I was wondering how hard is it to add wards and why they haven't done it yet. Is the PS4 limitations so bad that they will have trouble adding additional housing? Is this something to do with coding? When I played FFXI on PS2 anyone who wanted a moghouse could get one can't they just incorporate instanced housing the same way? Just trying to get a better picture of why housing isn't doing so great.
Is housing limited because PS4?
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11-03-2017, 11:00 AMKalitzoIs housing limited because PS4?
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11-03-2017, 11:05 AMSiniztorThink it boils down to there server space..Cant be ps4 cause you don't load a ward till you enter a ward...now if we were talking making each side of the ward 500 houses instead of 30 then ps4 might factor in.But just adding the option to enter more wards naaaa .As far as just adding more wards think its a storage issue on SE sideQuote:
Originally Posted by Kalitzo
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11-03-2017, 11:19 AMCanadane
It has nothing to do with what's on the client side, it's entirely the servers they have running for it.
I've been told things about how unstable they really are, and it's not pretty. -
11-03-2017, 11:20 AMKalitzoI was just debating this exact point with my FC. I didn't feel it was a technical limitation from the PS4 rather I felt it was a technical issue on the server side.Quote:
Originally Posted by Siniztor
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11-03-2017, 11:22 AMDustytomeIt takes a lot of physical hardware for the wards as they're running as zones as opposed to temporary instances.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalitzo
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11-03-2017, 12:16 PMEnkidoh
Housing issues in FFXIV have nothing to do with 'PS4 restrictions' (goddess I hate that stupid meme, and I'm a PC player).
And as for FFXI, Moghouses there were actually for technical limitations - the whole point of a Moghouse in FFXI was not to have a nice house you could decorate, but simply to provide an instanced area that only your player character inhabited in order to take them 'off' the main server to help stabilize it (this is why so many basic gameplay functions in FFXI could only be accessed there like your inbox or changing a Job/setting a subjob, it was to encourage players to spend as much time in there as possible.)
It's also why for many years you couldn't even invite others into your Moghouse, as that would have invalidated the whole point of having it in the first place. It was only after the player population declined enough that SE decided such a stability aspect was no longer necessary for the game and thus they eased off the restriction to inviting other players inside, but only if they are in a party with you (they still can't just waltz in through the front door when they wish).
Also, the very term 'Moghouse' was a misnomer - it was virtually the same as FFXIV's apartments - you couldn't decorate the outside and only had access to a single room, meaning comparing them to FFXIV is rather irrelevant as they're two different concepts.
Either way, housing's problems in FFXIV stem more from the fact that the housing system was designed ironically for a much smaller player population (when FFXIV ARR was in still in development SE deliberately set their expectations for the game low, using FFXI and FFXIV 1.0's player population as a guide, which was exceeded many times over in early access), and thus the problems with housing are reflective of the game's overwhelming success. It's not something SE can fix easily or quickly I'm afraid. -
11-03-2017, 04:35 PMRinukoMinor correction, you could have people in your moghouse, as long you were in a party and you opened up party member access to your moghouse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Enkidoh
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11-03-2017, 04:53 PMEnkidohNot originally, which is my point - for FFXI's first five years of service in fact, you could not invite anyone into your Moghouse, the ability to do so was only added in an update in 2007 (the November 19 2007 update specifically, which is nearly ten years to the day in fact). I couldn't find any archive on the FFXI website about it, but the FFXIcylopedia updates archive does list a copy and paste of the original FFXI page.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rinuko
So either way, my point still stands, FFXI's Moghouses were far more restrictive than they were made out to be and only had one of their restrictions lessened many years after it's launch, and are not necessarily a better system than FFXIV's current housing system. -
11-03-2017, 04:57 PMRinukoOh, I didnt realise you were talking from the beginning, then yes you are correct. It was added later. And it wasn't due to client side (PS2) since they dropped that support almost 6 (iirc) years later.Quote:
Originally Posted by Enkidoh
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11-03-2017, 05:14 PMSeoulstar
So..are we now moving to PS4 since PS3 was dropped?
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11-06-2017, 05:06 AMDyvidInterior housing is instance based and shares the same data center server as all instance content in the game; dungeons, raids, trails, story battles, etc...Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalitzo
Wards are world server based and share only that worlds content.
Back when housing first launched we had issues with dungeon lag and random disconnects, why you now return to the wards front door rather than the interior of the house. You can imagine the issues if everyone had their own personal mansion, with their own personal design, clogging up the instance server. Think 4.0 launch and those dreaded solo instance fights that stop everyone from progressing. -
11-06-2017, 01:22 PMEnlaPretty much all of this. ARR is essentially built upon 1.0's desiccated corpse and because of that all the shoddy programming that 1.0 was known for came along for the ride. They'd have to either massively increase the server sizes well beyond what they're currently willing or outright strip down the code back to basics and rebuild the game from the ground up. Neither of which are inexpensive solutions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyvid
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11-06-2017, 10:34 PMTridus
At this point it's pretty hard to argue that any restrictions in the game are due to PS4 specs, when until relatively recently it ran on the archaic PS3. There are almost certainly still PS3 related limitations kicking around, but the PS4 is more powerful than the PC I play on (faster CPU, faster GPU, same RAM without Windows overhead). So you'd be closer to the mark if you blamed my PC than the PS4. ;)
Housing is a backend issue, not a client one. Because each ward is running all the time (even if nobody is in it) there is server resource cost to having more of them. Making the existing ones larger would require map redesign and carry significant cost that way. Fully instanced housing would be a new system, because there isn't one that has an outside (apartments are effectively instanced housing interiors). -
11-07-2017, 09:04 AMKeridwynConsidering how little wards get used I wonder if it would be possible to instance the wards? When nobody is in them they're not active but when people are so are they. I'm not certain what kind of programming would be involved but if they can have multiple zone instances active couldn't they do that with subdivisions and wards beyond ward 1?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tridus
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11-08-2017, 10:08 PMTridusMaybe? At that level of detail it starts getting into knowledge of the backend infrastructure and system design that I don't have. :) The issue with instancing wards that I can see is that they're so large and they'd have to spin up anytime anyone teleports to their house, or logs in at their house, as you appear outside (in the ward). If you have to spin up an entire ward often enough, then shut it down and persist it, then spin it up again, it could wind up being worse than leaving it in memory all the time. Instance startup/shutdown isn't free in terms of server utilization either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Keridwyn
I tend to think the answer partially involves making the ward maps larger and having more houses in them, as you'd increase the number of houses per ward significantly which wouldn't require more ward instances to be running, and usually any given ward's exterior isn't heavily populated (so there is lots of room for more people to be in there without causing resource issues). That requires world design and artist time on top of the technical end so it's certainly expensive, but it's likely easiest on the servers* themselves as opposed to simply adding 40 wards.
(*Speculation, as although I am a professional software developer, I don't know what SE's backend looks like.)