New Year's Poem 2019

Traditions traditions traditions.

English

Destinies ordained are not man's to change,

But history's chain may he yet disclaim.

As scion joins with stock of withered bark,

So we, defying doom, embrace the Dark.

– From an anachronistic journal, author unknown

Japanese

定められし運命　覆すは人に叶わずとも
A destiny decided　/　is not to be overturned by Man.

定められし歴史 　覆すは人の業と知れ
A history decided　/　can be overturned by Man and His knowledge.

枯れゆく大樹の枝葉　代えられゆく大樹に接ぎて
The foliage of a dying tree　/　grafted to the tree that replaces it.

我　闇を友として　今こそ運命に抗わん
For us　/　with Darkness as our companion　/　the time to meet our fate has come.

German

Des Schicksals Wurzeln reichen tief
Destiny's roots reach deep,

Unerreichbar für der Sterblichen Hand.
Unreachable to the Hands of Man.

Der Baum der Geschichte aber soll erblühen
But the tree of history shall bloom

im Dunkel, das uns wiederfand.
in the Darkness which has rediscovered us.

– Aus "Alte Legenden neu erzählt"
– From "Old Legends Newly Told"

French

Il n'appartient pas à l'Homme de change la destinee,
It does not belong to Man, the changing of destiny,

Mais les maillons de l'Histoire toujours il puet reforger.
But the links (as of a chain) of History can yet be reforged.

Telle la verte pousse naissant sur le tronc candamné,
Like green growth (unexpectedly) sprouting from a doomed trunk,

Nous embrassons les Ténebres pour mieux braver la fatalité.
We embrace the Darkness that we might better brave fate.

– Nouvelles chroniques des temps anciens
– New chronicles of ancient times

Guess at Consolidated Version:
There is no changing fated destiny.
But the reins of history can be guided by the hands of man.
As healthy growth is grafted to a dying tree,
We make an ally of Darkness to escape our fate.

Notes:
Notice that "new chronicles of ancient times" was also used last year.

Guess at meaning:
I assume the comparative words are a hint. As scion is grafted to stem, so we embrace the Dark. "Like a healthy branch grafted to a dying tree do we make an ally of Darkness." Grafting our power to Zodiark may allow us to push back a Light-based disaster, but does that systemically push the symptom to a higher order and force us to confront Zodiark's intentions beyond preventing the end of existence? And is it a double-meaning? Something something grafting a newborn branch of history onto a dying destiny? There's also the idea that this could refer to a deliberate Rejoining but that's super uncomfortable right now, lol.

I'll keep mulling it over and come back after 4.5 (Part 1)

Useless Afterthoughts:
If we really do end up using tree metaphors and time travel, I'm gonna need some help making the perfect "Future Trunks" pun.

The first, second and fourth lines are all fairly expected "defying destiny" stuff, but it's the "withered bark" that has me wondering. I'll admit that my mind first thought of Exdeath....

I've heard it suggested that "stock of withered bark" could refer to a disreputable branch of a family tree, i.e. disinherited offspring. Seems like a bit of a complicated metaphor, though.

EDIT: Ooohhhhhhhh a scion like a tree cutting!

EDIT: Nevermind, 'moose Ninja-edited me.


German Translation:

Des Schicksals Wurzeln reichen tief
The roots of destiny are reaching deep

Unerreichbar für der Sterblichen Hand.
Unreachable for a mortal's hand

Der Baum der Geschichte aber soll erblühen
But the tree of history shall bloom

im Dunkel, das uns wiederfand.
In the Dark that found us again / recovered us



Please note that's in the middle of the night here and some sparkling wine may have been consumed, so no guarantees here.



EDIT 2: Well, I compared this one to last year's and it was quite interesting. Both are talking about how destiny is led by gods/cannot be changed, but history is the subject of mortals and can be changed. Well, wasn't there something in the Shadowbringers Trailer about 'let history be undone'...?


EDIT 3:

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Originally Posted by Keever

I've heard it suggested that "stock of withered bark" could refer to a disreputable branch of a family tree, i.e. disinherited offspring. Seems like a bit of a complicated metaphor, though.

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Well, if we think about it like a branch of a tree... Withered... Aren't the Shards like 'branches' of the Source? Withered... a Shard that has some problems?

Sounds more and more like time travel...

Ahem.

Approximate interpretation: destiny's course cannot be swayed (*Master Xehanort fingers*), but by taking up the power of Darkness it may yet be rewritten.

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

Well, if we think about it like a branch of a tree... Withered... Aren't the Shards like 'branches' of the Source? Withered... a Shard that has some problems?

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We've had seven Shards be Rejoined to the Source already. One Shard has been Flooded with Darkness. An eighth Shard is on the cusp of being Rejoined. I'd say we've got a bunch of sickly or even non-existent Shards to pick from here.

Wasn't it said at a lore panel or something that...

there only needs to be one more Calamity or something for the Rejoining to be complete?

Or have I been subjected to the Telephone game?

Quote:

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Destinies ordained are not man's to change

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Still, unless we know exactly what our destiny is, it's possibly that rebelling against our apparent destiny is a foretold part of our actual destiny!

Self-fulfilling prophecies and all that. You can't fight fate, you just do as much good as you can and if the prophecy is unbreakable, it'll come true sooner or later.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Wasn't it said at a lore panel or something that...

there only needs to be one more Calamity or something for the Rejoining to be complete?

Or have I been subjected to the Telephone game?

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I don't have the quote either, but I think it was that the next Calamity will be the last, but the reasons for that are unknown (and because of that I'm not regarding it as a spoiler - it doesn't tell us enough). Will Zodiark be resummoned? Do we put an end to the entire cycle before the Ascians can drive their plan any further?

Essentially, we're heading for the climax and ultimate resolution of this conflict, one way or another.

Well, as luck would have it I was just reflecting on the last line of 2017's poem (which Urianger made a point of also mentioning outright in game during SB's story), and the conclusion I came from that in light (ha!) of the recent developments and the Shadowbringers teaser, left me feeling very omninous for the future, and this year's poem only is making that ominiousness worse. Really, it's pretty easy to see everything goes Doomsday, and we are swept up in it ('azure lost admist the storm'), and now this year's one further drives that apocalyptic feeling home. And I don't like it one bit.

I know desperate times call for desperate measures, but I still can't shake the feeling that despite the idea of 'taking darkness to escape utter destruction' is in fact still playing into the Ascians' hands and makes the whole thing nothing more than 'heads we win, tails you lose', that no matter what we do, it will still work in the Ascians' favour. I just hope FF precedent does prevail and a third option is presented, but I hope 'becoming the WoD' is not that third option. But we'll see (it will be interesting to look back at this a year from now to see how this went in any case.).

Popping back in quickly to mention that it was the 5.0 keynote that referred to struggling to prevent "The Eighth and Final Umbral Calamity," which might be a reference to that 8 of 14 total worlds is Zodiark's "majority share" of strength He had when He was banished ... or it might just be a double-meaning. "I'm not going to stop the wheel. I'm going to break the wheel."

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Originally Posted by Cilia

Sounds more and more like time travel...

Ahem.

Approximate interpretation: destiny's course cannot be swayed (*Master Xehanort fingers*), but by taking up the power of Darkness it may yet be rewritten.

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This is what I keep thinking. It seems to suggest we cant change the course that past events are leading us to unless we can change past events. There has been a lot of talking about history recently in the story and the doom the future holds.

I am also somewhat reminded that in 1.0, unless I am remembering things wrong, some of the echo visions had players actually involved in events of the past such as when Minfilia's dad died. Now 1.0 was a bit of a narrative mess and I could be completely wrong but the Scion's souls have been pulled somewhere and if we could use the echo to travel between past events where the Scions now are and current day, it would explain how we would get involved in past events while still being involved in the war against Garlemald.

My suspicions are still that we will become the Warrior of Darkness to effectively usurp the position from the Ascians and thus remove them from the balancing equation.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

I know desperate times call for desperate measures, but I still can't shake the feeling that despite the idea of 'taking darkness to escape utter destruction' is in fact still playing into the Ascians' hands and makes the whole thing nothing more than 'heads we win, tails you lose', that no matter what we do, it will still work in the Ascians' favour. I just hope FF precedent does prevail and a third option is presented, but I hope 'becoming the WoD' is not that third option. But we'll see (it will be interesting to look back at this a year from now to see how this went in any case.).

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That's my feeling too. I think Darkness is being set up to look like our third option, the path out between two unwanted fates, but really? Up until now we've only had one option (Warrior of Light) and here we are with our supposed "only choice" being to abandon it and turn to the opposite half of a duality.

If we must take up the power of Darkness, let it be to take it alongside the Light and find the balance inbetween, the path that is our third option. "The road to dawn", as Kingdom Hearts put it, and that will be the hope in my mind as this plays out.

I feel like this might just be a "lesser of two evils" situation where the choices are to further the Ascians' schemes (Whether willfully or unintentionally) or let the world be destroyed with absolutely no hope of survival (It's suggested that the Rejoining won't necessarily eradicate all life...though it'll almost certainly end the world as we know it regardless).

I'd be surprised if Elidibus wasn't planning for things to play out in such a manner, since it would explain why he was saying we were key to Zodiark's revival.

Obviously there's going to be a way out of this mess in the end, though things are probably going to get much worse before they get better.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

Japanese
定められし運命　覆すは人に叶わずとも
A destiny decided　/　is not to be overturned by Man.

定められし歴史 　覆すは人の業と知れ
A history decided　/　can be overturned by Man and His knowledge.

枯れゆく大樹の枝葉　代えられゆく大樹に接ぎて
The foliage of a dying tree　/　grafted to the tree that replaces it.

我　闇を友として　今こそ運命に抗わん
For us　/　with Darkness as our companion　/　the time to meet our fate has come.

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Found this kind of translation on reddit, although I can't be a judge on correctness...

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JP version :

定められし運命 價すは人に叶わずとも
Men aren't the ones deciding fate

定められし歴史價すは人の業と知れ
But men are the ones deciding history

枯れゆく大樹の枝葉 代わられゆく大樹に接ぎて
From a rotten tree a branch is taken, to be given to it's successor.

我 闇を友として 今こそ 運命に抗わん
Thus we are now, among the dark, facing fate.

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The 'withered bark' bit makes me think of the Iifa Tree from IX. I'd love to see more things like that make their way into FFXIV. It'd make a pretty cool dungeon.

Well, according to a more recent interview we're only 60% done with the Hydlyen/Zodiark arc.

Hmm, most of the time you only graft something onto another thing is to make the host better. So, I guess we would need to figure out what the host is then? To me there's only three things that would be needing to be healed the 1st and 13th Shard and Hydlyen. I'm not sure how you would fix the 13th with more darkness so the other two would be a better bet. I don't know how you make one better without causing a rejoining though unless we do go and jump to the 1st and become the darkness bringer since we don't know how well her voice is acting as a light vacuum.

I'm surprised no one's brought up the first lines of the poem in contrast to Varis, and his remark in 4.4 about how "man is the master of his own destiny". It's definitely enough to make me even more interested in the part he'll play in 4.5's events (and possibly beyond). As for the "withered bark" line, I'm hard pressed to decide whether this is going to end up being more of a metaphor for what's to come or if there's any degree of literal meaning to be applied to future events. All these speculations bring up lots of possibilities though. The final line I think is certainly relevant to the possibility of the WoL taking up the role of WoD for a time in Shadowbringers, but I also worry it could mean we may end up having to work with the Ascians at some point. I'm not too keen on that idea myself, but if that does end up being the case then that implies just how badly the balance gets skewed in favor of the Light. I really cannot wait until next week when the first part of 4.5 drops, but I have a feeling we'll have some things answered and a lot more questions afterward. Either way, a lot's about to change.

An additional thought on Darkness not actually being where we are supposed to go (or at least end up) - a lot of people point to Arbert's claim that "Light, Dark, it doesn't matter" as proof that we don't need to stay allied to Light.

But how well-informed is Arbert? And where did he get the information from?

Unless he's had some kind of additional revelation on his own, it was Elidibus who 'helped' them to become the Warriors of Darkness, and is most likely their main information source. And I can see it being entirely possible that he neglected to give them some important pieces of information, or led them to draw incorrect conclusions.

Ah, yes, the reins of history back in the hands of Man. Because that worked so well for Ivalice between XII and Tactics.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Keever

I've heard it suggested that "stock of withered bark" could refer to a disreputable branch of a family tree, i.e. disinherited offspring. Seems like a bit of a complicated metaphor, though.

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I had a similar thought that it's in reference to the Imperial royal family. "Stock of withered bark" = the founding father was an Ascian. "Healthy growth" = new blood for the Empire in some way? Perhaps we'll see Zenos' siblings mentioned in the second lore book?

I just re-read the Rising 2018 song, and watched the end of the 4.5 trailer. I don't think it's time travel: I think we're about to go to the Mirror Shard.

The Rising song talks about everything the WoL has accomplished: "soar azure skies/wear crimson crest/shine Light" and then contrasts them with their opposite: "weave azure lie/crimson bleed/Darkness quench".

At the very end of the trailer, when Solus gives his line about "together we shall give the lie to this star's fraudulent existence" as a voice over, we see the WoL standing at the center of a ring of blue circles. At first it reminded me of Louisoux summoning the Twelve, but then I though of the Zodiac Braves symbols that appear before the Thunder God's ultimate. Then I counted the circles--there are 14. One for each shard plus the Source, perhaps? The WoL about to travel to another shard, where that Warrior of Light either couldn't or wouldn't do their job, so we have to oppose that shard's WoL by becoming their opposite--the Warrior of Darkness--in order to prevent the calamity on the Source.

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Originally Posted by Rosenoire

I just re-read the Rising 2018 song, and watched the end of the 4.5 trailer. I don't think it's time travel: I think we're about to go to the Mirror Shard.

The Rising song talks about everything the WoL has accomplished: "soar azure skies/wear crimson crest/shine Light" and then contrasts them with their opposite: "weave azure lie/crimson bleed/Darkness quench".

At the very end of the trailer, when Solus gives his line about "together we shall give the lie to this star's fraudulent existence" as a voice over, we see the WoL standing at the center of a ring of blue circles. At first it reminded me of Louisoux summoning the Twelve, but then I though of the Zodiac Braves symbols that appear before the Thunder God's ultimate. Then I counted the circles--there are 14. One for each shard plus the Source, perhaps? The WoL about to travel to another shard, where that Warrior of Light either couldn't or wouldn't do their job, so we have to oppose that shard's WoL by becoming their opposite--the Warrior of Darkness--in order to prevent the calamity on the Source.

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A fully living being cannot travel between the Shards and the Source though which our character still is - the WoDs specifically had to die on their own world in order to come here, and even Goddess!Minfilia was an incoporeal spirit when she took them back (I can't remember where it was stated but it seems to be very much a one-way trip). The fact remains, we just have so little to go on at this time to really make an accurate understanding of just what is going to happen, until 4.55 and the full Shadowbringers trailer are released.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

A fully living being cannot travel between the Shards and the Source though which our character still is - the WoDs specifically had to die on their own world in order to come here, and even Goddess!Minfilia was an incoporeal spirit when she took them back (I can't remember where it was stated but it seems to be very much a one-way trip). The fact remains, we just have so little to go on at this time to really make an accurate understanding of just what is going to happen, until 4.55 and the full Shadowbringers trailer are released.

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AFAIK, the WoDs were told by Elidibus that they had to die on their own world--he may have been wrong about that. It may be different traveling from the source to a shard than vice versa. Maybe the WoL is just powerful enough now to do it. The simplest explanation is that a Calamity breaks down the barriers between shards. Solus gets his way, and we're off.

Or not. I'm just guessing.

While trips between shards have all been one way in the past, this is still a video game narrative where the needs of the story trump the rules of the game's "reality." Thus, if they have some other strange excuse to let us travel between the shards (whether directly physically or through some other means) they can come up with some sort of magical way for us to do that. Maybe the barrier gets weakened due to the flood of light shenanigans, or someone discovers a totally new process. My personal pet theory is that's exactly what has happened to our Scion companions. Their souls are missing, and seem to have completely disappeared from the Source according to Krile and Matoya. But since their physical bodies are alive they are certainly somewhere. This aligns a lot better with their souls being in a shard than the time travel theory. Someone somewhere (maybe Hydelyn?) found a way to move souls between the shards without killing their mortal shells, allowing their souls to transfer and either form a new body there or maybe possess one. That's admittedly a pet theory though. We know so little about inter-shard travel it's hard to say one way or another.

My current theory is that the Scions are somewhere on/in the Moon with Zodiark. The Moon is not another Shard, it's part of the Source. However, it's quarantined from the normal Aetherial Sea. Which matches up nicely with what we see happened to the Scions aether/souls in 4.5.

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Originally Posted by Rosenoire

I just re-read the Rising 2018 song, and watched the end of the 4.5 trailer. I don't think it's time travel: I think we're about to go to the Mirror Shard.

The Rising song talks about everything the WoL has accomplished: "soar azure skies/wear crimson crest/shine Light" and then contrasts them with their opposite: "weave azure lie/crimson bleed/Darkness quench".

At the very end of the trailer, when Solus gives his line about "together we shall give the lie to this star's fraudulent existence" as a voice over, we see the WoL standing at the center of a ring of blue circles. At first it reminded me of Louisoux summoning the Twelve, but then I though of the Zodiac Braves symbols that appear before the Thunder God's ultimate. Then I counted the circles--there are 14. One for each shard plus the Source, perhaps? The WoL about to travel to another shard, where that Warrior of Light either couldn't or wouldn't do their job, so we have to oppose that shard's WoL by becoming their opposite--the Warrior of Darkness--in order to prevent the calamity on the Source.

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I loathe the idea of going to another shard. This kind of complicated mess could completely ruin the game for people. Remember XIII's time travel? Many people hated it.

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Originally Posted by DamianFatale

I loathe the idea of going to another shard. This kind of complicated mess could completely ruin the game for people. Remember XIII's time travel? Many people hated it.

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I'm...not sure how that would be so problematic.

If anything, it prevents things from getting complicated because it's a given that we're going to see a world ravaged by light and letting us go to one that's already been destroyed as opposed having the calamity actually happen then resorting to time travel or some such to fix it would be an even bigger mess.

Exploring Nagxia and the rest of Dalmasca seems more likely than dropping everything and venturing to a completely different planet or going back in time.

- Viera are pretty much confirmed at this point and will, presumably, be fleshed out and shown in-game to a more meaningful degree.
- Negotiators from both Dalmasca and Nagxia are shown visiting Hien in relation to his alliance.
- The end teaser after Orbonne suggests a tie in to the MSQ's in the future.
- Nagxia and Dalmasca have been fleshed out considerably in the latest lore book.
- Nu Mou, from the Ivalice games, are set to be a Beast Tribe in 5.0.
- There's still the entirety of Ilsabard to explore as well as the likes of Thavnair and Sharlayan. Ignoring them wouldn't go down well and neither would rushing through them. Ala Mhigo's treatment was a point of controversy during Stormblood after all.

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Originally Posted by DamianFatale

I loathe the idea of going to another shard. This kind of complicated mess could completely ruin the game for people. Remember XIII's time travel? Many people hated it.

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It also doesn't work well storywise, to leave behind all this lore that has been built up and throwing the players into some world that no one has any real investment in.

It wouldn't really be leaving behind built-up lore when they teased that the first shard might have relevance in the future.

It would be continuing a plot thread that was left hanging after the end of the 3.4 MSQ when there was no guarantees the first would successfully be re-balanced by Hydaelyn/Minfilia coupled with the place being under watch by the Ascians.

I'd prefer if we just had a straight progression of six new zones like in Heavensward, but with all this weird extra-dimensional/timey wimey stuff seemingly at play, I'm having a hard time imagining that our journey is going to be limited to the bounds of Hydaelyn this time around.

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Originally Posted by DamianFatale

I loathe the idea of going to another shard. This kind of complicated mess could completely ruin the game for people. Remember XIII's time travel? Many people hated it.

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One theory I've seen on the meaning of the Rising song is that we'll have to go back in time to undo everything that we've done, because we caused the imbalance of Light on the Source. I'd much rather go to a different world than have to go back in time and "weave the azure lie" of Ishgard's founding.

In light of the Paris Fan Festival version of the trailer, with Y'shtola being addressed as "Matoya", it opens up a new and interesting reading of the prophecy - particularly the third line.

In its various translations:

(E) "As scion joins to stock of withered bark"
(J) "The foliage of a dying tree grafted to the tree that replaces it."
(J) "From a rotten tree a branch is taken, to be given to it's successor." (post #13)
(G) "But the tree of history shall bloom" (can "Baum der Geschichte" be translated a different way? "Ancient tree"?)
(F) "Like green growth sprouting from a doomed trunk"

This seemed to be just a metaphor, but now I'm thinking it might refer to a literal event: Matoya's soul somehow being bound to Y'shtola.

Putting all the translations side by side, they seem inconsistent about what's actually happening though.

English: the scion (grafted branch or shoot) is attached to "withered stock" (the roots).

Japanese: the scion is a cutting from a dying tree, grafted to new stock so some part of the old tree lives on.

German: doesn't seem to match the others

French: a "doomed tree" putting forth new growth; no mention of joining things together. I suppose it could follow that the new growth is taken and grafted (as in the Japanese) but it's not said outright.

The Japanese version seems to make the most sense. English seems back-to-front (why graft a new cutting to a dying tree?) but perhaps got swayed by the tempting wordplay of "scion" - does that carry over in translation, or is it only the English name for the organisation that carries that double-meaning?

So anyway. Assuming Japanese is correct: part of an old tree grafted to the new one that replaces it, so part of it lives on.

It certainly seems very appropriate for the currently-theorised situation that Matoya may have transferred her soul into Y'shtola's body.


In which case....

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

Guess at meaning:
I assume the comparative words are a hint. As scion is grafted to stem, so we embrace the Dark. "Like a healthy branch grafted to a dying tree do we make an ally of Darkness."

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You've used the English version of the translation so even if it's just a metaphor, it might need to be the other way around. "Like a cutting from an ancient tree, we will graft a piece of the Darkness onto ourself."

If the third line is not a metaphor, it becomes clearer again. "As what happened when Matoya placed herself within Y'shtola, so shall we take Darkness within ourself."





I also have to wonder about the prophecy itself: the "anachronistic journal". (How does the Japanese version attribute this? Or doesn't it say anything? It hasn't been included in the translations.)

Urianger seems to have shifted from studying prophecies to actively making them as an astrologian.

And what might get a found journal labeled "anachronistic"? The writer's vocabulary seeming a few centuries out of line with the apparent age of the book...?

"Baum der Geschichte" can't be ancient tree or the likes, I fear.

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Originally Posted by RicaRuin

"Baum der Geschichte" can't be ancient tree or the likes, I fear.

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That's strange then. It doesn't seem to match what's being said in the other poems at all. I wonder why?

Getting back to the French translation there. Last line : fatalité is not strictly "the End" and not so much "doom" either. Fatalité is a relatively neutral word compared to doom. It essentially means something that can't be changed; it would be closer to "fate" in English, same etymology by the way.
Third line condamné is far stronger than "withered". In French it's hopeless, while "withered" is a weakened state, but it's not doomed.

The third line in French really means the growth is born (that's the verb used in french, naissant) from the tree. Grafted would be greffée. So it is something made from that tree. The French metaphor is something like "[as unexpected] as a new leaf on a dead tree, we will embrace the Dark to challenge our fate". The "unexpected" part is what is suggested by how the sentence is built.

Anachronistic Journal?

Kind of like the one that Goblin found, 3 years before it was written, in the Alexander Quests?

Bumping this post-5.3 because the tree metaphor has taken on another layer of meaning AND might explain how the English version got it backwards, as I noted earlier:

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English: the scion (grafted branch or shoot) is attached to "withered stock" (the roots).
Japanese: the scion is a cutting from a dying tree, grafted to new stock so some part of the old tree lives on.

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Of course our first understanding of the metaphor became clear once we got to play Shadowbringers - the "cutting from a dying tree" being the Exarch, sent from a dying future and becoming part of the new version of events that would replace it.

And now... well, it's the Exarch again but in an entirely different way, with his soul and memories grafted on his younger self.

And that younger self happens to be a newly invited Scion, so "scion joins to withered bark" may have been too good a pun to worry about things like getting the definitions the right way around.

(Which, funnily enough, is more or less what I suggested as a possible interpretation in my earlier post - though regarding Y'shtola and Matoya, based on what information we had at the time.)


Meanwhile the part about Darkness is interesting, given our recent discoveries about our own character.