should i even level ast?

its my last healer to level, but everything i read about it makes me not want to even touch it. no varied card effects just sounds like brainless draw spamming and feeding them to dps at all times. ast also have always had weak dps so theres nothing exciting like playign whm tryign to outdps the dps and sch used to be THE healer dps

Technically speaking, AST is top healer DPS right now if you go by rDPS, which is the metric people care about on fflogs and high end duties. However, if you're the type where that alone isn't going to appeal to you, ehhhhh, I'm not sure I could recommend AST . It has the worst MP economy of the 3, you now have to target swap constantly with the new card system, the seal system is a mess at worst and completely unnecessary at best, and they have the same boring rotation as every other healer outside of that.

Honestly, it's up to you, the best advice anyone can give you is to try it for yourself, you may fall in love with it, or throw it in the garbage. I did 2 dungeon runs on AST in this expac so far, and that's all I could really stomach to do. I couldn't even get it to max level and do an E1s run on it for a meme like I had planned to do.

I asked this question before and got a mix of answers, i actually ended up loving it personally and got almost to lvl 70 in matter of just a few weeks.

New ast players wont really notice any card problems, and 5.1 buffed it ever so slightly to raise damage. Plus ast is a little more complex than things like whm if you're a fan of less braindead classes (no offense whms, your class is just REALLY easy)

Best advice is to just try it a little and see what you think, at least get to lvl 40 or 50 imo since thats when you start really getting into the meat of classes. Opinions vary so much on ast it's hard to really know how you'll feel. Obviously it's all valid, but some people aren't as bothered by its flaws than others.

Yeah, I say give it a go, you can only form your own opinion around it. As much as I am one of those people who moans about the current state of healers, it doesn't mean other people are going to have the same problems as me and might like them. My view very much is "judge for yourself" because how other people enjoy things isn't necessarily going to impact your own enjoyment, as sometimes, you might find you are in the percentage of people who like what they see.

That said, despite my complaints, AST is actually the one I'm liking the most at the moment, despite SCH being my baby since forever, but seeing the changes to each and why I was unhappy with SCH kinda drew me closer to AST. Out of the three healers it's the busiest and has more to do in its downtime versus the other two thanks to its cards. So there is an extra depth to playing it WHM & SCH lack. And you've got a little versatility between Diurnal and Nocturnal Sects.

It is not without its problems, hence a lot of AST are unhappy and whilst I am liking it more than the other 2 healers at the moment (and feeling like I am betraying my baby, SCH) there are things I think could be better (some of which affects all healer jobs).

But main things that attracted me:
- Busier, oGCD weaves can be nice
- Cards fill up your downtime somewhat
- Gravity feels more impactful than Art of War
- It retains some of its "planned" approach, coming as an old school SCH, skills for planning ahead appeal to me. I plan my Earthly Stars, my Horoscopes and my Neutral Sects
- It is versatile in-so-much as you can choose WHM mode or SCH mode whenever you're not in battle.
- MP feels a little more like a resource you have to manage, though 5.1 has reduced that effect.

Things that I don't like so much:
- The card system feels less impactful than it used to and there's more of an illusion of choice, rather than choice
- Some of the spells, for me at least, don't flow as well into each other, but this could be because I've played SCH for so long
- Healer downtime isn't so great ATM, but at least for AST that's mitigated versus other healers, so can be a positive or a negative.

On the notes of cards, whilst they feel less impactful and exist as an illusion of choice. It isn't quite as far in a abyss as just hitting play. Although everything is "the balance", which is where the illusion of choice comes in, where it has I guess 'variety' is that instead of fishing for cards for their bonuses, you're fishing them for their symbol to build you Divination, which is like a Balance with a Spread Royal Road where potency is affected by how many unique symbols you have built up. It's not terrible coming from a non-AST point of view, but compared to what there was before, I think many find the current system to be lackluster by comparison.

But I'm sure others, particularly career AST's, may probably have a more extensive explanation of likes/dislikes or can give a better explanation of the job itself, to give a feel/expectations.

I've always had fun anytime I played AST.

WHM is the safest, AST is the most fun when it comes to keeping the group alive, and SCH...

I dunno maybe I just approach it with the wrong mindset, but SCH is the least fun of the 3. Not saying it is bad per se, just... not my favorite, lol.

But I've definitely had a ton of fun with AST. Pulling off that precisely timed Stellar Explosion always feels great, when it goes off a second after group-wide damage is just cool and it's very show-offy.

If you have never played AST you may like it. Not having a basis for comparisson may actually help you like it more than people who have been playing it since it came out. Part of it plays similarily to WHM which will make it feel at home for you in that context, but it offers it's own flare and has it's own gimmick both with cards and a couple "set and forget" abilities, although don't forget to pop Horoscope lol. It really should be a Set and Forget ability but that's a discussion for another day.

i have it at 70 since some people think i dont have it leveled at all. i just havent played it since shb because the card effects removal really soured me. thats why i was wondering if maybe i should just wait for next expac when they hopefully make ast fun again

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

i have it at 70 since some people think i dont have it leveled at all. i just havent played it since shb because the card effects removal really soured me. thats why i was wondering if maybe i should just wait for next expac when they hopefully make ast fun again

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I'd say, in that case, take it through a dungeon or two. From what I can tell, AST doesn't change much from 70 to 80, so you'll have the basic idea of how it works at max.

I got mine at 80 and I'm having fun with astro, sure it's not as good as its Glory days of SB but I switched astro to my main healer from whm once I got it to 80 cause it's a fun job to play.

The cards do feel lackluster individually, but the Divination-Crown bursts are still decently fun to maximize. I just wouldn't recommend the job if on a controller; otherwise, it's pretty fun, and certainly has a bit more to do than the other healers.

You'll love it at 80 for Neutral sect then hate the card system eventually for being dull and lazy. Astrologian used to be a lot of fun now they killed it and it's basically just boost damage only with a lackluster card system that needs to change or go back to the old system

You'll be busy, that's for sure. But who knows if you will find it rewarding.

I personally haven't enjoyed healing at all this expansion but i still want to 80 everything. I decided to get whm and ast done with beasy tribes. Its not the fastest way to get it done but its just a 10 minute daily chore.

Of course give it a go. The card system is nowhere near as good, but overall AST is a solid healer that can easily cover both mitigation and healing and provide more overall DPS than even a WHM.

Also it's worth noting that MP issues is only a problem when DPSing heavily, which I personally suggest every healer do, but the fact is a lot don't, and if you just like to heal and throw out the occasional DPS spell then AST is a fine MP-wise.

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

its my last healer to level, but everything i read about it makes me not want to even touch it. no varied card effects just sounds like brainless draw spamming and feeding them to dps at all times. ast also have always had weak dps so theres nothing exciting like playign whm tryign to outdps the dps and sch used to be THE healer dps

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It's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be, 5.1 ast has been buffed significantly compared to 5.0. You have amazing ogcd efficiency with your Malefic IV and Gravity cast times. AST is the only healer in the game that, when played optimally, does not loose damage from weaving its ogcds.

Your cards may initially seem bland, but regardless they're still a support mechanic that you manage externally from healing and can still optimize. Proper card +Divination use gives a decent amount of damage to your group. Usually your rdps is about 800-1400 higher then your actual dps thanks to it. Not to mention that 5.1 has buffed its Malefic and Combust damage to be more significant (Combust more so then Malefic).

AST isn't exceptionally bad, it's just got the same fundamental issues that all healers in this game currently share. If you want to heal then AST is a perfectly acceptable choice.

Those feels when you do not have Benediction and 4 freaking instant heals at your disposal.

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Originally Posted by Rasikko

Those feels when you do not have Benediction and 4 freaking instant heals at your disposal.

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1-2 charges of Essential Dignity, Celestial Intersection, Celestial Opposition, Collective Unconscious and technically Horoscope and Earthly Star, but those last two are a technicality due to needing setup. I wont argue Benediction since that's... well... Benediction. But still.

Amaro is best boy, do it for the Amaro.

Plus do you want AST to have exactly what WHM has got? Some of us are already complaining healers are too similar.

However, as Branded rightly points out, AST has plenty in the way of insta casts. I've never felt I've been without in terms of healing.

Plus, we all know, Benediction never goes off anyway. :P

Astro is a fun class, it's just kinda messy rn. You might wanna wait till next expansion or see if SE manages to make it better in the next patches if you are still unsure.

Astro is still fun, the card system needs improvement for sure however.
Give it a chance or at the very least you will have it level capped and be ready for next expansion or if it gets changes in Shadowbringers

its up to you to lvl up ast or not.
some minor players love ast right now and the majority hate it(myself included) but in the end you need to try ast for a bit, check it out for yourself and then decide.

if you love him great then level him up and use him if not just forget about him and lvl it when you feel like it if at all,that is the best advice we can give you really.

AST is fun with gigabrain potential, compared to the other two which are meme level boring with maybe SCH being a bit more fun than WHM.

The logic you've applied to crudely summarize Astrologian I could apply to literally any job in this game.

Form your own opinions. It doesn't cost anything to pick it up and try it. If you listen to everyone's complaints you'll never get anything done.

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Originally Posted by Maero

Astro is still fun, the card system needs improvement for sure however.
Give it a chance or at the very least you will have it level capped and be ready for next expansion or if it gets changes in Shadowbringers

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Honestly, if one could just convince themself that the cards give twice as much effect as they do, and they're not using controller, the mechanics pretty solid. (The only real complaint for M&KB players is that the effort seems to exceed the reward provided, but even that seems quite debateable given how much rDPS it puts out even now.) There's no part of it the card kit doesn't leave you plenty of agency after you get Minor Arcana. And, by the time you're used to it and have Sleeve Draw, it's hard not to get a perfect Divination each time, though working to that end will keep you decently busy during bursts.

Astro has the same MP costs and Cast times for the most part as WHM and SCH, the only major thing is that you don't have a way to generate MP/Ignore MP like SCH and WHM do. You have Lightspeed which just cuts MP costs in half. They are playable, but you need to be more deliberate with your spell casts. They have Regeneration rivaling WHM, not to sure on the shielding aspect. Neutral sect is also pretty nice.

I really just miss the old card system. Ast would have no problems with MP at all if 'The Ewer' still did what it used to. I hope they can reverse the card changes.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Honestly, if one could just convince themself that the cards give twice as much effect as they do, and they're not using controller, the mechanics pretty solid. (The only real complaint for M&KB players is that the effort seems to exceed the reward provided, but even that seems quite debateable given how much rDPS it puts out even now.) There's no part of it the card kit doesn't leave you plenty of agency after you get Minor Arcana. And, by the time you're used to it and have Sleeve Draw, it's hard not to get a perfect Divination each time, though working to that end will keep you decently busy during bursts.

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I actually am a controller user.. i play on PS4 Pro. I do not find it overly bad but i also do not heal Savage level content, lol

I want to level Ast but the card system imo is a huge turnoff for me. Ast mains might disagree with me on this, but to me the job is like trying to solve a rubix cube while sitting in your friends car while he's doing donuts in said car in an open parking lot. It's a mess.

The card system seems clunky only when you get DPS that are both the same role.. then SE's weird RNG algorithm does what it does best - be weird. You're gonna get all wrong-role cards and have to redraw like crazy. However, none of the card actions are on the GCD and therefor you can redraw/play/undraw/give card all the while casting something else.

I levelled it just because. I liked it quite a bit at 60, but the cards are now pointlessly doing the same thing, and that lord/lady crown should replace the card when it comes up rather than wasting extra buttons. It's quite messy at the moment. Fixable if they doing something about playing the cards.

You still need the other cards to build Divination. Lord and Lady don't give seals.

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Originally Posted by XiXiQ

I levelled it just because. I liked it quite a bit at 60, but the cards are now pointlessly doing the same thing, and that lord/lady crown should replace the card when it comes up rather than wasting extra buttons. It's quite messy at the moment. Fixable if they doing something about playing the cards.

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Sleeve Draw at 70 helps significantly with setting up cards and Divination, and gives you a burst cooldown of sorts at 3 min marks.

So I forgot how long Ive been playing it, but I cant put it down. I use it for 50+ roulette and leveling roulette. Cannot say when I last hopped on WHM. I use the 70 AF gear as glamour because it looks nice.

Yeah I can say this was worth it. Not gonna lie though... 40-70 was very rough...

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Originally Posted by XiXiQ

I levelled it just because. I liked it quite a bit at 60, but the cards are now pointlessly doing the same thing, and that lord/lady crown should replace the card when it comes up rather than wasting extra buttons. It's quite messy at the moment. Fixable if they doing something about playing the cards.

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Lord/Lady are essentially just another way to mitigate RNG, especially in synergy with Sleeve Draw. You initially get 4 draws per Divination, yet need only 3 Seals. Thus, if you run out of Redraws and can't make use of the 2nd/3rd Seal you get, you can just convert it into a Lord/Lady in order not to disrupt the Seals you already have.

It's actually one of the busiest healing jobs to play optimally at endgame.

WHM just spams glare most of the time.
Scholar is the same with broil.

AST, you're spaming malefic, but the cast time for malefic is such that you can weave in OGCDs no problem, which is a lot of what you're doing with the cards.

Personaly i just recommend leveling up another healer along with AST, gearing up with that healer, and then switching to AST once you've got a comfortable amount of healing gear. Low ilvl AST is rough. WHM and SCH have a much better time doing dungeons at lower ilvls in my experience.