Should something be done about TP?

Since Stormblood, TP has been pretty much useful only in dungeons and the rare aoe situations in raids with nothing else to gain from it during single target situations. Back then, TP was almost always running out if you're doing your rotation right and have high Sks, and regeneration was needed. Now, even MCHs/BRDs bring Tactician for nothing but enmity controls during raids and aoe situations during dungeons.

I really like what they did with TP in PVP; use the TP you have to be able to spam skills, and good use of TP rewards the player with stronger attacks than TP-conservative play. It's a style SAM uses in the form of Kenki gauge, you use your gauge to spam Hissatsu skills for both your highest hitting attacks and plain movement utility.

Maybe TP could use a similar treatment? Most classes almost never run out of TP no matter what goes in boss fight. Even when you're hitting enrage in a raid, you'd be lucky to see it less than 800/1000. Maybe I'm asking for unnecessary complications added to the rotation (let's face it, rotations are already brain dead as things stand), but I feel there's so much wasted potential. RDM and SMN can use their gauge (MP) for utility (Raise, Manashift) and those are helpful across all content. TP exists for...aoe?

I would very much enjoy if TP had more uses with casters and MP more with physical, but at the moment for many jobs they are barely or never used at all. Not sure about PvP but these are stats that definitely could have some potential rather than be wasted, maybe you can use TP to restores an allies MP and vis versa, or use it to knock a few seconds off a single cross-role action etc. I know there would be a ton of balancing things to consider but it would be nice to get some or more use out of MP/TP.

I guess TP is fine the way it is?
Just like MP it can limit the AoE output a TP job can do. It's something you'll never worry too much in a raid unless you die, just like Magic DPS's MP, making both an extra variable over death's many penalties. Besides that each TP job has their own way built in their single target rotation to avoid over consumption of TP.

This scenario is much different from the past, coming a long way from ARR. The way it is right now is good, but I can see it being removed in the future while the game evolves. But if it doesn't, shouldn't be bad.

Depends on what your doing, example as a tank in Eureka if doing NM smash fest you need to have TP support at times, isotherm it's rare to have TP unless you don't know how to manage it properly would just need to try and experiment best you can.

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Originally Posted by zuzu-bq

I guess TP is fine the way it is?
Just like MP it can limit the AoE output a TP job can do. It's something you'll never worry too much in a raid unless you die, just like Magic DPS's MP, making both an extra variable over death's many penalties. Besides that each TP job has their own way built in their single target rotation to avoid over consumption of TP.

This scenario is much different from the past, coming a long way from ARR. The way it is right now is good, but I can see it being removed in the future while the game evolves. But if it doesn't, shouldn't be bad.

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That's not true at all. Pretty much all non-casters will run out of TP and be unable to use any GCDs because their AOE gcds all have TP costs more than 200% of what their single target GCDs have. They go dry and they go dry relatively quickly.


The casters don't have that problem. Red Mage's Scatter is identical in cost to the single target skills Ver-Aero/Thunder which you're casting incredibly frequently with good RNG and the rest of it's AOE kit may as well be free (it costs TP but you use it so infrequently that you'll always regen back to full long before you need to Moulinet again). Black Mage literally never runs out of MP because of the way Umbral Ice works, so while it does have higher costs, it never runs into a situation where it can't cast unless the player does something wrong. Summoner's AOE is largely tied into it's oGCDs and aetherflow actions, so for absolutely no MP cost it can place dots with Tri-Disaster, spread them with bane, and then painflare twice to earn reduced costs on Tri-Bind and an AOE nuke. It's the closest to having a resource problem in AOE but it's still significantly better than the melee, ranged, and not-paladin tanks in that regard.

What Burd said. Only casters that really run out of MP for AOEs are healers. Casters never have to deal with that problem. Also, a punishment for death isn't TP, it's, you know, death. You die and you get weakness, lose your gauge, uptime. Also, once you use Invigorate and never die again, you'll never worry about TP. Changing TP to what it is in SB was needed because it was simply unfun to run out of TP because you've been playing well, but now it's on the other side of the problem; it doesn't feel like it even exists unless you die or AOE. Even when it comes to AOEs, melee resources are far inferior to melee, and objectively worse than casters, who have almost infinite resources.

On the question on what TP does in PVP: It acts as a resource and replaces the CD for skills like Quick Reload and Jump so it'd be used more often at the cost of TP. Exactly how Shinten works right now, for example.

But you shouldn't be going Out of TP unless the party is doing really bad damage and you don't have someone to throw Tactician or Goad.

TP cooldowns are there to help recover from death or AoE, and those are good enough reasons to have them in Raid. I'll pop Tactician when my melee dps are ressed and have been topped off accordingly, or to solve my opener aggro issues on BRD if I get a lucky string of crit and procs.

The real issue is there isn't a single TP based class that wants a lot of skill speed to boost its single target dps, so you rarely feel the need to have it. If we had a class based around, say, Empyreal Arrow style oGCDs, then maybe we'd feel the need to stack it. Even then, a class like that would want built in TP recovery in its kit and an actual skill speed buff rather than the haste buff we get now.

Would be smarter design if each job had their unique ways of recovering MP/TP instead of having thrown it all on role actions. But oh well... We're leading there though, most jobs do have unique extra ways to spend less or recover these resources. It really feels like SE want us to have the Role actions for enmity and deaths rather than our main source of MP/TP regen.

The way it works on PvP wouldn't really work on PvE though, since there its a resource for you to spend as you wish and short well planned bursts are better than consistent damage.

On the topic of Skillspeed (and Spellspeed too): the game just doesn't properly reward you for stacking lots of it. At least you don't casually starve for TP anymore if you want to be speedy as long there is a BRD/MCH around.

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Originally Posted by zuzu-bq

But you shouldn't be going Out of TP unless the party is doing really bad damage and you don't have someone to throw Tactician or Goad.

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But that isn't an issue that casters have to deal with literally ever, and it occurs semi frequently in dungeon situations.

Oh wow, maybe because they fit different roles in a party? No way.

SMN can actually have MP fatigue if things actually die too damn slow.

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Originally Posted by SpeckledBurd

But that isn't an issue that casters have to deal with literally ever, and it occurs semi frequently in dungeon situations.

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Actually, as a SMN I can very easily run low on MP in long fights.