New healer ideas?

I recently saw the caster gear designs, and fell in love with the healer gear runner up that was designed from the skysteel manufacturer, and it made me think of a healer that uses alchemical potions/ gasses to heal with a weapon that's similar to a design of the healer in tf2. What are your thoughts on this and what healer would you like to see in the game?

I'm still on the dancer train that uses steps, sambas, waltzes, and other dances to perform their abilities. I like the idea of them being a healer/ranged DPS using magical/aetherial chakrams as their primary weapon, and primary means to heal and deal damage.

The way I envision it is the chakrams are thrown at the enemy to cause damage, while aetherial bursts of energy from these weapons are used to heal. The dances are pretty much straight utility that helps the dancers and/or their comrades, all while flowing smoothly to create this elegant and exquisite healing style.

I like the chakram idea, and I would like to see dancer be brought in but I remember in a interview they said they wanted to play around with entirely new classes to FF, so I'm curious as to what they are planning.

That would be interesting to see. I still think back to the initial reaction of the lady in red (sorry, I'm still doing HW stuff), and the excitement when people thought DNC was coming in. I think that reaction will be taken into consideration along with entirely new classes.

There are actually still a ton of classes from previous FF titles that are not in this game. I wonder if they can come up with anything truly new that doesn't overlap in some way.

Been brainstorming with a friend about a possible Chemist class, where the class gauge would work like a Ninja's mudras except with potions and a lot more combinations.

Combine certain potions to make something that you can toss on the ground and make it explode to be a simple healing aoe on the floor like asylum.
Combine another set of potions to give an HP leech buff that drains a certain % of the damage they deal into HP to heal themselves (you wanna heal yourself up and not die? better do more dps, buddy).
Combine another set of ingredients to make a remedy to remove ailments.
Combine another set to craft an ether to restore MP, or another set to craft an elixir that fully restores HP / MP (obviously this would be like a 5 minute cooldown maybe).
Need to raise somebody? Better craft a phoenix down and use it on them.
Craft a steroid potion and it increases a person's DPS but lowers their DEF.
Craft another potion that removes GCD until you use 4 abilities or something.

Definitely DNC. I'm curious as to how they'll add a melee healer.

This is more or less how I would handle Dancer, though I would probably like to see a "dash to target" effect on "Golden Bell".
http://ffxivhomebrew.weebly.com/dancer.html

The real difficulty is coming up with something that plays mechanically differently than what we already have for healing, though. It doesn't matter what coat of paint you put on it if it boils down to exactly the same gameplay.

I would consider looking at the Bravely Default series for ideas that SE might be putting around in their offices.

Guardian seems an interesting take on a tank, possibly also acting as a blue mage by allowing you to possess nearby enemies or channeling the ghosts of specific enemies (and gaining monster abilities based off them).

Other classes specializing in throwing weapons, like chakram or pilum, are also a possibility for ranged dps.
I'm a big fan of the dancer concepts, but am uncertain whether it should be a melee healer or a ranged dps (like bard, who is also very heavily a support).

I don't think we need another melee dps though.

Chemist seems interesting but I'd really like it for geomancer to be considered as the next healer. Take ffxi's geo and tweak it to healing with bubbles to provide buffs and or healing to the party.

I'd like to see Chemist where it has abilities that combine together to create the desired effect, and all their oGCD heals (and probably oGCD attacks) are tied to this mechanic. Think of it like Mudras, only you can do other actions in between the combining, and you get more than four.

Dancer or Chemist seem the most likely, but AST is just a modified Time Mage, so they could easily shoehorn an existing non-healing class in there.

Classes that seem unlikely:
- Puppetmaster (already have a pet healer)
- Blue Mage (would make more sense as either dps or magic tank)
- Mime (what would they mime? how would this heal?)
- Viking/Pirate (would be weird healer, already incorporated into WAR)
- Geomancer (already incorporated into WHM)
- Merchant (can't really see how this would work where it's not just a Chemist?)
- Beastmaster (makes more sense as dps/tank)
- Mystic Knight (already incorporated into RDM)
- All of the classes that are just upgraded/altered versions of existing healers (White Wizard, Spiritmaster, Sage, Devout, etc)

If the next xpac takes us to the empire, Chemist seems very likely, since they cannot use magic over there. Dancer would have probably made the most sense in this xpac.

you encounter a geomancer in the AST class questline. I wonder if that means we'll get a geomancer job soon

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Originally Posted by paoweeotter

you encounter a geomancer in the AST class questline. I wonder if that means we'll get a geomancer job soon

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It's called WHM.

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Originally Posted by jstamos

It's called WHM.

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I'm fairly sure they could make it a full class, considering they made Astro from a FFT class that had one skill. It could be the debuffer to the buffer that Ast is, easily.

I want Dancer, Chemist (with gun), and Geomancer all added as healers!

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Originally Posted by jstamos

It's called WHM.

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They don't name drop for Nothing. If they say it exists or in the future, it will. It's weird that they bring it up now, because If I recall Geomancy has already been a thing. It's probably a stretch or I'm talking out my rear but Geomancers are part of the reason we have materia.

One of the big misconceptions about the Scholar is that they are a shield healer and I think that comes from the fact that they were originally the only thing you could choose from aside from White Mage and when you put them together the most notable feature they had was providing the shield White Mages couldnt. When you look at their ability kit though and how they progress and grow as they level it becomes obvious that they are a trick healer. Almost every heal a Scholar uses doesn't require MP. In early Dungeons Scholars can rely completely on their fairy and in End Game dungeons free instant cast abilities become your best friend. I think we have yet to see a true Barrier Class Healer. A Healer that specializes solely in mitigation would be very interesting to see because so far we have a lot of reactionary Healers that just happen to use a barrier.

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Originally Posted by NobleWinter

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This is only partially true. Back in 2.x, their shields may have been the only shields around, but they took some good hits. This was paired fairly well with Lustrate healing 20% of the target's health, even in Cleric Stance. 3.x was a great time for shields as well. They could buffer/fully protect people from hits that would normally nearly or fully wipe a group. This required some fishing or steady reapplication of shields, but it didn't cost an arm and a leg at the time, either. Good times.

I'm not sure what the devs vision for Sch has been, but I have always seen the Sch as the shielder while Eos healed them up. I mean, she is the reason we can even heal to the extent we do, lore wise, iirc.

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Originally Posted by Jhett_Magnum

They don't name drop for Nothing. If they say it exists or in the future, it will. It's weird that they bring it up now, because If I recall Geomancy has already been a thing. It's probably a stretch or I'm talking out my rear but Geomancers are part of the reason we have materia.

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Lol okay. Here are some FFXI geomancer spells: Stone/Stone 2, Sleep, Aero, Geo-Barrier (Stoneskin, no longer in game), Clear Mind (Pressence o Mind), an MP-resoting spell called Full Circle (Assize). The Padjal, who are the White Mages, are per SE's WHM Job Guide: "chosen of the elementals"

Sorry, but Geomancers are WHMs, just like Time Mages are ASTs (Gravity, multiple time-extending abilities, Comet/Meteor = Malefic, etc).

I would make an area healer, preferably one that is pure cooldown based with no MP costs. Overall heals are weaker, but they are able to affect people over a larger area and can use area targeting for some of their heals. A potion user might fit that if you have them throw potions for heals/buffs.

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Originally Posted by Tridus

The real difficulty is coming up with something that plays mechanically differently than what we already have for healing, though. It doesn't matter what coat of paint you put on it if it boils down to exactly the same gameplay.

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Each healer needs a core set of abilities that will naturally make all of them play similar. They need a cure, regen, cleanse, raise, AoE heal, MP restoration/cost mitigation, healing potency buff, and offensive skills in order to work in this game.

They don't necessarily have to play different, but rather 'feel' different. Giving each of them variations to their fundamental abilities goes a long way in making this happen. Such claim only needs to go as far as a WHM, SCH, and AST's very basic heal spell. They all do the same thing, but make each healer feel very different. Further diversity is where balance issues come in, because when you give one healer something another doesn't have, the other healer(s) need to bring something to the table that compensates for it.

I think an easy way for SE to plug and play with the healers is with their offense. The shear number of DPS jobs shows why this would be so easy. It's just more flexible, and each healer has their own flashy way of doing damage. It's pretty much that way now, and the cause of the imbalance is due to the utility each healer brings. It honestly should be an easy fix imo, but SE just loves to complicate things.

I think a healer like dancer can really bring something different to the table. Those core abilities would still be there, but they would have a different way to go about it, but the HUGE difference would be that we would have a healer that heals damage through either melee or ranged melee attacks. I believe ranged would be better as FF healers typically don't belong in the fray.

Body guard healer from Swtor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBKTwGkOilE

Just a random guide on how they work for any non swtor players.

GIVE ME DANCER!!!

I want to captivate and rally my allies with Sambas
I want to Waltz my tanks off their feet
I want to literally dance on the graves of my enemies.

GIVE ME THIS SE!!!!!!

To really throw a curve ball at the game, not just the healing community, a melee based healer would certainly be a very new take on the role. Not sure what else they can do with ranged without it feeling like a bit more of the same.

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Originally Posted by inhaledcorn

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When I made my Salve-Maker idea, thats exactly what I used, a Mudra like system to make heals, buffs and debuffs.

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Originally Posted by NobleWinter

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That's partially true, but not quite. Though what is a "Trick Healer" anyway, how would you define that? Anyway, while Scholar's identity is up in the air right now, the type of healer we were, to start, was the Tactical Healer, with a focus on mitigation, because of the tools we had and were able to use. Just like how WHM isn't the HoT healer, they just focus on it. It's not like neither healer didn't have access to the others focus. SCH was also the DPS/Off Healer most of the time since it was easiest for us to maintain steady DPS output.

Once HW released and AST came into play, thats when our identity began to crumble. AST, whose identity is the Buff Healer, could do the other 2 healers jobs, but still had its own identity. But, as HW went on and we got job changes, each healer sorta fell into place. WHM remained the Pure Healer, AST the Buff Healer, and SCH the Tactical Healer, still focusing on mitigation, though by a hair. And the defacto DPS/Off Healer.

The concept of Shield Healer didn't come into play until HW, because before HW only SCH had sheilds, so there was nothing to compare them to. Now with SB released, and the job revamps, SCH is in an awkward place since the majority of our mitigation tools ave been removed. This is why people are bringing up the sheilds, because SCH might feel like it did way back when if they get more mitigation with the sheilds. Players have also been clamoring for more shields to be given to SCH.

That's why SCH has become to be known as the Shield Healer, it's not because thats what they are, its because that was their gimmick from the start, but now AST can do it better. Think of it this way, before SB every job had a DoT or 2, but they weren't DoT jobs, the only DoT jobs were and still are SMN, SCH, and BRD.

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Originally Posted by paoweeotter

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Actually I get the feeling, and I am rooting for this, XD, but I didn't get healer from the AST quest with Geomancer. The only parallels they are drawing between the two arts is Divination. But when some info is given the art doesn't express healing, like AST does, though it does reference protection. Only one role focuses on protection over healing, tank.

Now I am adamant about a Geomancer Tank, since it just works based on past games and I feel we need a Magical Tank. But I will admit it could just be reading to much into the info we are given, but I really hope not, XD.

My thing with coming up with a new healer is we have to understand SE's Cookie-Cutter / absolute balance mentality with FFXIV. Geomancer would be a nice addition to healer but I'd take it as a DPS Caster too, mainly b/c I think they could do something unique from either angle.
But then again we're not in the SE facility that makes jobs, which is a bummer, and its sad that even though we may be posting ideas, these discussions won't see any light since they're a JP company and they more than likely barely look into these English forums. But I'll hold on to hope! Maybe one day SE will add a fan-made job and it would surprise that lucky person!

But back to topic: GEO for next job! Healer and make it be a FFXI cross over style with bubbles!

We need a melee healer so far we have 3 caster healer and they even all use cloth. Dancer comes to mind but I'm pretty sure that if they could fit some plate/mail wearer melee healer it would be a way more popular.

I like the Chemist idea. I imagine a machinist-medic, using a modified gun injector. I think the idea of using a mudra system is great, since the flavour of the class would be the "mixing" of essences to distillate potent elixirs. I see the Chemist as a dps-healer, playing around with essences he extracts from enemies that he transfuses to allies. For example, by dealing damage to an enemy he could get a type A essence charge.Then, by healing an ally he could get a charge type that depended on the role of the target healed. By mixing the different types of distillates he could reinject the resulting elixir into a target, which could cause a specific healing or damaging effect. Also he could store the mixes in phials for later use.
The job would revolve around concocting-storing during down time, then using the prepared potions during damage phases.
If an effect still lingered, the chemist could recycle it to use it out later.

I would like a Magical Tank and a physical Healer change things up. I have a feeling square will only release one job per future expansion.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

Each healer needs a core set of abilities that will naturally make all of them play similar. They need a cure, regen, cleanse, raise, AoE heal, MP restoration/cost mitigation, healing potency buff, and offensive skills in order to work in this game.

They don't necessarily have to play different, but rather 'feel' different. Giving each of them variations to their fundamental abilities goes a long way in making this happen. Such claim only needs to go as far as a WHM, SCH, and AST's very basic heal spell. They all do the same thing, but make each healer feel very different. Further diversity is where balance issues come in, because when you give one healer something another doesn't have, the other healer(s) need to bring something to the table that compensates for it.

I think an easy way for SE to plug and play with the healers is with their offense. The shear number of DPS jobs shows why this would be so easy. It's just more flexible, and each healer has their own flashy way of doing damage. It's pretty much that way now, and the cause of the imbalance is due to the utility each healer brings. It honestly should be an easy fix imo, but SE just loves to complicate things.

I think a healer like dancer can really bring something different to the table. Those core abilities would still be there, but they would have a different way to go about it, but the HUGE difference would be that we would have a healer that heals damage through either melee or ranged melee attacks. I believe ranged would be better as FF healers typically don't belong in the fray.

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The issue on job mechanics for ff14 healers is actually two-fold: AST have cards for buffs, WHM have lilies for CDs, and SCH uses aetherflow management. Most healers also have a secondary mechanic that often appears as a buff, such as Nocturnal/Diurnal, Confession and Free Cure procs, or the presence of a Fairy (which is effectively half of a character). There's a lot of room for creativity on this one, and there have been several proposals, especially for dancer.

As for the healer meta in FF14, which I think the both of you are talking about, there is a demand to move away from heals-over-time and barriers to something new. I think we all understand that healers need to be able to recover hp on a single target and in an area, to remove status effects, and raise players up. Without those core abilities, it just wouldn't be a healer in a MMO trinity. The question instead, is how do we make a healer that doesn't rely on either regen or barrier to help heal through the current or future content.

A damage-leech healer is a popular idea, but I really doubt it would ever be implemented in FF14 because the devs are really cautious about damage creep. It was an unintended consequence of the 2.0 SCH release (because they paired it with ACN and SMN), and it seems they devs have been somewhat split on how to deal with the balance in the job design ever since, hence the SMN and SCH's slightly schizophrenic gameplay. The same could be said to a lesser extent about Warrior as well.

One new idea that's seen some traction are healing orbs that a player can scatter around in an area and with whom anyone can pick up. This is especially useful with a more mobile fighting style and could work very well with a melee healer. This is because the melee healer can simply drop healing orbs that melee or tanks can pick up later for as much healing as they need. Of course, the healer can still provide more conventional targeted heals, but this on-demand burst healing would give the healing class an unique 'dps' phase where they are just trying to gain enough resources to drop enough healing orbs in time for the next damage spike. Mystics from Tera, and to some extent, Medics from Wildstar, are some examples of this type of healing.

A healing ability that restores missing health of a party member by partially draining the rest of the party. Call it like Equistasis?

Scenario:

1) Tank gets hit by a tank buster, e.g. unmitigated vrilled Chanchala Pull of Light
2) Instant cast Equistasis
3) Tanks gets 50k heal at the expense of 25k damage shared among the rest

It could be a heal or a shield.