Rough Draft For a New Monk Opener

So a lot of people are underestimating the fact the RoW gives a GL stack. This on top of the Perfect Balance changes have resulted in monks having the ability to execute tornado kicks with relative frequency. If used properly, you would only lose your GL stacks for a short time (1GCD without any GL and 2 GCDs at GL2) It's a tradeoff of somewhere between 70 and 100 potency to allow a high potency off-global to be executed at GL3 (note that because of GL3 buff, Tornado Kick's TRUE potency is 429).

Taking this into account, it is a DPS increase to execute Tornado Kick after a raptor form ability (in the cooldown just before a coeurl form skill), however only if shoulder tackle is off cooldown. If perfect Balance if off cooldown, Tornado Kick can be used pretty much Whenever (but is technically still optimal after a raptor form skill)

My friend and I spent the better part of yesterday theorycrafting an opener for monk, taking all of this into account. It allows for the use of 2 Tornado Kicks within a single Riddle of Fire window without sacrificing significant DPS.

Note that this opener requires that skill speed be a dump stat.

http://ffxivrotations.com/1cnj

The locations of Howling Fist, Elixir Field, and Steel Peak can be adjusted on the fly for if Forbidden Chakra becomes available from Brotherhood procs.

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Originally Posted by FoodAspectedPrimal

http://ffxivrotations.com/1cmj

The locations of Howling Fist, Elixir Field, and Steel Peak can be adjusted on the fly for if Forbidden Chakra becomes available from Brotherhood procs.

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The second line, you have Twin Snakes (RoF and BH) True strike, which is outside of your PB window...

I am having more questions than answers.

ah, thank you. That was an error leftover from a previous iteration where Perfect Balance was early in the opener (as the old version of the opener would have). Thank you for spotting that, I have made adjustments and edited the OP with the fixed skillpath.

Something I was doing yesterday that might help here, shoulder tackle is ogcd. So I would wind tackle > demolish > riddle of wind > dragon kick > fists of fire > twin snakes > inner release > snap punch > riddle of fire > forbidden chakra > bootshine > brotherhood.

This may not be as effective as yours, but maybe would help refine what you’ve put together.

Your version is perfectly acceptable, I would think, if you are not using a Strength Potion. Without the potion, delaying the riddle of wind until after the demolish is feasible as you wouldn't risk clipping dragon kick.
The other reason for the double tackle prior to the demolish at the start, however, is to grant the demolish the 10% damage boost from the first GL stack.

I did modify the second set of tackles with your advice, however.

Yeah, I thought that might have been why you might have placed Demolish after Riddle of Wind.

Also thanks for posting :)

Not that I have any real experience with MNK, but could you not drop Fists of Fire from the opener considering Riddle of Fire will activate it for you anyway? Could avoid the double-weave-with-potion clipping that way perhaps, which I would guess is more lost potency than 5% of a Dragon Kick.

As someone who has been on trying to maximize MNK’s new changes since 4.2 dropped, this is what I have come up with and has roughly a 200 DPS larger parse compared to pre 4.2 MNK.

Think of Monk as 4.1 Warrior where Warrior had 2 burst windows: Inner Release Berserk which is full burst window, and only berserk window.

Monk has shifted to having one huge burst window, which takes advantage of the opener and then 3 min into a fight where CDs line up together again (RoF, IR, Broth.). And priority maximization.

Ill make two more posts to greatly detail how these two phases of Monk work.

Opener: Courel Form—>WT—>Demolish—> RoW—>DK—>FistoF—>TwinS—>STR potion/Diversion—>SnapP—>RoF&I—>Bootshine—>Broth. TFC—>TrueS—>Howling Fist&SteelP—>Demolish—>ElixerF-->Courel Form (before RoF ends)—>TornadoK—>SnapP—>PerfectB= 3 stacks.

Never use your OGCDs before using all your buffs, including Brotherhood. You will lose out 5% extra damage. Do not forget to turn on FistofFire.

Reason why i use 1 TK in this opener is because building up GL stacks mid RoF upsets the the bonus damage from GL on your OGCDs, not to mention, losing GL stacks mid RoF resets our attack speed buff, making us get 3 GL stacks harder which is a overall potency loss to all of your weaponskills.

Next post is the smaller burst windows with a priority system.

The priority system consists of:
GL>Demolish>TwinS>DK>Tackle>TK.

The purpose of this priority system is to lose as little damage as possible when executing a TK so that you do not have to reapply a Demolish or DK or TwinS with 1-2 GL stacks, but with 3.

Once all these priorities are met:
Opo Opo-->FistoW-->Raptor-->WT->Courel->TK-->RoW->Opo Opo—>FistoW.

Reason why FistoW is used on Opo Form is because we want that 20% damage once GL 2 is attained in order to use Snap Punch or refresh Demolish.

Things to look out for: NEVER use PB outside of Buff window.
NEVER use TK unless you’re close to Courel Form.
Always remember to turn on FistoF after using RoW.
Opener is complex so make sure not to tunnel in fight or else all that damage is gone.

If I’m not busy, I’ll make a Monk Rotation video for 4.2 to help other catch up to speed. This isn’t the most optimal rotation and it can be polished, however, until proven otherwise, this is the best way to maximize Monk.

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Originally Posted by SoulSkyheart

As someone who has been on trying to maximize MNK’s new changes since 4.2 dropped, this is what I have come up with and has roughly a 200 DPS larger parse compared to pre 4.2 MNK.

Think of Monk as 4.1 Warrior where Warrior had 2 burst windows: Inner Release Berserk which is full burst window, and only berserk window.

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wait! 200 more overall or only in the opener / burst window??... if 200 overall, mnk is ffing OP

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Originally Posted by wereotter

Something I was doing yesterday that might help here, shoulder tackle is ogcd. So I would wind tackle > demolish > riddle of wind > dragon kick > fists of fire > twin snakes > inner release > snap punch > riddle of fire > forbidden chakra > bootshine > brotherhood.

This may not be as effective as yours, but maybe would help refine what you’ve put together.

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I don't think Demolish in Fists of Wind is a good idea, it'll be 5% weaker than in FoF wouldn't it?

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Originally Posted by Shiroe

wait! 200 more overall or only in the opener / burst window??... if 200 overall, mnk is ffing OP

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Yes, it is overall. Although, I say roughly because your DPS will heavily consist of how frequent you are able to TK.

looking at fflogs, adding 200 to mkn, 100 to blm and taking 100 away from smn (and keeping sam the same), mnk is is like top dps or close in a few.., well no suprise, we expected it to trade places with smn..

(did mnk lose a player base?.. all went sam?, so SE is fixing it?)

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Originally Posted by Shiroe

looking at fflogs, adding 200 to mkn, 100 to blm and taking 100 away from smn (and keeping sam the same), mnk is is like top dps or close in a few.., well no suprise, we expected it to trade places with smn..

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Uhhhh if you mean ahead of SMN by a decent margin? Then yes, Samurai and Monk were very competitive in DPS output, causing MNK to fall short in comparison by a tiny bit, but their utility makes up for it.

Now that they’re equal or MNK is even stronger which I believe is it,(haven’t touched Samurai in weeks.) meaning Samurai has become second best in personal DPS, SMN coming third but beats SAM in static demands cause strong and utility heavy.

Had 2 encounters in Jade Stoa today (pugs ya, may not be as good) but MNK is stupid strong, you will be able to climb from 8th place in the aggro bar to 2nd place after Diversion ends. Think SE will fix numbers due to how powerful monk is now. I hope not though.

once SE sees the base number of monk players go up again (since sam hogged many of those players), mnk will get a nerf

mnk and sam should not have similar personal dps numbers, sam should be like mimimum 300 dps ahead, .. since mnk's group contribution is ca. 300 dps.. (and mnk has mantra too)..

mnk and smn should have similar numbers

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Originally Posted by BucklesTrespen

I don't think Demolish in Fists of Wind is a good idea, it'll be 5% weaker than in FoF wouldn't it?

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Yes.... though the method I was using was less about the DOT tick and the efficiency of building up GL stacks, especially since not long afterwards you're reapplying it under Riddle of Fire. Even under the old Monk opener, your Demolish DOT wasn't that impressive since it was being applied without any GL stacks at all.

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Originally Posted by Shiroe

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When monk was introduced, it was given an identity to be a super fast melee job that hit fast, but weaker punches (compared to DRG as it was the only melee dps at the time.) to have strongest DPS for their low numbers. That’s its core identity.

Samurai was introduced and Yoshida specifically wanted Samurai to be the hardest hitting DPS, which no doubt about it, hits harder than Phantom Train ramming the platform. That’s Samurai’s identity.

When two of these jobs clash to compete for their spot, both of them are rivals and neck to neck, and that is still true even after 4.2. But Monk has utility that Samurai doesn’t, which makes it more desirable than its counter part. DPS Wise, they’re both fine and to be honest, if you’re not bringing a ninja and warrior to a party, Samurai being there to apply slashing for both tanks will greatly benefit the party instead of Monk’s 20 second 5% increase damage compared it slashing’s 100% uptime.