Cross-breading for Tantalplant seeds

Not sure if I got this right, but I've planted every second plot with Krakka Root and Wizard Eggplant. The Krakka Root matured after a few days, and I left it in. Today the Wizard Eggplant was ready for harvesting and I got 48 of them, and 3 seeds, not a single Tantalplant or seed for it. What is the chances of getting a Tantalplant out of that combination? As per instructions on the site I kept the Krakka Root, only harvesting and replanting the Wizard Eggplant. Everything was planted in Grade 3 Thanalan Topsoil, fertilized once, when planted, with Fishmeal, and tended several times a day.

https://www.ffxivgardening.com/

They list that cross as green, 90% chance of seeds or better. Exactly which of the two seeds you get is a 50% chance.

You should have harvested the krakka roots when they were ripe and planted more. It would have been 4 more chances for one more day.

Just in case you don't know this:

You can only get a seed if you plant next to an existing seed. Plant your first seed in throwaway soil, plant around the square alternating seeds, rip out the first seed and overplant. 8 chances of seeds.

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Originally Posted by Shadygrove

https://www.ffxivgardening.com/

They list that cross as green, 90% chance of seeds or better. Exactly which of the two seeds you get is a 50% chance.

You should have harvested the krakka roots when they were ripe and planted more. It would have been 4 more chances for one more day.

Just in case you don't know this:

You can only get a seed if you plant next to an existing seed. Plant your first seed in throwaway soil, plant around the square alternating seeds, rip out the first seed and overplant. 8 chances of seeds.

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If you check their diagrams you should not harvest the krakka roots, just the wizard eggplant. As I understand the diagram the krakka roots should stay there until you don't want to try to cross-breed anymore.

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Originally Posted by Angelhearth

If you check their diagrams you should not harvest the krakka roots, just the wizard eggplant. As I understand the diagram the krakka roots should stay there until you don't want to try to cross-breed anymore.

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Then either the diagramm or your understanding of it is wrong.

One thing you need to know about cross breeding is that what seed you may get (if your crossbreed is sucessful) is decided when planting the seed, based on the plants already growing in the spots excatly next to the one you're planting in right now. If you have one kind of crop that grows faster than the other one (in this case: Krakka grows faster than Eggplant), you can - and should - harvest the Krakka roots so you can plant new ones that will grow right next to the Eggplants you already have. If your first batch of eggplants is ready to harvest before your second batch of Krakka, harvest the eggplants and plant new ones, to make the most out of the second round of Krakkas you've got.

Shadygrove is also right with their suggestion to use throw away soil for the first seed you plant - use Thanalan III after that. If your timing is right (you can manipulate with fertilisier if needed) you can keep crossbreeds going forever, without ever looking at an empty garden.

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Originally Posted by Vidu

Then either the diagramm or your understanding of it is wrong.

One thing you need to know about cross breeding is that what seed you may get (if your crossbreed is sucessful) is decided when planting the seed, based on the plants already growing in the spots excatly next to the one you're planting in right now. If you have one kind of crop that grows faster than the other one (in this case: Krakka grows faster than Eggplant), you can - and should - harvest the Krakka roots so you can plant new ones that will grow right next to the Eggplants you already have. If your first batch of eggplants is ready to harvest before your second batch of Krakka, harvest the eggplants and plant new ones, to make the most out of the second round of Krakkas you've got.

Shadygrove is also right with their suggestion to use throw away soil for the first seed you plant - use Thanalan III after that. If your timing is right (you can manipulate with fertilisier if needed) you can keep crossbreeds going forever, without ever looking at an empty garden.

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But why should I harvest the Krakka Roots? I only want the Tantalplant, nothing else.

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Originally Posted by Angelhearth

But why should I harvest the Krakka Roots? I only want the Tantalplant, nothing else.

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Because they have a shorter grow time (3 days) than the eggplant (5). By leaving the Wizard Eggplant in place and harvesting the Krakka Root then replanting, you have the potential to get more Tantalplant seeds.

As an example, let's say you grow for 15 days harvesting and replacing only one seed type. If you leave the Wizard Eggplant in place and harvest/replace the Krakka Root, you could get up to 20 seeds in those 15 days. If you leave the Krakka Root in place and harvest/replace the Wizard Eggplant instead, the most you could get is 12 (this is assuming you're using the 8 bed plot).

The diagram might have suggested leaving the Krakka Root and harvesting/replacing the Wizard Eggplant because of the seed cost. But Krakka Roots also sell steady, usually at a profit compared to the seed cost, while eggplant has a more limited market. You should at least make back the cost of the Krakka Root seeds while potentially getting more Tantalplant seeds.

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Originally Posted by Angelhearth

But why should I harvest the Krakka Roots? I only want the Tantalplant, nothing else.

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The way crossbreeding works is that you basically harvest the seeds as an additional item to the crops - so if you harvest a plant that has the potential to also yield crossbreed-seeds, you will harvest both at the same time. You cant get the Tantalplant without the Krakka roots and each time you harvest a Krakka root that was planted in such a way that it has the potential to get you Tantalseeds, you have the chance to get those seeds.
If you're able to plant two rounds of Krakka roots, you get four more chances to get seeds. (As I mentioned: The crossbreed "snaps" the moment you plant the seed, based on what plants are growing next to it at that moment - your second round of Krakka roots should be planted next to the first round of eggplants, so they'll snap right into the potential to yield Tantalseeds. Basically: 4 eggplants can make 8 Krakka roots snap into that potential, but only if you harvest the first 4 once they're done)

The same basically goes for the eggplants - again: each time you harvest one, you have a chance to get a seed. In order to plant as little plants as possible, you'll never want to end up with an empty garden and instead alternate harvesting and planting the crops.

This becomes even more intresting and important once you're dealing with rare and expensive crossbreeds - eggplants and Krakka roots are fairly easy to obtain after all. But crops like Glazenut, Jute and Thavnair Onion can be used in crossbreeds aswell - and using the same plants for two or even three crossbreeds is extremly helpful.

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Originally Posted by Angelhearth

But why should I harvest the Krakka Roots? I only want the Tantalplant, nothing else.

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You're not going to harvest Tantaplants; you'll harvest Tantaplant seeds when you pull up your krakka or eggplants

So you guys are saying the premium source on cross-breading in FFXIV is wrong?

https://www.ffxivgardening.com/cross-diagrams

Thavnairian Onion, first diagram.

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Originally Posted by Angelhearth

So you guys are saying the premium source on cross-breading in FFXIV is wrong?

https://www.ffxivgardening.com/cross-diagrams

Thavnairian Onion, first diagram.

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No, we're saying you're not understanding whats going on in those diagrams.

I would assume that this "loop" thats mentioned on the two diagrams with the arrows (is there a word for that kind of diagram? Flowchart, maybe?) is pretty much what we've been trying to explain to you: You want to keep producing Tantalplant-seeds by constantly crossbreeding wizard eggplant and krakka roots.

The diagrams with the gardenbeds show a step that comes after you actually got your Tantalplant-seeds (and the Royale Kukuru seeds, for that matter). In order to get there - and to keep your crossbreeds going, because its pretty much a waste not to use plants for multiple crossbreeds, you'll want to keep producing Tantalplant-seeds. Non of those diagrams detail how to do that, though.

You can apply the method shown in the diagrams with the gardenbeds or do as Shadygroove suggested: Get 9 krakka root seeds and 4 eggplant ones. Get one "Thorw away Soil" (cheapest you can find) and 12 Thanalan II soils.
Plant your first krakka root using the throw away soil, then plant an eggplant with Thanalan III next to it, next to that krakka and so on. Once you've filled all spots, remove the first krakka root you planted and replace it with a krakka root planted with Thanalan III soil.
Wait 3 days until all Krakka roots are ready to harvest. Harvest the Krakka roots - each crop has a chance to also yield a Tantalplant seed. Your eggplants are still growing, so replant Krakka roots using Thanlan III soil - because they're being planted to eggplants, they'll have a chance to yield Tantalplant seeds in the end aswell.
From this point onwards you should be able to just alternate between harvesting and planting Eggplants and Krakka roots to keep your cross going as long as you wish. Each time you harvest the plants, you have a chance to get a seed on top of your normal crops - replanting only one type of plant at once is key to minimise the amount of seeds and soil you use.

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Originally Posted by Vidu

Plant your first krakka root using the throw away soil, then plant an eggplant with Thanalan III next to it, next to that krakka and so on.

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I would actually start with the eggplant first. Eggplant seeds are usually dirt cheap on the MB compared to Krakka Root seeds at the vendor. That way you're only wasting about 400 gil instead of 3900. It's still the same result in the end.

Also, many players with small houses growing Thavnairian Onions don't harvest the Tantalplant or whichever chocobo food seed they're using because of limited gardening space and the annoying RNG for getting a new set of seeds. They'll leave the Tantalplant in place and just harvest/replant the other seeds. The harvested items from the other seeds tend to cover the cost of buying those seeds. Growing time is devoted to producing the onion seeds instead of interrupting the cycle to get another set of chocobo food seeds (and dealing with it's RNG).

Someone with a medium or large can set up a different seed cycle in each garden plot so it's easier for them to be harvesting everything because they can be constantly replacing what's used in the onion seed plot with what's grown in the chocobo food seed plot.

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Originally Posted by Vidu

No, we're saying you're not understanding whats going on in those diagrams.

I would assume that this "loop" thats mentioned on the two diagrams with the arrows (is there a word for that kind of diagram? Flowchart, maybe?) is pretty much what we've been trying to explain to you: You want to keep producing Tantalplant-seeds by constantly crossbreeding wizard eggplant and krakka roots.

The diagrams with the gardenbeds show a step that comes after you actually got your Tantalplant-seeds (and the Royale Kukuru seeds, for that matter). In order to get there - and to keep your crossbreeds going, because its pretty much a waste not to use plants for multiple crossbreeds, you'll want to keep producing Tantalplant-seeds. Non of those diagrams detail how to do that, though.

You can apply the method shown in the diagrams with the gardenbeds or do as Shadygroove suggested: Get 9 krakka root seeds and 4 eggplant ones. Get one "Thorw away Soil" (cheapest you can find) and 12 Thanalan II soils.
Plant your first krakka root using the throw away soil, then plant an eggplant with Thanalan III next to it, next to that krakka and so on. Once you've filled all spots, remove the first krakka root you planted and replace it with a krakka root planted with Thanalan III soil.
Wait 3 days until all Krakka roots are ready to harvest. Harvest the Krakka roots - each crop has a chance to also yield a Tantalplant seed. Your eggplants are still growing, so replant Krakka roots using Thanlan III soil - because they're being planted to eggplants, they'll have a chance to yield Tantalplant seeds in the end aswell.
From this point onwards you should be able to just alternate between harvesting and planting Eggplants and Krakka roots to keep your cross going as long as you wish. Each time you harvest the plants, you have a chance to get a seed on top of your normal crops - replanting only one type of plant at once is key to minimise the amount of seeds and soil you use.

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The way I read it, and I've read a few flow charts, being an engineer, is that only the Wizard Eggplant shall be harvested. I've also read it elsewhere on that site (not sure where), that harvesting the Krakka Root is not needed, you should just let it be. Have you actually harvested Tantalplant seeds from a Krakka Root?

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

I would actually start with the eggplant first. Eggplant seeds are usually dirt cheap on the MB compared to Krakka Root seeds at the vendor. That way you're only wasting about 400 gil instead of 3900. It's still the same result in the end.

Also, many players with small houses growing Thavnairian Onions don't harvest the Tantalplant or whichever chocobo food seed they're using because of limited gardening space and the annoying RNG for getting a new set of seeds. They'll leave the Tantalplant in place and just harvest/replant the other seeds. The harvested items from the other seeds tend to cover the cost of buying those seeds. Growing time is devoted to producing the onion seeds instead of interrupting the cycle to get another set of chocobo food seeds (and dealing with it's RNG).

Someone with a medium or large can set up a different seed cycle in each garden plot so it's easier for them to be harvesting everything because they can be constantly replacing what's used in the onion seed plot with what's grown in the chocobo food seed plot.

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Thats a fair consideration! I'm probably to used to having at least three gardenbeds at my disposal and setting up "ever lasting" cycles that compliment each other. I'll admit that I also didnt check the current prize of eggplant-seeds - you're absolutly right when you say that the cheapest crop should be the one that gets planted first!

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Originally Posted by Angelhearth

The way I read it, and I've read a few flow charts, being an engineer, is that only the Wizard Eggplant shall be harvested. I've also read it elsewhere on that site (not sure where), that harvesting the Krakka Root is not needed, you should just let it be. Have you actually harvested Tantalplant seeds from a Krakka Root?

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Yes, I've gotten Premium-Chocobo-Food seeds from Krakka roots before - both used crops (in your case: eggplant and Krakka root) have a chance to yield the seeds you desire. Since both seeds are reasonably cheap (3k for the Krakka roots still seems cheap to me), I'd consider it a waste of time not to harvest the Krakka roots for the chance of extra seeds and then replant them.
You dont have to harvest and replant the Krakka roots, though - doing so will give you a chance to get 4 more seeds at a cost of 12k every 3 days, though.

Once you actually have Tantlaplants growing, you can consider not harvesting those (though they have the potential to yield Onion seeds aswell) and just use them for constant crossbreeding. The reason behind this would be that the Tantla-seeds are rare and therefor expensive, so you can only constantly replace them if you've set up a gardenbed that will produce those seeds again and again.

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Originally Posted by Angelhearth

The way I read it, and I've read a few flow charts, being an engineer, is that only the Wizard Eggplant shall be harvested. I've also read it elsewhere on that site (not sure where), that harvesting the Krakka Root is not needed, you should just let it be. Have you actually harvested Tantalplant seeds from a Krakka Root?

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I have, yes. I have also harvested the other premium chocobo foods from them as well. Curiel root, Pahsna fruit, Sylkis bud, Mimett gourd.

I cross them with 7 day crops like Glazenut, Jute, Blood pepper to get Thavnairian onion seeds. I do a continuous rotation like Vidu suggested as the chocobo foods are 5 days.

I was totally infatuated with gardening, at my worst I managed 21? 23? garden beds on two servers. I am much better now. I only have 5 going on one server. You can believe what we tell you about gardening. Really.