Hi! So recently I've been going around hoping from job to job, trying to find the missing piece. I liked healing, so I started on AST, but it feels lacking. I find WHM weird, and I do not want to try it. So I wanted to know more about the Job, and what sets it apart from others. As well as it's uses in raid's and the like.
I hear that Noct. AST is better, but Ive also heard that the healer meta is SCH/AST. So I don't really want to understand what's the deal with that.
Also, I'd like to know how SCH plays in game.
I got to be honest, I have never even unlocked arcanist, Im actually about to start leveling it now. Thank you in advance answering.
What's Scholar like?
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04-28-2018, 08:29 AMKontaiWhat's Scholar like?
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04-28-2018, 09:19 AMMaltothoris
The short version is that the Sch can do better personal dps than the Noct Astro, it has free heals in the form of numerous ogcds and the fairy, the shields are only slightly weaker and Sch carries a reliable form of raid dps in the form of chain stratagem.
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04-28-2018, 10:55 AMKrojack
Personally I'm not enjoying it. I'm only at level 66 so far but healing dungeons seems like a huge struggle ever since around level 55. At 60 I got all the 260 gear and even level 60 dungeons it felt horrible. I'm comparing it to both AST and WHM which I already got up to 70. Both of those classes felt fine in dungeons. With SCH I'm non-stop spamming heals just to keep the tank stable. If I stop to do anything and get behind then I'm screwed. I HATE the whole Afterflow system.
Once I get it to 70 I'll never heal with it again. Not in it's current state anyways. -
04-28-2018, 11:33 AMKontaiCan you offer more information? I'd like to have a pretty thorough idea of the Job.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maltothoris
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04-28-2018, 04:10 PMEnla
I had something nice typed out but my brain decided to die on me at the half way mark. Ergo, here's a link to a comprehensive guide that explains the job in a fairly decent manner.
https://www.mooglemedia.com/sch-class-guide/ -
04-29-2018, 03:34 AMEaMettSCH is, imo, the most gear dependent healer. Like you, I also found that it was the hardest healer to level.Quote:
Originally Posted by Krojack
I think there are plenty of reasons for it but a lot of leveling content is downsynched in odd ways, your tanks often aren't geared properly, you're often undergeared yourself, you don't have your full skill set (excog and fey union are a huge relief with tank healing), it's often hard to anticipate damage in that content, etc. etc.
It really shines at cap however with a bit of gear. And is probably the most reliable healer in 8 man. I only ran a couple of expert roulettes (usually prefer running those with whm) but it was a breeze.
SCH is however not for you if you like to keep people topped off. That's just a huge mana drain/waste of aetherflow stacks. It's also not a good match if you would rather react to damage intake rather than anticipate it. -
04-29-2018, 03:49 AMEaMettIn general in raid settings SCH has the highest personal and raid dps of the three healers. It also has the lowest sustained HPS of the three but this usually isn't too much of an issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kontai
The reason for this is that most of their healing is ogcd so they spend less time actually casting healing spells. Due to this, they can maintain more dps uptime.
This comes with some caveats however. SHC ogcd skills are walled behind the aetherflow system so you're limited in how often you can use those skills (3 every 45-60s). This means that you need to have good knowledge of the fights and some coordination with your co-healer if you want to leverage your kit properly.
It's also made even harder from the fact that part of your dps kit also uses aetherflow stacks. So you need to know when you can use them for dps and when you should hold onto them.
The other part of your kit is shielding. Just like above you'll need to know the fights well enough to anticipate the damage and know when shielding is an advantage and when you simply shouldn't bother wasting a gcd.
The lower HPS for SCH usually isn't an issue because the healing checks aren't too bad. You will however find that when things go lopsided you have way less ability to reverse a bad situation than a powerhouse class like WHM. (ie: losing your co healer can be tricky)
In a dungeon setting however WHM is king. Their tool set is just a perfect match for that type of content. Regens are perfect for freeing you from having to heal the tank. Your aoe kit is ridiculous. Bosses require little healing so you can get a lot of dps uptime.
Bottom line is, sch has a pretty steep learning curve compared to the others but it's also very rewarding since you can essentially top the charts if you do well. -
04-29-2018, 04:54 AMRisvertasashiI first want to talk about this specific point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kontai
Noct AST is not competitive for a raid slot and never has been. If you doubt this, feel free to check FFlogs -- for any raid tier, not just current. If you're wondering more about the meta, SCH is basically the guaranteed slot (and has been for 3 years now, no sign of changing), while AST/WHM compete for the last slot depending on the current round of buffs/nerfs.
The explanation for this ties into what makes SCH so good. Basically, SCH has a lot of oGCD healing, allowing it to respond fast and without upsetting the cadence of DPS. Then there is the fairy, which provides external, free healing. Free in two senses: It takes neither a GCD away from SCH, and obviously costs no MP. As an example, one of the savage raid bosses, Guardian, will target a DPS player for a burn and/or bleed type DoT attack with ticks that are very strong. SCH can simply have the fairy use Fey Union (perhaps on top of Whispering Dawn as well), and that mechanic is handled. The SCH (and his/her cohealer) can then DPS, or heal the tanks, or whatever else as needed.
In comparison, Noct AST would have to use GCDs and spend MP to accomplish the same thing. The whole duration of the DoT, and possibly some extra healing to top up after if it's immediately followed by a raidbuster. A considerable amount of MP for a single target shield at that. (SCH's shield is even more expensive, but SCH has the advantage of having more tools to work around it).
Anyways if you're looking for a really 'different' healer, Scholar is definitely the way to go. -
04-29-2018, 06:37 AMEnlaThis. I used to /hate/ SCH as well when I looked at it from the viewpoint of a WHM main and frankly couldn't understand any of the appeal my friends were raving about. It wasn't until I learned to mitigate damage and anticipate it before it even happened that I started to enjoy the class. Between Rouse + Whispering Dawn, Crit Adlo, Excogitation at higher levels, and macros you really have all you need in dungeon content to be effective. Even to the point that I'm mostly DPSing during content with only a few moments needed to top off the tank before I go on my merry way. It's only in very rare circumstances that I find my aetherflow stacks being chewed through like candy, and it's often due to people repeatedly standing in the bad rather than any outright issue with the class.Quote:
Originally Posted by EaMett
More than anything else, what I recommend newbie SCH's learn is not just the class itself but also the content they're running. SCH shines the most when you know what cast is coming next and can nullify it's affect before it even has the chance to hit. There's really nothing quite like placing a Crit Adlo and Excogitation on a tank before a boss does a tank buster mechanic, only to see them healed almost back to full by the end of it. It makes me giddy every time it happens. If waiting for the damage to happen before healing it is more your style however, SCH will seem PAINFUL by comparison because it lacks the ability to actually react beyond a few minimal and limited casts. -
04-29-2018, 08:02 PMEloahSounds like you're doing something wrong. The Aetherflow system is ver integral to their gameplay, but compared to the other systems, its one of the better implimented. Also question, if you just want the class/job at 70 why not just play SMN.Quote:
Originally Posted by Krojack
I can't say I agree with that. SCH is no more dependant than the other two. When SB launched and it was discovered SCH was the healer that got shafted, while WHM and AST got buffs, I was furious, but I persisted with my main job, right up until the end. And while there was a bit of a curve at first, I had no problem healing everything right up to Ala Mhigo. And I was in upgraded Shire gear right up until I got the relic gear. Now if you aren't familiar with how the job plays than yes you might struggle, but if you know the intricacies, it's a breeze.Quote:
Originally Posted by EaMett
Placeholder for some text -
04-30-2018, 03:51 AMEaMettWell, based off of the simple fact that sch has the least amount of sustained hps it is by default the most gear dependent. It's hard to maintain the contrary when comparing sch to a whm who'm I'm pretty confident could solo heal most of the current content in 270 gear (provided a decent static).Quote:
Originally Posted by Eloah
This was readily evident when SB hit and tanks were pulling 60+ dungeons like they were running Baelsar's wall in 270s. Sometimes you couldn't even keep up with the HPS output required from some large pulls in places like Bardam's meddle (on SCH). This was way less of an issue on the other healers.
That isn't to say that you can't fill the gap with skill, but we are talking about leveling here afterall. -
04-30-2018, 10:57 AMEloahBut you said it yourself, they havr less HPS because a majority of their heals are oGCD; including Lily, whose heals don't count towards your total.Quote:
Originally Posted by EaMett
But I think I see where the confusion is, since you stated "when SB launched", you're confusing going in blind with going in ilprepared. When SB launched, everything was brand new; including the abiliy shuffle, but that only affected job play "slightly". Anyway, the the entirety of SB was uncharted for everyone, there was no guage of mob strength, desired/standard pull length, boss mechanics, etc. Just like with everything else in the game, once you have a base understanding of your surroundings, it's all standard fair. The best example of this is The Vault. When it first came out, there was rampent death, now not really... Though ironically, I had no issue when it first came out either in full Ironworks gear, better then my WHM and AST friends, hmm, maybe it is me, lol -
04-30-2018, 02:23 PMYeol
I won't get into deep details but here is what I think you should know:
SCH is a shield type healer. So you should focus more on preventing damage rather than healing damage.
Their healing potency is lower than the other two healers, but it shouldn't be a big deal if you're mitigating damage correctly, big raw heals will not be needed. Crit shields means the enemy will deal almost no damage (Party member will receive 0 damage).
Your fairy easily makes up for the low potency. Eos can increase healing potency by 10%, give regen to the party, and by sending your fairy away you increase your own healing potency by 20%. -
04-30-2018, 10:58 PMGhishlain
SCH is a resource based pet and mitigation healer. I would argue it has a fairly low skill floor because of the auto healing fairy and high burst healing potential but also a high skill ceiling due to the resource heavy nature of the job itself which requires you to know a fight intimately to plan out the usages of those resources.
Unlike WHM or AST which make more frequent usage of their MP for their healing, SCH relies heavily on their cooldowns to mend wounds or blunt incoming damage.
At it's core, the Fairy is a constant 166 potency heal every three seconds on whomever you want and is both MP free and GCD free from the master which is better than most HoTs in the game. Eos; the healing fairy also has access to an AoE HoT, a AoE magic defense buff, and a AoE healing potency received buff (all on a cooldowns)
The other core element to the SCH kit is their Aetherflow, which gives them back both MP and three resources to use for a myriad of healing abilities including a single target heal, an AoE heal on a 30s CD, and a "smart heal" that heals the target when their HP falls below 50% HP on 45s CD. There's also a mitigation ground AoE you can use but generally it's better to use the raw heals as they tend to give more potency/Aetherflow.
SCH also has access to a crit buff that helps improve every party member's DPS on that particular target and Deployment Tactics - an ability that allows them to spread their shield to everyone around the target. When used with Adlo, it provides the best AoE HP shield out of all the healers and is even more potent if you happen to RNG into a Crit-Adlo.
In general, Noct AST has better raw shields but SCHs kit is more than just shields, having strong healing cooldowns, a consistent DPS buff, and a consistent "HoT" in the form of a fairy.
The DPS buffs is what makes "SCH/AST" meta as well, since stacked support buffs out the ying yang leads to incredible gains across the board. Also once players become severely overgeared, the healing requirements start to become trivialized thus negating the need to run the more progression meta of SCH/WHM. -
04-30-2018, 11:41 PMEloah
Since it was mentioned, I'll elaborate on the best use for Sacred Soil, the AoE defensive dome shield. As mentioned prior, usually the direct heals are best, but if the entire party is going to receive AoE damage in rapid succession, or the Boss is going to unleash a massive AoE attack, then Sacred Soil is good to use. Not sure how far you are on certain things, but stacking mechanics where you'll be hit with multiple burst attacks, Boss LBs, or having the entire party fight in close proximity, is generally when you'd use it. Flights like Nidhogg, A12/S, The Griffin, and I'm sure there are more. But you'll learn where and when it'll br good to use the more you get a feel fir the job.
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05-02-2018, 05:18 AMRubissOn the Fey Union bit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Risvertasashi
This is actually false. If you give someone with the burn a Fey Union, they will die if they receive no other healing. -
05-02-2018, 02:25 PMYeolI can assure you that with BiS, I did not die. Maybe gear (from both sides) affect it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubiss
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05-05-2018, 09:54 PMCYBEReris
YMMV but the job didn't really click for me before unlocking Lustrate and learning to be more proactive in placing and managing the fairy.
One of the major strengths of SCH is that they are very good at "triaging" in tense situations because they have an auxiliary healer capable of erasing chip damage, low-cooldown oGCDs gated by Aetherflow management, and single-target and AoE shields that can protect against incoming damage, potentially buying time.
Whether calmly planning out the means to save your party from certain death in a crisis or preventing so much damage even major mistakes don't lead to a crisis in the first place, I find it a highly satisfying gameplay fantasy. -
05-06-2018, 05:33 AMSebazy
My 2 cents:
In terms of casual play and content, SCH is a little more straight forward and easier to play to a basic standard than AST. The pet does a reasonable job on autopilot and can merrily carry a group through lower level dungeons and such. Played to a higher standard in casual content it's a little more self sufficient than AST as well, whilst it's not quite the dungeon powerhouse it was throughout HW, it's dungeon dps is still very solid with great efficiency and sustainability to help push along any sub par groups you might end up in. By contrast, AST is largely at the mercy of it's group.
As far as raids and high end play goes, in my eyes the main thing that's always separated SCH from it's peers is it's ability to gain GCDs by way of offloading as much work as possible onto the fairy (thus why I've always been a firm advocate for Eos frequently being a DPS gain right the way from 2.0 when Selene's misleading spell/skill speed buffs were overvalued). Simply put, a well played SCH can contribute both very significant HPS and DPS simultaneously better than it's rivals especially with Eos out. By contrast, a NoctAST is pretty much flipping a switch between DPSing or healing with very little in-between.
There was a weird patch at the start of 4.0 where Noct AST was arguably the safer progression healer for Deltascape Savage but that simply isn't the case as of the SCH fixes that arrived shortly after.
Since I'm no stranger to somewhat controversial opinions on healers, I'd also go as far as saying that with the right comp, Chain is actually as good as if not better than AST's cards in terms of your overall raid DPS. Whilst it's not as good a buff on paper as Balance, the fact that it just aligns with the big raid burst makes all the difference. -
05-06-2018, 10:20 AMEaMettIt's lower than ASTbuffs. I don't have in depth knowledge on the topic but I've often noticed that CS is an added 350-600 rdps whereas AST cards do anything between 500-1kish(on great rng) extra rdps. With that said SCH personal dps makes up for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebazy