Savage is way to hard nerf it please!

If a raid is impossible to clear using its party finder mechanic, its too hard for an MMO in my opinion.

Eden Savage 5 is WAY to hard for an MMO.

Uhhhhh. No.

Wait, this wasn't Titan Men?

Its named savage for a reason its not supposed to be easy.

It's called 'savage' for a reason. If you can't clear it with a bunch of randos, then there's a few underlying issues. It's not 'impossible'. Ask the people who HAVE managed to clear all the fights with random groups they joined.

Just because you have trouble, doesn't mean it's the definitive answer that 'it's impossible'.

As somebody who doesn't really have space to be dedicated to a static or consistent group and has to PUG to a certain degree...I disagree. I barely touch Savage as a result, whilst it interests me and I am capable enough of doing it, but I'm not asking for it to be more puggable so it's more accessible to me. Like, I have easier content that I can pug already. Extremes are more puggable, Normal Raids are puggable, alliance raids are puggable.

The game just has tiers of difficulty for content and Savage and Ultimate exists for people who want that higher difficulty tier. If it's too hard, then you're not the target demographic for that content. Especially as some in the savage scene are saying Savage is too easy at the moment. Let them have their thing. Do normal for the story and the experience of doing the fights, do Extremes if you want more of a challenge but more achievable with PUG's. I mean, the devs already accommodated by splitting 8 man raids into Savage and Normal, back when Coils came out as our first 8 man raids Normal was basically Savage with no easier mode available.


Whilst this does smell of a Titanmen post, but if your point is serious, those are the reasons why I disagree with the sentiment.

Currently proving E8s and I've been full pug this tier so it is very doable with random people, just gotta keep trying.

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Originally Posted by Crushnight

Currently proving E8s and I\\'ve been full pug this tier so it is very doable with random people, just gotta keep trying.

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Progging' /mobile autocorrect

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

If a raid is impossible to clear using its party finder mechanic, its too hard for an MMO in my opinion.

Eden Savage 5 is WAY to hard for an MMO.

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The game in general is too easy. Make everything harder. Too many games have pandered to noisy people with no desire to learn how to play a game resulting in a very noticeable drop in the quality and skill level of the average player. Game companies need to work on correcting that mistake.

https://i.giphy.com/media/tFK8urY6XHj2w/giphy.webp

Bait thread.

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Originally Posted by Dreamsoap

Bait thread.

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And the usual bait responses.

This tier honestly didn't feel that bad outside of E8S which is a much steeper increase in difficulty then E3S vs E4S was.

Part of the issue is that E7S is way too lenient of a DPS check, which coupled with the target dummies largely being undertuned this time around does not give people a very accurate picture of how much DPS they need to be pulling to be able to beat E8S.

my main PUG all the way to e8s, so no,
ifyou find it hard try enjoy the normal raid, thank you

Impossible in party finder ?
Waw, I wonder how all these people to do then to slowly progress.

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

If a raid is impossible to clear using its party finder mechanic, its too hard for an MMO in my opinion.
Eden Savage 5 is WAY to hard for an MMO.

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Most people I encounter play on a level that would put a chimpanzee to shame and think they can clear savage by breathing on their keyboards/controllers.
I'd avoid randoms like the plague when it comes to savage progression.
Get a guild group.

Sure, there are skilled randoms out there, but you will grow a lot of grey hair playing Russian roulette hoping to find a few, wiping hundreds of times in the process.

PS: Savage is not too hard. It isn't targeted at uncoordinated random groups.

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

If a raid is impossible to clear using its party finder mechanic, its too hard for an MMO in my opinion.

Eden Savage 5 is WAY to hard for an MMO.

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Lemme get this straight, you can't do something, so you want the devs to take it away from everyone, including those who can? Nope. Stop being so entitled. Savage is optional content. Get yourself a raid group if it bothers you that much. If it was impossible, it wouldn't be in the game. I can't clear savage, I don't run around telling the devs to make it easier for me though, I'm not the target audience, players who want a challenge.

y’all. this is bait. I mean.. It has to be, right? ....Right?!

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Originally Posted by Fredco191

y’all. this is bait. I mean.. It has to be, right? ....Right?!

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*chomps*
Yup... bait confirmed.

Not that tasty though.

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Originally Posted by Fredco191

y’all. this is bait. I mean.. It has to be, right? ....Right?!

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Checking a certain site that shall be unnamed for very legitimate reasons it's almost definitely bait. Though not as finely crafted as that top percentile player who did the same exact topic a few months ago to similar amounts of sputtering outrage.

I say normal mode content needs a nerf before savage, I can still die if I do not use a cooldown ever so often.

Savage is... Savage. It is not supposed to be easy as PU. And not supposed to be "one run one down". So, if you want to train and clean it the "hard way", without static, you have no choice but to use PF (but still, you have no guarantee to find the right team since some use PF as if it was DF and expect some kind of PL).

You can also wait next update to have a better stuff and try unsync. And if it is for glamour, one day it will come as craftable gear (currently we are 5.x then 6.x or 7.x.).

Say whatver you want. but when you streamline your end game to cater only towards the top 1% of players you alienate the other 99%
Furthermore, savage is different in how the boss fights look. If there was an easy mode with the exact same mechanics/cutscenes (where the boss just doesnt insta kill you when you make a mistake) trust me I would be doing that mode and staying far away from savage. But the only way to experience all the visuals IS by doing savage (or youtubing it which is NOT the same)

And no this is not bait.
I am dead serious. This type of experience leads to players rage quitting, hating the game, taking long breaks, and eventually quitting. Especially for gamers knows as "Casual Completionists", and there are a LOT of those!

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

Especially for gamers knows as "Casual Completionists", and there are a LOT of those!

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Well they're gonna be waiting a while to clear content not meant for them...

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

Say whatver you want. but when you streamline your end game to cater only towards the top 1% of players you alienate the other 99%
Furthermore, savage is different in how the boss fights look. If there was an easy mode with the exact same mechanics/cutscenes (where the boss just doesnt insta kill you when you make a mistake) trust me I would be doing that mode and staying far away from savage. But the only way to experience all the visuals IS by doing savage (or youtubing it which is NOT the same)

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Dude...savage is supposed to be difficult content, and the only aesthetic difference is a model in the last turn. Stop being a drama queen. Stick to the normal mode and ex trials if you don't want to work on hc content.

It's hard to clear it in PF just because the average PF player is terrible and that's because the rest of the game doesn't do anything to encourage them to improve.

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

Say whatver you want. but when you streamline your end game to cater only towards the top 1% of players you alienate the other 99%
Furthermore, savage is different in how the boss fights look. If there was an easy mode with the exact same mechanics/cutscenes (where the boss just doesnt insta kill you when you make a mistake) trust me I would be doing that mode and staying far away from savage. But the only way to experience all the visuals IS by doing savage (or youtubing it which is NOT the same)

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But savage isn't catered towards the top 1% of players. Ultimate is. Savage can be done by casuals and shockingly it can even be done by someone who is severely lacking in performance. Last raid tier I saw black mages getting outdpsed by the healer clearing it. If you ask me it needs to be HARDER, not easier. You don't like making a mistake and dying to it ? Then learn the mechanic. Don't ask for the little challenge we have to be removed just because you can't be bothered to improve.

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

Say whatver you want. but when you streamline your end game to cater only towards the top 1% of players you alienate the other 99%

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Say whatever you want, but savage isn't for 1% of the playerbase. In fact every since they made huge adjustment to savage in Alexander:Creator, they were a lot more participation in savage and far more good result.
Since the content will last for 6-7 months, as time will pass content will be easier thanks to gear. That's for people having more difficulty dealing with the enrage timer.

Maybe it just doesn't suit you and you should drop it and do normal mode only.
You don't have to force yourself to do if it looks too hard for you. Ther's nothing wrong.
But savage content currently has no problem.

There's content in this game that doesn't interest me but I'm glad it exists for people that do like it. Savage is content that does interest me. You keep your toys and let me keep mine? :D

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

And no this is not bait.
I am dead serious. This type of experience leads to players rage quitting, hating the game, taking long breaks, and eventually quitting. Especially for gamers knows as "Casual Completionists", and there are a LOT of those!

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Because they'd be highly entertained and stay subbed all patch if they beat all of Savage week one?

Anyway, they nerfed Savage for you ages ago. It's called Normal mode and fits what you're looking for perfectly, go check it out.

When I clicked on this thread, I thought it was gonna be about e8s, which is much more difficult than the rest of the tier.

Now I'm just laughing.

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

And no this is not bait.
I am dead serious. This type of experience leads to players rage quitting, hating the game, taking long breaks, and eventually quitting. Especially for gamers knows as "Casual Completionists", and there are a LOT of those!

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Designing a game in order to appease the OCD of a subset of it's players is an exercise in futility.
This is YOUR personal problem, not ours and most certainly not SE's.

Accept that there is content that is not aimed at you and move on.

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

Say whatver you want. but when you streamline your end game to cater only towards the top 1% of players you alienate the other 99%
Furthermore, savage is different in how the boss fights look. If there was an easy mode with the exact same mechanics/cutscenes (where the boss just doesnt insta kill you when you make a mistake) trust me I would be doing that mode and staying far away from savage. But the only way to experience all the visuals IS by doing savage (or youtubing it which is NOT the same)

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Well, technically if you just want to experience the content and can find 7 people to do it no matter if they have cleared or not, the game doesn't really stop you. Experiencing the fight should mean doing it as the devs intended, right? It just removes the gear. If you want the gear, wait until they nerf it down the line (they remove chest restrictions) or form a group of non-cleared like the devs want you to if you want it sooner than that. Seems fair.

This thread is silly and OP is silly. Raiders need prog content to do, why would SE nerf that content? What, do you want Ultimates, the actual, for realsies hardest content in the game, to be puggable too?

To hard ot not to hard. That is the question.

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

And no this is not bait.
I am dead serious. This type of experience leads to players rage quitting, hating the game, taking long breaks, and eventually quitting. Especially for gamers knows as "Casual Completionists", and there are a LOT of those!

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It's pretty hard to take seriously TBH.

There is a difficulty issue, but it's not quite what you think it is IMHO.

The problem isn't that Savage is too hard, because it flat out isn't. It's close to as easy and accessible as it's ever been. The DPS requirements aren't especially rough with the first couple of fights being particularly generous without stooping to Alte Roite levels of stupidity.

In my eyes, the actual issue here is that the rest of the game simply doesn't prepare you for Savage. Even EX trials are easier and more forgiving than they've ever been. Voice comms and some basic understanding of incoming mechanics can get a competent group through Ruby within a few pulls and everything below that is a literal face roll where dieing practically takes effort and there's no punishment and little chance of failure when you actually manage it.

I've carried DPS through the latest dungeon with over 5 stacks of vulnerability on them on a couple of occasions and the game does literally nothing to suggest to them that their standard of play is actually unacceptable in the end game.

This is where the real problem lies.

SE can 100% do better than this, ARR had a superb difficulty curve with the 49+ dungeons ramping up the difficulty, not to mention that the dungeon bosses were used to demonstrate and teach mechanics that would then reappear later on in the HM Primals.

Sadly it feels like SE lost their nerve for casual content with teeth after Pharos Sirius got nerfed =(

OP is right. Here's my solution: an arena with a chest. You loot the chest once, get all gear sets for all your jobs ( you can add any relic you want too, even ultimate weapons, and mogstation outfits).
Now you're free to afk again in Limsa until SE closes servers in 2075.

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Originally Posted by Novae

OP is right. Here's my solution: an arena with a chest. You loot the chest once, get all gear sets for all your jobs ( you can add any relic you want too, even ultimate weapons, and mogstation outfits).
Now you're free to afk again in Limsa until SE closes servers in 2075.

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All of MY jobs? That implies I wouldn't get gear for jobs I don't have leveled/unlocked so I would have to keep going back each time I level a new job. Clearly too hard and unforgiving, that level of repetition might lead me to unsub

Obvious troll is obvious

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Originally Posted by Cirque-it

If a raid is impossible to clear using its party finder mechanic, its too hard for an MMO in my opinion.

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It's not impossible to pug. Just harder than with a pre-made. Just like anything else.

You might want to look up the definition of "savage" and then decide if you should still be able to get a clear easily.