Why don't Allience Raids drop rings?

Okay, rings are wonky, you can equip two of the same yet most are still unique-locked, which means you need slightly better rings to get to that ilevel threshold. Alliance Raids, are usually considered catch up content, but they only drop non-acc gear.

While I am aware that there are other sources of equivalent rings,and that there are crafted non unique rings that are just as powerful (if not more given the potential made possible by pentamelds), I do believe that having more sources of rings of the same ilevel coudne't hurt

what do you think?

Dun Scaith had a weekly quest added to it to get accessories, but Orbonne didn't follow suit.

There's a reason they removed belts from 24 man raids. Why would you roll on a piece of gear that gives less stats than any other equipment slot that drops. You have tomestone rings(capped and upgraded uncapped), 8-man raid ring, crafted, and then the dungeon rings. The same applies to belts. That's 6 different rings from that alone. 7 if you include savage 8-man. They also usually only have 1 meld slot unless it's tomestone or savage raid.

Point: you wouldn't roll on them in 24 mans anyway because you'd rather take the bigger upgrade from the 4 major left-side pieces.

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There's a reason they removed belts from 24 man raids.

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Belts are not a glamor'able slot, which is the biggest reason they got axed.

Rings make the most sense of potential non-major leftside pieces. If you aren't raiding, rings from alliance raids would compete for available best in slot, where they arent for any other slot.

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That's 6 different rings from that alone. 7 if you include savage 8-man.

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There are 2 rings at max (non-weapon) ilvl: savage and upgraded tome, and 2 at -10 ilvl: upgraded crafted and tome. Upgraded crafted rings only have 1 materia slot. Alliance raid is max ilvl -10.

That said, anything that lowers drop rate for glam pieces is probably not worth it.

It would be nice if alliance raids dropped accessories, and having the option to get decent ilevel ones from that repeatable quest for Dun Scaith was nice. I wish we could do that again.

Personally I'm glad they don't drop rings. I largely get alliance raid gear based on cosmetics, so accessories would just dilute the pool of what's available.

It was already annoying enough in older alliance raids when you get nothing but belts in a chest. I know accessories have a cosmetic element, but they are so small and often hidden that I'd prefer that they remain out. Besides you can get accessories for stats from plenty of places.

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Originally Posted by Stepjam

Personally I'm glad they don't drop rings. I largely get alliance raid gear based on cosmetics, so accessories would just dilute the pool of what's available.

It was already annoying enough in older alliance raids when you get nothing but belts in a chest. I know accessories have a cosmetic element, but they are so small and often hidden that I'd prefer that they remain out. Besides you can get accessories for stats from plenty of places.

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They could just double up on the drop slots. One armour and one accessory. I feel like some dungeons do that, maybe I'm wrong.

As said, not always the case but accessories (and weapons for that matter) were something that was part of alternative content. If memory serves, trials were often used in 2.0 for accessories with a shift to the 8 man raid. Especially since it typically just took 1 token to get an accessory.

I want to say they divide it up to encourage people to do different content. In addition if 24 man raids DID drop accessories, it would double the number of weeks to get the full set of both armor and accessories.

As is, one could do both the most current 8 man and 24 man raids to get geared up in a rather reasonable amount of time, especially if you just went for accessories in the 8 man.

This doesn’t even take into account tomestone gear which typically is fairly competitive as well, especially as it is upgraded using 24-man raid tokens.

So as is we typically already have crafted, tomestone and 8 man raid sets, all fairly competitive...in addition to 24 man raids already tied to tomestone upgrades, I don’t really see the need to add more unless it was an alternative grind a la Bozja.

I'm glad that they don't, and I'm also glad that they abandoned belt drops. Seriously, no one is running 24 man raids for belts. They are there for the glamour mostly. I really did like having that quest for Dun Scaith every week though, so I wouldn't mind seeing something like that again.

Gear drops are just for glamour in 24 person raids. You can use the weekly token to upgrade a Crystarium ring.

Buy an upgraded tomestone ring and wear an unupgraded tomestone ring.

Answer to OP: To save on dev time, don't have to create 4 different accessory types, worry about balancing their substats versus other ring choices, and worry about adding in drop slots vs. other gear. They've never dropped accessories other than belts, which they axed. I'd love for them to bring back something like the Proto-Ultima accessories though. Just for folks skipping out on the Savage tier for whatever reason. Dun Scaith was such a good 24 man. Would love more glamour options like the Proto-Ultima Mesh as well. Also I'm still jonesing for them to add the dye option to that as well. /scratches neck

As far as 24 man drops being just for glams... well, no. Maybe less-so in this day and age, but in the FFXIV of Christmas's past, they often times would result in new BiS depending on substat weights, since 10 iLvls in one slot usually doesn't outweigh poor substat allocation. I haven't looked into a BiS table in a long time, cause I'm don't have a lotta fun with that sorta thing, but this usually always holds true for the second and third 24 mans of an expansion. Where say a leg or body armor for job X, both its tomestone and raid counterpart have 0 crit. Then the 24 man one does have crit. Boom. BiS piece from a 24 man. /shrug

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Originally Posted by Mhaeric

Gear drops are just for glamour in 24 person raids. You can use the weekly token to upgrade a Crystarium ring.

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Sure! Just like how the new ex weapons are just for glamour xD

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Originally Posted by Wolwosh

Sure! Just like how the new ex weapons are just for glamour xD

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EX weapons are different because they are an upgrade for anyone who doesn't do savage content. 24-person coffer drops are identical ilevel to non-upgraded tomestone gear that we've had for 2 patches and the 24-person completion token itself gives better gear. At best you could describe the 24-man coffer drops as catch-up gear if someone somehow doesn't have i490 tomestone gear yet.

The Crystarium pieces are not BiS for every slot because of different substats. Healers are perhaps the best example since piety is a wasted stat (now that they've fixed AST's MP management). So for example on gloves two of the three options have piety on them, leaving the YoRHa Type-53 gloves as the best choice.

It doesn't come cheap either. Buying all the armor and accessory pieces costs 5010 allegories, which represents just under three months of weekly caps. Adding a weapon makes it over three months. There's five different sets for accessories and seven for armor, so I can guarantee you that no one has all of them bought yet. In fact it's impossible to buy all of them before the next tomes are released and allegories become uncapped.

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Originally Posted by tdb

The Crystarium pieces are not BiS for every slot because of different substats. Healers are perhaps the best example since piety is a wasted stat (now that they've fixed AST's MP management). So for example on gloves two of the three options have piety on them, leaving the YoRHa Type-53 gloves as the best choice.

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Gear's ilevel and thus main stat always takes priority over any substat, even when ditching Piety.

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Originally Posted by tdb

It doesn't come cheap either. Buying all the armor and accessory pieces costs 5010 allegories, which represents just under three months of weekly caps. Adding a weapon makes it over three months. There's five different sets for accessories and seven for armor, so I can guarantee you that no one has all of them bought yet. In fact it's impossible to buy all of them before the next tomes are released and allegories become uncapped.

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Everything you're describing here is catching up, not progression.

Has anyone done research on how main stat affects damage? All I can find is formulas for the substat.

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Originally Posted by Mhaeric

EX weapons are different because they are an upgrade for anyone who doesn't do savage content. 24-person coffer drops are identical ilevel to non-upgraded tomestone gear that we've had for 2 patches and the 24-person completion token itself gives better gear. At best you could describe the 24-man coffer drops as catch-up gear if someone somehow doesn't have i490 tomestone gear yet.

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I get you, but I don't completely agree.
On my alts I prefer an alliance piece with nice stats over a crystarium piece with for example ss and tenacity.

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Originally Posted by Mhaeric

Gear drops are just for glamour in 24 person raids. You can use the weekly token to upgrade a Crystarium ring.

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This sentiment is inaccurate for non-raiders. The gear from the 24 man raids can often be an upgrade over the same item level piece you bought with tomestones (also remember that for non-raiders that the left side piece is the exact same item level as the 24 man piece when the content launches) and can be used on jobs other than a main job to boost item level and power.

Additionally as stated about black mage, some jobs will get more out of a piece if the substats are right even if it's a lower item level. There have been a few times where the lower item level is extremely competitive or out right better than the higher one based explicitly on the substats of both pieces.

That said... I do think that the proto ultima fight in Dun Scath was a great way to get more accessory options into the hands of players and should be a thing they repeat. And if they're worried about making too many options and breaking certain jobs, they could always make the turn in at that point be for the same coffer you'd get in savage.

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Originally Posted by Mhaeric

Gear's ilevel and thus main stat always takes priority over any substat, even when ditching Piety.

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Not always true. Multiple classes have the 480 Idealized gear as BiS over 500. Especially in the case of Piety, 490 crit items can easily beat 500 pieces with Piety as the dominant stat. There's also the Neo-Ishgard accessories which are a fractional downgrade in a few cases if upgraded to 490, compared to 480 max pentamelded. Only in the case of weapons is ilv nearly always king due to weapon damage.

The Best In Slot for healers involves mixing Edenchoir with Augmented Chrysterium. Everything is iLvl 500. There might be a few niche cases out there where a lower ilvl gear is a better option, but the current meta is not it.

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Originally Posted by Imps

The Best In Slot for healers involves mixing Edenchoir with Augmented Chrysterium. Everything is iLvl 500. There might be a few niche cases out there where a lower ilvl gear is a better option, but the current meta is not it.

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Yeah, I can see that with those options you can get i500 items in every slot without piety in any of them. But what about non-raiders who can't get Edenchoir? Take gloves for example. Augmented Crystarium has 353 mind, 281 piety and 197 determination. YoRHa Type-53 has 335 mind, 275 determination and 193 critical hit - same stats as Edenchoir but slightly lower numbers. Is 18 mind truly better than 78 determination and 193 critical hit, like Mhaeric implies?

Edit: I realize that for non-raiders gear optimization isn't really relevant. But since I play several different classes I like to spend my limited allegories on the items where I get the best results and use YoRHa or Augmented Neo-Ishgardian on the other slots.

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Originally Posted by tdb

I realize that for non-raiders gear optimization isn't really relevant. But since I play several different classes I like to spend my limited allegories on the items where I get the best results and use YoRHa or Augmented Neo-Ishgardian on the other slots.

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You basically answered your own question here. Build an i480 equipment spread using the two, then, when you have enough tomestones, pick out which pieces are the best to swap out for. Or whatever piece you're having trouble getting dropped from YoRHa.

I main AST, and raid with that. I run dungeons using DRK for extra tomestone drops, and open world using RDM. So I get where you're coming from, but relying on crafted gear isn't bad for non-raiding classes, imho.

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Is 18 mind truly better than 78 determination and 193 critical hit, like Mhaeric implies?

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Its basically even, with that being almost the best possible case. The best possible as a healer would be Pie/spd vs Crit/Det, where you probably would eat the mainstat loss to take crit/det.

We saw this more a few times last expansion with 5 socket armor, especially on casters, since blm wanted significantly different stat spreads than the other two.

Main stat is worth significantly more than secondary stats.

I hope next expansion they just drop a ring slot.

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Originally Posted by Esmoire

I hope next expansion they just drop a ring slot.

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While I would like that too... it's hard because it's so baked in.

I think they ran into a similar problem when it came to one-handed verses two-handed white mage and black mage main hand weapons. They couldn't delete one-handed weapons without running into problems for characters currently equipped with one.

It could cause balancing issues if they delete a ring slot since they may not be able to unequip basically every character in the game of one of their rings, in which case the slot would go away but the item would still be equipped, and that would cause balancing issues if that person never takes off their now invalid ring (and additionally would cause an unfair advantage for someone who has the, I assume, 530 item level ring in that slot compared so someone with a 400 or 270 from previous expansions)

It would be simpler if they differentiate the ring types by which hands going forward, keep the exiting rings generic (able to go on either hand) but have the new rings (or at least the new "unique" rings) going forward be specific to a given hand, and have an identifier for which is which (like say, for example Hypothetical Ring of Casting Dextros or Tomestone Leftside Ring of Aiming or smt)