Improving as s WAR

Evening all,

A simple question as the title suggests:

How do I bring my DPS from around 4.6k on O9S to higher numbers?

I don't miss GCDs, I'm using food and pots, I'm i383 and I'm fairly certain I'm doing everything right but obviously the numbers don't back it up.

Any advice that can help me improve by any amount will be hugely appreciated!

Thanks in advance,

Jack

I’m pretty much in the exact same spot so I’d like to know as well, but I’m pretty sure I have an idea of what I’m doing wrong (so this may or may not apply.) I tend to see 5k+ wars getting off a couple more fell cleaves during a fight so for me I think it comes down to not refreshing storms eye at just the right time. More reapplying of the buff translates to less beast gauge which also translates to less fell cleaves. People who know more than I do can point out other stuff, but I would expect this to be a common theme among wars trying to absolutely optimize their dps. Hope that’s helpful!

Keeping infuriate on coldown to gain the seconds reductions everytime you use fell cleave is pretty important too, speially during inner release Windows, 5k WARs enjoy having timed raid buffs too since the job scale a lot with trick attacks and crit buffs, keep that in mind.

You're using Onslaught too often, try not to have to use Butcher's Block, work on Storm's Eye uptime, and make sure to optimize raid buff windows. Also keep in mind that your personal DPS is limited by your raid composition (SAM over MNK or DRG, no AST, etc.).

Thanks for the advice so far!

My Eye timing could definitely be improved as I often hit a wrong button. As for Onslaught, should that not be used on cooldown? Or is saving that 20 gauge for Cleave/Upheaval more beneficial?

I understand that I'm limited by the buffs given and that raid co-ordination only usually happens in established Statics (might look into joining one) but I hate to think that I'm under performing.

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Originally Posted by JackBlaine

Thanks for the advice so far!

My Eye timing could definitely be improved as I often hit a wrong button. As for Onslaught, should that not be used on cooldown? Or is saving that 20 gauge for Cleave/Upheaval more beneficial?

I understand that I'm limited by the buffs given and that raid co-ordination only usually happens in established Statics (might look into joining one) but I hate to think that I'm under performing.

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Avoid using Onslaught on cooldown. Comparing on potency per pauge (ppg) basis:

Onslaught: 100p for 20g; 5ppg
Upheaval: 300p* for 20g; 15ppg*
Fell Cleave: 520p for 50g; 10,2ppg
Inner Beast: 350p for 50g; 7ppg**

* = if HP at 100% and no HP boosting buffs active
** = simply added for comparison in less-than-ideal scenarios

So Upheaval has full dibs on gauge priority, followed by FC / IB. Onslaught is best used as a gap closer to increase uptime if for some unfortunate reason walking between GCDs isn't enough when you eventually have to do a bee line for mechanics. Alternatively its decent for snap aggro in fights with adds that start with 0 enmity along wizh Equilibrium. Also affected by Unchained, if you need a lot enmity FAST.

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Originally Posted by JackBlaine

Thanks for the advice so far!

My Eye timing could definitely be improved as I often hit a wrong button. As for Onslaught, should that not be used on cooldown? Or is saving that 20 gauge for Cleave/Upheaval more beneficial?

I understand that I'm limited by the buffs given and that raid co-ordination only usually happens in established Statics (might look into joining one) but I hate to think that I'm under performing.

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as reinhardt sow you onslaught is a dps loss and works only as a gap closer better or as a gauge control to avoid overflow but thats pretty hard to happen, but in inner release window is the contrary, you have to use all you fell cleaves,onslaught and upheaval since they gauge cost is removed and are free oGCD so more raw potency by the face.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Avoid using Onslaught on cooldown. Comparing on potency per pauge (ppg) basis:

Onslaught: 100p for 20g; 5ppg
Upheaval: 300p* for 20g; 15ppg*
Fell Cleave: 520p for 50g; 10,2ppg
Inner Beast: 350p for 50g; 7ppg**

* = if HP at 100% and no HP boosting buffs active
** = simply added for comparison in less-than-ideal scenarios

So Upheaval has full dibs on gauge priority, followed by FC / IB. Onslaught is best used as a gap closer to increase uptime if for some unfortunate reason walking between GCDs isn't enough when you eventually have to do a bee line for mechanics. Alternatively its decent for snap aggro in fights with adds that start with 0 enmity along wizh Equilibrium. Also affected by Unchained, if you need a lot enmity FAST.

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Actually, using onslaught on cooldown is pretty much dps neutral than not doing so, and the reason is due to keeping your gauge at higher levels. This means you crit more frequently.

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Originally Posted by Hierro

Actually, using onslaught on cooldown is pretty much dps neutral than not doing so, and the reason is due to keeping your gauge at higher levels. This means you crit more frequently.

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This.

Also Fell Cleave is a GCD while onslaught is an oGCD. Onslaught's real ppg is way closer to FC than it looks.

While I’ve read that using onslaught on cd is dps neutral, after making the switch I’ve found not spamming it to be a dps gain. I’d suggest trying it out for a few fights at least and looking at your numbers.

So I took a more detailed look at your situation, OP, and I've seen a couple of things.

First, You want to let your gauge sit as close to 100 as possible, for as long as possible. I see that it rarely goes to 100, and that's not optimal because it means you're missing out on extra crit chance. That said, you only want to fell cleave or onslaught when you HAVE to, at 100 gauge. Even when you're at 100 gauge, if your next GCD can be heavy swing, use that first then FC/onslaught.

Second, you need to be more strict with your upheaval timings. I use it on the dot, exactly when it comes off CD. I notice you let upheaval sit on cooldown for about a second or two, but that adds up over time. This becomes a serious problem when you're using IR on cooldown cause it could lead to upheaval drifiting outside of IR's window, and that's exactly what happened in your best encounter.

Third, you need to be more careful with when you use onslaught, because similar to the previous issue, if you use onslaught just before an IR window, you miss out on a guaranteed direct crit, and for what? just to keep it on CD? This also applies to situations with pushes or knockbacks. If you mindlessly use onslaught on CD, you might miss out on when you need it for its utility. You can onslaught, or you can FC, in terms of dps there is no difference but we must keep in mind the importance of planning ahead and making sure we don't mess up because of mindless skill usage.

otherwise, you're pretty solid. I would just play it safer with storm's eye and keep refreshing it at 7 seconds instead of as close to 0, like we often would like to do to get more gauge from path, but realize that the extra 10% on a more consistent basis really adds up.

A good rule of thumb is to FC when you have roughly 7 secs left on Infuriate before it comes of cd. If you are sitting on 100 gauge, Infuriate is at 30 sec before coming off cd, use a FC so you don't waste a 5 seconds. Infuriate is more on a 45 sec cd and with IR its closer to 30 sec cd. It's very fast so your entire rotation revolves around what time Infuriate is at and how much gauge you have.

Onslaught should only be used as a gap closer/IR and only if the gap makes you waste more than a gcd. Stepping out of aoes like midgars spin spin combo don't count. Pro tip for o10s. flip-spin combo if you are mt you can still hit the boss but be at max melee range.

Upheaval is only good for IR and those scenarios where you capped 100 gauge after doing maim and have SE already refreshed. Simply use upheaval and finish with SP to get back to 100. Unfortunately if you are mt Upheaval will very rarely bee at its full 300 potency since you won't be sitting at full hp.

Other than that party comp is definitely the biggest factor to WAR dps. I've been in parties where the AST threw me an enhanced Balance during my IR and NIN trick attack is up. I'm already seeing numbers past 25k in o9s and I only have the suzaku axe and food buffs. No pots for me cuz im broke.

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Originally Posted by Marxam

A good rule of thumb is to FC when you have roughly 7 secs left on Infuriate before it comes of cd. If you are sitting on 100 gauge, Infuriate is at 30 sec before coming off cd, use a FC so you don't waste a 5 seconds. Infuriate is more on a 45 sec cd and with IR its closer to 30 sec cd. It's very fast so your entire rotation revolves around what time Infuriate is at and how much gauge you have.

Onslaught should only be used as a gap closer/IR and only if the gap makes you waste more than a gcd. Stepping out of aoes like midgars spin spin combo don't count. Pro tip for o10s. flip-spin combo if you are mt you can still hit the boss but be at max melee range.

Upheaval is only good for IR and those scenarios where you capped 100 gauge after doing maim and have SE already refreshed. Simply use upheaval and finish with SP to get back to 100. Unfortunately if you are mt Upheaval will very rarely bee at its full 300 potency since you won't be sitting at full hp.

Other than that party comp is definitely the biggest factor to WAR dps. I've been in parties where the AST threw me an enhanced Balance during my IR and NIN trick attack is up. I'm already seeing numbers past 25k in o9s and I only have the suzaku axe and food buffs. No pots for me cuz im broke.

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Upheaval is good in any situation. Playing optimally means keeping it as close to on cooldown as possible. You want to be a swiss watch when it comes to hitting that button exactly 30 seconds since the previous use. It doesn't matter if your HP is low, it doesn't matter if slashing debuff or storm's eye buff fell-- if that skill is off cooldown, use it ASAP.

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Originally Posted by Hierro

Upheaval is good in any situation. Playing optimally means keeping it as close to on cooldown as possible. You want to be a swiss watch when it comes to hitting that button exactly 30 seconds since the previous use. It doesn't matter if your HP is low, it doesn't matter if slashing debuff or storm's eye buff fell-- if that skill is off cooldown, use it ASAP.

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Did someone do the numbers on how the ratio of potency:HP scales? I'm not denying you are right that in theory Upheaval needs to be used on cd but with my experiences at least I seem to not really have an option either because I drop combos due to mechanics and/or I'm 2 gcds from a dual FC before a boss jumps. I usually find myself weighing in the fact that I can either use Upheaval or wait 2 gcds for a FC. Upheaval during ToB is for sure mandatory an even more so with IR so that goes without saying. I pug through content and am o10s clear so I don't have the luxury of a static where I can be more consistent and optimal with how I play.

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Originally Posted by Marxam

Did someone do the numbers on how the ratio of potency:HP scales? I'm not denying you are right that in theory Upheaval needs to be used on cd but with my experiences at least I seem to not really have an option either because I drop combos due to mechanics and/or I'm 2 gcds from a dual FC before a boss jumps. I usually find myself weighing in the fact that I can either use Upheaval or wait 2 gcds for a FC. Upheaval during ToB is for sure mandatory an even more so with IR so that goes without saying. I pug through content and am o10s clear so I don't have the luxury of a static where I can be more consistent and optimal with how I play.

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At the very lowest HP, Upheaval will still do 100 potency. That matches the potency of onslaught exactly, which if you look back earlier in the thread, people have pointed out the very fact that an oGCD of that power still has considerable value. So, even in the worst case scenario where you use Upheaval after holmganging a tank buster, it's still better than not using it at all. You may be thinking "but I can still use it if I wait a few seconds to get topped off," but that's not exactly accurate, because as I explained earlier, the whole point is to be able to use Upheaval inside your 10-second IR window.

Easily you can lose an entire cast if you want to realign upheaval with IR, or even worse, have Upheaval drift outside that window, and that's the biggest reason why you want to keep it on a tight watch and slam the button when you can.

Thanks so much for all the help so far!
Changed up my play style and I'm seeing good results!

The only issue I've had so far is when I hit 90 gauge and my next gcd is Storms Path, do I FC or Onslaught?

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Originally Posted by JackBlaine

Thanks so much for all the help so far!
Changed up my play style and I'm seeing good results!

The only issue I've had so far is when I hit 90 gauge and my next gcd is Storms Path, do I FC or Onslaught?

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If you won't need onslaught's gap closer for the next 15 seconds, you can onslaught or FC, makes no difference. Sometimes you notice specific phases end on certain GCDs so you can use either option so you end a phase either on a combo finisher, of FC.