Do you think there is any way they are going to revert some of the upcoming changes?

I main whm, shadowbringers whm is going to be awesome in my opinion. However, I also like playing astro and I will no longer be playing it in the expansion. The card system being massacred is horrible and I see no need to play the job anymore. This seems to be the opinion of the majority; the changes are a lazy way to address the problem of balanced being overpowered compared to other cards and it kills all the decision making and variety the job had. I am not a big fan of scholar, but what I have heard the fairy is being pretty much killed off from the job while also reducing it's damage dealing capabilities.

Is there any way that SE will admit the changes they made are bad and they will revert at least some of them? Or is that just wishful thinking? If enough people stop playing astro and scholar do you think they will do something? I love all the other changes the expansion brings but astro is dead to me.

No. Yoshi stated in the Easy Allies interview he's not interested in feedback before the expansion is released.

If they do revert anything it'll happen after launch.

I think Energy Drain or something similar will come back to the Scholars by the Savage patch.

I think Bane will be worked into Healer toolkits as a baseline or be added as a role action.

Time Dilation could be given back to Astrologian, maybe just don't let it work on Cards.

they will just say actually play the job first. then they will make changes later.

They want you to beta test their changes for them on the live build because they live in the stone age.

As above. It'll just be a drip feed of minor adjustments over the next 2 years. I honestly don't think they have the manpower to do anything more than that.

I'm confident they will do something, it's just a question of what/when. Scholar, sooner than later, and most if not all changes will be for the better. Astrologian, a big question mark for how much they'd change, but I'd say they have a decent chance of at least something better before the expansion is midway through. White mage, lmao.

I dont think so. Just look at the insane shitstorm they received with whm back then in 4.0. WHM then only got some bandaid fixes over the whole Stormblood expansion. So through the whole of 5.x, i wouldnt expect more than a couple bandaids here and there.

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Originally Posted by Sanghelios

I dont think so. Just look at the insane shitstorm they received with whm back then in 4.0. WHM then only got some bandaid fixes over the whole Stormblood expansion. So through the whole of 5.x, i wouldnt expect more than a couple bandaids here and there.

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Warrior's abilities got reworked though, so that gives me some hope.

I think we will have to play the jobs first before they do start to look at criticisms, which is fair in my personal opinion(it’s okay to feel otherwise!) but as said above, I think we will see balance changes around when savage content is released :) have hope!!

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Originally Posted by Sanghelios

I dont think so. Just look at the insane shitstorm they received with whm back then in 4.0. WHM then only got some bandaid fixes over the whole Stormblood expansion. So through the whole of 5.x, i wouldnt expect more than a couple bandaids here and there.

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As Samsta said WAR got reworked, and SCH and SMN got a LOT of fixes came 4.1 (they were butchered in 4.0); so the door to medium changes is not closed, but it most likely won't happen before 5.1 (they use Savage as beta testing lol) in 4 months. Anything before that will likely fall under the minor change category, not a second overhaul or full revert.

They will after release when everyone is making the same complaints.

I expect them to return at least some of the DPS skills by the very first 5.X patch. Probably buff Scholar to ridiculous levels, because for some apparent reason they love doing that in patches

Scholar will likely get some variation of energy drain back, likely a mp restore with no potency attached. AST and WHM are fine mostly. Maybe there will be a buff to Divination making it 3% 5% 10% so that it's a little more impactful.

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

they will just say actually play the job first. then they will make changes later.

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This. And it’s good advice.
Play it first.

If they actually make the general content need the seemingly excessive amount of healing they're giving us, reverting many of the changes wont be necessary.
But that's a very big "if" that people have doubts on for good reason.

Although some players wont be satisfied no matter what unless it increases their damage.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

As above. It'll just be a drip feed of minor adjustments over the next 2 years. I honestly don't think they have the manpower to do anything more than that.

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They have the manpower to slash-and-burn working systems and skills, but not to hit Undo... Hmm.

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Originally Posted by Samsta

Warrior's abilities got reworked though, so that gives me some hope.

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Because it’s WAR. They’re still apologizing for 2.0 WAR and Holmgang being a bind.

There were other jobs that didn’t see anything major happening to them despite repeated feedback from launch until even now. Both DRK and MCH were told to wait until 5.0 released for significant job changes, as was WHM—they didn’t give WHM anything really until 4.5 with the enmity reduction on some of the GCDs and Assize’s CD reduction...which ironically defeated the point of the enmity reduction on their GCD heals because Assize has basically become a damage button with a giant overheal.

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Originally Posted by Orbus

If they actually make the general content need the seemingly excessive amount of healing they're giving us, reverting many of the changes wont be necessary.
But that's a very big "if" that people have doubts on for good reason.

Although some players wont be satisfied no matter what unless it increases their damage.

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Increasing damage intake to a level where you'd mostly heal still wouldn't be exciting. The GCD healing toolkit is as boring as the 2 button DPS rotation. You either spam Cure/Physik/Benefic, or you spam Succor/Helios/Medica.

Healer design in FFXIV is fundamentally as simplistic as it can be.

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Originally Posted by Orbus

Although some players wont be satisfied no matter what unless it increases their damage.

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Thats partially because there is still the older content to "heal", and the MSQ, beast tribe stuff where we have to DPS on our own.

Give SCH a reward for healing well with a dps aetherflow dump move, and give selene a use outside of cosmetics via weaving between the two like smn does, if they dont want it to give mp back so be it just make sure it gives faerie gauge and decreases boss damage on their next move by a small percent or something until next attack is used, give WHM damage on fluid aura back and brave/faith, Ast has damage buffs that can be tuned to make up for the damage it lacks, or give it access to haste or something.

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Originally Posted by Samsta

I main whm, shadowbringers whm is going to be awesome in my opinion. However, I also like playing astro and I will no longer be playing it in the expansion. The card system being massacred is horrible and I see no need to play the job anymore. This seems to be the opinion of the majority; the changes are a lazy way to address the problem of balanced being overpowered compared to other cards and it kills all the decision making and variety the job had. I am not a big fan of scholar, but what I have heard the fairy is being pretty much killed off from the job while also reducing it's damage dealing capabilities.

Is there any way that SE will admit the changes they made are bad and they will revert at least some of them? Or is that just wishful thinking? If enough people stop playing astro and scholar do you think they will do something? I love all the other changes the expansion brings but astro is dead to me.

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No . With the release date so close, S.E. will not revert any changes.

What does exactly "a reward for healing well" mean? Because if the party is alive by the end of the fight that means you healed "well". Nobody died, and you could have maintained them at 100% HP, 50% HP or even 1% HP for the whole fight. If they don't mind, in the end it doesn't matter. I think what you mean is Give SCH a reward for proper management of its resources.

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Originally Posted by GrimGale

What does exactly "a reward for healing well" mean? Because if the party is alive by the end of the fight that means you healed "well". Nobody died, and you could have maintained them at 100% HP, 50% HP or even 1% HP for the whole fight. If they don't mind, in the end it doesn't matter. I think what you mean is Give SCH a reward for proper management of its resources.

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That is what I was meaning, I just cba to put 10000% into typing on a forum like this.

If changes are going to be made they will be around 5.1 the earliest imo.

not gonna happen. I never seen any mmo in my life that has this word: revert. no more 1.0 please!!

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

they will just say actually play the job first. then they will make changes later.

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Thums up!!

I feel like at some point Energy Drain will make a comeback for SCHs, just because a.) The ability still exists for SMN so not hard to re-implement it for SCH I'd imagine, and b.) SCHs tend to get gameplay grievances smoothed out waaaaay faster than other jobs, if 4.0 is any indication.

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Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo

I feel like at some point Energy Drain will make a comeback for SCHs, just because a.) The ability still exists for SMN so not hard to re-implement it for SCH I'd imagine, and b.) SCHs tend to get gameplay grievances smoothed out waaaaay faster than other jobs, if 4.0 is any indication.

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it doesn't operate the same anymore, it'd likely be a new ability that functions like the old one, if at all.