Chronic Design Flaw On the Skysteel Tools

This is the same design flaw that has been overlooked by SE on all of the relic tools for this game starting in ARR. Only some of the relevant stats are included on the Dragonsung tools, one is missing. This makes the relic tool inferior to the crafted tool in one very important aspect. I'm talking about CP for the crafting tools and GP for the gathering tools.

Base stats on an HQ Facet tool are 735 craftsmanship and 400 control before any melds. Obviously, a Dragonsung tool is designed to be the equivalent of a melded Facet tool, at 770 craftsmanship and 421 control.

I can't imagine any serious crafter overlooking the CP or GP meld on a Facet crafting or gathering tool. The loss of CP on the crafting tools has an immediate detrimental effect on the ability to complete some of the crafting macros we have been using without using food buffs or medicine. In contrast, the battle relics are a pure joy with five open melding slots.

TBH I really like these tools, I'm just frustrated that SE overlooks details on this and other things.

How do we address this issue in a way that will make SE wake up to the fact that that the missing CP or GP is a real design flaw, one they have overlooked for years?

The relic tools and relic weapons at this stage are well worth the amount of effort (pretty minimal) it takes to get them.
Future stages will no doubt improve them significantly - and require a significant amount of work to get.

im hoping that later on the tools actually become BiS.

currently even combat relic weapons arent better than even crystarium ones, so the skysteel tools not being the best isnt that far fetched rn.

if later on though the skysteel tools aren't bis... well... thatd be awful

if you've melded your gear/OH for CP a loss of 6 CP is minimal imo from the MH. but not everyone can meld to that extent i guess?

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

if you've melded your gear/OH for CP a loss of 6 CP is minimal imo from the MH. but not everyone can meld to that extent i guess?

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6 cp per tool is 12 cp in total, thats a lot and can actually make or break a macro/rotation. cunning craftsmans syrup gives 16 cp for comparison

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Originally Posted by MistakeNot

The relic tools and relic weapons at this stage are well worth the amount of effort (pretty minimal) it takes to get them.
Future stages will no doubt improve them significantly - and require a significant amount of work to get.

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This does not address the missing GP and CP

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Originally Posted by Mystic

The loss of CP on the crafting tools has an immediate detrimental effect on the ability to complete some of the crafting macros we have been using without using food buffs or medicine.

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NQ Frumenty. Adds 10 CP and costs 7 gil at vendors in Limsa/Gridania/Ul'dah. There's your 6 CP back.

If you haven't been using food/syrup, maybe you should? It gives you some flexibility when setting up your macros/rotations. Even cheap food like Frumenty can make a difference.

Or you can just keep using your Facet tools as I assume you currently are (what I plan to do). They told that Skysteel tools won't be BiS until the final version released this expansion and that end game crafters will likely prefer sticking to their pentamelded tools. It's silly to be complaining now when we got what we were told to expect.

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Originally Posted by Mystic

The loss of GP on the gathering tools has a similar effect, as in the future it will become impossible to hit certain GP numbers, 900 GP for example.

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We don't know that it will be possible to hit 900 GP when the 5.3 gear is released.

I'm also unclear on what advantage you expect reaching 900 to give. It won't give any additional Appraisal actions unless SE changes the GP cost. 850 is enough for Pick Clean plus 6 Bountiful Yield/Harvest II. 855 is enough for King's Yield/Blessed Harvest II plus 4 Bountiful Yield/Harvest II on the weather nodes in Diadem. I don't have GP melded on my tools but I already hit those numbers with food.

Adding another 50 GP doesn't grant us another useful action since their current design philosophy doesn't seem likely to force us to go back to using Field Mastery/Sharp Vision to hit 100% gathering on a legendary node.

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Originally Posted by QooEr

6 cp per tool is 12 cp in total, thats a lot and can actually make or break a macro/rotation. cunning craftsmans syrup gives 16 cp for comparison

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You're not going to be losing 12 CP because Skysteel tools are main hand only. You'll be losing 6 at most.

Macros/rotations can be adjusted. Different foods/syrups can be used.

And we still have our Facet tools to use. We're not being forced to use Skysteel tools except when making items to upgrade them. If you're doing fine with them now, keep using them. Toss the Dragonsung Tools into saddlebags or onto a retainer until it's time to upgrade them again.

The skytool relics at this phase are NOT meant to replace overmelded Facet gear. This is only the first phase and not nearly the end of the tool. If you already have your faceted tools and have them overmelded, either hold off on doing these until the next phase or do them and store them and keep using your facet gear.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

NQ Frumenty. Adds 10 CP and costs 7 gil at vendors in Limsa/Gridania/Ul'dah. There's your 6 CP back.

If you haven't been using food/syrup, maybe you should? It gives you some flexibility when setting up your macros/rotations. Even cheap food like Frumenty can make a difference.

Or you can just keep using your Facet tools as I assume you currently are (what I plan to do). They told that Skysteel tools won't be BiS until the final version released this expansion and that end game crafters will likely prefer sticking to their pentamelded tools. It's silly to be complaining now when we got what we were told to expect.


We don't know that it will be possible to hit 900 GP when the 5.3 gear is released.

I'm also unclear on what advantage you expect reaching 900 to give. It won't give any additional Appraisal actions unless SE changes the GP cost. 850 is enough for Pick Clean plus 6 Bountiful Yield/Harvest II. 855 is enough for King's Yield/Blessed Harvest II plus 4 Bountiful Yield/Harvest II on the weather nodes in Diadem. I don't have GP melded on my tools but I already hit those numbers with food.

Adding another 50 GP doesn't grant us another useful action since their current design philosophy doesn't seem likely to force us to go back to using Field Mastery/Sharp Vision to hit 100% gathering on a legendary node.


You're not going to be losing 12 CP because Skysteel tools are main hand only. You'll be losing 6 at most.

Macros/rotations can be adjusted. Different foods/syrups can be used.

And we still have our Facet tools to use. We're not being forced to use Skysteel tools except when making items to upgrade them. If you're doing fine with them now, keep using them. Toss the Dragonsung Tools into saddlebags or onto a retainer until it's time to upgrade them again.

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This really isn't about my buying Frumenty. It's about the inherent design flaw present since 2.0. That was the whole point of the post.

no, it does not take a lot of work, it's in fact harder to get the crafted tool than the relic one, and crafting was not flawed, they just made it a lot easier for noobs which is a bad thing.

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Originally Posted by Tyssyn

This is only the first phase and not nearly the end of the tool.

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Are you sure about that? Did Yoshi said that or is there any other good source for it?

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Originally Posted by Mystic

This really isn't about my buying Frumenty. It's about the inherent design flaw present since 2.0. That was the whole point of the post.

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But it's not a flaw. It's intended so the crafted tools continue to have useful value. Otherwise everyone would immediately default to using the relic tool and make adjustments in their other melds to compensate for craftsmanship/control gains and losses.

You get to take your pick on what's most important to you.

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Originally Posted by Pepsi_Plunge

Are you sure about that? Did Yoshi said that or is there any other good source for it?

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When Skysteel tools were announced in the live letter, YoshiP said we would be upgrading them over the course of the expansion and that the final stage tool at the end of the expansion would be BiS.

When you do the quest to show the NPC your first Dragonsung tool, she tells us that there were further design notes found with the tools that they were still trying to make sense out of and that they'll let us know when they're ready to upgrade our tools even farther.

If those aren't a good enough source for you, nothing will be.