If anyone has beaten good king mog without using the ressurect exploit I challenge you to post a video online.
Has anyone beaten good king mog without cheating?
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12-18-2011, 07:59 PMHaruHas anyone beaten good king mog without cheating?
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12-18-2011, 08:00 PMJinko
BG did it without exploit.
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12-18-2011, 08:19 PMApplePie
Too hard without exploit.
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12-18-2011, 08:21 PMMedurawell, i dont think a fisher level 9 could have done it anyways :DQuote:
Originally Posted by ApplePie
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12-18-2011, 08:22 PMRuri
Impossiblu!
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12-18-2011, 08:23 PMManafont
Insomnia Besaid was first to beat it legit, without archers. Also if we including exploiters we were 2nd NA only behind a 5 archer exploit group.
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12-18-2011, 08:32 PMMadruk
I like how everyone has their own version of what a legit kill is.
Personally if you haven't done it naked, you haven't done it legit. -
12-18-2011, 08:33 PMNeroI smell butthurt. Archer exploit? wow.. thats interesting lol. I didnt know that using Archer is an exploit, which was a Common Strat for Batraal Speedruns btw.Quote:
Originally Posted by Manafont
I agree with this. lolQuote:
I like how everyone has their own version of what a legit kill is.
Personally if you haven't done it naked, you haven't done it legit.
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12-18-2011, 08:42 PMPenguinSince BG are primarily an NA LS that would make you NA 3rd i think since vicious are an NA LS aswell as far as i know?Quote:
Originally Posted by Manafont
Also you stacked MRD so i don't really know why you keep complaining about stacking 1 class.
Also our video of our first kill will be up soon, my upload sucks really hard so uploading a 22 minute video takes a while but it should be up sometime today for you to view our extremely messy first kill :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Haru
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12-18-2011, 08:47 PMJinko
If you haven't killed mog in reindeer outfit you don't count.
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12-18-2011, 09:36 PMKiriA500Oh yeah...and get all those sweet unequipped stats? CHEATER!Quote:
Originally Posted by Madruk
Beat it without running the game, like a true gamer! -
12-18-2011, 09:42 PMRichard_BG
Penguin bringing the MF smackdown of factual information
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12-18-2011, 10:46 PMManafontToo bad we killed it before you? i was done and watching you when you FINALLY got it done. We didn't stack anything we told people play what you want to play and guess what? we beat you to it. Gratz me!Quote:
Originally Posted by Penguin
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12-18-2011, 10:51 PMManafontGuess that smackdown got reversed. I walk off with the belt again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard_BG
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12-18-2011, 10:58 PMRowln
The amount of butt hurt is pretty overwhelming.
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12-18-2011, 11:00 PMManafont
The amount of Archers is overwhelming
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12-18-2011, 11:06 PMRowlnhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7mdT...eature=relatedQuote:
Originally Posted by Manafont
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12-18-2011, 11:08 PMManafontReported for getting off topic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowln
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12-18-2011, 11:14 PMRaikki
Oh my god are people really trying to argue over who beat whom by a couple hours? Stop being children. This was an easy boss and if you start gloating about it you make yourself and your LS look bad.
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12-18-2011, 11:16 PMRowlnYour topic is off topic. This whole forum is off topic. This GAME is off topic! You cant handle the truth!Quote:
Originally Posted by Manafont
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12-18-2011, 11:17 PMPenguinYou did? than you took a while to report you killing it if you killed it 2nd.Quote:
Originally Posted by Manafont
12-16-2011 10:35 AM - my time when we first killed it.
12-16-2011 08:03 PM - my time is when you first mentioned your LS beating the fight on the thread linked below.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...DOWN%21/page13
You also posted on that thread just after we killed it with no mention of you killing it.
If you did kill it before us congrats, still doesn't change the fact you stacked MRD and are complaining about stacking classes, or are you just complaining about people using archers now? -
12-18-2011, 11:28 PMManafonthttp://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-DOWN%21/page5Quote:
Originally Posted by Penguin
I'm sure you can read and guess which one it is.
No one is complaining about anything mister "world first legit kill" screenshot made on someone else kill thread. Rofl butthurt much? "we're going to sit here 8hrs until we kill it".
I find it funny how you watch someone else stream trying to learn how to do a fight but yet you mute yours and always hold back info from the public asking. Unlike your terrible LS, i like to see other playing with good items when i learn the strat i tell them. Get good plox! -
12-18-2011, 11:29 PMPenguinTrue enough and it makes it even more pointless considering how many exploited it to get earlier kills.Quote:
Originally Posted by Raikki
My point to Manafont was mainly why complain about class stacking when you did it yourself to get a kill? everyone is going to class stack in this game until SE make each class viable enough to bring 1 of each or add abilities like the BRD songs that will most likely make it a requirement to bring that class to each fight.
We personally used archers since me and rich wanted to play archer and all of our dps were more experienced with archer than with PUG or MRD, and LNC didn't seem that strong at the time with the directional combos.
Doesn't mean the fight cant be killed with anything other than archer that has already been proven to be false, it just means we went with the best setup we could use at that time and I'm sure Manafont's LS and other LS's did the same thing. -
12-18-2011, 11:30 PMManafontI used to handle the truth, Then i took an arrow to the knee.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowln
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12-18-2011, 11:32 PMManafontY U NO MRD?Quote:
Originally Posted by Penguin
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12-18-2011, 11:38 PMPenguinThan congrats on getting the world first legit kill.Quote:
Originally Posted by Manafont
Not sure what stream we were watching to learn the fight, if you are referring to rich (the person who streamed) watching Daeva of Wars stream during our attempts that wasn't to learn the fight he and others just like watching Daeva's stream when they are attempting fights as we have respect for them and like to see how they are doing, the same members watched the stream during ifrit and during DH.
We muted the stream because i dunno about you but i personally don't want what i say to be broadcasted to 200+ people but i dunno maybe thats just me.
And we never held back any information, infact if it wasn't for my bad upload speed we would have had a video of our 1st kill out yesterday.
And good items? huh? what? -
12-18-2011, 11:43 PMPenguin
Also this picture? http://i.imgur.com/EjKSz.jpg
Dunno about you but i don't see anything about world first mentioned. -
12-18-2011, 11:49 PMManafontYou can keep typing up a storm but you will still be bad in my eyes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Penguin
P.s i'm going to watch a movie now, you made false claims and got proven wrong. BAI! -
12-19-2011, 12:01 AMPenguinI probably am bad compared to you since you are quite clearly the best FFXIV player ever.Quote:
Originally Posted by Manafont
And technically you haven't actually proven me wrong to do that you would have to provide actual proof and all you did was link to a mule characters post without any link to you or your LS, i believe you without real proof because i know the fight isn't hard and that a melee setup is quite easily capable of killing it.
Competition between linkshells is what makes endgame fun and if you are as good as you claim i look forward to trying to beat you guys in future content, i just hope its much harder than the moogle fight was. -
12-19-2011, 12:25 AMfusionalIf you got world first without exploit, that's really awesome and congratulations. If you did it with marauders instead of archers, that's also really awesome and congratulations there, too. But how is using archers an exploit when they are simply more convenient to use due to lack of direction requirements of combos? Do you have any proof of them doing immensely more damage than other battle classes? In our cursory (and admittedly imperfect) testing it seems that the DoW damage dealing classes are doing very balanced damage in ideal circumstances. But perhaps your mileage varies?Quote:
Originally Posted by Manafont
And it's a moot point to complain about stacking of archers when you stack marauders- especially considering in stacking archers you're sacrificing survivability and control for increased court vision and convenience. If anything, stacking marauders is probably a wiser strategy for learning the fight because they're not getting hit for ridiculous amounts of damage like your paper tiger archers are. Plus, if a linkshell has more experience with one class than another, it makes more sense to learn with that class than to all learn an entirely new class for new content (when you're rushing for the kill).
Finally, post proof. What information has BG withheld? BG streamed publicly and had audio enabled for a lot of it. Is BG even obligated to publicly stream everything and always openly air our vent discussions? If so- apply this standard to all progression-level linkshells. Was your linkshell streaming with audio the entire time? If so, post proof. If archers are overpowered compared to other DPS, post proof. If you got world first, post proof.
And for the record- you and another mule saying you got it first because of a timestamp in a forum post means absolutely nothing. Saying you did it with group configuration X instead of Y without proof means nothing. Link relevant main characters from the LS with the lodestone history timestamp. Are you afraid to post on your mains? Why? Link a video of your legit kill. We have one uploading, so let's all hold each other to the same standard here. Don't be hypocrites.
But who really cares about world first Moggle Mog kill now? Because if people are able to exploit for a fast, cheap, easy win- what's the point of rushing for world first through the correct, legitimate strategy? If you did it first, fine, awesome, cool, great. Congratulations to you, and respect. But you're missing the point on two very important principles.
1. If you make a claim, back it up. And 2. if you're upset about people calling a certain strategy an exploit, don't counter by calling *their* strategy an exploit when you're essentially doing the same thing.
And don't say the raise/reset strat isn't an exploit. If it were intended game mechanics you wouldn't immediately get kicked from the battlefield with all party members dead. If it were intended game mechanics it would work like FFXI where you still have 5+ minutes to reraise and recover before you're kicked. But if nothing happens, you're all kicked and game over. It clearly is an exploit. And as long as the exploit remains: A. getting a kill in this manner deserves zero respect, and B. getting world first means pretty much nothing because it isn't achieved legitimately.
Also- saying using archers is an exploit is ridiculous considering the lack of directional requirements for combos is built into the game intentionally, at least for now. Though they still have to play it smart about distance. If this isn't intended or creates a class imbalance, then it should absolutely be fixed/changed. But the bottom line is- those mechanics are currently intentionally built into the game, and therefore not an exploit. However, considering parties are immediately removed from the battlefield when all members are dead, without delay- using the raise/reset strat IS an exploit because it is in direct violation of intended game mechanics. The proof is in the pudding.
WoW handled exploits with outright bans. Pending the severity of the exploit, FFXI banned people, too. If the devs are worried about banning people because they don't want to lose potential subscription fees, ok, fair enough I guess, but it sends a really awful message and the least they can do is hotfix the exploit and strip achievements and/or weapons from people who got their achievements/weapons from using that strategy.
I can't speak for everyone in the world, or really anyone else- but for me, it has absolutely *nothing* to do with not getting world first. At this point I could care less about that. If people get it done first/fastest, fantastic. More power to them and utmost respect. But if they did it using an exploit, it just feels cheap, and takes away from the meaning and sportsmanship associated with good-natured rivalries and sportsmanship.
Remember how much respect we lost for the Patriots when we found out they were winning by spying on other teams?
While that doesn't take away from Belicheck being an outstanding coach or Brady being one of the best QBs of our time... cheating is cheating. And so it applies here, too. No one is trying to say none of the linkshells that used the exploit have any skilled players worthy of respect. But cheating is cheating, and it really leaves a bitter taste in the mouths of everyone that didn't cheat, and outright refuse to.
In the end I just feel like this is a pointless discussion and you're just a really awful troll. But while the discussion is open, something needs to be said about all this crap.
tl;dr: Did it right? Grats! Did it right, first? Seriously, grats! Cheated? Doesn't matter whether you did it first or last. Sack up about it, and while we wait for some kind of hotfix to prevent further abuse of this exploit- prove you can do it straight up the right way.
Period.
Now stop trolling. -
12-19-2011, 12:44 AMRaikki
This is still a totally pointless discussion but I can confirm through the wonders of exploiting the lodestone's time zone setting that Neo Manafont (Besaid) beat Moggle Mog between 4AM and 5AM EST.
P.S.: You can also fake lodestone history timestamps this way. Have fun!
Edit: In my haste I completely missed the fact that they only have the achievement for killing the king himself, not beating the entire instance. Sorry for misleading. -
12-19-2011, 12:47 AMBlarp
I see the alpha nerds have gathered to argue about FFXIV "progression" raiding. We all know progression raiding in FFXIV is important internet business, but could you go shit talk on each others forums or something.
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12-19-2011, 01:00 AMviion
What is cheating it, i've watched a few vids on youtube and all seem legit, they dont do any special tricks.
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12-19-2011, 01:10 AMRaikkiIn phase 2 you can kill a couple of the moogles, then wipe and raise to remove aggro and replenish MP and buffs and re-engage and have a much easier fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
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12-19-2011, 01:18 AMRagz
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12-19-2011, 01:20 AMReq
I think the hilarious thing about this is, there wasn't a huge outcry about people killing the adds and then wiping to batraal then going back and killing him without adds spawninig. Its the same exact thing.
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12-19-2011, 01:25 AMviionIsnt that what people did in Divine Might in XI?Quote:
Originally Posted by Raikki
I dont see it as cheating just another tactic. -
12-19-2011, 01:28 AMReqIt isn't, this whole cheating thing has spawned from people with big egos being buttmad that other people killed the moogle before them possibly using a method thats easier than killing it without dying.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
Like I said in my previous post, where was the outcry when you could go back and kill batraal without his adds if you wiped on his third form?
In my opinion, the meat of the moogle fight comes when all of the moogles spawn anyways, and is about 10 times harder than getting to that point and simply surviving the song. The only real difference I see is people will be looking for an extremely optimal setup for doing the most damage for the first part, and using the "exploit" multiple classes can get in on the action because its more about outlasting them over zerging them down as fast as possible. -
12-19-2011, 01:39 AMJennestiaPeople super tanked Divine Might -- The only wipe one was depending on the Ark Angel Mithra's pet since some of them couldn't be slept or would sleepga (mandy) or to recover after a bad 2 hour (Mijin Gakure.) The one they're referring to in XIV is a different type of situation.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
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12-19-2011, 01:53 AMPenguinThe meat of the moogle fight as you put it is the part between after the song and when the 2nd/3rd add is dead, most LS's using the exploit can kill 1-2 adds max before loosing control meaning they never really overcome the hard part of the fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Req
The difference between surviving/controlling the fight normally the way it was intended and the exploit way is seriously night and day and unless you have killed it the way it was designed to be killed you probably wouldn't realize how much of a difference the exploit makes.
The fight is designed to be killed in 1 go that is why when all 8 people die you get automatically kicked out of the instance, if the fight was intended to have a reraise type tactic involved than you would most likely have time to raise up before it removed you from the instance.
Id agree with the Batraal thing but id say the main reason there was no outcry was simply because from what i remember none of the early kills used that way to kill him and most if not everyone just killed it the normal way, the problem now is that quite a large number of LS's are using the exploit way to kill the moogles because simply put it is significantly easier and removes alot of the dps requirements from the fight.