Warriors need MORE damage

As of right now they're barely ahead of PLD in terms if DPS. It needs to be higher. There needs to be a chasm between the 2 in terms of damage.

Why does there need to be?

It's because there's no point in being called the DPS tank when the DEF tank is doing nearly as much damage

It's a tank, not a DPS.

I honestly can't tell if these threads are just people trying to do a bit or not anymore.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crater

I honestly can't tell if these threads are just people trying to do a bit or not anymore.

---

I assume it's a bit at this point.

Tanks exist to take hits for the team and have high defense, not high offense.

warrior was in 2nd clear for Ultimate they're fine.

Where are you getting this idea that Warriors are the "DPS tank" and Paladins are the "DEF tank"? And where does that put Dark Knights? Are they the "in the middle" tank?

The damage each of the tanks are able to do right now is pretty close, so there's no point in fussing over it.

Also, boosting Warrior damage even further would automatically make them the best tank and wouldn't be fair to the other two.

Warrior damage is base off off rng https://www.mooglemedia.com/releasin...w-xenosys-vex/ this interview frim xenosys-vex explains why

Yeah there can't be a dps chasm between them now because warrior mitigation/utility is fine too, so it wouldn't have a downside to offset big dps. It feels good for all of the tanks to do good dps and just be differentiated by playstyles which I think they are achieving quite well atm.

Fell Cleave needs a buff, should only cost 10 rage. Warriors need a niche, and that niche should be fell cleave, so they need more fell cleaves.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crater

I honestly can't tell if these threads are just people trying to do a bit or not anymore.

---

I regret what I did now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rufalus

Yeah there can't be a dps chasm between them now because warrior mitigation/utility is fine too, so it wouldn't have a downside to offset big dps. It feels good for all of the tanks to do good dps and just be differentiated by playstyles which I think they are achieving quite well atm.

---

There's still a big gap in utility between PLD and WAR/DRK. That's not balanced.

I'd prefer if Warrior did the least DPS and had little to no utility.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FallenWings

I'd prefer if Warrior did the least DPS and had little to no utility.

---

... why? Are you just bitter at Warrior, or do you have some reason to want to turn it into the worst tank?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by WhyAmIHere

I regret what I did now.

---

Regret nothing!

My whole hotbar is Fell Cleave so if u could make it cost no rage so I can just mash buttons that'd be cool. Get rid of my mitigation, I'm a dps with instant ques now.

Honestly WAR could be fixed with two simple tweaks.
Give Fell Cleave an emnity modifier and make Fell Cleave have an additional effect that makes the next Fell Cleave cost no gauge.
Super easy, I expect SE to be able to have these changes implemented by the next major patch.

TBH I actually like how all the tanks compete in damage....except DRK. Makes it fun tryna top WAR damage as PLD. Buff DRK dps instead pls.

considering paladin is basically a warrior with much better utility,better mitigation and the only thing stopping people from going double PLD in raid is LB penalty then yeah i say they need some buff in their damage
like buffing fell cleave damage or making inner release 60 seconds cooldown instead of 120 seconds

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jukebox12

Warrior damage is base off off rng https://www.mooglemedia.com/releasin...w-xenosys-vex/ this interview frim xenosys-vex explains why

---

This sounds like an actual legit issue.
While RNG is RNG.
DRK getting the same level of RNG wont lead to as high of numbers.
but if we look at the average from all 3 tanks, w/o RNG, then we get a different picture.
(It wont be drastic, but its still a difference, as ppl are comparing the highest DPS done, not the average)

Should have known the WAR crybabies would come out of the woodworks sooner or later demanding more unreasonable buffs for a class thats pretty much on par with PLD.

Taking actual numbers and statistics into consideration DRK is the only class that has a clear gap inbetween the tanks and its still viable.

TLDR; War players crying for no reason convinced they are a DPS class while they are not.

Having dps based on rng is bad, however, I don't think many warriors would want that to change. More reliable damage output needs to be balanced by a dps nerf. You can't do 100+ dps (or 200+ if you buff it) everytime. War's dps would be still be ahead of paladin, but it would be less noticeable. I'm no math expert, but I think nerfing fell cleave or berserk, and buffing the rest would make war less dependent to their berserk windows (which is still not great, the job would take a hit on identity)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dio_Tiferet

Should have known the WAR crybabies would come out of the woodworks sooner or later demanding more unreasonable buffs for a class thats pretty much on par with PLD.

Taking actual numbers and statistics into consideration DRK is the only class that has a clear gap inbetween the tanks and its still viable.

TLDR; War players crying for no reason convinced they are a DPS class while they are not.

---

can you tell me in what world warrior is equal to paladin? oh right in a world where PLD players don't want other tank to be as good as them so they can get that sweet guaranteed raid spot
#pathetic

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by konpachizaraki

can you tell me in what world warrior is equal to paladin? oh right in a world where PLD players don't want other tank to be as good as them so they can get that sweet guaranteed raid spot
#pathetic

---

Stormblood paladin is no where near as broken as the warrior was in Heavansward

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by konpachizaraki

can you tell me in what world warrior is equal to paladin? oh right in a world where PLD players don't want other tank to be as good as them so they can get that sweet guaranteed raid spot
#pathetic

---

The difference in PLD and WAR right now is minuscule you are just looking for a reason to have WAR returned to 3.0 status where it was completely broken.

That being said i do think PLD dps is a bit excessive considering their toolset and ease of use but WAR is still in a good spot and the only tank with slashing debuff on them not to mention the most powerful personal mitigation.

Look at the total picture before you start demanding selfish biased buffs especially if those buffs are related to dps because in that case your interests are definitely not in the right place.

Kind WAR sirs,

Would it be okay, would it be acceptable, if SE fixed some of the problems with DRK first before WAR gets its 3rd major buff in an expansion that isn't even half a year old yet?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SyzzleSpark

Kind WAR sirs,

Would it be okay, would it be acceptable, if SE fixed some of the problems with DRK first before WAR gets its 3rd major buff in an expansion that isn't even half a year old yet?

---

I'd like to believe that class changes aren't a 0-sum game. If you really believe that SE can only balance one job at a time I think you should probably mosey on over to the DPS subforum where people playing MNK are hoping for some balance changes, I think their one thread might threaten almost literally every thread on this subforum in the past four weeks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jameseoakes

Stormblood paladin is no where near as broken as the warrior was in Heavansward

---

no way, heavensward warrior never had the amount of utility current PLD have while still able to compete in dealing the highest damage at the same time.
stormblood paladin is better than heavensward warrior,even if somehow SE changed warrior design back like 3.x with addition of 4.x skills the current PLD design will still outshine them

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by konpachizaraki

no way, heavensward warrior never had the amount of utility current PLD have while still able to compete in dealing the highest damage at the same time.
stormblood paladin is better than heavensward warrior,even if somehow SE changed warrior design back like 3.x with addition of 4.x skills the current PLD design will still outshine them

---

Wait what?

Edit: thanks to people who could word this better than me :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jameseoakes

Wait what?

---

My consciousness wishes for the guy that he's just trolling my intellect however fears for the worst.

HW WAR had two debuffs that were not just good, they were mandatory. And it was the only job that could bring them. SB PLD earning a teamslot without having such broken utility is actually indicative of superior design. That's why nobody actually seriously believes that PLD is overpowered, because while it is really, really good, it doesn't fucking blackmail you into having to take it.

Yeah I gotta gree with James and Syzzle here: Permanent 10% damage down with very few exceptions kinda made WAR the best tank for literally everything. I mean, even now, permanent 10% mitigation by WAR with path would be better than anything in the PLD arsenal. Full stop. And at a time when WAR had the top DPS spot by a margin even greater than today...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SyzzleSpark

HW WAR had two debuffs that were not just good, they were mandatory. And it was the only job that could bring them. SB PLD earning a teamslot without having such broken utility is actually indicative of superior design. That's why nobody actually seriously believes that PLD is overpowered, because while it is really, really good, it doesn't fucking blackmail you into having to take it.

---

can you explain the reason why paladin isn't as bad as warriors heavensward other than grudge, PLD are kinda mandatory to have as well that's why they're in almost every raid group if not all of them while WAR and DRK are interchangeable

HW
https://i.imgur.com/777CNf4.png

vs

SB
https://i.imgur.com/bSAytrH.png

:rolleyes:

WAR in HW was almost exactly 2:1 to the other tanks. Because it made up almost every comp. Period. Hearing that someone wasn't running WAR was almost hilarious. PLD does not even come close to having the same dominance.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DaulBan

HW
https://i.imgur.com/777CNf4.png

vs

SB
https://i.imgur.com/bSAytrH.png

:rolleyes:

WAR in HW was almost exactly 2:1 to the other tanks. Because it made up almost every comp. Period. Hearing that someone wasn't running WAR was almost hilarious. PLD does not even come close to having the same dominance.

---

That's because DRK was a badly designed PLD clone so that you never wanted both of them at the same time. Imagine a DRK trying to MT for Reprisal with no additional enmity while PLD has Savage Blade in its dps combo.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Launched

That's because DRK was a badly designed PLD clone so that you never wanted both of them at the same time. Imagine a DRK trying to MT for Reprisal with no additional enmity while PLD has Savage Blade in its dps combo.

---

Yes obviously it was DRK's fault WAR was ridiculously overpowered in 3.0

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Launched

That's because DRK was a badly designed PLD clone so that you never wanted both of them at the same time. Imagine a DRK trying to MT for Reprisal with no additional enmity while PLD has Savage Blade in its dps combo.

---

Didn't WAR also have it's aggro skills in it's DPS combo?

There are 4 things that choosing not to bring a PLD to your raid group in SB does not cause:

1. The two tanks that you do bring dealing 10% less damage.
2. Any other user of slashing dealing 10% less damage.
3. Your NIN to have to use an inefficient rotation.
4. Missing out on an on-demand -10% incoming damage debuff.

This argument that PLD is as powerful as WAR was in HW is absolutely laughable. Anyone that continues to assert this deserves the most condescendingly snarky "RLY? SRSLY? xD" faces that the people on this forum can muster. To assert this is like saying DRK/PLD comps weren't horrible in HW. If you said that back in the day you were LOL'ed to the horizon and back, probably by the same people in this thread right now asking for buffs. In HW if you made a PF and a DRK and PLD joined people would immediately speak up and either ask one of them to swap or nag the PF leader about not locking a slot to WAR. By contrast I see DRK/WAR comps in PF all the time nowadays and nobody bats an eye.