Sch Best Pet Fix idea?

So i was thinking about a way that they can help mend this issue with sch pets , because they are just nothing but a color swap now , why not Leave EOS as it is for simpler healing and change Selene into old pet healing but keep all the same skills as they are.
I think having selene only play as pre 5.0 would be best and fix Sch's real issue with people not be able to control pets when they wish to and heal other targets at the same time as using your main heal , this way we can have both the new way for new sch's and if you want swap pets to the old way of healing in order to satisfy veterans Sch's.
I think this is one way to get back some of FF14's Healers.

im not sure i understand what do you mean and also how are you planning on doing it cause right now i don't see it being supported by scholar system.

can you explain please your idea? :)

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Originally Posted by CrimsonGunner

im not sure i understand what do you mean and also how are you planning on doing it cause right now i don't see it being supported by scholar system.

can you explain please your idea? :)

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basically change one pet so it has the old healing system , you used to be able to make pet cancel its cast and move it to another player , so you could heal lets say a tank with your main heal while telling your pet to heal another player at the same time , as it stands they took that away and made pet have its own mind that heals with you

I would want Selene to have a different moveset, preferably I'd like her to have an offensive kit vs EOS defensive kit, and both fairies should have their abilities on the pet hotbar. The fact I have to weave their abilities in now just to get ghosted is ridiculous. Either have them as pet GCDs or as oGCDs SE, don't do this worst of both worlds nonsense.

If I've got the gist of it.

Eos => How faeries work right now. Cannot force cast embrace, the current system where you queue abilities through fae actions.
Selene => How Eos used to work. You can force cast embrace, everything is on the pet bar, you can still weave them whilst you're still casting.

If I got the right idea. I believe they're possibly addressing the issue with SMN (as they share the same approach) this patch. I'd be interested in seeing how they end up doing that and if it can be applied to Scholar.

But I feel more of the issue for me is that Eos and Selene used to do different things and I'd have liked them to embrace (heh) the faerie side more and do more with Selene. Whilst yes, we got Seraph instead, but she adds 2 extra moves and is temporary, Selene was persistent and offer 3 extra moves (or 4 if we wanna go back further). I like Seraph and if I were to rework the SCH kit, I'd keep her and sacrifice something else, but her purpose is to boost our healing potential when we already have a lot, whereas Selene had was able to offer more utility and I'd have liked to have seen more of.

I pretty much object to anything involving the need to fairy swap. That was a huge annoyance for me for pre ShB SCH. Even if they went the route of SMN and made the cast instant, there is still going to be a delay between when I want Lily to do something and when she actually does it. This has been the ongoing problem with pets for who knows how long now, and with the pet actions removed from the pet hotbar, things are even worse.

Having either Eos or Selene work the previous way doesn't resolve the issue with whichever fairy is currently working under the current system, and again it does not resolve the ongoing issue that stems from the previous version. Wonky AI makes us want more control over our pets, but having total control over them pretty much defeats the purpose of a pet class.

I can't speak for other SCHs but I never really enjoyed the overall micro-managing of Lily. Not because I wanted a more simple version of SCH to play but because I would much rather interact with my pet in a way that doesn't feel like shouting commands at a disobedient child. I don't know what they are going to do to fix it, but as of 5.0, they went the wrong direction.

That's something I haven't thought of: That each fairy not only has different skills but entirely different behaviour and skillset. Like someone wrote here about making the fairy work like Dance Partner, you tag someone with Eos and she follows them around instead of the Fey union beam. And then Selene would work as pre-5.0 Lily, actualy Embrace potency pet Hotbar gcd, fey skills and all. Seeing behave entirely different: Eos disciplined and proper, Selene rebellious and full of lunacy.

Not this current thing were they couldn't make up their mind if they want Scholar to be a pet job or not where I barely feel her presence. I would say anything is better than current system to entice something entirely new and good, but 'anything' would invoke Murphy's law as it did in 5.0 so I'll more boisterously ask for the old pet hotbars, mortal fairies and skills back.

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Originally Posted by Saefinn

If I've got the gist of it.

Eos => How faeries work right now. Cannot force cast embrace, the current system where you queue abilities through fae actions.
Selene => How Eos used to work. You can force cast embrace, everything is on the pet bar, you can still weave them whilst you're still casting.

If I got the right idea. I believe they're possibly addressing the issue with SMN (as they share the same approach) this patch. I'd be interested in seeing how they end up doing that and if it can be applied to Scholar.

But I feel more of the issue for me is that Eos and Selene used to do different things and I'd have liked them to embrace (heh) the faerie side more and do more with Selene. Whilst yes, we got Seraph instead, but she adds 2 extra moves and is temporary, Selene was persistent and offer 3 extra moves (or 4 if we wanna go back further). I like Seraph and if I were to rework the SCH kit, I'd keep her and sacrifice something else, but her purpose is to boost our healing potential when we already have a lot, whereas Selene had was able to offer more utility and I'd have liked to have seen more of.

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your exactly right in what i was suggesting ,alot of what changed was dumbing down the class more for people that dont know how to use rotations/ adapt .
This Change (5.0) took out all the fun out of the class and skill , alot of other classes ended up in a similar fashion , i fear soon things will get real dumb and everything will be dumbbed down into pvp skills where they are combined into the same action where you berly press a button or two and occasionally press a 3rd button cause thats how it feels in pvp.
SE keeps taking the fun out of playing classes that require you to pay attention outside of the already scripted duty's =/

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Originally Posted by Gemina

I pretty much object to anything involving the need to fairy swap. That was a huge annoyance for me for pre ShB SCH. Even if they went the route of SMN and made the cast instant, there is still going to be a delay between when I want Lily to do something and when she actually does it. This has been the ongoing problem with pets for who knows how long now, and with the pet actions removed from the pet hotbar, things are even worse.

Having either Eos or Selene work the previous way doesn't resolve the issue with whichever fairy is currently working under the current system, and again it does not resolve the ongoing issue that stems from the previous version. Wonky AI makes us want more control over our pets, but having total control over them pretty much defeats the purpose of a pet class.

I can't speak for other SCHs but I never really enjoyed the overall micro-managing of Lily. Not because I wanted a more simple version of SCH to play but because I would much rather interact with my pet in a way that doesn't feel like shouting commands at a disobedient child. I don't know what they are going to do to fix it, but as of 5.0, they went the wrong direction.

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i agree that its not perfect but having the choice to command pets the old way or the new way without changing the current skills would satisfy alot of healers and return some fun into SCH , getting everything reversed wont happen and there are alot more fixes that need to happen , but giving us the choice to micromanage them our selfs would be best i think and can easily be done.
Objecting fairy swap would not matter as they are both the same and nothing but a color swap now , my suggestion would make it so they both do the exact same thing as they do now but give us the option to pick auto healing or macro healing (old way)
cause not everyone can do this effectively

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Originally Posted by Billythepancake

I would want Selene to have a different moveset, preferably I'd like her to have an offensive kit vs EOS defensive kit, and both fairies should have their abilities on the pet hotbar. The fact I have to weave their abilities in now just to get ghosted is ridiculous. Either have them as pet GCDs or as oGCDs SE, don't do this worst of both worlds nonsense.

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getting that done or move sets for EOS and Selene onto pets wont happen, so get that nonsence out of your head. otherwise just give us every old ability & let us pick our abilities out of the bunch like Blue mage.
This specifically only refers to controlling pets

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Originally Posted by Mirajane_Takami

getting that done or move sets for EOS and Selene onto pets wont happen, so get that nonsence out of your head. otherwise just give us every old ability & let us pick our abilities out of the bunch like Blue mage.
This specifically only refers to controlling pets

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And the system you suggested would do nothing but make the fairy that controlled the old way objectively better in every way. Choosing to use either have to weave abilities in, or being able to use them off the pet hotbar, why would you NOT choose the hotbar if they were exactly the same? It would have 0 downsides. Giving the fairies different and varying movesets would also cause a balance issue, sure, as eos was better than Selene in most cases, but you at least do have situations where Selene was genuinely a better choice. In no situation, unless maybe you're doing a challenge run?, Would there ever be an instance where this new control system is better than the old one.

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Originally Posted by Billythepancake

And the system you suggested would do nothing but make the fairy that controlled the old way objectively better in every way. Choosing to use either have to weave abilities in, or being able to use them off the pet hotbar, why would you NOT choose the hotbar if they were exactly the same? It would have 0 downsides. Giving the fairies different and varying movesets would also cause a balance issue, sure, as eos was better than Selene in most cases, but you at least do have situations where Selene was genuinely a better choice. In no situation, unless maybe you're doing a challenge run?, Would there ever be an instance where this new control system is better than the old one.

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that is the whole point of this postt if you did not read to keep there skills the same , honestly i dont want there abilities to be the same but thats NOT what this topic is about .
not everyone chooses to use the Pet hot bar and just put pet abilities on there normal hot bar with or without macros , its not about making it more challenging its that the current way is boring and takes out fun from the class .
Sch's whole thing from the get go was about balancing your healing/DMG and controlling your pet , witch made it different from every other class (excluding SMN/ACN,)
the instance where this new control system is better than the old one , is for people that dont know how to play the class and wont be subjected to actually learning how to play SCH.

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Originally Posted by Mirajane_Takami

that is the whole point of this postt if you did not read to keep there skills the same , honestly i dont want there abilities to be the same but thats NOT what this topic is about .
not everyone chooses to use the Pet hot bar and just put pet abilities on there normal hot bar with or without macros , its not about making it more challenging its that the current way is boring and takes out fun from the class .
Sch's whole thing from the get go was about balancing your healing/DMG and controlling your pet , witch made it different from every other class (excluding SMN/ACN,)
the instance where this new control system is better than the old one , is for people that dont know how to play the class and wont be subjected to actually learning how to play SCH.

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And how is choosing to not have something on the pet hotbar going to make it easier to learn? If anything it's become more difficult because, unlike the old system, you couldn't leave things on auto if you so chose, or with the new system you have issues of ghosting, weaving, clipping, none of which you had to worry about with the old, so why would you ever choose the new when, for the vast majority of people, it would feel worse AND put you at a disadvantage. Yes I did read your post, which was why I made the suggestion I did, because choosing between a system that barely works and one that works well, who in their right mind would pick the one that barely works

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Originally Posted by Billythepancake

And how is choosing to not have something on the pet hotbar going to make it easier to learn? If anything it's become more difficult because, unlike the old system, you couldn't leave things on auto if you so chose, or with the new system you have issues of ghosting, weaving, clipping, none of which you had to worry about with the old, so why would you ever choose the new when, for the vast majority of people, it would feel worse AND put you at a disadvantage. Yes I did read your post, which was why I made the suggestion I did, because choosing between a system that barely works and one that works well, who in their right mind would pick the one that barely works

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if you remember what i said not everyone uses the pet hot bar thats why there is the option to disable it , all those skills can go on your normal hotbar you just choose not to do that , witch is fine .
your not supposed to leave your pet on auto healing it was about balancing your own heals with your pet just like SMN had to balence there DMG skills with there pets.
Most would choose the old way that has worked out for over 3 years till now , the people who came to FF14 at the start and played SCH this whole time till now would prefer all changes to go back to pre 5.0
the new way is crap and part of the reason why there has been a huge lack of Healers outside of white mage , AST has its own problems

if i understand you correctly ,you suggest one of the fairies be the new way and the other the old way right?
so can i add something to that idea ,maybe make it an option that both fairies could be like that?

have a toggle pet option that you can choose between the old way and the new way for both of them?

while i prefer having 2 different pets with different skills,it is a good idea to those who loved to use the pet hotbar and use abilities like that ^^

nice idea mirajane. :)