ifrit bleeds we can kill it

I am sure im not the first person to complain about this but I am usually not the kind person to whine about it. I normally just accept it or just move on. I have never posted once before so this is my first time and sorry if this is at wrong place.

my frustration lies with the drop rate/or the randomness of who gets the drop. I know there are people long before me cried for help on this and I remember Yoshida explain him self on this but I would beg for another look at this..

I have been organizing with some with the same purpose as me lately to repetitively fight ifrit. We have a pretty decent track record. Over 100 tapers have been used. And not one ifrit weapon. before you start to say people have done many more fights before they got a drop please hear me out. I understand that... But does it make it right? Or fair or fun?

Maybe I am alone on this but I play final fantasy for fun. I like to be rewarded for all the hard work I put in. imagine you work so hard to get a group together to do the battle.. Some old friends some new get all set up with plan and go. You go night after night praying you get something and everyone around you have pretty much got some thing and all you got to show is few dark matters and couple plants.. And thank the lord all mighty, 6 Totems and one from a dear friend because he feel bad that he had tossed his ifrit cane because he already have one and a bow and a spear.

I mean I am here to have fun. I am so happy all the people I helped but why am I the only one forsaken.. Toss me a bone please, hell I'll settle for an ifrit toilet brush for the love of god
I would never even bother posting until it seem like everyone is complaining "oh I already have that or I don't want that" then it really hit me wtf... Why am I here what the hell is the point.. All those times I died trying then I finally organize a group to win and able to win repetitively and everyone is getting something and here I am and all I have to show is some Dark matter couple plants and 6 totems..while just about everyone else its tossing it away because they already have one. How am I suppose to have fun.....

LOL i was the same as you, the drop rate is low, but the weapons are still the best in game and its been long time since they released those, i agree on this drop rate, but maybe the bone could be having 100% totem drop for every player but a higher number needed to exchange for weapons, like 30 totems to be able to trade em for a weapon in just a couple of days you could have 2-3 weapons if you go intensive, the other option i think would be the best is to make the weapons drop in loot list and be able to give em to someone else in the party, i have already got 3 pug weapons, while other people is looking for only that weapon, so they just need to do that and everyone will be happy.

Hey atleast you have some totems lol 4 more and you will have a weapon. Those dont drop nearly enough. Loot in that fight can be so much better if SE did one or both of these things. 1) Make totems 80-100% drop rate so ppl can work towards something. 2) Allow weapon to drop to lootlist so one may give to another player especially if its a duplicate weapon.

The rest we can deal with honestly. I know its a dead horse but it doesnt make it any less true.

Hello,

It is quite easy to get one or two items from Iffy. Not even that hard to get the Totems you want if all you are after is one item. For example, I am a Mage. I am only really interested in the WHM/BLM item. So all I really need are 20 totems. Whilst farming for totems if I get those items, great, if not, I will soon.

The challenge is when you want to get 7/7. This results in a difficulty curve being generated where each subsequent item is tougher and tougher to get until you reach 7/7. Put simply:
If you have 0 items, and an item drops, you have a 7/7 (100%) chance of getting a new item.
If you have 2 items, and an item drops, you have a 5/7 (71.4%) chance of getting a new item.
If you have 6 items, and an item drops, you have a 1/7 (14.3%) chance of getting a new item.

The difficulty curve increases with the total number of items you have, thus making getting a full set very challenging indeed, but not making getting 1 or 2 items quite that challenging. This is perhaps why they allow duplicate items to drop (and sadly dissapear). It feels mean, it feels annoying, but it does mean those who persist for 7/7 fought a gradient curve of diminishing returns and succeeded.

So, basically... I think it's fine as it is. And it makes getting 7/7 all that more 'precious' or 'prestigous' and perhaps trains us up to stop thinking we need to have EVERYTHING to be happy.

I have my Bow, and got my Cudgel and Staff while helping others. I'm happy, and need not the rest. If they come, they come, if not, no biggy, and won't even affect my role as a WHM!

I can accept the drop rate but I can't accept the fact that people in group are tossing away items because they already have one...you don't even get a chance. Not once but multiple times...

At least offer a chance to pass to some poor soul who have gone 25+ with nothing.

With that said the ffxiv Gods must heard my plea.. (Yoshida did :p) After probably 30+ fights I was rewarded an axe and with my buddy's kind heart giving me his totems, I got my 10 totems and got a knuckle.

still need the bow the cane and cudgel and sword. I was well rewarded last night I think I got 3totems maybe four. I gave them all to my buddy so he can get his dream weapon the sword.

I know I will be doing lot more of these fights but i'm going to say I am going to feel horrid when the war in my party been tanking this entire time doesn't get an axe and I get another one....
He have been the same amount of fights as I have been if not more and he been wanting that axe for a while. He have up hope on the drop and just focusing on totems... But I guess at least he got a cane and few others. not useful to him but still better than NOTHING.

Seriously please just take another look at this, at least offer the pass. The drop rate is bad enough. and people will still continue to do ifrit for new class they got to 50.

This is a possible solution, make the weapons returnable for totems, keep the totems trade-able, then the following happens:
- you win an extra weapon, it is NOT UNIQUE, but NOT TRADE-ABLE, then
- you return the weapon for totems, give the totems to deserving player, player can get a weapon.
- save totems, sell them for gill, other players can get weapons.

or:
- morph the weaspon.
- provide a quest to receive an item which can morph an ifrit weapon to another ifrit weapon. people will play the ifrit once then play for that item too, and they wont camp the damn place.

Hello,

All of these suggestions will skew the drop rate, at which point the drop rate itself will have to be lowered, leaving the overall chance at the same.

You might have an argument if they could be automatically traded in for seals.

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You might have an argument if they could be automatically traded in for seals.

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What about the morph idea, I keep thinking it's better...

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Originally Posted by cha0sking

What about the morph idea, I keep thinking it's better...

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That would skew the chances of getting 7/7 unfortunately. Recall:

If you have 6 items, and an item drops, you have a 1/7 (14.3%) chance of getting a new item.

So getting the 7th item means you have a 14.3% chance (provided you get an Iffy WEapon drop and all Iffy Weapon drop rates are equal. No reason to believe otherwise yet).

However, if it 'morphed' you would be changing it to:

If you have 6 items, and an item drops, you have a 1/7 (14.3%) chance of getting a new item, but a 100% chance of it morphing, therefore you have a 100% chance of getting a new item.

You've increased the chance of getting a complete set by a factor of 7 (actually by more, since this has to be extrapolated to all the other drop rates).

At which point, if they want to keep the probability of you getting a complete set consistent, they would need to decrease the drop rate of any item significantly to make up for the 'morph' effect.

At the end of the day, I think it is not about which item we get or how we get it or what it can or can not turn into. It's all about the probaility of getting *A* item and the probability of getting a full set.

It is up to them if they want to increase the probability of getting a drop, and then come up with some mechanism for doing so (i.e. totems).

I like your explanation of the statistics I really do. In ways it makes sense, but what about enjoying the game. I'm willing to put effort in but after all the time I put in and not get what I want it starts to make me frustrated. then the ever question pops up "this is a game, i'm suppose to be enjoying this...."

I don't know but I think some kind of balance is needed. But I really think passing the weapon should be offered.

Hello,

I think you are touching on the important part here. I do not think being able to get the Iffy Weapons quicker or easier is the real answer (and doing so diminishes its value).

I believe the crux of the problem really is:
The desire to see forward progress.

It can be frustrating to do 20 runs and get nothing until the end.
If somehow whilst doing the 20 runs you are continuously rewarded (albeit not with rewards as great as an iffy weapon) then this should make it feel more.. hehe.. rewarding ^.^;

Presently the reward is some XP and glorious dark matter (although one could argue this is more painful to see than nothing).
Perhaps if the rewards were upped a bit each time:
Guaranteed 4500 XP (yay, transfered to another job that could use it).
Guaranteed 100 Company Seals (This is, after all, based on a Grand Company quest. 100 Seals in 30 minutes is not too bad).
Chance for Random Materia (Maybe some materia can drop, low rate, but still nice to see).


Basically so that each fight itself if somewhat rewarding, whilst waiting for the 'big' reward.

I like the idea of a chance at random materia, but rather then just random materia it would be nice to see it tailored towards Ifrit. So basically things like fire veil, fire materia, strength materia and heaven's Fist as potential drops, to go with Ifrit. I can understand the frustration of not obtaining said loot, but when the loot table is as small as it is, then the reward % has to be skewed in a way in which it should be tough to obtain. It'll just feel that more rewarding when you finally obtain it, whether it be through totems or Ifrit himself. It's not like getting to Ifrit himself is tough either, collect from tapers then head into the battlefield, it's not like you lose it when you lose, you get to keep it until you win.

So really there's a lot of positives within the Ifrit fight the only true negative is the drop rate but based on everything else the drop rate fits in well with Ifrit.

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/d...dead-horse.jpg

6/7 for like 3 months. I get my 6 weapons on the first month i started doing runs. Right now i'm at 7/10 totems... I just want to finish this pain... ;_;

I have a friend that was 6/7 with 3 of each one (two on retainers and one the inventory) and it took him like 3 months to get his last one (axe).

well im 7/7 on weapons but if SE make good items drop of ifrit like good lv4+ materia or material to made good armors. i will gladly goin back to have fun at ifrit pond hehehehe

I realized that I started getting more and more dark matters, it increased from 3-5 to 8 now. Is that a sign that I am getting closer to obtaining the ifirit wepon? :D

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Originally Posted by Signy

6/7 for like 3 months. I get my 6 weapons on the first month i started doing runs. Right now i'm at 7/10 totems... I just want to finish this pain... ;_;

I have a friend that was 6/7 with 3 of each one (two on retainers and one the inventory) and it took him like 3 months to get his last one (axe).

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Ten days ago i get the claws i was missing, now i have 7 totems totally useless taking 1 inventory slot of my retainer.