Double Casting

Anyone else find it really annoying that spells interrupt when casting them twice?


(if a thread like this exists...couldnt find it)

yes

/410car

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Originally Posted by neminis

Anyone else find it really annoying that spells interrupt when casting them twice?


(if a thread like this exists...couldnt find it)

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it's not just when casting them twice now. half the time the animations don't show with the timer, sometimes they just decide they want to cancel on their own, and sometimes you have to hit the same spell like 5 times before it finally starts casting anything.

being a caster since this patch hit has been quite annoying.

Yeah i noticed that as well.
I have to usually cast it three times before he begins to cast anything...drives me nuts.

Hello,

I notice that if I use macros to cast spells I can avoid this problem. For example:

If I smash on my stoneskin button but nothign happens and I smash on it again, it may end up being cancelled.
If I use my CTRL-8 (stoneskin) macro, and hit it 10 times in a row, it will go off without any cancellation having occured.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Asiaine

Hello,

I notice that if I use macros to cast spells I can avoid this problem. For example:

If I smash on my stoneskin button but nothign happens and I smash on it again, it may end up being cancelled.
If I use my CTRL-8 (stoneskin) macro, and hit it 10 times in a row, it will go off without any cancellation having occured.

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that may well work for a keyboard, but for a controller that just leads to more annoyance than fun game play. having a work around for a bad game design does not make the design any better.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Asiaine

Hello,

I notice that if I use macros to cast spells I can avoid this problem. For example:

If I smash on my stoneskin button but nothign happens and I smash on it again, it may end up being cancelled.
If I use my CTRL-8 (stoneskin) macro, and hit it 10 times in a row, it will go off without any cancellation having occured.

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Nice! just sucks that i have to do macros for all spells again -.-

/supported

Spell casting is broken, It was better the way it was before.

yeah i noticed my spell casting sucks, if they're going have to change it where you can spam spell casting to cast one spell if they're to do the move to cancel casting.

Agreed, they need to remove the two clicks to cancel, we don't really need it now that we can move to cancel.

I have also noticed this problem of spells not going off, both on BLM and WHM and have lost party members and myself because I couldn't cast a heal, its frustrating as hell.

When I'm trying to cast Flare I hit the button like 20 times and hope that it casts. If it didn't work the fight is usually already over anyway :/

Yeah spell casting sucks now, its so buggy, another bad design decision. Sometimes trying to cast flare for 5 seconds after ive stopped moving and nothing, and in cutters cry timing nukes is essential especialy for a speed run.

It blows my mind the developers that come up with this shit.

patch 1.19 - "I know, lets remove skill ques and piss off all the players and make it more anoying to play the already anoying battle system"

patch 1.20 - " ok it was a bad idea to remove the ability ques, here have it back but you need to do a hidden text command to turn it back on"

patch 1.21 - " ok lets piss of mages this time around and make spell casting really anoying and buggy and make spell casting stop if you move even though the server structure is in a mess untill 2.0"

Its not just casting either, DoW timing is completely off after patch. Sometimes button presses register and action, sometimes they don't. Its close to what it was like before when you had to wait until an action was fully complete before starting a new one.
Its not awful. Its just sort of disappointing that things are getting worse and not better.

Is it possible to use the /facetarget option before casting (if it is pre-cast moving that is causing the problem)?
Is it possible to try to use /macros as well (I have no idea if you can do this with a controller, I am sorry).

All I can say is so far, I have no issue with casting, but I may be unusual (for many reasons ^.^;;) in that I use a keyboard macro for spells (cure, fire, etc), and only use non-macros for self-targetting spells (shroud of saints, etc.).

I'm sure there are many areas for improvement, and always will be, but perhaps there is some way to work with what is there and still be happy ^.^;

I am hoping in future actions will be more responsive (you press it you KNOW right away if it was accepted or not). Then that will solve many problems including this ^.^

I'd say it's fairly awful!
I play normally duo'ing as a GLD or PLD usually without another healer and sometimes that 'Cure' HAS to be cast NOW!
As I use a controller I'll click the Cure icon (expecting it to work as it should) then I'm immediately off navigating the action bar looking for my next skill, fully expecting the spell to work.

If that click of the Cure doesn't go off (as it hasn't been lately) it often results in rage/death.

(yes I'm aware I should be using macros, thx)

Hmm so it's not just me then. I've been way less "on the ball" with my casts since patch, missing heals I've never had a problem with before now. I hope it gets fixed soon, it's pretty infuriating to be honest.

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Originally Posted by Validas

(yes I'm aware I should be using macros, thx)

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Thing is I don't know why we should be, the macro system in this game is archaic to say the least, sure it may work but I don't think we should have to result to work arounds for something as important as the action bar working correctly.

Using macros does seem to help and I recommend that is what everyone does for now, until Square fixes yet another giant mess they have made. They really are not filling me with hope for 2.0.

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Originally Posted by Akira_Tenshi

Using macros does seem to help and I recommend that is what everyone does for now, until Square fixes yet another giant mess they have made. They really are not filling me with hope for 2.0.

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On the plus side.... 2.0 is meant to address these specific issues (server and UI). So if anything, it may be understood that these are not ideal yet because the (much better) solution is already planned/implemented in 2.0

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Originally Posted by Asiaine

On the plus side.... 2.0 is meant to address these specific issues (server and UI). So if anything, it may be understood that these are not ideal yet because the (much better) solution is already planned/implemented in 2.0

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It would have been awesome if they could have implemented PVP-centric casting changes when the servers were capable of PVP...but I digress.

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Originally Posted by BrusselSprout

It would have been awesome if they could have implemented PVP-centric casting changes when the servers were capable of PVP...but I digress.

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I just said the same thing in the dev post. Why make changes now that are limited by the servers when we dont even have pvp yet...

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Originally Posted by syntaxlies

I just said the same thing in the dev post. Why make changes now that are limited by the servers when we dont even have pvp yet...

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I think its probably so people are used to the change prior to moving to 2.0, PvP isn't coming to 2.0 for a while anyway.

I do agree that it was a mistake making these changes given that the server isn't adequate, that being said fights like Ifrit and Coincounter where stopping cast at a moments notice are much better.

It may be something simple they overlooked and could be fixed in 1.21a.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

I think its probably so people are used to the change prior to moving to 2.0, PvP isn't coming to 2.0 for a while anyway.

I do agree that it was a mistake making these changes given that the server isn't adequate, that being said fights like Ifrit and Coincounter where stopping cast at a moments notice are much better.

It may be something simple they overlooked and could be fixed in 1.21a.

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I know why they did it, but when they realized they couldn't do it to its full potential they should have held back to at least patch 1.23. Don't see why we should have to get used to a system that's needs improving.


theres a post from yoshi on it, its server limitations and not getting fixed til 2.0.







Quote Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida View Post
Hi, this is Yoshida, the producer/director.

Thank you for all of your feedback on the changes to spell casting specs. I would like to respond to some issues.

■Casting spells after moving ■

This is in regards to the time it takes before being able to cast a spell after moving, which we have received a lot of feedback on. There are two reasons for this specification.

①The time it takes to communicate between the client and server

　　　⇒This can take up to 0.3 seconds for transferring packets, plus the response time.
　　　　As an online game, this is unavoidable. (In order to prevent cheating, we cannot use the client only)

②Inability to cast due to movement intertia after stopping

　　　⇒We have reduced this spec as much as possible while maintaining the quality of our graphics.
　　　　Similarly to when /facetarget is used, if we reduce the inertia period any more, we would have to remove it. Since inertia is mapped in the server, it is not possible to cast spells during this time.

　　　　With that said, my decision is:
　　　　“If /facetarget is not used, minimize the negative hit to graphics quality”
　　　　“If /facetarget is used, prioritize performance over graphics quality”
　　　
I believe that this is the limit to what we can accomplish before the 2.0 re-launch.

Of course we have considered forcefully stopping the movement of the character’s feet as soon as a spell is cast, but this would be too substantial of a change. Also, we plan on implementing spells that can be cast while moving in version 2.0, so we would like to avoid this idea. (It would also be very difficult to separate spells between those that can/cannot be cast while moving, but we have more time to spend on this issue.)

■Behavior when inputting the same action twice ■

Another spec we have been receiving feedback on is that an action will be cancelled if the same action is input again while the action is being performed.

We plan on making an adjustment to this spec in patch 1.22. This spec is an integral part of FFXIV’s game play, but after patch 1.22 we plan on separately handling these cases based on whether /queue is ON or OFF. To explain:

①If /queue is ON

　　⇒An example of the queuing of actions would be when 3 actions (A, B and C) are input successively and the 3 actions are performed one after the other. If A, B and C comprises a combo, inputting:

　　　Input A⇒ While A is being performed ⇒Input B⇒ While B is being performed ⇒ Input C

　　　This will lead to the combo being executed as quickly as possible.
　　　However, as unlikely as it may be, there will be situations where the player wants to cancel a queued action before it is performed.

　　　Let’s say A, B and C comprise a combo, A can be performed any time, and a combo with B can be performed if A is successful while the character is to the side of the opponent and a combo with C can be performed if B is successful.

　　　Suppose C is in the queue while B is being performed and the requirements for B are not met (for example: the opponent changes direction). The player will probably want to cancel C. Instead of performing C, which would not be part of a combo, it would be better to cancel C from the queue and re-queue A.

　　　As such, a spec to cancel queued actions is necessary. In order to accomplish that, if /queue is ON, inputting the same ability twice will cancel the ability (in other words, the current spec will remain).

②If /queue is OFF

　　　⇒Since queuing is turned off, no matter what is input, the ability that was input first will be performed completely. As a result, abilities cannot be cancelled while being performed when /queue is OFF.

It would also be possible to assign “Esc” as the “action cancelling key,” but this is not possible for gamepad users, so we believe it is necessary to maintain the ability to cancel an action by inputting it a second time.

Finally, we are also thinking about implementing something like “/actioncancel ON/OFF” in addition to /queue ON/OFF. We are afraid this may overcomplicate things, but we are looking into whether or not this would be beneficial for players.

I forgot to mention one thing. Basically, we will be removing the ability for monsters to cast spells while moving. However, for certain monsters for whom being able to cast spells while moving is a characteristic trait (the Achilles’ heel of ranged classes), we will still allow casting while moving.


It is difficult to pull of ＷＳ combos, because monsters change direction too much
I would recommend either using some form of crowd control before inputting a combo or balancing hate (to reduce monster movement) before inputting a combo. I also feel that it is a test of player skills to try to read the movement of the opponent and input a combo without using crowd control.

There are many behaviors that cause monsters to change directions rapidly, but these will all be removed in version 2.0. I apologize that these behaviors have not been removed yet.


Maybe I am wrong to expect action from the FF14 development team.
I think you said one sentence too much.
People will try their best if they receive encouragement and will become fed up if they are criticized too much.
If you could flatter us a bit more, we would gladly climb up a tree for you.
Maybe I said a bit too much myself, but remember that it is very late.


So we have to input an ability twice to cancel it, huh…
Is it not possible to implement a cancel button?
The problem with a cancel button is that it is difficult to distinguish which ability is to be cancelled during communication between the server and the client. It isn’t that we didn’t think of it. ^^


Are there any players out there who are masters of cancelling actions?
I’m sorry; I’ve always been a big fan of cancelling actions.＾＾；

read the original post in the dev tracker

I noticed this last night as well. I was the healer for the main tank in the DRG last fight and everything was going great until I hit my cure and nothing happened. I hit my cure again quickly, nothing happened so I keep hitting my cure and all the while my PLD is losing HP. Guess what happens? He dies as my cure finally decides to work, except it gets cast on me cause well, he's dead >.> I got him up pretty quickly and we recovered but come on!!!

People are always going to whine about getting easymode taken away from them. If they brought back the old system now and changed it at 2.0, people are still going to complain. Might as well do it now and have less whining at 2.0 release! Woot!

"This can take up to 0.3 seconds for transferring packets, plus the response time.
　　　　As an online game, this is unavoidable. (In order to prevent cheating, we cannot use the client only)"
Is this the first time for Yoshida to work on an online-game? The response time is ~3seconds for lots of players which is just inacceptable and LOL there are so many cheats for this game and I bet with a hacked client you could cast anytime from anywhere. Don't see the point of adding a "feature" to an engine that is clearly not working well with it. Might as well turn the game into an FPS -_-
"Of course we have considered forcefully stopping the movement of the character’s feet as soon as a spell is cast, but this would be too substantial of a change."
Hai? Of course it's way better to spam the player's log with messages that his spell failed...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jinko

I think its probably so people are used to the change prior to moving to 2.0, PvP isn't coming to 2.0 for a while anyway.

I do agree that it was a mistake making these changes given that the server isn't adequate, that being said fights like Ifrit and Coincounter where stopping cast at a moments notice are much better.

It may be something simple they overlooked and could be fixed in 1.21a.

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if you look at the change and think it will be fixed in 2.0, but people will be ready for the system it really doesn't work that way. yes, you may know the basics of the system, but when you take into account of lag and using only macros for 7 months to a year then you will still be relearning to play the class no matter which system is in place.

if you use the work around for 7+ months you will still have to change how you play regardless. one way makes you learn the changes once and the other makes you learn and change multiple times. i swear the whole idea of pvp just needs to be scrapped since it is actually holding the game itself back.