How in the hell do you beat a good sch, they're invincible with lustrate being an ogcd physick that can't be silenced nor pulled.
SCH in feast...
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08-16-2017, 12:20 AMJigokunoreizasanSCH in feast...
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08-16-2017, 01:05 AMVice-Taicho
Give melee back their stun and shit will get real , the reason why they shine so much is that you need to be in sync with team but with our ghetto ass chat it's almost impossible.
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08-16-2017, 01:36 AMCynricNice job!Quote:
Originally Posted by Jigokunoreizasan
No but seriously, They get three white flashes, DPS one target, silence while they lustrate then kill them = profit. at least that's how I do it, if they get the broil off before you silence you're gonna have to stall or try something else I guess, your melee gonna have to split the damage a little to force them to waste their stuff before going in for the kill.
I'm usually a Monk so best I can do is hope and pray and burst them when they're down -
08-16-2017, 01:39 AMJigokunoreizasanI'm specifically talking about to the level of Rum Raisin's sch, It's rare I see her in the "danger" zone. It's just so much healing and shielding going out in a short time frame I can't do anything but watch. Other schs aren't that good and can easily be overpoweredQuote:
Originally Posted by Cynric
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08-16-2017, 02:07 AMCynricI dunno I've never fought that person, but i've fought against our plat scholars regularly, you have to remember that CD's are not infinite, a big big big issue I see is, okay so say the target you're focusing has blackest on, people still focus them, if the entire game you only focus one target CD's will only need be used on that target, so if your DPS don't bother hitting anyone else but the target, people will only have to use CD's on them, if your tank isn't CCing then a good healer almost can't be beaten .Quote:
Originally Posted by Jigokunoreizasan
People keep saying focus this focus this, but most of my games up to platinum were won by splitting then changing targets and bursting while the healer is surprised.
and most of my losses have come from my attempting to just "Focus the 1" how does that end? Benediction? Lustrate? Blackest Night? Protect? Cover? All these CD's being used on a single target and then when they wear? people still focus them just to repeat the process all over again.
Throw the healer down low? Blackest night the healer protect the healer, lustrate etc. then focus that 1 and they'll melt. -
08-16-2017, 02:21 AMJigokunoreizasanYa most of my wins come from me multi dotting when I play smn and just waiting until I have my double AF burst and just pop the lowest thing I see, but what you are saying makes sense I'll keep a note of that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynric
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08-16-2017, 02:32 AMCynricyou also have the issue of tanks trying to DPS as well leaving healers able to freecast. If no one is hitting them and other targets when do they run dry on MP? It'll take a while, if you're forcing them to heal multiple people/shield multiple people they will eventually run out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jigokunoreizasan
I'm still working on reacting to blackest/protect myself, because those things really really make a difference between a kill and half HP. -
08-16-2017, 09:30 AMTheodric
They do appear to be a little too strong. I'm baffled by the decision to increase the amount of health that healers have, too, since they already have the ability to replenish their health pool far more easily than any other role can. Ultimately, though, all of my frustrations inevitably come back to the lack of an ability to communicate efficiently with the other members of my team. Stock chat phrases just do not allow for a strategy to be outlined that fits the current match.
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08-16-2017, 02:51 PMHyrist
Honestly, the game hinges on the strength of healers now, which is why I tend to not let the Tank be the only one to pressure them.
IMO, this is where I said things like "sustained damage being important" come into play. The best I've been able to come up with at this point, and is hard to communicate is to split the healer's focus. It's easy to heal one target, it's not to try to heal multiple in this version of PvP. So threaten the healer's own health with one dps (typically the lower one) and the tank - with the tank limiting their CC. Then, when the healer makes the hard choice of who to appropriately heal, the Tank CCs the Healer, and the DPS converge their burst on whatever target the healer chose to neglect in favor of saving.
It's tricky to pull off, especially with communication as restricted as it is, but doing this tactic repeatedly makes it hard for the healer, who's already going to be strained trying to keep up with all the DPS going around. Enemy Tank and Healer cooldowns really does mean you need to be putting out consistent damage without running out of your own resources too quickly. The idea is to bait out the strong defensive and recovery cooldowns, then catch 22 them into making a poor choice.
Again, not easy to pull off at all, but it works. That's why just blindly focusing one target isn't the best tactic at all times. These things will begin to iron out and become more prevalent with time though. -
08-16-2017, 03:52 PMCynricThis pretty much mirrors my experience and what I've been saying for a while now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyrist
Healers in the current state of the game suffer and fold under multiple DPS pressure, the only issue with it is, if your healer or tank don't know their roles. But then that battle was lost from the beginning and you're just trying to make the best out of a bad situation.
Also at least one DPS has to be able to get that kill while health is low and damage is spread. It only takes a second of the pressure letting up for a scholar to get a bunch of lustrates on everyone.
It puts me in an odd spot in thoughts on balancing, on the one hand healing feels way too important and in some cases beyond way too potent. But on the other hand I've seen how powerful burst can be when a Healer is CC'd and that doesn't seem right either.
This new PvP they've made is just a huge mess. -
08-16-2017, 04:09 PMMirchyou hafta become better, it's simple.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jigokunoreizasan
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08-16-2017, 07:15 PMsnipski
Good scholars are so op its not even funny right now actually they have no weakness.
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08-16-2017, 11:07 PMJigokunoreizasanThere's getting better and then there's having an infinite amount of ogcd heals, 3 broils and a good sch has AF up and ready to pop again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirch
Lustrate just needs to not be the same potency as their main healing spell... -
08-16-2017, 11:49 PMJigokunoreizasanYea, the more I think about it the more I feel focusing one target with their healer being a really good sch is futile. I just wish I can actually talk to people and tell them we need to split dps then burst the lowest health one when our tank can cc or the sch will just keep everyone we focus up easilyQuote:
Originally Posted by Hyrist