Dear RedMages

When in dealing with Groups of mobs the Red mage was given a move (actually 3 but I'm going to keep this simple for the benefit of the general public)

It's Called Scatter.

in groups of mobs your not meant to be focusing on building up balance really quickly your meant to be aoeing

Scatter has a 25% chance to proc and even more powerful scatter upon hit.

Plus after the first scatter the second scatter is instant because of dual cast

So please when facing groups of mobs if you truly can't be bothered to learn anything about your class. please just press scatter over and over again. It's easy and very hard to mess up and takes less effort than building up balance on one of the many tank's target. plus it makes it a lot easier for the tank to keep hate

and most of all you do more dps.

so please it's 1 button. just keep pressing it. Classes like sam have to 5 buttons correctly to aoe well.

you just have 1. please try

Sadly, the people you are talking to most likely do not participate on the forums, or probably even knows it exists.

Its not as simple as scatter for 3 mobs. Its:

3 Mobs: Scatter and alternate between VerAero and VerThunder to quickly build Black and white mana.

4 Mobs: Spam Scatter.

I like to alternate between using Embolden for one pull and Manafiction for the next.

Moulinet is what you spend your black and white mana on for a pay off on 3+ pulls. Your goal, when you plan on using manafiction is to get mana to:

15, 30, 45 or 75.

15 + manafiction = 1 Moulinet
30 + manafiction = 2 Moulinet
45 + manafiction = 3 Moulinet
75 + Manafiction = 4 Moulinet (use 1 then manafiction)



So it is wrong to say just scatter at 3... You should say: "Just scatter at 4." :p

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Originally Posted by virgil204

Scatter has a 25% chance to proc and even more powerful scatter upon hit.

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Just a minor nitpick... It's not more powerful in terms of damage, it just builds 8 white and black balance instead of just 3 of each.

I do agree with your post in general though. Earlier tonight I ran a Skalla as a Scholar where we did full pulls, and the red mage did their single target rotation the entire way through. I'm glad that I had gone with Scholar instead of Astrologian since at least I had decent dps to partially make up for it and the resources to maintain healing for the looooong fights that lasted long past the tank's cooldowns.

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Originally Posted by virgil204

3 Mobs: Scatter and alternate between VerAero and VerThunder to quickly build Black and white mana.

4 Mobs: Spam Scatter.

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This is the most efficient, yes, with the added caveat that for 3 targets if you have a proc'd Scatter use that instead of VerThunder or VerAero. A normal Scatter does the same damage vs. 3 targets as VerAero, VerThunder, or a proc'd Scatter, but gives only 6 balance compared to the 11 balance of the single target spells and the 16 balance of the proc'd Scatter.

But even if all you do is Scatter Spam, the difference is not huge since it's only a difference of balance earned which might add up to one or maybe two extra Moulinet.

Dear Red Mages,

You have an instant cast raise on every other spell. If both healers in your alliance are dead... please use it. T_T

i think its less about ignorance and more about it being extremely boring

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Originally Posted by Giggz

i think its less about ignorance and more about it being extremely boring

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So RDM who single target dps on groups of mobs are purposefully cutting their dps in half just to make it more interesting? That theory doesn't wash. There's ways to make the AoE more than just Scatter spam that don't tank your dps. E.g. cooldowns, saving balance to squeeze out extra moulinet via manafication, weaving with single target spells vs 3 mobs, etc.

Wait a minute you want RDM to use their AoE abilities but in your other post you say you don't want the tank to pull more than one pack of mobs :thinking:

OP is the next most likely to spam threads and get banned.

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Originally Posted by Ameela

Wait a minute you want RDM to use their AoE abilities but in your other post you say you don't want the tank to pull more than one pack of mobs :thinking:

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quote in my post where I said I don't want tanks to pull more than one pack of mobs.

I dare you quote me

How does telling people not to pull a pack of 20 mobs mean that you are telling them to pull only 1 pack of mobs

please explain you understanding of the English language

Quote:

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Originally Posted by virgil204

quote in my post where I said I don't want tanks to pull more than one pack of mobs.

I dare you quote me

How does telling people not to pull a pack of 20 mobs mean that you are telling them to pull only 1 pack of mobs

please explain you understanding of the English language

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Most dungeons have a wall stopping you from pulling more than 2 or 3 packs anyway, it's impossible to pull a "silly amount of mobs" outside of like pre-2.3 dungeons (where you're so overgeared that it doesn't matter that much anyway), unless your definition of a silly amount of mobs is, indeed, 2 or 3 packs.

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Originally Posted by Ameela

Most dungeons have a wall stopping you from pulling more than 2 or 3 packs anyway, it's impossible to pull a "silly amount of mobs" outside of like pre-2.3 dungeons (where you're so overgeared that it doesn't matter that much anyway), unless your definition of a silly amount of mobs is, indeed, 2 or 3 packs.

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and yet people on my dear tank thread have actually confirmed asking their tanks to regularly pull 3 or more packs. Sad part this statement assumes no one but you plays the game when we all know there are plenty of opportunities in even storm blood dungeons starting from level 61 all the way to level 70 for you to pull more than 2 or 3 packs. But you're here seriously suggesting that dungeons prevent you from doing this. When you yourself probably pull more than 2 or 3 packs on a regular basis.

The sad part is this statement will become the core of your argument while you go back to your in game dungeons and pull more than 3 packs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by virgil204

quote in my post where I said I don't want tanks to pull more than one pack of mobs.

I dare you quote me

How does telling people not to pull a pack of 20 mobs mean that you are telling them to pull only 1 pack of mobs

please explain you understanding of the English language

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They mean your "Dear Tanks" where you clearly complain how bad it is when tanks pull big packs.

Dear RDMs, please use all of your toolkit.

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Originally Posted by Niraves

Dear Red Mages,

You have an instant cast raise on every other spell. If both healers in your alliance are dead... please use it. T_T

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Or they can just try not to die too much coz RDMs have limited MP pools too.

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Originally Posted by Nerisu

Or they can just try not to die too much coz RDMs have limited MP pools too.

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I don't see how you can be starved for MP when you have lucid dreaming unless you're raising several people a minute. Or if you're not using lucid dreaming.

This is just a bad/lazy player issue, not a RDM issue specifically. You'll always have dps that refuse to aoe in situations that need it, won't raise if they have the ability, won't use their full kit, etc.

In those situations you do what normal people do when they have an issue, discuss it with the other person and then kick them if it doesn't change :P and that applies to each role

YOU DON’T PAY MY SU-

[Julian Dusk has been dismissed from the duty.]

Instead of making all these Dear (insert job here) threads here in general, please put them in the forums for each specific job.

The people you're calling out can't be bothered to do simple math then they probably can't be bothered to be on these forums to even see this.

Am I gonna have to shitpost? I will make a Dear Mentors thread I swear.

I probably won't actually.

This is like a copy pasta. I like it!

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Originally Posted by virgil204

Dear Ninjas

When in dealing with Groups of mobs the Ninja was given a move (actually 3 but I'm going to keep this simple for the benefit of the general public)

It's Called Death Blossom.

in groups of mobs your not meant to be focusing on building up ninki gauge really quickly your meant to be aoeing

Using Ninjutsu to proc katon for an even more powerful hit.

So please when facing groups of mobs if you truly can't be bothered to learn anything about your class. please just press death blossom over and over again. It's easy and very hard to mess up and takes less effort than building up ninki on one of the many tank's target. plus it makes it a lot easier for the tank to keep hate

and most of all you do more dps.

so please it's 1 button. just keep pressing it. Classes like bard have to 5 buttons correctly to aoe well.

you just have 1. please try

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This can really be applied to any DPS that doesn't take the 5mins to read their tooltips and learn how to aoe dps properly.

I thought ninki gauge is only charged up by autoattack, so as long as you are within the mobs' vicinity, it should automatically charge?

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Originally Posted by Moonfish

Sadly, the people you are talking to most likely do not participate on the forums, or probably even knows it exists.

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#trollpost he has done one for every role/job.

https://i.imgur.com/MDX9Le8.png

That is all.

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

3 Mobs: Scatter and alternate between VerAero and VerThunder to quickly build Black and white mana.

4 Mobs: Spam Scatter.

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Glad I'm not the only one doing this. Spamming Scatter when tank only pulls 3 mobs is such a waste of MP too.

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

Its not as simple as scatter for 3 mobs. Its:

3 Mobs: Scatter and alternate between VerAero and VerThunder to quickly build Black and white mana.

4 Mobs: Spam Scatter.

I like to alternate between using Embolden for one pull and Manafiction for the next.

Moulinet is what you spend your black and white mana on for a pay off on 3+ pulls. Your goal, when you plan on using manafiction is to get mana to:

15, 30, 45 or 75.

15 + manafiction = 1 Moulinet
30 + manafiction = 2 Moulinet
45 + manafiction = 3 Moulinet
75 + Manafiction = 4 Moulinet (use 1 then manafiction)



So it is wrong to say just scatter at 3... You should say: "Just scatter at 4." :p

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Thanks for this info, I only recently started taking my RDM into duties with people (50-61 with my squadrons) so I was wondering how I should be utilizing these skills.

LOL.

First people complain RDM is so OP ... now people complain they don't AoE enough. Seriously ...

Most RDM I've partied with go so gung ho with their AoE abilities, the Tank can't keep aggro ... and guess what happens? Yeah ...

It's all about balance, party make up, and what those parties want to do.

Dear virgil204,

Whether you make valid points or not, I hope I never end up in a party with you. You come across like a control freak and a jerk.

Sincerely,
Baingoleth

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Originally Posted by Kohdo

https://i.imgur.com/MDX9Le8.png

That is all.

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This wins honestly.

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Originally Posted by Baingoleth

Dear virgil204,

Whether you make valid points or not, I hope I never end up in a party with you. You come across like a control freak and a jerk.

Sincerely,
Baingoleth

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Same. Unfortnatly im on his datacenter :(

Nothing annoys me more than seeing a fellow RDM focus on their single target spells/melee rotation after the tank pulls an entire room. Do you not see me using Scatter and Enchanted Moulinet? Why aren't you being a team player?

dear forum users are we behavior in Jobism dismate again are fellow red mage.

all kidding i remember about scatters.

Enchanted Moulinet is more dps then scatter so you will not just want to spam scatter but also use veraero and verthunder between scatters to build up your bars faster
So if you are just using scatter i am sorry but you are not doing the most out of the jobs potential

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Originally Posted by Maero

Enchanted Moulinet is more dps then scatter so you will not just want to spam scatter but also use veraero and verthunder between scatters to build up your bars faster
So if you are just using scatter i am sorry but you are not doing the most out of the jobs potential

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Only if you are facing 3 targets exactly. If you're facing 4 or more then Scatter spam without single target weaving does more damage even though you don't get quite as much balance build up because the extra 100 potency per additional mob per scatter more than outweighs the extra moulinet you get.

And even on 3 targets, if all you do is Scatter spam without weaving single target spells it's not that huge a dps loss, since it only adds up to one or maybe two moulinet per encounter. I'm happy as long as I see a redmage scattering on 3+ mobs instead of only single targeting. I'm ecstatic if they do weave on 3 targets though.

And here I thought I was being lazy spamming it /tearsofvindication

Haha at least RDMs are trying to do their job? The most problems I have seen are people who play Bards. The trend I see is everything is saved for bosses and not trash pulls. Not using Mage's Ballad on big packs. No songs unless on boss, no foes unless on boss, no Refresh for healers who help dps or Tactician when appropriate.

RDMs may be a bit lackluster in terms of raid DPS support and long-term sustained DPS (not that they're terrible), but when it comes to dungeons, you'd be hard-pressed to find a more capable DPS.

RDM have the amazing ability to very easily and freely switch between single target and AoE without losing a step and can convert their gauge into a strong single target or AoE burst. To top it off, their two main AoEs don't even suffer from a loss of damage per additional target and the one that does has a lengthy cooldown (but it's a free ability that can be used during a dual cast for bonus damage, so not complaining).

Want to see just how OP a RDM can be in a dungeon? Try going in Tank + RDM + 2 other DPS into expert. A good RDM can keep up the heals and burst damage at key times to the point where it doesn't even look like you're missing a healer and you have 3 DPS instead of just 2. Of course, this requires a darned good tank and smaller pulls, but bosses melt in the face of 3 DPSes. Overall, my experience with such runs have been that you get out in just about the same amount of time as an average run. You can do it faster with a traditional makeup, but that requires max pulls and everyone knowing what they're doing.

Now a bit more on-topic. In general I agree with the given strategies for 3 and 4+ groups; however, at 4 and 5 mobs, I'll sometimes still opt to weave Veraero and Verthunder during dual cast depending on the exact situation.

For example, say the target list looks like this:
Mob 1 - 10%
Mob 2 - 10%
Mob 3 - 40%
Mob 4 - 20%
Mob 5 - 15%

Now, one of those mobs clearly has much more HP than the others meaning that if we stick to pure AoEs, we'll probably end up with one mob at about 20% left and have to go to single target rotations to finish it off. Once in that situation, it's obvious that Jolt II > Scatter for a single target, but what if we could avoid Jolt II to begin with for this encounter? In seeing this situation and knowing that I'll have to use some single target skills at some point anyway, I'll weave Veraero/Verthunder (basically the 3-mob RDM rotation) on the one target with a large amount of HP left to get it down with the others so that hopefully the entire wave is finished off with AoEs instead of forcing myself and my partner into full-blown single target rotations on a weakened mob. In that moment it means I'm doing less than my potential maximum DPS, but over the course of the entire encounter, it means I've upgraded a few Jolt IIs into Veraero/Verthunder. Meanwhile, my partner can stick with their AoE rotation and hopefully not face the issues with switching to single target at the tail end of an encounter (which effectively means that I'm potentially upgrading what would be their single target attacks into 300 potency attacks as well).

Of course, if your partner happens to be one of those TP-bound classes that have trouble keeping up AoEs through an entire encounter, let it be their job to help you avoid having to cast Jolt II by targeting the high HP mobs when their TP runs low and evening things out. Even if they don't do that right, no worries, you're a RDM, just hit different buttons and you're suddenly doing single-target damage on that final mob or two as if you were doing that the whole time (no need to worry about getting certain buffs/debuffs up as you switch).

Well i would not use enchanted moulinet on anything less then 3, lol
3+ i will argue highly that EM is far better then just scatter spam. Someone had posted actual dps numbers with comparissons sometime ago.
Point of all of this is OP has no clue how to play Red Mage to it's full potential by the sounds of it

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Originally Posted by Lufir

Haha at least RDMs are trying to do their job? The most problems I have seen are people who play Bards. The trend I see is everything is saved for bosses and not trash pulls. Not using Mage's Ballad on big packs. No songs unless on boss, no foes unless on boss, no Refresh for healers who help dps or Tactician when appropriate.

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To be fair the Bard community has always been bad or lazy. It is refreshing to see some good ones though.
I used to main Bard at the start of 2.0 (well Bard and blm) and yeah people are just lazy i think