A lack of competitiveness in FFXIV

I'm not sure where this thread should go, but I guess it's kind of general in a broad sort of way.

Linkshells, currently are glorified chatrooms. Unless your linkshell has a really nice website, with event/raid schedules and everyone is nice and active in the forums, I feel that they feel quite empty in presence (ingame).

There is currently no way for anyone to compete with each other, I'm not specifically talking about PvP, but that's something I'd personally like, I was a big brenner fan.

Currently, we have Primals and Raids for lvl 50, where there are secret achievements for speed runs. (I don't get why these are only viewable on the lodestone, I really dislike having to close my game to look at something intrinsically linked to it, when there is no real reason why this couldn't be viewable in game.)

Would it be very hard to add leaderboards for speed runs? - I don't think so.
Would that very simple addition allow linkshells to compete against each other in an non aggressive way? - Totally
Would it be cool to check a board in the main cities, read the top times for the day/week/month/all time and then rouse up your shellies to try and beat it? - I think so.

This doesn't just have to apply to speed runs. Linkshells could compete on any number of things, total NM's killed, company seals collected, provisioning supply missions, chocobo escorts, total leves completed in a day, anything..

Give us a reason to be in a linkshell SE, I want to feel like i'm part of an organisation, not just a squatter in a chatroom.

What does everyone else think to this?

I think the idea is fine as long as it doesn't lend itself to a mandatory culture - which I don't see happening. So long as competitiveness is optional its a great idea (seeing as those who want that experience could find it while those who do not can abstain at little-to-no penalty.)

I agree with the idea so long as that rule is observed.

I think leader boards would be a great addition but not for speedruns, because I want them to be removed.

I would rather see leader boards for killing a boss in the fastest time (ie from engaging it to it dying) and reset every week.

They also could add leader boards for linkshells for hamlet defence, ie most active linkshell on the server etc.

I agree. And I suggest we rip off ragnarok online with the castle defense system: linkshells battle once a week to mantain domain of upgradeable castles.

I like that idea.

For dungeons and bosses:
Fastest time to beat dungeon or primal is good. Need many more like that imo.
Player "name" dealt most damage to "boss name"

etc etc

Edit:
They could show the results of these at the end or beginning of these events too.

Isn't this what the free company system is about? We'll be able to capture and summon primals for pvp.

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Originally Posted by Majidah

I agree. And I suggest we rip off ragnarok online with the castle defense system: linkshells battle once a week to mantain domain of upgradeable castles.

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Check out page 12 of this 2.0 PDF.

"Frontlines" seems to be just that. I think Free Companies will usher in a lot of the competition for which people are looking. Unfortunately, like many other things, we have to wait till 2.0.

However, 1.x can be looked at as a chance to be ahead of the curve by taking the time to deck our characters out in HQ quadruple-meld gear!

1 HNM open world mob, attack-able by 1 party only is what this game needs. Just one.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

I think leader boards would be a great addition but not for speedruns, because I want them to be removed.

I would rather see leader boards for killing a boss in the fastest time (ie from engaging it to it dying) and reset every week.

They also could add leader boards for linkshells for hamlet defence, ie most active linkshell on the server etc.

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I like this idea. Very similar to how Aion did its server/PVP rankings. Both users and guilds as a whole were counted for their PVP contributions. The top 10 or 5 received some pretty hefty combat tricks and bonuses.

FFXIV already has this planned with summoning primals and free companies. Hamlet defense should also be integrated into this and the free company with the highest contribution (reset once a week or maybe once every 3 days) should get some unique combat bonus that they can use.

I'll save Square-Enix the trouble of developing it and admit you have the larger e-peen. There, no need for PvP!

I'd be for the fastest time on dungeons, but FFXI did that with BCNM's, so we just CAN'T have it in this game...sowwy!

I agree. I'm a big fan of competition in these games. Personally, I don't see what people find satisfying about having easy access to gear. A month after content is provided, everyone is running around with the same gear and weapons. When you remove competition, it leads to homogenisation of the player base.

I enjoy this game, but I fear I'll never enjoy it as much as doing ground kings in XI.

Individual leaderboards for Achievement points & LS/Company Leaderboards for overall players. Yes please!

This would somewhat promote LS members into helping their own people complete content. Gotta bump your LS rating!

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Originally Posted by Bongeh1986

I'm not sure where this thread should go, but I guess it's kind of general in a broad sort of way.

Linkshells, currently are glorified chatrooms. Unless your linkshell has a really nice website, with event/raid schedules and everyone is nice and active in the forums, I feel that they feel quite empty in presence (ingame).

There is currently no way for anyone to compete with each other, I'm not specifically talking about PvP, but that's something I'd personally like, I was a big brenner fan.

Currently, we have Primals and Raids for lvl 50, where there are secret achievements for speed runs. (I don't get why these are only viewable on the lodestone, I really dislike having to close my game to look at something intrinsically linked to it, when there is no real reason why this couldn't be viewable in game.)

Would it be very hard to add leaderboards for speed runs? - I don't think so.
Would that very simple addition allow linkshells to compete against each other in an non aggressive way? - Totally
Would it be cool to check a board in the main cities, read the top times for the day/week/month/all time and then rouse up your shellies to try and beat it? - I think so.

This doesn't just have to apply to speed runs. Linkshells could compete on any number of things, total NM's killed, company seals collected, provisioning supply missions, chocobo escorts, total leves completed in a day, anything..

Give us a reason to be in a linkshell SE, I want to feel like i'm part of an organisation, not just a squatter in a chatroom.

What does everyone else think to this?

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Love it.

11 did something like this where it would state the fastest time and the leader of the group of a BCNM. However, that is slightly dated.

Something like:

Linkshell:
Chests:
Time:

An NPC outside the dungeon/primal can list the Leaderboards w/ that info.

The linkshell listed can be the one that the leader of the group is wearing when exiting the battlefield/dungeon.

There could be global leaderboards as well, so we can compete serverwide.

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Originally Posted by Bongeh1986

This doesn't just have to apply to speed runs. Linkshells could compete on any number of things, total NM's killed, company seals collected, provisioning supply missions, chocobo escorts, total leves completed in a day, anything..

Give us a reason to be in a linkshell SE, I want to feel like i'm part of an organisation, not just a squatter in a chatroom.

What does everyone else think to this?

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This is your problem lol. Let me preface this, though, by saying that there are two types of competitors

1) True competitors: These ppl compete because they love competing. They will make a competition out of anything, even if such things are normally not supposed to be competitive. Oh there's new content out? K we're gonna go beat it first and put out a video. Oh there's new gear? We'll be the first to make a complete drop list. Whats that? You just tanked Ifrit on GLD? Kk, I'ma go tank it as a naked pug and post a video. These ppl make their own competition because they love to be competitive. They dont need a game to set it up for them.

2) E-peen competitors: These are ppl that need everything set up on some grand stage (ie leaderboards) where their competition and success can be made known to the masses. These types of ppl could care less about being competitive for its own sake, its only competition if everyone knows about it and everyone can see the result. Naturally, these ppl are the most vocal about their accomplishments, and feel more elite than the "true competitors". These ppl compete to increase their e-peen, or their own perception of self-worth by validating themselves on a large scale. It can be generally assumed that these ppl are either douches or nonfactors in RL. It would be wrong to call ppl like this competitive. They are, suffice it to say, egotists: they only care about inflating their own self-worth.


With that said, your problem is that you are not competitive. A true competitor, as in one who is truly competitive, finds competition in anything and everything. Just the other day I started racing a friend to 50 MIN simply because I heard he was lvling MIN again. I had one of the highest MIN ranks in my LS (something i took pride in), so I asked him what lvl it was. He said 38. Oh crap, same as mine. You can guess what happened next..we were both up to 2am mining like crazy. We gained a good 6 levels that day alone. Competition. It is what you make it, and it is always there. You're just not competitive, and you're not looking for competition. You sir, are looking to increase your e-peen, or at least the e-peen of your LS. You want SE to give you the stage.


I dont disagree with the addition of exclusively competitive content, but I find it erroneous to say there's no competition. I also dont like when ppl act like they are competitors when really they are just egotists in search of fapping material. Nothing wrong with being egoistic (im just not a fan), but call a spade a spade. You want something to gloat over.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

This is your problem lol. Let me preface this, though, by saying that there are two types of competitors

1) True competitors: These ppl compete because they love competing. They will make a competition out of anything, even if such things are normally not supposed to be competitive. Oh there's new content out? K we're gonna go beat it first and put out a video. Oh there's new gear? We'll be the first to make a complete drop list. Whats that? You just tanked Ifrit on GLD? Kk, I'ma go tank it as a naked pug and post a video. These ppl make their own competition because they love to be competitive. They dont need a game to set it up for them.

2) E-peen competitors: These are ppl that need everything set up on some grand stage (ie leaderboards) where their competition and success can be made known to the masses. These types of ppl could care less about being competitive for its own sake, its only competition if everyone knows about it and everyone can see the result. Naturally, these ppl are the most vocal about their accomplishments, and feel more elite than the "true competitors". These ppl compete to increase their e-peen, or their own perception of self-worth by validating themselves on a large scale. It can be generally assumed that these ppl are either douches or nonfactors in RL. It would be wrong to call ppl like this competitive. They are, suffice it to say, egotists: they only care about inflating their own self-worth.


With that said, your problem is that you are not competitive. A true competitor, as in one who is truly competitive, finds competition in anything and everything. Just the other day I started racing a friend to 50 MIN simply because I heard he was lvling MIN again. I had one of the highest MIN ranks in my LS (something i took pride in), so I asked him what lvl it was. He said 38. Oh crap, same as mine. You can guess what happened next..we were both up to 2am mining like crazy. We gained a good 6 levels that day alone. Competition. It is what you make it, and it is always there. You're just not competitive, and you're not looking for competition. You sir, are looking to increase your e-peen, or at least the e-peen of your LS. You want SE to give you the stage.


I dont disagree with the addition of exclusively competitive content, but I find it erroneous to say there's no competition. I also dont like when ppl act like they are competitors when really they are just egotists in search of fapping material. Nothing wrong with being egoistic (im just not a fan), but call a spade a spade. You want something to gloat over.

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Very well said. +1 sir and/or madam.

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Originally Posted by Clydey

I agree. I'm a big fan of competition in these games. Personally, I don't see what people find satisfying about having easy access to gear. A month after content is provided, everyone is running around with the same gear and weapons. When you remove competition, it leads to homogenisation of the player base.

I enjoy this game, but I fear I'll never enjoy it as much as doing ground kings in XI.

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since when is competition about easy gear? I have no interest in competing in this game...nor do I wish for all the gear to be easily obtained, I like a challenge. Those are two entirely different notions don't just shove them together.

Thanks for the feedback everyone, interesting to hear people's opinons and different points of view towards what they'd be interested in competing with.

A few people seem to have missed the point of my thread :(

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Originally Posted by KiriA500

I'll save Square-Enix the trouble of developing it and admit you have the larger e-peen. There, no need for PvP!

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I like PvP for the same reasons I like playing counterstrike or dota, fighting with other human beings, is always more interesting that fighting AI. People change and evolve strategies, generally AI is pretty dumb and once you figure out how to beat it, it's just a case of rinse repeat over and over.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

It can be generally assumed that these ppl are either douches or nonfactors in RL. It would be wrong to call ppl like this competitive. They are, suffice it to say, egotists: they only care about inflating their own self-worth.

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Your post should have probably been prefaced with 'I'm about to generalise the human race into two categories, one in a hideously insulting way.' Stereotyping is childish, no single person is the same, but thanks for showing what kind of person you are.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

your problem is that you are not competitive.

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I'm glad that you know my personality completely from reading a few lines of text. Thank you for categorising me into a group of people that I wouldn't like to place myself with in an attempt to discredit me and my thread.

I have played this game since Alpha. In the early days, I ran events with my LS, silly things like races from Limsa to Gridania naked, with everyone putting in 5k and the winner getting the pot. It was fun. I also like to make videos of my achievements, I just don't flash them around forums all that much, so you likely wouldn't have seen them, so they don't have very many views. Here is my ifrit speed run, http://youtu.be/V-NHXSdNBOA, it's not all that great, but we got the hidden lodestone achievement for it and I was proud.

I think that I probably fit quite snuggling into the middle of your two overly generalised categories, like a lot of people, I might imagine, probably do.

Think for a moment about real life, specifically sports. Baseball, Football, Rugby, American Football, Basketball, the olympic games. All of these games are televised, the players are thrust into celebrity status. Do you think every single player by your logic, only plays these games for celebrity status? and are they only televised to further increase the status of said celebrities? I would argue not. I imagine a vast majority of the players, got into, and continue to play the sports because they love competing and playing. I imagine the fans and followers of the sports are very glad that it is easy for them to keep up with the goings on and the results of the games they weren't able to physically attend.

This is what I am asking SE.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

You want SE to give you the stage.

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Wrong. I want SE to give everyone the stage.

I also completely agree with other posters comments, this whole thing should not be intrusive, like battling content, if you want to craft, don't equip a sword. If you don't want to be competitive, you shouldn't be forced to go and look at the leaderboards tab in the menu, or talk to the leaderboards NPC.

I'd be interested to hear what other people think about this, I imagine the forums are going to be quite active at the moment due to server merger. Please be constructive guys, your allowed to disagree with how I feel, but please don't resort to hiding snide, il-informed insults under a veil of flamboyant vocabulary and a wall of text.

I find Lux_Rayna Right in so many point ... take me as example, when i start game year ago .. i decide to do my MRD to 50 SOLO. and i did it ... and i challenge to do all jobs to 50 in shortest time, and i did it.

And now im kind satisfied with achievement system. its have a lot of competitive ideas. Like what i'm doing now ... is Crafting thing .. to get all crafting tools. and that is amazing experience.

So When They Will make leader-board thing .. or LS announcement like ranking. that will kill the game in my opinion, because what make me leave most of game .. is people Forget most enjoyable things in game and focus in doing that challenge. and that make a lot of game not stick around for that long .. because only couple of people taking top ranks and others just keep trying until they quit the game.

I don't understand how having a leaderboard would kill those challenges qfox, would they not make them more accessible?

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Originally Posted by Bongeh1986

Your post should have probably been prefaced with 'I'm about to generalise the human race into two categories, one in a hideously insulting way.' Stereotyping is childish, no single person is the same, but thanks for showing what kind of person you are.

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"I'm glad you know my personality completely from reading a few lines of text." Lol. You're being incredibly dramatic btw, I generalised two types of competitors, not the human race. Please show me where I said "two kinds of people" anywhere in that post. I'm glad you came to those conclusions about my personality by completely misconstruing what I said in the first place. Entire human race my foot, how did you come to that conclusion anyway?

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I'm glad that you know my personality completely from reading a few lines of text. Thank you for categorising me into a group of people that I wouldn't like to place myself with in an attempt to discredit me and my thread.

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Let's be honest, the only impression I have of you is what comes out of your mouth (or fingers in this case). You can't blame me for coming to conclusions based on that, as I have no other way of getting an "impression" of you. We all do this, you just did it above. Thats why you always have to watch what you say, or be judged based on what you say. If I ran around calling ppl faggots you could probably assess im an asshole. Quite frankly, its no one's fault but mine that you got that impression. Point is, you can't blame ppl for coming to conclusions based on what you say.

Anyway I wasn't even trying to discredit you, but I was trying to discredit your claim that

1) FFXIV doesn't have competition
2) There's no point in LS's, or to use your words "no reason" to be in an LS outside of socializing.

Based on your post, how can I conclude anything other than: "there's no competition cuz there's no big stage to compete on." As you can see its a pretty logical assessment on my part. You said there was no competition in FFXIV, which I know to be false because I compete all the time on FFXIV. You then said you need a reason to feel part of an LS, which I know to be false because an LS can make its own reasons for existing..even competitive ones. So then what other conclusion can I come to other than: "this guy really just wants to increase his e-peen". As I said at the end its not a bad thing, but how can you expect me to believe you're a competitor when you said there's no competition. Duh. Had you included some other information, like what you gave me just now, I could've come to an entirely different conclusion about you and your issue with the game. In other words, your first impression sucked....I only took what you gave me. A better OP would be: "Hey I'd like more competition in FFXIV, cuz while doing stuff is fun and all it'd be nice to compete on a big scale too". You didn't say that at all lol. You straight up said something that was entirely false, based on a premise that there was no e-peen leaderboards. Like I said, I took what you gave me.

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I think that I probably fit quite snuggling into the middle of your two overly generalised categories, like a lot of people, I might imagine, probably do.

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Too bad you gave an entirely opposite impression. Like I said, I took what you gave me...which is basically QQ that there were no leaderboards. I fail to see how my conclusion is anything but logical. As far as middle-grounds go, there isn't one. You either like competing, regardless of where it is, or you only like competing on e-peen stages. Athletes are all competitors...long before they were playing it out in front of millions they were playing it out in the backyard...competing against themselves, friends, sports figures they looked up to. They are "true competitors" as I was describing.

Idk if you misunderstood, but truly competitive ppl can also love the big stage. My point is that they dont need a stage to be competitive, and dont rely on the stage for that competitiveness. It is just another avenue they can explore to sate their competitive desires. Someone who only feeds off of the stage is just egoistic; they also tend to be douche bags but it is wrong to say all of them are douches. They are, without a doubt, egoistic though. You have to be. As I said in the OP, there's nothing wrong with the egoistic category, its just not my cup of tea.

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Wrong. I want SE to give everyone the stage.

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For your own egoistic purposes. And I will tell you why: not everyone wants the stage, and you know this. You want the stage so you can dominate ppl, so you can prove your the best, and so you can find satisfaction in this endeavor. You're not giving them the stage any more than a world champion boxer gives his challengers the ring. Its not you being an egalitarian, its you inviting ppl to get publicly stomped. I'm a fan of the big stage myself so I get it. There's nothing wrong with it, but again, just call a spade a spade. Pretending there's any other reason for it is just silly. Like I told you earlier, I agree with this implementation. Idk if you missed that.

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I'd be interested to hear what other people think about this, I imagine the forums are going to be quite active at the moment due to server merger. Please be constructive guys, your allowed to disagree with how I feel, but please don't resort to hiding snide, il-informed insults under a veil of flamboyant vocabulary and a wall of text.

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Lol, why so dramatic. I do like how you devoted such a flourish purely to my wall of text. Though it really wasn't personal, if you're an e-peen guy just say you're an e-peen guy and correct me on the douche part. Nothing wrong with it lol