So, I used to main BRD, but since ShB BRD is an archer, and not a bard, I decided to switch main. Now I'm a WHM but I want a DPS too. I thought MCH looked fun, and so far it is very fun (lv 73 so far). I like ranged, will probably level DNC and BRD (archer...) too eventually, but right now I'm going for MCH.
Issue is...I'm in EU but play on a NA server, and I've heard that MCH is not really playable with high ping. Not aiming for hardcore stuff here, I will probably try to clear the extremes and maybe try savage for fun (but savage will probably be as WHM, mainly, if I even run it). Just wondering if it is possible to get ok dps on MCH with high ping. So far I'm having lots of fun with it, even though I think my gauss rounds don't always register when I'm in the overheat thing mode :)
MCH with high ping. Possible...?
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07-14-2019, 02:29 AMZaddiMCH with high ping. Possible...?
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07-14-2019, 03:21 AMDarkstride
I would say it's more playable now with high ping than it was before. You no longer have random procs to manage. You basically just keep your cooldowns on cooldown and use your combo in the meantime.
The big issue before is that if you couldn't maximize Wildfire, you might as well not even play the job because that was the core of your DPS. High ping could ruin Wildfire. You still have Wildfire now, but it's easier to max its damage. I suppose it depends on how badly you really lag behind. The biggest impact I think it would have is whether it not you can fire off the max amount of Heat Blasts while overheated. -
07-14-2019, 03:43 AMPhysicunless your ping is really bad, it should be fine for extremes. Really you are probably fine on savage too, it's not that reactive anymore. people just feel like they might sqeeze out 1 more attack when heated, that's about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaddi
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07-14-2019, 04:27 AMCabalabob
Overall it’s not that bad, it is purely that hypercharge burst window. Missing that 5th heat blast takes a big chunk out of your dps and if it’s happening every time you use it it’s gonna add up. The real question is how does MCH’s damage stack up against other dps? And is that chunk out of your dps from high ping going to cripple you compared to low ping MCH’s like it did in Stormblood?
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07-14-2019, 05:12 AMZaddi
I think I have average EU ping to NA server (I'm on PS4, not sure how to check my ping, but my connection is decent at least). Nice to hear that it is possible to play MCH with high ping, because I'm having so much fun with the job :D
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07-27-2019, 03:35 AMAyanumi
Its worse with high ping that it ever has been before with all the 1.5s recasts and weaving youll be expected to do, unless you are happy to just avoid weaving in 1.5s and accept always being sub-optimal.
The job is going to be playable, youll be able to clear any content as always, is it smooth? Hell no. Will you get frustrated at clipping any heatblasts causing you to drift drill or airanchor or wildfire by even a second? Hell yeah. -
07-27-2019, 04:01 AMDogempire
MCH is honestly not much of a reactive class considering there isn't really a random proc you have to deal with, you may lose a bit to GCD clipping here and there but it's not super noticeable.
I had a lot of lagg yesterday during Titania EX and even though I was clipping CDs frequently because of the higher ping I was still able to get all of my heat blasts 95% of the time and not lose any gauss rounds and split shots.
I've only been playing the class for maybe a couple weeks, but currently the class plays out, at least for me, in that you can easily plan out your rotations by looking at your hotbar and the cds on your drill/air anchor, looking at your battery/heat gauge, and then deciding where to go from there.
If anything it plays more like a planning class where you anticipate the best places to time your skills and whether you can squeeze in certain skills without overcapping on resources. -
07-27-2019, 04:03 AMDogempireMachinist is currently 4th place, BLM and DRG are 1st and second, and Samurai is 3rd. (They really need to nerf DRG and buff Samurai and MCH)Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabalabob
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07-27-2019, 04:38 AMHezzlocks
For casual play, absolutely 100% yes, you can play MCH perfectly fine.
For optimized play in Savage, you may have a little difficulty getting the most out of it, but you'll still be leagues more viable than pre ShB.
For perfect play in Ultimate, ehhhh i dunno. You could probably do it but not perfectly. -
07-27-2019, 04:45 AMZaddiI'll never even reach ultimate so that's not an issue XD My MCH is lv 80 now, and it's really fun, I'll keep playing it :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Hezzlocks
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07-27-2019, 05:07 AMHezzlocksYeah I'll likely never try that myself either, but yeah, MCH is in a great spot for casual play right now, even with a bit of ping behind it, and that includes Extreme trials, so you're gold. The biggest issue that comes up right now is trying to optimize Hyperdrive so that you don't cap on Ricochet and Gauss Round. Normally you need to weave at least one of each in to prevent capping, but if your ping prevents you from doing that without losing a Heat Blast (you get 5 per Hyperdrive) then you can compensate by just making sure you have 0 charges of each, and if there's still 20+ seconds to recharge the first charge you can even do it without capping at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaddi
Apparently for perfect play it's a little more complicated than that, but for casual play, that's about the only thing you need to worry about beyond pressing buttons as they light up and resource management. -
07-27-2019, 09:32 AMDogempireWait what about Ultimate makes MCH with high ping undoable?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hezzlocks
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07-27-2019, 02:07 PMHezzlocksI never said undoable, I actually said you probably could do it, just it'd be more difficult to pull off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogempire
The thing about Ultimate is that player skill and efficiency matters more than gear. Savage already works towards that trend, but it can be outgeared. Ultimate, not quite so much. Obviously gear is always important, but Ultimate relies more on you being able to squeeze out as much from your job as possible while still being able to perform mechanics properly. Since MCH can do everything but Flamethrower on the move, the performing mechanics bit isn't so serious with high ping so long as you know what's coming and move immediately, it's the performance part that may take a hit.
Hyperdrive is the key here. You get 5 Heat Blasts per Hyperdrive, no problem, but Heat Blast generates Ricochet and Gauss charges, and you never really want to be capped on either of them as being capped on them means over the course of the fight you're losing damage from lost charges. Each Hyperdrive will regenerate 2.5 charges of both, technically about 2.8 charges if you factor in the 8 second duration of Hyperdrive. This means that the game is currently set up so that you can pull this off even without weaving a shot, but only if you activate Hyperdrive at about 0.2 charges (about 24-25 seconds left on charge time).
In Ultimate you're likely trying to work around such things as Trick Attack timings to maximise your damage output, which means it isn't always going to be possible to only ever activate Hyperdrive during that little sweet spot. With low ping, this would be fine, as you'd only ever really need to weave in 1 Ricochet and 1 Gauss Round to keep that covered (though honestly if you're working with Trick Attack timings you're more likely weaving between *every* Heat Blast). With high ping, however, trying to do this will cause enough clipping that you will actually lose 1 Heat Blast from your Hyperdrive rotation, which is more devastating than it sounds. It's lost damage on its own, sure, but it's also 15 seconds Ricochet and Gauss Round recharge lost, *and* if this happens while you're using Wildfire, that's one less Weaponskill used during Wildfire, so it too is doing less damage.
You can probably still do Ultimate as a high ping MCH, but you certainly won't be perfect, which adds a little more pressure on to everyone else. Of course, you could say the same about many other jobs with high ping, too, just MCH is still slightly more at the mercy of ping when it comes to perfect play than others. It's still LEAGUES better than it was before, SB MCH was just horrible with high ping, so it's still doable in high end content, still viable for Savage, and still perfectly good for any other casual content. SB MCH was way more at the mercy of ping, and was only really viable for for casual content if you had a high ping. So, definitely an improvement.