Craft grinding gets tedious.. Needs more automation.

I'm making Ishgard stuff for scrips for crafting materia.
Using macros, so it goes: Click - click - wait - click - click - wait - click- click - wait - click - click - wait - wait - click....Zzzzzzzzz

Even without macros, if you have a routine down that works every time, there's no challenge. Just click the same things over and over again, so you end up just sitting there clicking the same buttons for hours.

One advantage WoW crafting has over this is that when you have to make many of the same thing, you just set the quantity, and click ONCE. then AFK while it makes them all.. We could that option here, Perhaps with the option to loop and chain macros.

Well, I do believe there’s a fine line between making crafting more approachable, and just being outright lazy...there’s really no need to make FFXIV and WoW the same game.

Yoshida will 99% do what you suggested though, lol. 6.0 if I had to guess, along with guaranteed materia melding.

I dunno. On the one hand, I'm sitting here looking at the 10k+ white scrips I need for my endgame crafter gear and thinking "that's a lot of scrips". But on the other hand, if I could just press one button to receive scrips, there wouldn't be a sense of accomplishment.

FFXIV does have quick synthesis, but it comes with some (intentional) limitations. You can't quicksynth collectibles, and the chance of getting HQ items is fairly low. It's mostly intended for mass-producing intermediate materials.

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

One advantage WoW crafting has over this is that when you have to make many of the same thing, you just set the quantity, and click ONCE. then AFK while it makes them all.. We could that option here, Perhaps with the option to loop and chain macros.

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You have that advantage here. The vast majority of items allow for quick synthesis. Stick to making those items if you don't want to have to use a rotation.

WoW's crafting was a joke because of that one click then done design for everything, even back when crafted items still had some relevance in Vanilla and BC. We definitely don't need SE to turn the crafting here into the same joke.

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

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Perhaps with the option to loop and chain macros.

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Recursive macros are about as good as botting. There are good reasons we don't have them.

You could also save a lot of time and money by playing another game if you don't actually want to play this. Cookie clicker is still around for that instant gratification in one click, I believe. No subscription fee.

Quick Synthing collectables??? No thank you. Macro's are good enough quick synth is for when Quality or collectablity are not a concern.

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Originally Posted by Shadygrove

Recursive macros are about as good as botting. There are good reasons we don't have them.

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In all seriousness, if they aren't actually going to bother enforcing DoH botting I'd be all for having recursive macros especially now that they're adding a competitive aspect to crafting with the Ishgard Restoration in 5.2.

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Originally Posted by Shadygrove

Recursive macros are about as good as botting. There are good reasons we don't have them.

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Then, perhaps a change to Quick Synth. After you've made 10 of an item in a row, you get the option to QS any number of them by repeating the same actions you used previously.

Kind of how it is. The challenge, such as it is, is in making macros and optimizing them, even though it is much easier to do so now. Or if you are manually crafting, taking advantage of good/excellent procs.

I can't see them reducing the time, and I also think complete afk crafting is unlikely as it changes the nature of the game too much when you can play in a completely automated fashion for hours without even having to press any buttons after the first one. But I agree you can already afk and watch netflix and just press the button again every time your controller chirps.

No. Crafting is good and unique in this game because it actually requires you to do something, rather than just watch a bar progress like in pretty much every other MMO out there.
If you don't like crafting, there's no need for you to do it, just buy things off the MB.

Oh dear god no, I'll take the in depth tediousness of this game over the literal nothing in WoW every day, all day. This game's crafting actually has depth, DoH jobs feel like actual work instead of just "click the button make the thing".

Meh, I like the rotations and stuff.

Just clicking "make" and going to get a sandwich is boring, I mean, if anything I'm wondering why WoW doesn't have instant crafts, like, click and it's done. Why wait on the progress meter?

At least in XIV, you get nice little animations and stuff. Better than just playing with your hands like WoW, lol.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

Just clicking "make" and going to get a sandwich is boring, I mean, if anything I'm wondering why WoW doesn't have instant crafts, like, click and it's done. Why wait on the progress meter?

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SW:TOR had a different take on this. Instead of crafting yourself you'd task your crew members with doing the crafting. Depending on the level of the item it might take anywhere between a few minutes to an hour, but you could do other things meanwhile. You could queue up to five items per crew member too. I forget if you could give them new tasks from anywhere or if you had to be on your ship for that. It was pretty good as far as simplistic crafting systems go, but FFXIV's is loads better.

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Originally Posted by tdb

SW:TOR had a different take on this. Instead of crafting yourself you'd task your crew members with doing the crafting. Depending on the level of the item it might take anywhere between a few minutes to an hour, but you could do other things meanwhile. You could queue up to five items per crew member too. I forget if you could give them new tasks from anywhere or if you had to be on your ship for that. It was pretty good as far as simplistic crafting systems go, but FFXIV's is loads better.

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Kinda like Warframe's Foundry, basically same thing. Tell People/Thing to build something, come back later.

Boring as frick and it is all about the grind for materials and the blueprints to make the stuff, rather than the crafting itself.

crafting I'm fine with but, gathering can be so boring sometimes. It's not even hard Just back and forth back and forth gathering materials lol. At least for the skybuilder stuff it gets tedious with how much materials you need.

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Originally Posted by SockOutlet

crafting I'm fine with but, gathering can be so boring sometimes. It's not even hard Just back and forth back and forth gathering materials lol. At least for the skybuilder stuff it gets tedious with how much materials you need.

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I will admit that I do kinda wish they had kept gathering materials the way they were in ARR, with the gathering nodes more tightly grouped instead of having three groups of 2 that you had to try and remember.

With the inclusion of Skybuilder's stuff, and of course the new changes to where your detection abilities (not Truth, but rather Arbor Call, and I forget what the other one is called) will pick up Ephemeral Nodes, half of the time I try to gather something and I can't remember where all three groups are and my detection abilities are telling me about junk I don't care about. I want to gather, say, Dimythrite, not that stupid Ephemeral Node that spawns in the middle of the Dimythrite nodes that makes it impossible to use my sensing ability. And of course, it's a lot of flying back and forth, that doesn't really add anything to the experience other than tedium.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

I will admit that I do kinda wish they had kept gathering materials the way they were in ARR, with the gathering nodes more tightly grouped instead of having three groups of 2 that you had to try and remember.

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Once I finally find the right cluster, I'll just set down A B C markers so I always know which direction to turn after each set of nodes. Now, actually finding/remembering where everything is located on our ever-expanding zone maps, that's another problem.

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Originally Posted by Hasrat

Once I finally find the right cluster, I'll just set down A B C markers so I always know which direction to turn after each set of nodes. Now, actually finding/remembering where everything is located on our ever-expanding zone maps, that's another problem.

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If they are gonna split the nodes up like that, the least they could do is give us a FSH-style node map like they do for fishing holes, where we can bring up a map and any node we discovered appears on the map with little shaded areas like some wikis on the Internet do.

I wouldn't mind some sort of bulk crafting recipes, i know i need 12 units of the thing so i make a 10 and two 1s. Although for fairness sake it would have to use a lot of actions and have a high difficulty to hq and i dont know if theres any sort of math that could reasonably balance that out.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

If they are gonna split the nodes up like that, the least they could do is give us a FSH-style node map like they do for fishing holes, where we can bring up a map and any node we discovered appears on the map with little shaded areas like some wikis on the Internet do.

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Oh my god yes please! I waste SO MUCH TIME flying around in circles trying to remember where the damned node triangle is! The descriptors in the gathering guide are entirely too broad. Don't just tell me to check around Scree for Dwarven Cotton... maybe specify "Oh yeah... check the area over there by rock pillars and the cliff just outside of Tomra!"

I have... had some experiences with this... <.<;

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Originally Posted by Kytrin

Oh my god yes please! I waste SO MUCH TIME flying around in circles trying to remember where the damned node triangle is! The descriptors in the gathering guide are entirely too broad. Don't just tell me to check around Scree for Dwarven Cotton... maybe specify "Oh yeah... check the area over there by rock pillars and the cliff just outside of Tomra!"

I have... had some experiences with this... <.<;

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Yeah, then when you teleport to Tomra and you do an Arbor Call or what-not, and it shows you an Ephemeral Node, or you go there and it's a Skybuilder's Node and you keep flying around using those abilities and it keeps showing you the stuff you don't want.

One thing I do not understand is why did they not stick the Skybuilder's stuff inside of other nodes that were already there instead of cluttering everything up?

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Originally Posted by Maeka

Yeah, then when you teleport to Tomra and you do an Arbor Call or what-not, and it shows you an Ephemeral Node, or you go there and it's a Skybuilder's Node and you keep flying around using those abilities and it keeps showing you the stuff you don't want.

One thing I do not understand is why did they not stick the Skybuilder's stuff inside of other nodes that were already there instead of cluttering everything up?

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I have a suspicion they kept it separate to avoid confusing new gatherers. It's probably also why the lower level nodes are in areas out of sync with the zone's general gathering level. So if you go hunting for it, it's on purpose and after you're higher level than the normal stuff there anyway. It IS very cluttery though I agree.

They may have also set it aside because of things being added later on in the restoration.

For DoH, you got quick synthesis, that thing sacrifice constant hq for automation you seek. Also they kind of still have better chance hq based on rating?

For HQ, it is like you need to pay attention of it, you do that not like some production machine, but as an artisan pursuing perfection. Which of course garners more attention. (Still, macro eh)

As for DoL nodes, unspoiled and ephemeral is either time based hard to get or collectibles which need a lot of buffs. Forcing you to manual actually benefits much rather than blindly click and "oh shiet I wanna stop it to put my hq or yield buff but now I can't" scenario.

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

I'm making Ishgard stuff for scrips for crafting materia.
Using macros, so it goes: Click - click - wait - click - click - wait - click- click - wait - click - click - wait - wait - click....Zzzzzzzzz

Even without macros, if you have a routine down that works every time, there's no challenge. Just click the same things over and over again, so you end up just sitting there clicking the same buttons for hours.

One advantage WoW crafting has over this is that when you have to make many of the same thing, you just set the quantity, and click ONCE. then AFK while it makes them all.. We could that option here, Perhaps with the option to loop and chain macros.

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OP, do you even know what you're asking for? You are basically saying you don't want to craft. So why are you even doing it? Automating synthesis attempts takes the challenge right out. Yet, here you are using macros while simultaneously asking for crafting to be more challenging.

When looking at any particular crafting recipe that is the final product, and we evaluate the process from beginning to finish (mat acquisition, quick synth intermediary mats, crafting final product) the very last step actually consumes the least amount of time. This remains true even if manually crafting turn-ins when the goal is turning in tons of a finished goods. In short, you spend far more time acquiring the mats you need.

Even though mat acquisition is time consuming, there is no difficulty. You might have to deal with a little RNG and waiting for node windows to spawn, but nothing too bad. I can't speak for everyone, but FINALLY getting to sit down and just craft is my reward for all the time spent gathering the damn mats, and I'll burn down rain forests before I let automated synths and macros take that away from me.

The challenge with crafting comes when facing a new recipe difficulty so you can no longer use your bread n butter rotation, and forcing the player to improvise by an untimely failure during a synthesis, or both. Once you figure out a solid rotation for a new recipe difficulty, then the only thing that makes it challenging after that is having to improvise due to a failure. If you then figure out a way to come up with a rotation that compensates for any and all failures, then you're waiting for the next master books, or the next expansion at that point.

Basically, the challenge in crafting isn't perpetual. But neither is anything in the game. Once a raid group figures out how to clear the current savage/ultimate, what do you think happens next? They start farming it, with the only challenge coming when something doesn't go right. Once content is consumed, then it's a matter of choice of where you sink that time until new content is released, and it sounds like you do not like where you are putting that time, so stop.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

OP, do you even know what you're asking for? You are basically saying you don't want to craft. So why are you even doing it?

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Probably he wants the cosmetic rewards from Ishgard restoration with none of the effort.

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Originally Posted by tdb

SW:TOR had a different take on this. Instead of crafting yourself you'd task your crew members with doing the crafting. Depending on the level of the item it might take anywhere between a few minutes to an hour, but you could do other things meanwhile. You could queue up to five items per crew member too. I forget if you could give them new tasks from anywhere or if you had to be on your ship for that. It was pretty good as far as simplistic crafting systems go, but FFXIV's is loads better.

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Is it possible to level one of your Retainers as a weaver, for example, and assign them to generate the scripts for you?

The fundamental issue is that each macro comprises several actions, using a macro creates a noticeable pause whilst you wait to use your next macro.

If you want more gameplay, and more fun, then don't use macros; just apply the action for each crafting step.

In other words, play the game. Otherwise, why are you here.

Macros are crap Im sorry but I refuse to use macros for any reason. They encourage laziness the same way GPS negates reading road maps.

Point is if you rely on macros for everything, then you don't learn how to do crafts manually or you just forget.

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Originally Posted by Tohe-Spidhire

Is it possible to level one of your Retainers as a weaver, for example, and assign them to generate the scripts for you?

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SW:TOR did not have anything quite like the scrip system. You could have your crew craft endgame items which players would pay a pretty penny for, but IIRC those required materials from raids.

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Originally Posted by Jimmymagic

Macros are crap Im sorry but I refuse to use macros for any reason. They encourage laziness the same way GPS negates reading road maps.

Point is if you rely on macros for everything, then you don't learn how to do crafts manually or you just forget.

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Or you have horrifying flashbacks to Rath's Rotation from HW. That was the entire reason I washed my hands of manual crafting. I get quite enough challenge building my macros to the best possible setup until an update requires they be modified thank you. I don't need to hunt and peck my way through the exact same rotation every single time I want to craft collectables or a stack of something HQ. Or stress myself about procs and know that if things don't proc my whole rotation could be screwed. I don't have the time or patience for that level of stress and mess.

Granted, all the changes make that whole issue far less than what it used to be, but I'll stick with my macros all the same. They're far better time management for someone who can't be glued constantly to the screen, and I don't think it's at all appropriate to call people who use them lazy. It's fine if you prefer manual crafting, but there are other factors at play than merely "Hur dur.. I dun wanna do it the hard way because I want it all handed to me on a silver platter!".

Assumption that I am glued to the screen is not valid. It you are playing an mmo for time management you might want to play something else. All mmo are time sinks. What the hell do you care if I use macros or not. You want macros by all means I just stated my opinion. I didn't attack somebody because of it. Macros do not save time they save button pushing that's it. But hey what ever. SE gets your money either way.

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Originally Posted by Jimmymagic

Assumption that I am glued to the screen is not valid. It you are playing an mmo for time management you might want to play something else. All mmo are time sinks. What the hell do you care if I use macros or not. You want macros by all means I just stated my opinion. I didn't attack somebody because of it. Macros do not save time they save button pushing that's it. But hey what ever. SE gets your money either way.

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You're the one who said macros were crap and the people who used them are lazy. But I'm not going to argue the point further. :)

Another...but..but WoW post....This is NOT WoW, we don't want WoW...you're here so you don't want WoW...so stop askin fer it to be like WoW....

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Originally Posted by Arrhin

Another...but..but WoW post....This is NOT WoW, we don't want WoW...you're here so you don't want WoW...so stop askin fer it to be like WoW....

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Not everything about WoW is junk. As an example, I'm sure a lot of players would love to see part of the glamour system work more like the transmogrification system where the appearance of any bound item in your inventory is automatically added to your collection without limit and without a visit to a glamour dresser.

But WoW crafting has no end game while FFXIV does. If the OP wants one button crafting, he can stick to the items that have quick synthesis available and avoid the end game crafting content that lacks it.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

Not everything about WoW is junk. As an example, I'm sure a lot of players would love to see part of the glamour system work more like the transmogrification system where the appearance of any bound item in your inventory is automatically added to your collection without limit and without a visit to a glamour dresser.

But WoW crafting has no end game while FFXIV does. If the OP wants one button crafting, he can stick to the items that have quick synthesis available and avoid the end game crafting content that lacks it.

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I'd have to say the Transmog system is one of the (very) few things that WoW did better than XIV.

But if that's all you really got going for your game, you're in trouble lol.

Honestly as I sit here and really think about it, I can't really think of much I can really say I enjoyed more in WoW. Okay, maybe more variety of non-humanlike races perhaps. We finally have the Hrothgar in XIV but until they came along, everybody was a human with optional tails, horns, or cat/bunny ears. Or really short people.

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Originally Posted by tdb

I dunno. On the one hand, I'm sitting here looking at the 10k+ white scrips I need for my endgame crafter gear and thinking "that's a lot of scrips". But on the other hand, if I could just press one button to receive scrips, there wouldn't be a sense of accomplishment.

FFXIV does have quick synthesis, but it comes with some (intentional) limitations. You can't quicksynth collectibles, and the chance of getting HQ items is fairly low. It's mostly intended for mass-producing intermediate materials.

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I Was thinking that at first too. Then I started making facet gear 2-3 peices at a time. I only farmed enough scripts for my current needs. It makes things way less daunting. Plus everything gets faster over time. Instead of farming all the scripts up front, each time I need more my gathering/crafting gear is better - so it goes faster.