As the name of the topic implies I am in need of help with my WHM. Currently I have just hit 57 with my white mage and I will say right off the bat it has been a helluva good time playing as a white mage. Never did a healer in any game before, decided to give it a spin and never looked back, most fun I have had on the game in a while.
Now that being said I will digress into my issue which is trying to understand what I have been reading in different forums regarding the end game WHM rotations. From what I have been able to gather it seems like WHM are no longer needed for heals and rather dps. Read roughly 5 different forum posts from reddit and other sites and all basically summed up my experience soon to be, put up HoTs, and spam cast Holy till everything is dead while throwing out the occasional assize or asylum...is that true?
I read in the posts that I should never touch cure I or II, ignore the lily counters or go as far as removing off my screen and I will be honest as I read that and more I have become suddenly discouraged about reaching end game with my white mage. Several responses in the different forums made it sound like WHM heals are almost never needed and we are secondary healers whom is kept around for dps purposes only.
I will admit almost all posts I found dated back to august of 2018 being the oldest but they were the most recent I could find. With current content brought in recently between 4.0 and 4.5, has the environment improved for WHM or is it as bad as everyone has made it out to be?
Coming to understand WHM in endgame
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02-19-2019, 09:48 AMFilmakusComing to understand WHM in endgame
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02-19-2019, 10:24 AMGhishlain
In short, those comments you read aren't wrong but to say "never" use Cure and Cure II may be a slight exaggeration.
In general as a healer your priorities are to maintain party health, then throw out DPS spells as GCD fillers when your healing isn't required. However, the healing power in this game is absurdly high, allowing for minimal healing requirements and significant DPS GCD usage. Things haven't changed much since August of 2018 and will continue to look so in the foreseeable future, and may even become worse if more oGCD heals are introduced to the healer kits in the upcoming expansion.
The Lily comment specificly to WHM isn't a lie either - unfortunately due to the structured nature of boss fights it's very very easy to plan out all the WHM healing in a singular fight and thus negating the need to generate Lilies and/or making effective use of the cast time reduction bonus the Lilies provide.
For structured and static Savage / Ultimate parties, you can pretty much predict exactly when and how damage will occur, taking a lot of the random factors out and thus you'll be DPSing more than healing. You'll find less structured and more chaotic healing if you participate in 24-man content, or if you enter Savage content as a PuG, you'll probably make more use of your healing abilities and spells like Cure and Cure II, thus feeling more like a healer.
It's an unfortunate circumstance of the current healing meta due to the FFXIV game design. -
02-19-2019, 11:20 AMmanamoppet
Some of those tips are greatly exaggerated. First of all, us healers heal first, dps is secondary. A WHM can solo heal 8 man parties if needed, and are not secondary healers.
Cure II is used late game, as sometimes the tank will be hit like a truck, and other times like being hit with a rolling train-wreck. Sometimes one can use CureII+Tetragrammaton to bring the tank from 20-30% to 80-90% when Benediction is on cooldown. Healing/damage varies in the dungeons, and is something one learns to account for, and sometimes different strategies for healing that one are unfamiliar might occur, and require a bit of improvisation. Since WHM don't have proper shield magic before lvl. 66, HoTs and Asylum make healing less stressfull, especially combined with Largesse. After applying HoT you can put up an Aero I+II now and then - it's not required, but lower the time having to heal. The lilies sadly aren't really something that need a lot of thinking about, they are mostly just there, and nice to look at. Cure 1 is mostly used on the ranged dps, or you can use Cure III if there are melee near the tank that got hit with an aoe. Medica (+/- Plenary Indulgence) is more effective and faster than Medica 2, but when to use either still depend on the content.Quote:
"Those who would walk the path of the white mage are healers without peer, possessed of the power to deliver comrades from the direst of afflictions—even the icy grip of death itself." - Jobguide
Holy spam can be done, but it takes a lot of mp without Thin Air (lvl. 62), and the tank will die if done indiscriminately. Swiftcast+Holy(+Assize) combo can give you a bit of breathing room to get a situation under control, and pick off the small mobs with little health left, allowing tank/dps to focus on the larger ones.
Just remember to be a healer foremost, and if you're comfortable/bored then apply damage :) -
02-19-2019, 11:33 AMNocturniaUzuki
Most of it has been covered already, but I'll more clearly state that it's not anything strictly against WHM. Some. people go on about how WHM is "bad" in the current meta, but that's a load of bull unless you're min/maxing to the extreme and actually care enough to restrict an entire class based on a few numbers alone. So don't worry about it.
All of the healers avoid using GCD heals like Cure I and I when playing at a mid-tier or higher Savage raiding level. As has been mentioned, that is because the goal of healing efficiently in this game is to minimize actual healing time and focus on DPS. Since heals are so strong, this is realistic.
Even if you're solo healing, you will spend a lot of time DPSing if you've reached a certain level of healer proficiency.
In dungeons, you're looking at large pulls where you cast Regen/Asylum, the odd Tetra or Bene, Benison, and then Holy spam while rotating PoM/Thin Air and Lucid Dreaming to AoE down the mobs. In older dungeons, this is less the case because mobs hit a lot harder and tanks aren't so tanky.
In any case, rest assured that if you want more intensive healing challenges, you CAN find them. There are things you can do where you will spend almost all of your time healing. However, the downside is that almost never ever does them, since it's old content. And to get that level of healing focus, you'd need to be solo healing it. Things like solo healing MinIL Ultima, or MinIL T9, etc, where the autos do so much damage, you're focused on healing tank most of the time. -
02-19-2019, 11:42 AMFilmakus
So for the most part it comes down to the situation as far as which heals are priority to use.
Sad to hear lilies truly aren't used cause on paper the idea sounds great but after looking over exactly how it works I due see its flaws.
So if I am understanding everything correctly to sum up healing in general terms, and I'm talking super general, for example throw out Medica II, Regen on tank(refreshing both when needed) and then from there fill in time with DPS such as Aero II and Stone II (or stronger variants once I get them) and Holy then if tank is about to take full frontal damage from a tank buster be ready with a Cure II or III depending and making sure Asylum is out during extended fights?
Thanks for all information given so far and any more received after this been truly enjoying WHM and want to see it through to the end and the more I understand the better! :) -
02-19-2019, 12:27 PMmanamoppetThere was a lot of improvement on various issues in patch 4.5, but lilies probably won't be useful until the new expansion. We'll just have to see.Quote:
Originally Posted by Filmakus
Well, generally you don't use Medica II when fighting mobs outside boss-fights in the lvl. 60 dungeons and up, as it can affect the tank aggro more than regen, especially since most dungeons (that I can think of) have ambushes/ reinforcements. Cure III if more than one PC can be healed from it, otherwise Cure II. But that's the gist of it, yes :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Filmakus
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02-19-2019, 12:59 PMGhishlainYou more or less get the gist of it, though Medica II is an AoE heal so it's better after a raid buster - it's usually not worth the GCD usage to use Medica II if the only person who will benefit from the heal is the tank.Quote:
Originally Posted by Filmakus
And as mentioned earlier, sometimes it's not even Cure II you want to use, you'll get Tetragrammaton which is essentially a free Cure II that's instant cast on a 60s cooldown (you'll get this at level 60).
In terms of healer priorities, you tend to want to exhaust your instant and free abilities before you start to spend GCDs on heals as it's generally more efficient to spend an ability that uses 0.75s versus a GCD that spends 2.5s. Once those are exhausted, you start to move into your spells like Cure II to heal.
Also, due note that Cure III is a very small AoE. It's not as MP efficient as Cure II for single target but it's pretty much the best on demand GCD AoE heal in the game, offset by the fact that your party members have to be in closer proximity of the target.
Asylum usage pretty much comes down to what you want out of it. In some cases it's best to use it as a stationary single target heal that will assist the tank, though if you can get 4/4 or 8/8 people stacked in Asylum for the entire duration, that's a lot of free healing that can be done for a single ability. It's unlikely, but if you can set it up well, it can save you a Medica II GCD since both Asylum and Medica II have similar potency / use. I find Asylum is about personal preference as well as the content you're participating in. You'll find very little use of it in 24mans in some regards because it's so chaotic it's hard to keep your party in your Asylum so it's best to just help the tank's HP if they're MTing. Even in more structured environments, there's no reason to use Asylum as an AoE just because the boss is so big and people seem allergic to enter the boss' hit box, lol. So again, just use it to keep your tank's HP up at that juncture.
Happy healing~ -
02-19-2019, 06:21 PMGeminaAt level 57, you are only going to have one ogcd heal in Benediction, so you'll be casting Cure II more often in the lower levels. At 60 you get Tetra, which will give allow you to begin to rotate these two ogcds before you have to resort to using Cure II. Using your regens effectively will also prolong the need for heals. The idea is to try and give continuous healing with your ogcd heals so you don't have to resort to Cure II, but do so if it is needed. This is also contingent on your party working with you and not against you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Filmakus
Cure I is a spell that gets pointed out from time to time about its usefulness because Cure II is more gcd efficient. You still need to keep Cure I on your hotbars because of level sync. But if you are about optimizing your gcds and recognize that you don't really have MP problems at all as a WHM, it will almost always be better to cast one Cure II instead of two Cure I's to get your tank up past your threshold.
It's a passive trait, so you honestly don't have to pay attention to it at all. The devs don't seem to want to give WHM a gimmick they have to micromanage like the other two healers. The concept isn't that bad, but it really does very little to actually benefit the WHM. Secret of the Lily 2 however is complete trash and still leaves a lot of us scratching our heads. Hopefully come 5.0 they figure something out better as I don't think the lily mechanic is going away; just getting reworked.Quote:
Sad to hear lilies truly aren't used cause on paper the idea sounds great but after looking over exactly how it works I due see its flaws.
Use Medica II sparingly. A mistake I see far too often is WHMs keeping medica II up full time. Regen is your sustain spell, and Medica II is actually more suited as a recovery spell more often that not. It can be used to sustain when constant AoE is inflicting damage whether it is unavoidable, or peeps are derping. In these cases, Swiftcast it. Otherwise, a well-timed largessed Medica II going off quickly after a large AoE blast is superior to Medica and more gcd efficient. This is great when people are spread out as they often are. Cure 3 is great when mechanics force the group to stack; and this happens often after a certain point.Quote:
So if I am understanding everything correctly to sum up healing in general terms, and I'm talking super general, for example throw out Medica II, Regen on tank(refreshing both when needed) and then from there fill in time with DPS such as Aero II and Stone II (or stronger variants once I get them) and Holy then if tank is about to take full frontal damage from a tank buster be ready with a Cure II or III depending and making sure Asylum is out during extended fights?
When you don't need to heal, regen, rezz then your downtime is filled with DPS. Keep your dots up as best as you can and throw rocks when you have nothing else to do. Assize is your bread 'n butter and should ALWAYS be on cooldown unless the timer somewhat lines up with raidwide AoE.
There's a little more to it than that such as weaving ogcds like Divine Benison, Cleric Stance, Presence of Mind etc. between castings, openers on bosses but I think you'll get the hang of it as you go along. WHM is very fun to play and just needs a little love. Good luck out there. -
02-19-2019, 09:52 PMSida
The post you have been reading are largely boasting. Not necessarily unrealistic boasting, but they come from the standpoint where everything works, everyone knows their steps, no one takes damage they shouldn't. While this is one way to play the game, get a perfect static and blast forward, it's by no means the only one. Healer is largely reactive role, more so when playing with people who need to be reacted to. I find fun in my healer role playing in chaotic 24-man groups and taking my chances in random parties. I've been in Orbonne runs where I've had to pull every healing trick in my sleeves (and few I didn't know I have) to make sure my party, and in some case, the neighbouring party whose both healers stay dead more time than alive, can stand up long enough to get past things. No time to consider what I should or shouldn't use as healer, as long as it increases right amount of health in right place at right time and I can cast it it's good. Question is how you want to play the game, not how the forum tells you how you should play it.
Disclaimer for last sentence, by that I don't mean one should be any less than they can be, nor do I endorse the "healing only healers". I'm just saying there can be challenges for healer where they can be more than just glorified dps, even if that's the picture meta-people like to paint. -
02-19-2019, 11:20 PMKalise
A thing to keep in mind is generally, forums tend to err towards the min/max levels of content. Which is where the "Never use Cure" thing comes from, because in a min/max static, it's entirely possible for Healers to co-ordinate so as to put the majority of the healing onto their oGCD skills leaving more room for pushing DPS.
However, there is far more content, as well as far more players, which will cause this playstyle to be literally impossible. Just like how the "Meta" thing for Tanks is to never use either Tank Stance nor Enmity combos, but it will be necessary for a lot of PuG groups and various dungeons and trials.
As far as WHM goes... In min/max scenarios their additional healing is unnecessary when everyone is doing mechanics nigh flawlessly all the time. But outside of that, the abundance of healing is really helpful to make up for peoples mistakes or to just give yourself some breathing room to mess up on occasion.
Lilies are... Poorly implemented. In min/max scenarios not only will your default CD's be short enough to time to the predictable incoming damage, but also you'll be trying to minimize usage of Cures to actually proc the damn things. Outside of that, it's really a case of how limited they are in generation. ONLY being from casting Cure I/II (With additional Secret of the Lilies II also only proccing off critical Cure I/II...) that makes them really kind of bad to play around. Since, given the plethora of other skills you have, you tend to want to minimize your use of Cure I/II anyway in favour of just using your oGCD's, Regen, Medica's and Cure III with Cure I/II being just the last resort for bringing someone's health up.
However, this is merely in the current expansion. No doubt that come Shadowbringers, there will be some changes to WHM and likely Lilies that will help alleviate some of these concerns and ideally make Lilies be more useful to the point of wanting to play around them (For example, hopefully they're not still tied to Cure I/II only...) -
02-20-2019, 02:34 AMGeminaI didn't read a single post here that told the OP to not use Cures. I pointed out using Cure II over Cure I, but that is the extent of it. The OP has also expressed his interest in taking WHM into endgame, so optimization and min/max is going to be very important, and it's best to learn it sooner rather than later. But striving to play optimally is going to put you a cut above the rest of the healers in PUGs if even only for the courtesy you're showing your other party members. They will appreciate it. Trust me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalise
A lot of min/maxers will say that min/maxing doesn't matter for anything outside of savage/ultimate. The ABC rules applies heavily here because they look at every single second during an encounter, and if your GCD isn't always ticking down, you're wasting everyone's time. This is a much different mentality than what's being proposed to the OP here. I oppose the meta mentality, but only the thought processes that lead to exclusions and elitism. I don't oppose optimization by any means.
That is not to dismiss your post though. A lot of healing is reactionary. Especially for WHM, and even more especially in 24-man content. While I feel that savage content tests your ability to memorize an encounter; alliance raids is where it's at to test your ability to react to damage that is not part of the script. In chaotic battles which are common in alliance raids, it can (not always) make more sense to hold on to certain abilities or sit on a couple of GCDs to evaluate the situation. But you still want to ABC as much as possible. -
02-20-2019, 02:55 AMKaliseNo, but the OP mentioned reading Forum/Reddit posts that said that kind of thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gemina
Which, like a lot of strange things that people end up getting confused about, stems from people using vague statements as opposed to explaining fully the actual situations. To which, is not a problem for people whom know what is inferred, but for people who are unaware and looking for more information, it ends up giving the wrong idea.
"Never use Cure I/II" "Healer DPS isn't important" "Tanks never use Tank Stance" "Only use oGCD's to heal" "Min/maxing is not important outside Savage/Ultimate content"
These are common statements. But they don't detail the actual thoughts behind them and if taken at face value, are outright wrong.
"Never use Cure I/II" doesn't mean to just take them off your action bar and literally never use them. It means that generally, you'd prefer to be using any other heal in their stead. Sometimes things don't go to plan and you NEED to toss out a Cure II to top off someone who accidentally took some more damage. If you're doing Roulettes you'll likely want to be using Cure I/II frequently because incoming damage tends to be faster than oGCD + Regen can keep up with in higher level dungeons and trials.
"Healer DPS isn't important" is referring to how it's less punishing for a Healer to pause DPS to spend GCD's on non-damage skills than it is for any other role that have higher base DPS so things are played out with that in mind (I.e. Tanks forgoing extra mitigation of Tank Stance in order to push out more DPS > the extra bit of healing they save the Healers having to do by having that extra mitigation)
"Only use oGCD's to heal" again, is more about focusing on utilizing oGCD's more than GCD's. Since it's better play to be able to continue to DPS as much as possible. But if you need to use a GCD heal, you need to use one.
"Min/maxing is not important outside of Savage/Ultimate content" would generally refer to playing in a "Perfect" way. Since you'll never get to play "Perfectly" outside of content where everyone else needs to play "Perfectly" too. It doesn't mean that learning optimal ways of using a class is not important, only that it's good to know the "Perfect" way to play and work towards that while adapting to the content that you're running. I.e. Focusing on using oGCD's to heal, but then using things like Cure I/II when necessary. -
02-20-2019, 03:49 AMGeminaI can't speak for what the OP read on reddit, only what I've seen in this thread; and he, and any onlookers will have received very valuable and elaborate information from its contributors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalise
I believe I know where your stance is coming from. The 'in a perfect world, in a perfect static, you can play perfectly like this." But no one here is telling the OP to take Cure I and II off of his hotbars, or healer DPS isn't important, or min/maxing only matters in savage. Everything you have elaborated on in your previous post has been covered, and OP understands that a lot of what healing entails is situational. All of this won't change the fact that someone will point out that all encounters in FFXIV are scripted though. It's the cold hard truth. It's why I prefer alliance raid over savage. The latter truly is like learning and practicing choreography, and a misstep can throw everything out of whack. I much prefer the randomness of roulettes, and not knowing if someone will eat a mechanic or not.
Perhaps going into 5.0 the devs will stop the scripted battle nonsense they've been leaning on for over 5 years now. It would be very interesting if enemy AI sees that 5 of 8 party members are below 50%, and moves to finish them off. Right now, healers can comfortably let players sit there so long as they know what's coming. -
02-20-2019, 05:39 AMFilmakus
All the information has been extremely helpful with understanding how to use my different skills. Thanks again everyone can't wait to continue my WHM and get it to 70! :D
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02-20-2019, 06:23 AMDmhlucky
I'm sure it was said, but also play the job as you want to. If you aren't doing endgame content, its a LOT more flexible on how you play.
You Can, just spam cure 1, if you want, and you wouldn't get yelled at. It is more efficient to wait, DPS and use Cure 2 and regen, yes, but you won't get harassed for it.
In lower person content, lets say Duo Eureka as heal/tank, i found i would charge Assize with Lilies before the assize update with the latest patch.
Lilies Can help, but its not something you rely on, which is why most people say don't bother with them. Even if they made it so you could store, and then Choose to activate, that would be better.
All healers start with a DPS spell, that should be an indication of their capability. Yes, their role is to keep the party alive, a "good" healer, will help kill monsters faster, negating the need for extra healing.
Don't get discouraged, healers are fun to play and rewarding. Some situations call for specific things, but for most normal content, play it how you feel comfortable. -
02-20-2019, 08:04 AMNocturniaUzuki
I concur that there while our recommendations have largely been based on high-level end-game scenarios, that that is only for ideal scenarios. I would also agree that holding spells and using a lot of Cures is important in things like Alliance raids. And frankly, that is one thing I really like about Alliance gameplay. When I play Alliance, I will typically use about only half my DPS rotations and save the rest for emergencies. Assize can get dropped on cooldown, but Tetra and Bene aren't going anywhere. I have my trigger finger over Rescue too!
In roulettes and dungeons, it's largely casual gameplay and you can do whatever you want. Personally, I play for challenge most of the time, and I find dungeons largely boring unless something makes them harder. I find that difficulty by optimizing. I like max-size pulls, and I like to heal as little as possible. I also tend to play DPS and use my healer knowledge to run healerless dungeons. But that's just me. -
02-28-2019, 05:53 AMColtvoyance
I wouldn't get discouraged by what you read about WHM endgame.
Reading up on the class online is probably the worst thing you can do for your morale.
Fun Fact: WHM players have been insecure and complaining about the class since they nerfed Holy in 2.0. And I say that confidently as a member of its community. (We're right to complain, but we've gotten almost too good at it...)
However, as a WHM main who has been playing since 2.0... the class is still fun. I wouldn't worry about it not being fun to play if you already enjoy it. It gets a lot more fun after 60. It's perhaps not as "exciting" as card games and fairies, but it's still fun. If you're like me... You find ways to entertain yourself; little optimizations you can make, you get riskier with your strats, you start making your own games to challenge yourself...
What you've probably read is that the class is in a tight spot, it's been ripped apart, given to everyone else, and left as a featureless husk. This is partly true. A lot of the vitriol online is because square has treated the class very poorly for awhile now. The greatest crime being the class' lack of definition and uniqueness. The lilies, yes, can be completely turned off and you wouldn't notice. It's a major problem of the class.
However, its still fully functional, and a lot of the statements you're reading that scare you are from super high-end zealots who play 24/7 and min/max to the extreme because numbers make them hard.
What's also true is Square has finally recognized the class is seriously lacking and is doing something about it. We don't know what, but we can hope.
I'd sit back, relax, and enjoy the class. Plenty of us at end-game still enjoy it, and if you decide to, so can you. You picked a great time to get into WHM because we've already done all the hard work of crying for it to be made better. Enjoy the rewards of that in a few months. -
02-28-2019, 06:06 PMSylvain
Also, as a last advice (because everyone covered extensively most of it)
Once you're 70, or while you're leveling up to 70. I would recommand you to take a few minutes to actually learn how the two other healers actually heal.
Their strong and weak point.
More importantly take time to understand how AST Earthly Star and Collective Unconscious and recognize the difference between a regular AoE shield (Succor) and a Deployed Adloquium.
Since Healing is Always done by 2 healers, it is important to have a rough understand of your co-heal tool so that you Don't interfer with their Healing.
A simple example would be the AST dropping the Earthly Star before an AoE. This is a visual clue telling you "I'll heal the next AoE" so to put it Simply, Don't start spamming Medica1-2 right after the AoE.
Sometime you'll be teamed with quite competent healers who will use their ogcd very effectively, knowing how these ogcd works will help you adapt and minimise your time spent Healing.
Most people gave advice regarding WHM Healing but I also wanted to point that, beside in dungeons, you'll Always be 2, so keep that in mind. -
02-28-2019, 11:11 PMMortex
The greatest problem whm has is his immobility that goes for dmg and healing spells. After the ‘quality of life changes ‘ for Astro with his bubble and the possibility to do dmg while you move and having almost the same heal potential as whm makes it so busted. Plus the fact that Astro gives more raid dps then whm. Whm has the blm problem, you feel like a stationary dps/ healer that has almost no ability that you can use when you need to run.
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03-01-2019, 01:04 AMExiled_Tonberry
Everyone already said everything there possibly is to say about WHM, so I just want to add this.
WHM will only truly feel bad when you compare it to the other healers. Once you start noticing what AST and SCH is capable of, you really start to feel how ridiculous WHM is. It pretty much fails at everything it sets out to do, and it only had one job; to be the best at healing, but it doesn't even accomplish that.
We're all hoping WHM sees some major changes in 5.0, but honestly, don't hold your breath. The vision SE has for WHM is fundamentally flawed and they're very stubborn when it comes to changing things. I mean aside from it's balance and playstyle issues, they have an entire lily system they need to fix.
And with Dancer, the next potential healer, on it's way things are just looking worse than ever. -
03-01-2019, 10:48 AMNocturniaUzukiThis is a massive overstatement. It may not have as high a DPS potential as the other healers, and the Lily system is obviously in need of a major rework, but I don't feel it's ridiculous at all. If it was that bad, nobody would play it in Savage raiding, and yet plenty of people do. And it can even solo heal everything as well, as far as I know, with the possible exception of some raids that absolutely require shields. Although some of those can be covered by tanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry
And it has a playstyle that is really rather enjoyable. Cure III, Thin Air, Asylum, and Plenary Indulgence are very satisfying skills to use. In comparison to Earthly Star and Collective Unconscious, they do have some drawbacks, but also some advantages. The advantage of Cure III is that it doesn't have a cooldown, and doesn't need 10s to reach maximum potency. The advantage of Asylum is that it has a longer base duration than Collective Unconscious' regen, the latter of which can be extended, but does so at the cost of a 120s CD ability. Asylum could use a small potency buff, perhaps, and/or a radius buff.
But ultimately, WHM is the most satisfying healer to play from a positional point of view. AST and SCH are frankly allowed to take the lazy route to positioning. Party members have a lot of freedom to move, and still get healed. With WHM, that's not the case. You can call this a massive flaw, but I look at AST and SCH and think it's boring that you can skip so much positional optimization. I mean, hell, if we're busy talking about how WHM is "bad" because in top tier parties, it can't output as much DPS, and it's healing tools are "weak", the topic of it's hard-to-use abilities really shouldn't come up, considering it's a "top tier" party that should know how to work with a WHM, and yet it does. Just because it requires more party coordination doesn't mean it's bad. Some potencies could use a buff, a shorter Stone cast time would be nice, and the Lily system needs it's rework, but I have no issue with WHM's current position. Least of all its identity. Because it does have an identity. It's the game's compiling healer. Though actually, the buff to Plenary Indulgence hurt that identity a bit. -
03-01-2019, 10:53 AMNocturniaUzukiWhile this is definitely a good point, I can't help but take issue with the way you said "always done by 2 healers" :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylvain
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03-05-2019, 06:47 AMdeadman1204
The "competitive advantage" of WHM is they have the strongest heals. However, the other 2 healers can function in all cases just fine, which means it isn't an advantage.
Leaving WHM with no competitive utility, same or lower dps than other heals, and more gcd heals (especially if your under 70).
People play all classes cause they like them. But when you compare all 3 healers, its obvious that one is lacking. -
03-06-2019, 02:02 AMExiled_TonberryI wish more people could understand this. It's not called an advantage when every other healer can do what you do regardless.Quote:
Originally Posted by deadman1204
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03-06-2019, 07:15 AMFtailIf all the healers were going hunting for deer in the woods, both the AST & SCH would come with a nice hunting rifle which is perfect for the job. WHM is the only healer that would come hunting for deer with an RPG. The job is complete overkill. I can understand balancing WHM more in the next expansion, I support that idea, maybe nerf them and give them a hunting rifle like an AST & SCH and buff them in other areas that they are lacking. DPS between all 3 healers is the most balanced DPS we've ever seen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry
http://puu.sh/Cygh5/2431a86c87.png
4.4 comparison:
The only thing WHM is missing is raid utility to make it even with AST & SCH. Also you can't properly say it's not an "advantage" to have superior heals, especially when those heals are not on a time gate. However, you can say it's almost never an advantage in organized high end groups. When the other healer dies, sure you can blame the party wipe on the person who fucked up, but a WHM might be able to keep the group together where a SCH & AST would fail solo. You'd be correct if you said it's not an advantage that negates the deficits of the job or something similar. Sorry, I'm being nit picky.