. A thing which only those with the Echo could do, this isn't a power fantasy, but it does explain her having weapons and gear showing which can only be gotten from some raids or dungeons. It's also why she always has the Black mage Soul Stone equipped. She won't admit out loud she's a Black Mage, but RP wise I play her as having learned the art and gotten the stone. I don't RP her as a summoner or Scholar, but she is a skilled arcanist and can summon a Carbuncle, and she is technically a Scholar of all Magic. She is also skilled with a sword, and bow, as her family raised her to have those skills. Which is how I can explain Red Mage, without her being explicitly one. She knows Black, White, Arcane, and is aware of Red. She also grew up as an Elezen in Ul'dah, which factors into RP a whole lot, her parents left Ishgard to avoid the inquisition, as she had an Uncle who was a Dragon Worshiper. So instead of the default Duskwight back story, I went with the Ishgard angle.

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Long story short, RP Players tend to make a back story that fits the world lore, and then RP as things happen to their character. Having RP of someone skilled is fine, but no one wants to RP against a god unless it's apart of a storytellers campaign, which I've seen, yes RP players will sometimes have a member of their RP group RP as the WOL, an official of the city, or even a Primal or god. But these are a part of long ongoing RPs, and the RP God is a temporary character used for a plot device or other storytelling tool. These characters are usually scripted as well.

It's always fun when a Default Midlander shows up in the level 50 Warrior gear, with the name Hero or other cheese name, to a private house, and everyone has to react to the guy being literally THE Warrior of light. (happened 5 years ago for our FC, the sky pirate one, he was asking our help to face the Void Ark. Yes, our Guild leader used a Fantasia and a temporary name change, just to RP out why we as an FC were going to do the Void Ark. It was a good RP session as well, we then had a huge laugh in Discord about it. That was near the end of me doing lots of RP as well. I kind of miss having a good group to RP with. My fault really, I was still splitting time between this and the Irvine based MMO.)

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So basically your idea works, but exceptions are made for long term stories that work just like a D&D game. With a Story Teller, and a party of adventurers/crafters playing out the story.

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BTW because it's fun to do, my 3 mains:


Marielle Sansoleil - Black Mage Ishgard Elezen grew up in Ul'dah

Mary Jigoku - Dancer, Au Ra Rean, She was born in the village of Sui-no-Sato, in the Ruby Sea, she left home at 16 years old and found her way to Kugane, which eventually lead her to travel to Ul'dah where she started her adventurer career. She is currently only 18 years old. Her birth name was Mariko Shisui, she took the name Mary Hell due to 8th-grade syndrome when she left home.


Caitlyn "Bhump" Aliapoh - Miqo'te Keeper of the Moon -Isekai RP:

Born in 2030 in the Bay Area, to North African and Latin parents, Azeem Garcia lived in a world that was dying, the Phantoms had all but killed most life on Earth. Azeem went to bed one night with his husband and woke the next day in a wagon heading to Ul'dah. With that as a premise, I am using this character as a leveling challenge, and streaming it to twitch, also I am writing a novelization of her leveling adventure. <- Not using her for any active RP because she is going to be the WOL, in fact, I named her Human self Azeem because her husband in that life was named Emmet. Yah, not even going to be subtle in the story, as I want that dynamic that Emet-Selch and the WOL, both are reminded of life on a world long destroyed in the forth Umbral Calamity.

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Additionally, I have a whole list of high-level alts, for more specific RP.

Ashett Tholl - Dwarf from the First RP
Bhump Dabhump - Cat Girl predecessor to Caitlyn "Bhump" Aliapoh, less Isekai, more Sky Pirate.
Marhiel Aloc - Reimagining of my old 2nd Ed AD&D High Elf War-Wizard. All my Mary/Mariel, Marielle, characters are based loosely on my AD&D character. Mary was not her first name, and I can't say what it was because I can be an idiot at times and not notice a thing for years, and couldn't figure out why people laughed when I would say her name. Note I'm bad with names and use to name things based on the reverse spelling of a thing I saw. In this case, it was a can of cola. You can figure it out.
Dhuem Bhuenay - doom bunny, made the character as a lala way back when.
Llis Yesirel - Bunny Girl for fun
Mary Winter - My first character was a Lalafell in 1.0, now a femroe.

I do recall in the thread I made some time earlier about what the RP community would and wouldn't accept in terms of RP in terms of the WoL and going to the first (which was the big one).

There is a quote from Yoshi-P in regards to going to the first for RPers.

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Interviewer: This is a question on behalf of the game’s roleplaying community. Many players, who do not act as if they are the Warrior of Light, but rather pretend to be everyday adventurers, were excited to create stories that take place on the First but saw that the game’s narrative didn’t really allow travel for “normal” individuals to end up there. If players want to pretend their “normal” characters can travel to and play on the First, is that okay? (I promise this is a question that many of them eagerly await an answer to.)

Yoshida: Hrm… Personally, I see video games as something that gives you the freedom to play however you like. So, if you, the player, believe that you can travel to the First, then so be it, right?

We have yet to reveal everything about who the Warrior of Light is, and whether they are the only ones who are special. Furthermore, the definition of a “normal individual” seems a bit vague here, as well. I think the power to believe and the desire to persevere are the biggest elements that drive progress in an individual, and so if you believe that you as a character can go to the First, then wouldn’t that be enough? A life dictated by someone else is no fun anyhow, is it?

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Problem is, even if we use this as saying pretty much our characters on our own will can to and from places like the first (and in essence being one of the WoL thanks to the most recent patch story), the community continues to fight back against it even though I rarely if ever see people actually RP as the WoL or even one of them.

Job crystals: Been a while since I paid much attention to the job crystals so I can't argue that going some of these jobs might make the character a target and such (though I will need to go back and rewatch the cutscenes for some of them to see if the lore has changed or expanded) but I think at this point the crystals are not as big of a deal as people make them out to be. Sure they might take a long time to understand and use to their limit but having people walk around with multiple job crystals isn't so far fetched anymore this far into the story. Hell, if you wanted to bring in gameplay mechanics as well, I would argue that most of the mentors probably have a stockpile around just waiting to give them away for any future WoL.

For the echo, I maybe only bumped into a handful of people who's characters have this sort of ability though never RPed enough with them to know what sort of power they had with it. If the latest patch (or the last patch) has shown like you said, it just allows them to hear her more easily rather than actually being gifted by her so it isn't such a rare ability (if also supported by the multiple WoL's in the most recent patch AND taking into account the other shards who still have a population to talk about).

Location: This sort of fits in with the whole 'not everything the player does is canon to their character' which is true, but if they wanted to also RP that their character has been to these locations than sure, why not? I think the problem here is just the way the game is designed. For a lot of just normal dungeons, I am sure that other characters before ours came along have been there and either gave up or locked it up due to failure and being either the WoL or just gifted in battle, we came along and cleared them out. This goes for any of the raids as well. For trials and those where you have to deal with a primal, loops back around to the characters being special in some way (which writing it now does seem like a strange loop if a character says all this is canon but their character isn't gifted by the echo).

Any RP character can just be as well connected as the WoL depending on how they go about their backstory, orgins, and how they play the character. The only difference being no cutscenes or anything to show it but it isn't far fetched to say that a character knows one of the major leaders personally or even side characters like Hildebrand, Godbert, Amyric, etc. The last thing we need is someone who isn't part of the RP community and even claims they are not an expert on the subject to start calling people a liar if their characters have some sort connection to more powerful NPC's (looked up what Chuuni means and still don't understand it).

One thing that annoys me the most as a long term RPer is when people bring up the whole 'power fantasy' when it comes to WoL. Just because he can't be tempered, has multiple job crystals, and known connections doesn't make it a power fantasy. To me, a power fantasy would be someone who's character has done all of these things (lets say MSQ and side content) in RP alone and with no help whatsoever with no injuries or even any sort of effort. Where they are the best thing ever and nothing can touch them (I tend to see power fantasy and god modding as almost one in the same).

It's been shown countless times throughout the game that the WoL (our character so to speak) has been exhausted, beaten, injured, nearly killed, etc, and this is with having the echo, (assuming) multiple job crystals, and being well known in Eorzea and the first. If it was really a power fantasy, our character should have no trouble with any of the threats that come to them and wouldn't even need any help from the leaders, factions, or the scions.

What I wish I would see is the RP community just shut up about excluding people just because they don't agree with something in regards to their character and just go along with it until it becomes extremely out of bounds (like with the whole god modding bit). I get that people will like and not like certain things but it gets annoying hearing how x person was belitted and insulted because y didn't agree that z was canon and the x persons character didn't follow the lore to the very letter. Any long time RPer knows (or I would think so) that lore at most can be bent but not broken.

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Originally Posted by Gothicshark

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Yeah I kinda forgot that the constant influx of sprouts, though it didn't help that the thread I made was partly a response to a comment made on another thread that also disregarded this.

Anyway. Your insight is also appreciated and for all its worth, even though I don't RP I did take the time to craft a backstory of sorts and some details for my character

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

Alright, here I try to discuss the reasons why I think RPing as the WoL (at least ingame) is usually considered taboo. Bear in mind that I'm not involved with any RP communities, nor am I an expert on the topic, so any corrections and discussion on this would be appreciated.

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I wasn't aware I needed permission from other people to imagine my story?

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

Bear in mind that I'm not involved with any RP communities, nor am I an expert on the topic, so any corrections and discussion on this would be appreciated.

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What are you trying to do with this post if you're neither in a roleplaying community nor posting to one?

Are you trying to set rules for a community you're not part of?

Are you trying to understand it?

Why are you spelling this out, and what is the outcome you are looking for?

https://media3.giphy.com/media/3oEdu...iPA1Ww/200.gif

People can, will, and do RP whatever they want. For whatever reasons they want. With others who want to RP with them. People who try to police other's enjoyment and what is, or is not, 'permissible' in RP are generally side-eyed as sticklers who need to, and should, stick with others of like mind and leave everyone else well enough alone.

I can have an AU(Alternate Universe) where my character is NOT the WoL, but IS a Dravanian(dragon) running around in Landlord("human") form.

I can have an AU where my character IS the WoL and enjoy myself thusly, shipping with whatever NPC I desire with or without other people being involved.

And frankly, no one is going to stop me from doing either and enjoying myself. :o

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Originally Posted by Iscah

What are you trying to do with this post if you're neither in a roleplaying community nor posting to one?

Are you trying to set rules for a community you're not part of?

Are you trying to understand it?

Why are you spelling this out, and what is the outcome you are looking for?

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In a way, I'm trying to understand it, yes. But I was also collecting some thoughts I had on the topic when another thread mentioned WOL-roleplayers, and the thread is a collections of reasons why that is the case. Which is to say that it is a response to post on another thread that I didn't post on that thread because I find it to be rather long and not germane enough for it.

Primarily because I do have some interest in how storytelling works, and because I've been around certain aspects (namely fanfic, and RPs could be seen as a different, more collaborative take on that concept) long enough that to tell that there is a stigma against "too perfect" characters, and assume that such a stigma manifested against WoL role-players. In a way I was basically trying to spell out the ways the WoL would be or is seen as such. The nature of MMO protagonists means that they are perfect for starting RPs as they are blank slates, but this also means they could run into the same issues as in fanfic communities (again, Sturgeon's Law)

I think its also why I made the Superman comparison as he too could be seen as "too perfect" in some circles (even despite the kryptonite).

With that said I do admit that I sometimes have a problem with tone, phrasing and communication in general. And I must acknowledge that the post could be seen as a gatekeeping attempt, even though I didn't intend to gatekeep (its why I mentioned my lack of credentials in the field, and also why I asked for actual experts and RPers to share their insight). So I apologize for any tonal mistakes.

Might as well throw in my opinion; can you RP as THE DEFACTO WOL... I don't think I have a proper answer for that one... but you CAN RP as A WOL, which is a fair compromise...


But then there is going to be at least 1 person who WILL argue WHY you can't RP as A WOL(which mostly boils down to "Fun not allowed because I didn't come up with the idea first" tantrum)...

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Originally Posted by Krotoan

I wasn't aware I needed permission from other people to imagine my story?

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Of course you don't need that, as long as you do your imagining all by yourself.
But if you are going to do any actual RP, together with other people, you all need to agree to some ground rules - just like when playing any game.

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Originally Posted by MistakeNot

Of course you don't need that, as long as you do your imagining all by yourself.
But if you are going to do any actual RP, together with other people, you all need to agree to some ground rules - just like when playing any game.

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I think that is the main takeaway as to why roleplaying as the Warrior of Light isn't recommended: Playing with others as your character.
https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/topic/21696-rping-wol-fc-question/?tab=comments#comment-310672
This particular post From Hydaelyn Roleplayers I feel sums up the reservations pretty well: "Anyone claiming that their character is a Warrior of Light is basically claiming that their character is one of the most important people to exist in Hydaelyn."

The WoL is literally superhuman, and that on its own is polarizing. The amount of achievements, connections, abilities, and so on are extremely beyond the typical person. It also leads to issues as to what would challenge them, the potential consequences of crossing them, and other lore related things related to a character that, for one reason or another, decides to stand up to the Warrior of Light or not do what they say, which only grows should the Warrior of Light get thwarted. Characters based on the Warrior of Light, because they are working off of someone already far overpowered, tend to be overpowered themselves, and have the very plot of the game as something to lord people over with, which to many RP communities, is an unfair advantage.


That said, making someone overpowered or godmodding their actions is stuff that would affect how well a character is written even if they weren't the Warrior of Light.

Roleplay as whatever you want.

Just be aware that even roleplayers have many different preferences so it's just finding the right people who share the same preferences.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

This particular post From Hydaelyn Roleplayers I feel sums up the reservations pretty well: "Anyone claiming that their character is a Warrior of Light is basically claiming that their character is one of the most important people to exist in Hydaelyn."

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99% of that website is concerned with making sure people don't RP anything that might be interesting, fun, or resemble something from a Final Fantasy game. Yawn.

I am the WoL, and the main character of my story. That story is finding a huggable pillow I can use and a bucket of icecream cause grinding for air currents is hard. Don't @ me!!! D:<

I simply prefer to have have two versions of Jojo, my character.

The first is the version Square Enix has more or less crafted for me with the game's story and it is the Warrior of Light and Darkness himself. Let me highlight the fact that I do not actively roleplay with this version of the character but I like to imagine different scenarios and how he might respond to them. For example, I might come up with a reason as to why he would go from being a white mage to a warrior to a dark knight and so on and so forth. In-game, your character just sort of... does things. What I do is essentially come up with the thoughts he may or may not have about the things he does, be it pick up a new job or go fishing.

The second version is the one I have crafted. Although this Jojo shares his appearance with the WoL/D Jojo, they have entirely different backgrounds. This Jojo is a dancer-healer, born to a couple of alchemists in some nameless town along the west coast of Thavnair. He'd spent much of his youth paying off a debt to a troupe of entertainers, where he learned to dance. Years later, his travels would lead him to Gridania, where he'd find a home with the conjurers' guild. I wrote him to be an eclectic sort of person, which is why I consider him to be a healer in the broadest sense: not a conjurer, not a white mage, not an astrologian, not a scholar. His medical knowledge is a bit of an amalgam of all these branches. It's entirely possible that there are instances which merit the use of conjury over astrology, etc... Hell, being that he was the son of alchemists, the use of potions and the like is not out of the question. Of course, this Jojo isn't the WoL/D, so I'm coming up with a few ways to have him learn the different arts without necessarily carrying all the baggage that comes with it. White magic, for example, could prove to be quite difficult to learn, considering what an exclusive club that is.

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Originally Posted by DRKoftheAzure

Might as well throw in my opinion; can you RP as THE DEFACTO WOL... I don't think I have a proper answer for that one... but you CAN RP as A WOL, which is a fair compromise...


But then there is going to be at least 1 person who WILL argue WHY you can't RP as A WOL(which mostly boils down to "Fun not allowed because I didn't come up with the idea first" tantrum)...

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Or people just don't find the concept of RPing with someone claiming to be any sort of significant figure in the lore of the world to be interesting and simply choose to not RP with anyone desiring to do so? Very few people are actually going to argue with someone about the specifics; they're just going to decline, maybe say 'not interested in RPing with WoL characters', and find someone else. From the years of being in RP circles in FF14, its more often the case in my experience that people who want to be WoL's are the ones throwing tantrums/arguing than others.

At the end of the day, people can RP whatever they want. But RPing as story-related characters, characters that have huge significance in politics, or WoLs will automatically turn away anyone who's interested in RPing out down to earth, common folk interactions/adventures, which is the vast majority of public RP. if someone wants to RP as a WoL, they just have to find like-minded individuals while understanding their desire has limited their choice of RP partners by a considerable margin. Everyone has their preferences.

Personally, I already get enough of WoL antics and shenanigans in the MSQ. I'm not interested in bringing it into RP and exploring fun, small-time stories, character interactions, etc. If someone was claiming to be a WoL, I'd be straight up telling them 'you're either losing your WoL tag while RPing with me, or I'm finding someone else.'

One of the driving issues for RPing the WoL/WoD is limitations, in lore the WoL is basically a messianic figure with untold powers able to take on any foe with the power of immense friendship and unbreakable bonds, further the NPCs around the WoL all refer to them as a singular being (though they do acknowledge the 'friends, mercenaries, other heroes' that the WoL summons in boss battles. In the beginning they went out of their way to say that the other players you wrangle up for dungeons are mercenaries and fellow adventurers, NOT WoLs, in the latest dungeon the other players are explicitly called aspects or heroes from other worlds, much like how Ardbert was an aspect/hero from another world that was literally a splintered fragment of the WoL's soul. For his part in things Elidibus tries to copy you and in his fight he summons heroes from other worlds, champions in their own right to battle against you, so it's not like the world has only a single heroic figure who is the WoL it's more that the WoL is a title bestowed to these heroic figures in which the WoL of the Source is we the players.

So, let's say everyone RPs are the WoL, you have to acknowledge a couple things, either only one of the people claiming to be the WoL KNOWS the NPCs or the NPCs just call everyone the WoL and just kind of ignore the fact they also know a couple thousand OTHER WoLs. Further you also have to take into fact that every single WoL in that collective group has spearheaded the raids, slayen the Primals, brought low the Ascians, and whatever else which should be a feat accomplished at most by the WoL and a group of 7 other random WoLs further reducing the accomplishments of the WoL as a central figure.

It's just kind of messy.

I personally RP as just a random explorer that has interacted/fought alongside the WoL and the NPCs, it's just much easier and it provides far more freedom for my own headcanon separate from the railroaded story of the game (aka I can be an asshole, the WoL IN CANON is a pushover save for the DRK WoL in which case they harbor a secret deeply hidden resentment for being a pushover.)

Thanks but I'll pass.

Is it honestly that big of a deal anyway? Most people only RP in decently small circles compaired to everyone in the game. When I visit balmung people are rping all over the place and none of them are connected so if someone wants to bring their msq character into an rp who cares? Thats pretty much what they are doing. I understand there being rules but the more people get down to it.. it just gets way too silly. Most people are trying to bone other characters anyway. When I used to try to rp adventures all people wanted to do was bone. I couldn't even get people together to even do anything other than make babies. Let alone do a longer style RP like an action anime series. People either want to be nobodies or sex gods. :c

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Originally Posted by Floortank

99% of that website is concerned with making sure people don't RP anything that might be interesting, fun, or resemble something from a Final Fantasy game. Yawn.

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A statement which is 100% wrong. Most of that website is about how to have fun when doing RP, and about finding other people to RP with.

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Originally Posted by Controller

Is it honestly that big of a deal anyway? Most people only RP in decently small circles compaired to everyone in the game. When I visit balmung people are rping all over the place and none of them are connected

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Actually, that is not quite true. Most RP is done in small circles, true - but the circles overlap. Some of the people in group A will also play together with people in group B from time to time, and someone in group A will also play together with people from group C, and so on. There are usually enough open RP events that it is rare for the circles not to overlap at least some.
If you start from a random roleplayer, trace the characters that person RPs with - be it occasionally or often - and then keep tracing connections, then you will eventually reach a large portion of the RP community.

lots of rp stuff like this doesn't really matter when you can, basically, just... choose not to rp with someone who doesn't click with you and what you want.

literally doesn't matter, you can let them tell their story and you can go tell your own. Neither of you are required by any rule or law to interact/work together if you don't... want to.

shrug.jpg

Don't police what other people can and cannot roleplay.

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Originally Posted by Infindox

Don't police what other people can and cannot roleplay.

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It is not a matter of policing or forbidding anything, it is a question of advising people who want to RP that certain character concepts (like roleplaying as the WoL) will make it hard for them to find other people that want to RP with them. No more and no less, and what they do with that information is up to them.

Saying that your RP character is THE Warrior of Light is like saying that you're more important than everyone else in the group. If your group is fine with that, sure, have fun, but for RPing with random people, it can come across as condescending and kinda dickish. And that's just assuming the default "generally agreeable, nice person" WoL of the main scenario, not people who want to play antiheroes or murderhobos or whatever else.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

Saying that your RP character is THE Warrior of Light is like saying that you're more important than everyone else in the group. If your group is fine with that, sure, have fun, but for RPing with random people, it can come across as condescending and kinda dickish. And that's just assuming the default "generally agreeable, nice person" WoL of the main scenario, not people who want to play antiheroes or murderhobos or whatever else.

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But the main plot says you are the WoL of many. So if it's known world wide that there are more than one at any an all times why is this an issue? Literally we're all WoL so really it's not about the title anymore. Why can't people look at it like the MSQ is your day job as the WoL, the one taking all the actual game quest and doing the things we do in MSQ and RP as days off or after you save the world. Since we're ALL WoL we never need to talk about what we have to do at our day job and just simply live life? Least thats how I will look at it anyway.

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Originally Posted by Gameovers

But the main plot says you are the WoL of many. So if it's known world wide that there are more than one at any an all times why is this an issue? Literally we're all WoL so really it's not about the title anymore. Why can't people look at it like the MSQ is your day job as the WoL, the one taking all the actual game quest and doing the things we do in MSQ and RP as days off or after you save the world. Since we're ALL WoL we never need to talk about what we have to do at our day job and just simply live life? Least thats how I will look at it anyway.

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Because a lot of people who RP don't see their RP character as the WoL. They may do the story to unlock areas and enjoy the story, but that RP character's canon isn't that of the WoL - they separate the two in their mind. Other people do extremes and raids on character they RP on, but many of them also do that for gear or mounts or such - it's not part of that particular character's canon.

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Originally Posted by Gameovers

But the main plot says you are the WoL of many. So if it's known world wide that there are more than one at any an all times why is this an issue? Literally we're all WoL so really it's not about the title anymore. Why can't people look at it like the MSQ is your day job as the WoL, the one taking all the actual game quest and doing the things we do in MSQ and RP as days off or after you save the world. Since we're ALL WoL we never need to talk about what we have to do at our day job and just simply live life? Least thats how I will look at it anyway.

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My RP character isn't a WoL and that's the case for the vast majority of the actual roleplayers I've met over my past six years of time in this game. On occasion you'll meet one person who does align themselves with the idea that they're one of Hydaelyn's Chosen but they are very few and far in between with people of that persuasion preferring to claim to have just the echo instead. Most people understand there's a difference between gameplay and personal stories and tend not to assume everyone is 'x' because that's a very quick way to get people irritated.

All that said, people can play whatever they want. The roleplay scene in this game is big enough to facilitate all kinds of stories and if someone wants to play the Derplander in all their grape loving glory then that's perfectly acceptable. There's even a thriving community of NPC roleplayers who will happily rent themselves out for smaller events. One of my fondest memories from roleplaying in Heavensward was that there was an entire group of Ward roleplayers who would happily come to events to exist as antagonists, or even scenery dressing, for roleplayers who were roleplaying before Thordan's death in the timeline. Just don't expect other people to want to roleplay with you and be careful about going to server wide roleplay events, because that kind of power/meta gaming is pretty heavily frowned upon by the larger community. However if you find a niche part of the community that supports it, or even just a friend group, go nuts. Your personal roleplay doesn't need to affect mine and we can co-exist as separate entities.

Noo, hmm, looks like I m still on officil forums and not on Hydaelyn Roleplayers. Funny.

Use the good old off-game to sort this kind of things out! I'd imgine it is courteous to let your potentil new RP buddy to know something about your character, for example that he/she is WoL.

And from there you can agree, if that is good premise.

There is girl in my FC who has developed her character with premise that the character is WoL. But she is not annoying about it at all, and seems to prefer to just write fanfiction and make cute fnart about the scenarios she and her bff thought experiment about their characters. Very harmless.

At the end of the day, trying to make other people to think about rp like you do seems nothing short of moot to me. People who agree with you alredy agree with you, and you will save everyone's time by leaving people who prefer it differently to their busines, and everyone wins.

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Originally Posted by Gameovers

But the main plot says you are the WoL of many. So if it's known world wide that there are more than one at any an all times why is this an issue? Literally we're all WoL so really it's not about the title anymore. Why can't people look at it like the MSQ is your day job as the WoL, the one taking all the actual game quest and doing the things we do in MSQ and RP as days off or after you save the world. Since we're ALL WoL we never need to talk about what we have to do at our day job and just simply live life? Least thats how I will look at it anyway.

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At the fall of Dalamud, just about every adventurer was considered a Warrior of Light, and a Hero of Eorzea. However, five years later, there is The Warrior of Light, slayer of primals, the bane of acsians, and the hero who saves two worlds is a bit taboo. No one will feel like you are god-modding RP if your and adventure who was at the Fall of Dalamud, and no one would care if you RP as a member of the Warriors of Light, but some will take offense if you claim to be the one true hero of this world, however, if you have a good RP group, and your group is fine with it, do it.

It's really case by case, never lead off as "Hi, I'm the savior of the realm and destroyer of the heart of Zodiark." that's the kind of thing that doesn't go over well.