Problems with The Fashion Report: Why it promotes Greed and Player Toxicity

The Fashion Report is an interesting piece of content. You're loosely given the ideas of certain pieces of equipment you need to fit into a slot and are encouraged to seek out information from other players on which pieces best suit the role, as the objective is the same for everyone. But therein lies the problem; it's the same for everyone.

By making the Fashion Report objective the same for each player it means that every player needs to look into getting the same items for each slot should they wish to receive a high score, and not all items can be gained through tomes and easy crafting. Much if it falls to high level crafts, and if you don't have the means to craft it you're left at the mercy of the Market Board which has become a horrific monstrocity due to this. Shirts that were once 5k are now 80k. Skirts that were once 20k are now 480k. Prices inflate rapidly due to greedy players looking to drain money from those who wish to partake in this piece of content, and not everyone is sitting on millions of gil that they can just throw at this and that.

The lack of information the content itself provides leads to players spreading information that only the super expensive clothing they're selling will result in a high score, rather than the fact that there are several options that will give you similar or at least close to similar results.

Another keyword the content used is "sharing", which is ironic as attempting to use a piece of clothing for the event will bind it to you, thus preventing you from sharing it with friends or other players who are looking to complete the weekly 80 point challenge as well. This is likely what attributes the most to prices skyrocketing on items as players are fully prevented from sharing or reselling their pieces, instead leaving them with an inventory clogged of expensive, bound, gaudy pieces of clothing.

There are a multitude of solutions that could fix this piece of content. Providing players with the items they need or giving better hints to where they can acquire the best pieces would work well, though I think the best quick solution would also be the most simple to implement: remove the Item Binding from The Fashion Report. By removing the Item Binding players would be able, if not entirely encouraged, to share or resell the gear they acquired for the weekly event. This would keep item prices lower, but keep the market moving as demand for new items would arise every week. Players could also share their gear this way, allowing an overall increase in positive player interactions.

Oh, and please add an Armoire next to the Masked Rose. It would be incredibly helpful for everyone and make me a very happy lizard.

The system has been designed with the intention of having the market/crafters speculate. When this contest ends on Tuesday we'll get the next theme, then the contest proper won't start until Friday. 3 days will be spent speculating wildly on what the items are going to be for the next contest before anyone knows what gives gold coins. It's going to cause tonnes of interesting activity.

There isn't any toxicity, just soreness at things costing a bunch. I don't see how buying and selling on the market place can be considered toxic. Square have made that 3 day gap because they intentionally want massive amounts of speculation to occur in between each contest.

This is good for the market. It's interesting, it changes demand for various items on a weekly basis, it stops it from being stagnant to-and-fro of gear for new raids vs new cosmetics vs old difficult to find cosmetics.

Now it's going to have weekly supply and demand for the HOT NEW THING IN FASHION.

GET THE EORZEAN LOOK

As much as it sucks to be unable to get the best of best items right now, keep in mind there's more than one good shirt for the theme right now (I'm assuming that's what everyone is bothered about) and we don't know if there may be even more that are good. While it won't be a game friendly to those with low gil, there's a good side to this - we never know what's going to be in demand next week, and it's highly possible that you could use the weeks in between to collect pieces of glamour when it's cheaper.

How is that toxic ?

I mean, it's only a minigame. There's no need to spend millions of gils for it.
And even so, people sell things that seems valuable because they want to earn more for their own purpose. What's wrong with that?

This isn't because you have no money that people suddenly become toxic and greedy...

It is a bit unfortunate that a minigame (for MGP no less) has such an impact on the economy. Was under the impression that most folks ran out of things to buy at GS ages ago.

Maybe once the novelty wears off, things will stabilize again.

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Originally Posted by Hasrat

It is a bit unfortunate that a minigame (for MGP no less) has such an impact on the economy. Was under the impression that most folks ran out of things to buy at GS ages ago.

Maybe once the novelty wears off, things will stabilize again.

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Really only if you are dedicated to doing the challenge log. For casual Saucer visitors like me, there's a lot of stuff to get. I'm still needing to get the Archon Throne and Fenrir and I just got the flying pea monster (which is the only mount that actually exists in the game)

Probably after the novelty wears off, yeah, things will go back to normal. I know when they revamped chocobo races a bit feed spiked up a little bit in price and now it's worthless again.

This has been excellent for the Balmung markets. Pretty sure myself and my friend paid for a small house selling long skirts.

This is actually one of the better ideas they've had in awhile. Stagnation is the bane of every mmo, and something like this that has the potential to shake up the market and keep it fresh is very welcome.

Otherwise yes it is very boring. At the start of every patch you have the usual big ticket items being DoW/DoH crafteds and the new designated expensive glamours (sweater and the robe now), you know the deal, and everything else is pretty ho hum and formulaic until the next patch.

It got lots of people to run old content like the Vault this week too, which is always good since it makes otherwise deprecated content feel relevant for a short time.

They should get rid of the four-a-week attempt limit, so players aren't afraid to discover alternate options (assuming there are any). That way it would increase demand for more than just a select few items a week.

Think its designed with public forums in mind. People share info so quickly anyway.

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Originally Posted by Myon88

It got lots of people to run old content like the Vault this week too, which is always good since it makes otherwise deprecated content feel relevant for a short time.

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Yeah, there's no way I'm running Vault over and over hoping to win the lot on accessories against others trying to do the same for the same purpose. I'll just solo Dusk Vigil unsynced and keep the gear all to myself.

You can solo the Vault undersized fairly easily on certain jobs, wasn't referring to running them as a group. But yes, Dusk Vigil turned out to be a slightly easier option as well.

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Originally Posted by KDSilver

... This isn't because you have no money that people suddenly become toxic and greedy...

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Throughout history scarcity of resources has pretty much always been the root cause of 'toxic' behaviour, greed and ultimately conflict; minigames in MMOs are not immune to this.


As for the Fashion Report, at worst it's by far the easiest 10K MGP you can get per week, so it's a bit hard to complain... well, unless you actually try to put some effort in. The main problem I see is that there seems to be no reward for anything less than 'the best', i.e. 80%+

As an example; my partner put in about 2 hours and ~100K gil trying to make an outfit, but only managed a best score of around 70% (that somehow kept getting lower on later retries despite getting more gold medals ???) ... meanwhile I simply walked up in my regular dungeon duds, scored about 50% (and a rather amusing comment), and netted the same prize of 10K MGP with no effort or expense at all...

It's not hard to see that this is just plain wrong in terms of 'effort vs. reward', and that there needs to be intermediate prizes for those who put in some effort yet only manage a score of between about 60% and 79% (even if that means a lower 'participation' prize to even out the 'average' reward payout).

Example reward structure:
Less than 60% only rewards 2K MGP (the 'participation' prize).
60%+ rewards another 8K MGP (total of 10K).
70%+ rewards another 10K MGP (total of 20K).
75%+ rewards another 10K MGP (total of 30K).
80%+ rewards another 20K MGP (total of 50K).

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Originally Posted by Acidblood

As an example; my partner put in about 2 hours and ~100K gil trying to make an outfit, but only managed a best score of around 70% (that somehow kept getting lower on later retries despite getting more gold medals ???)

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As another example, I put in no more than 15 minutes of effort and 20k gil in mats and netted a winning score, so I'm not sure what point this is supposed to make. Not to be indelicate, but is it possible your S.O. just did it wrong? From your description (more medals but lower score) it sounds like they left the non-hinted slots empty on their subsequent attempts, which will absolutely tank your score and make it impossible to win.

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Originally Posted by Acidblood

The main problem I see is that there seems to be no reward for anything less than 'the best', i.e. 80%+

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Sure there is... the easy 10k participation award you already mentioned. "The best" would be a 100% score, 80% is already pretty darn forgiving, I mean it's just barely a B- in most schools. The reward is the highest one you can get in one go short of the cactpots and imho it shouldn't be that easy to obtain; the event gives a participation award already, and a pretty nice one at that. I really don't think the whole thing needs dumbing down or that there should be a nerf to the overall payout for the winners (80% gives a total of 60k right now, 10 for participation and 50 for winning.)

The only adjustment I would make would be to ensure that gold medal items are available to lower level players (looking at you, last week's rings!)

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Originally Posted by Rymm

The only adjustment I would make would be to ensure that gold medal items are available to lower level players (looking at you, last week's rings!)

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This and the gender issues (dem shoes last week) are the only problems I have with the mini game. Yes it stinks is eliminates poorer players if they rely on the MB as well....overall though they have room to refine it if need be. I certainly hope they do. I didn't have the right top (hannish was too expensive, falconers got sold out), skirt (longskirt sold out) and didnt feel like farming a ring last week and managed a 72, which, isn't bad but....given two of these slots were crafted (though I think the long skirt had a dungeon drop equivalent) it stunk a bit. But that's alright, easy 10k?? >.>

My problem with Fashion Report is similar, but differs to some extent: it relies entirely on who has the most gil to spend on crafted attire, when it should be based of flat scores based on what gear you used to glamour. It's basically inaccessible for the poor and/or people on servers with seller markets only.

It seems less interesting than I expected. Like there's only one correct answer and a lot of things that seem like they should work don't. After a few weeks we'll know every category and the correct item to use for it.

The most irritating thing about this is that to get the perfect score you need mogstation dyes.

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Originally Posted by Xiomara

The most irritating thing about this is that to get the perfect score you need mogstation dyes.

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no, you do not.

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Originally Posted by Xiomara

The most irritating thing about this is that to get the perfect score you need mogstation dyes.

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False. Experiment and not take first bits of information as the only answer.
Snow white dye was just as successful as the ''mog station'' pure white dye last week (BTW you can buy it in game as it comes from retainer ventures - quick)

This week the 'expensive' item (New world hose) can be made for practically free because you can buy the rare item in the craft for 500 yellow crafter scripts.
This is a networking game.
Some weeks you wont be as prepared as others depending on what kind of player you are, sure. But its just MGP. You still get access to the new furnishing just for participating!

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Originally Posted by Xiomara

The most irritating thing about this is that to get the perfect score you need mogstation dyes.

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All mogstation dyes are available in the game - from retainer quick ventures. Can be sold on the market board aswell, so aslong as someone puts them up, you can spend gil on them instead of real money. Or just hope for your retainer to bring them back. Or look for a dye that works just aswell.
I'm not sure if there is a replacement for the "Dark green" but there seems to be alternatives for the gold, so...

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Originally Posted by Acidblood

my partner put in about 2 hours and 100K gil but only managed 70%. I walked up in my regular dungeon duds and netted the same prize with no effort or expense.. It's not hard to see that this is just plain wrong in terms of 'effort vs. reward'

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That was me this week (attempts 76, 76, 78, 78). Changed some gear and dyes but saw little/no improvement. Scoring below 80pt threshold is same reward as doing nothing. I actually did preparation with a combination of farm/buying materials to craft gear and multi Shiva runs for weapon/bracelet.

Not sure why it has a cap on number of weekly attempts since the participation reward and best reward can only be earned once each no matter how many tries. If it was uncapped then we could spend more time trying all kinds of clothing and dye colors instead of waiting for news from other people.. potentially finding alternate top-score pieces if more than one correct answer exists.

The only issue I have with the Fashion Report is the fact that there is only one definable way to get a perfect score, and in doing so, the reward is Job/Class Locked. Last week it required having a 60 FSH, this week it requires a 64 SAM.

In doing so, this makes the creativity of the entire minigame void. There's ONE recipe for success, meaning it causes the marketboard to inflate on specific items only once Friday rolls around and someone inevitably figures out the winning combination of dyes and items and posts it online. I feel SE should have more variety here - have multiple ways to get a perfect score. I know you can't be fully about player creativity, but honestly shoving the ability to get a perfect score behind a single job is silly. Like, last week could have easily been "Have any gatherer at 60." And this week could be "Have a melee DPS at 64". Widen the scope a little bit - don't force people to try and speed level jobs if they're behind just to possibly try and win a title.

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Originally Posted by ColorOfSakura

The only issue I have with the Fashion Report is the fact that there is only one definable way to get a perfect score, and in doing so, the reward is Job/Class Locked. Last week it required having a 60 FSH, this week it requires a 64 SAM.

In doing so, this makes the creativity of the entire minigame void. There's ONE recipe for success, meaning it causes the marketboard to inflate on specific items only once Friday rolls around and someone inevitably figures out the winning combination of dyes and items and posts it online. I feel SE should have more variety here - have multiple ways to get a perfect score. I know you can't be fully about player creativity, but honestly shoving the ability to get a perfect score behind a single job is silly. Like, last week could have easily been "Have any gatherer at 60." And this week could be "Have a melee DPS at 64". Widen the scope a little bit - don't force people to try and speed level jobs if they're behind just to possibly try and win a title.

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Especially when the restrictions make no sense. Why would one shiva's diamond weapon get gold while the others only get 2-3 stars? Even something as obscure as 'pirate in the sky' being Leofard's pants in dyeable form makes sense, even if it's lame (I don't like how subjective clues are when there are other items that match so clearly). If they want it to be one specific weapon, put that in the clue. And the dyes need to be clued, as well!

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Originally Posted by InkstainedGwyn

Especially when the restrictions make no sense. Why would one shiva's diamond weapon get gold while the others only get 2-3 stars? Even something as obscure as 'pirate in the sky' being Leofard's pants in dyeable form makes sense, even if it's lame (I don't like how subjective clues are when there are other items that match so clearly). If they want it to be one specific weapon, put that in the clue. And the dyes need to be clued, as well!

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That's part of my issue as well - the fact that the weapon is a SPECIFIC WEAPON is ridiculous, especially when there's literally zero hint at what weapon it would need to be. Also yeah, the whole oblique "Pirates in the Sky" thing is a bit obnoxious when most people very clearly thought "Oh, it'll be the pants literally named *Sky Pirate's*."

The fact that you are required to have a specific job leveled to 64 at minimum this week is just ridiculous. Lest we ignore the fact that the one of the items the first week was still going for upwards of 15,000,000 on most servers, and the mats were hiked up to the point you couldn't make it for yourself without it being a loss, or that you are required to have items dyed Pure White or Jet black—it's like they don't bother to look at server markets before making stupid choices like this. Furthermore, the theme should not be beholden to an individual job ever. I don't think the person in charge of the themes is even remotely using their brain to its full capacity; I mean that in the most offensive way possible, and simply thinks that the lackluster hints and arbitrary requirements are fun...when they're, at best, immeasurably stupid.

Fashion Report is nice conceptually, I think if done properly they could have something that would actually be fun and enjoyable to participate in, but like all Gold Saucer activities have been upon their introduction; save for maybe Chocobo racing, it is highly flawed and needs a bit of an rework and —gasp, dare I say it— multiple options rather than just a single correct item per bloody slot.

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Originally Posted by Aniya_Estlihn

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Why do you need 100 points? You only get a title and achievement for hitting 100 points.

If Achievements and Titles are so important to you, why aren't all your jobs level 70 already to get all those titles and achievements that you're missing?

People have gotten an 80+ score on basically every job right now and that's the only thing that's important for MGP. And if you only care about the shop, you just need a score of 1+ to unlock new items since people who don't care about this still have the coat hangers unlocked.

If you really want a 100 score Achievement and Title, just wait for a week that's better suited to you. This week the dyes are very expensive, but last week they weren't that bad.

Use Fashion Report to make good money and then when it's a week that's suited for you, put in some effort and try to get 100 points.

The only thing interesting about this is the tilte (Fashion Leader) and the animatios plus extra MGP. I was expecting more. Like unic glamours receive a reward. So if not on 24 hous a person makes exactly the same glamour as you you will receive a reward, also should be a way to not see the glamour that a people chose to avoid copies, something like a dressing rooms. A post with your char on the back like a model if it got high raitings.

I do wish the hints were better or the accepted responses would be wider (all shiva/ice stuff should have counted for the weapon for a full score..)
And the dyes are annoying, but it does seem you get points for having the wrong dye (example: if the 3-point dye is Jet Black, any other Black dye will yield 2 points. dying with any other dye yields 1 point) so dying them with cheap dyes is still worth it to get closer to 80.

But that being said, I didn't spend much getting to 80 this week on my Scholar. I spent a lot of time and money last week getting my fisher from 41 to 60 and doing all the class quests so I could buy my lucis, and then the other stuff, but that was a 1-time thing to get the achievement.

From now on it's smooth sailing to 80, so I just had to run shiva for the bracelet, used Eikonic for my weapon, cheap highland boots for my feet, cheap dyes all around that were in the same color category. Bam, 84 for about 90k gil. 50k MGP for 90k gil ain't too bad.

I don't understand the madness for the 100 score every week. I suppose it gives people something to do, so I don't see anything toxic about it.

I aim to get 100 once for the achievement, but so far I've been satisfied getting 80+. I even managed to get 86 on an alt, and her crafts are all <50 atm. Didn't even spend any gil--just did a bit of research and used ordinary dyes (deepwood green and dalamud red).

As for the greed... Again, it's a madness I don't understand; however, I did make a bit of gil by making spring skirts from dress material that was gathering dust on a retainer. If it hadn't suddenly been in demand, I can guarantee it would still be sitting on my retainer.

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Originally Posted by Fyxation

I don't understand the madness for the 100 score every week. I suppose it gives people something to do, so I don't see anything toxic about it.

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Some people simply cannot be 'second-best', they have to be top of the ladder always - it's an ego thing I guess. Me, I'm happy being mundane, boring and ignored and can't be bothered trying to be top cat when I know I am a mere stray. ;)

Seriously, the only reason I've done the Fashion Report was to unlock the new furnishings in Kasumi's store, which I've now done (and do not require any particular score, you just have had to do the Fashion Report twice). So, I'm probably not going to do this again, at least, not how it is currently set up anyway, as it has too many problems to me to be worth the effort (MGP I get through the mincactpot anyway and I don't care about the achievement).

Personally I think it should be changed that instead of the same style for the week being consistent for all players and across all servers, each player should be given their own individual style, that is completely random which is not shared by anyone else (which would cause some... interesting combinations.. but that's half the fun ;)) and thus would mean there would be no flow on effect to the Market Board with prices suddenly skyrocketing on some random item that has happened to be regarded as suitable for the style for this week.

Besides, Redolent Masked Rose's taste in 'fashion' clearly leaves much to be desired - when he told me I had "defecated" over my style I wanted to slap him and shouted "You wouldn't know fashion if it hit you in the rear!"

So I am done with it, I don't want my taste in couture dictated by the fickle whims of some dandy from the WVR's Guild. ;)

I think a big reason for people trying to get 100 every week is because we just don't know how the rewards system works. Do we just need 80+ every week to get the "Spring" gear, or do we need so many 100 scores under our belt?

People have hypothesised that a participation score was all that was required to unlock last week's boutique items, rather than a weekly participation. In that case the higher the scores you get, the quicker you can unlock the boutique's new gear. It all depends on how much you 'need' the glamour.

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Originally Posted by kuma_aus

Why do you need 100 points? You only get a title and achievement for hitting 100 points.

If Achievements and Titles are so important to you, why aren't all your jobs level 70 already to get all those titles and achievements that you're missing?

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Because I don't want *every* title in the game. I desire specific ones and given that the one given by the Fashion Report is "Fashion Leader" - I'd enjoy having that title. That's all.

Also - the fact is that making the Fashion Report limited on how to get a perfect score makes it so that players will quickly get tired or burnt out of trying if they keep being locked out every week.

Totally out of the loop, haven't been playing much since 4.2, wtf is a fashion report?

The Fashion Report is the new minigame at the Gold Saucer, based on glamour. You're basically trying to match your gear/glamour to a desired style given by the npc, the judging for which is opened over a weekend (between Friday to Sunday). Doing it once a week nets you a flat reward of 10000 MGP, but if you get a perfect score you get bonus MGP (and an achievement as well). There is also a vendor there whose stock is added to gradually by undertaking the minigame - at the moment it's some new furnishings (a High Houses' bustle dress on a dressmaker's mannequin, a large hat stand with a man's Ishgardian coat and hat, and a cosmetics set), but apparently some new glamour gear is also part of it, but that has not yet unlocked.

And the npc for the event is none of than the Guildmaster of the WVR's Guild employing a very flimsy disguise. ;)

This page gives more information about the Fashion Report.

I could see how some players may have an issue with obtaining the gear to fulfill the glam report. Honestly I don't craft much so if there was something specific I needed then I'd either have to go to the MB or gather the materials for someone to make them for me, eitherway it would cost Gil or time to get it all done. In some ways I find it a little annoying that someone who could craft or did already have the mats would be a step ahead, but again it's a completely optional minigame so it's not like I have to do it to have any worth.

It seems fine though as it is, probably a good incentive to work on my crafters more and dig them maps for mats!

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Originally Posted by ColorOfSakura

Because I don't want *every* title in the game. I desire specific ones and given that the one given by the Fashion Report is "Fashion Leader" - I'd enjoy having that title. That's all.

Also - the fact is that making the Fashion Report limited on how to get a perfect score makes it so that players will quickly get tired or burnt out of trying if they keep being locked out every week.

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If it's an achievement and title that you really want, then you should put in extra effort to unlock it just like you would with any other hard achievement and title that you really want.

I got my first Lucis tool last week for Fashion Report to get 100, this week I'm aiming for 100 as well since I enjoy it and since Fashion Report encourages me to do stuff I would normally put off. So right now I'm leveling my Samurai to 64 from 61 at 1% into the level from before I realised that I needed a 64 SAM for it. Right now I'm 63 with it.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Doing it once a week nets you a flat reward of 10000 MGP, but if you get a perfect score you get bonus MGP (and an achievement as well).

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Minor correction. You only need 80 points to get the bonus MGP. Achievement and title are all you get at 100. If all you want is a quick 10k you can talk to the judge once over the weekend in your normal gear, get a low score and participation reward, and move on.