Thinking of starting tanking, need advice.

Hello
I am looking for advice on starting tanking in SB now the skills etc have changed. I have only ever tanked at level 30 with a warrior and moved to a DPS but the tanking role seems more interesting now that the queue times are bigger and now that there is a exp boost for leveling im looking for a new lease of life on ffxiv.

Could someone please help me regarding which tank is the best and what for? How easy are each of the tanks for someone near enough completely new to tanking and which would you recommend for a new tanker?

Thanks

Easiest: DRK
Mild: PLD
Hardest: WAR

As for "Fun"
PLD and DRK.
PLD is a bit more of a challenge, but still plenty easy.
DRK is straightforward. (I actually find DRK boring as heck, but there's quite a few people who find the simplicity of DRK fun.)

PLD is the best in pretty much any situation, be it MT, OT, ease, fun, etc.

The only exception is lower levels, where maybe WAR is more fun, since it has berserk, and PLD lacks the fun abilities till closer to 50+

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

Easiest: DRK
Mild: PLD
Hardest: WAR

As for "Fun"
PLD and DRK.
PLD is a bit more of a challenge, but still plenty easy.
DRK is straightforward. (I actually find DRK boring as heck, but there's quite a few people who find the simplicity of DRK fun.)

PLD is the best in pretty much any situation, be it MT, OT, ease, fun, etc.

The only exception is lower levels, where maybe WAR is more fun, since it has berserk, and PLD lacks the fun abilities till closer to 50+

---

Has DRK always been considered the easiest or have the changes with SB pushed it here?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mantra

Has DRK always been considered the easiest or have the changes with SB pushed it here?

---

No, DRK was definitely more complex than PLD pre-SB and arguably still is. It is simpler than it was before the expansion, however I haven't a clue as to why they would deem PLD as more complex that DRK.

All tanks are pretty much "good" at everything. Though some are able to do things that others can't.

Lemme start off by saying why I play Warrior. They're rather simple reasons, actually kinda silly now that I think of it. The first is that I like having the most HP. And the second is that their animations look and sound a lot cooler.

Paladins have a shield and are able to block attacks. It's very strong now that they can block magic. The other two tanks aren't able to do that.

And Dark Knight... I mean, I guess people like the fact that they wield a big-ass sword, and have an interesting arsenal of skills.

Don't worry about which one is the easiest or hardest, because none of them will be too hard that you won't be able to learn how to play with them properly. Just study their abilities, what each one can do, and pick the one you think you'll have the most fun with. In my case, I ended up with Warrior.

Lemme know watcha end up picking! :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mantra

snip

---

In regards to your original question, this expansion did a lot to even the viability of all tank. PLD being the strongest and WAR the weakest (note that the margin here is small). Once the balancing patches come out, we will see how that changes. For a new tank I would recommend PLD or WAR as they have the most straightforward kits.

Wrote this in another thread on same topic - for 99% of the game, all 3 tanks are roughly equal in capability and functional use. So it comes down to what do you think looks coolest: giant axe, giant sword or sword/board.

End of the day, there is a tiny amount of the game where meta obsessed FCs and premade groups might resign WAR-DRK to OT, if invite them at all. IMHO, if that happens to me, you or anyone...make better friends, join a better FC.

So pick - giant axe, giant sword, or sword/shield. Everything else will be roughly equivalent.

I would say: PLD.

War have many issues right now, most will only be visible in end game content, but one will bug you through your entire career: The AoE agro tool for Warriors is a cone that needs repositioning to hit as many foes as possible, plus a target in the right direction.

PLD or DRK both will have an easier time holding agro throughout the leveling content, and PLD will simply be easier overall.

The thing that "bugs" me about Overpower is that it uses TP, and our only TP generator (other than time) regens a whopping 200 TP every minute, in DPS stance. PLD and DRK both have their AoE threat tool as a spell, and both have MP regen tied to one or more combo attacks, giving them essentially unlimited AoE aggro generating capability in either stance, where a WAR must manage resources and stances much closer.

Would be awesome of BB combo became a TP generator.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Venjenz

Snip.

---

Torn between sword and small sword and shield! Guess ill have to look at their abilities, thanks!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chronons

Snip.

---

Thanks for the info!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BluexBird

Snip.

---

Im torn between PLD and DRK. I like the idea of both but I think Im leaning more towards DRK as I think the class story will be more interesting, although the PLD abilities seem cool too. Such a hard choice! Thanks for the reply.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chronons

Snip.

---

Thanks for the info.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ogulbuk

Would be awesome of BB combo became a TP generator.

---

For PLD and DRK, it is the first combo button, not second, so it should really be on Skull Sunder. It's the one ting that has always bugged me about the job, and no idea why SE has let it go so long.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Venjenz

The thing that "bugs" me about Overpower is that it uses TP, and our only TP generator (other than time) regens a whopping 200 TP every minute, in DPS stance. PLD and DRK both have their AoE threat tool as a spell, and both have MP regen tied to one or more combo attacks, giving them essentially unlimited AoE aggro generating capability in either stance, where a WAR must manage resources and stances much closer.

---

Warriors have Steel Cyclone. That's arguably the best AoE enmity generator in the whole game! In fact, it's BECAUSE you have Steel Cyclone, that you don't have to blow ALL your TP into generating agro.

If you're running out of TP as a Warrior, you're doing something wrong.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Venjenz

For PLD and DRK, it is the first combo button, not second, so it should really be on Skull Sunder. It's the one ting that has always bugged me about the job, and no idea why SE has let it go so long.

---

I guess because even now I think it's weird that a combo that requires TP to execute refunds TP.

Maybe a much more realistic expectation would be to have Overpower have a Combo Action off Skull Sunder to cost half TP (similar to how DRG Ring of Thorns used to cost half TP if used as a Combo Action from Power Surge.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BluexBird

Warriors have Steel Cyclone. That's arguably the best AoE enmity generator in the whole game! In fact, it's BECAUSE you have Steel Cyclone, that you don't have to blow ALL your TP into generating agro.

If you're running out of TP as a Warrior, you're doing something wrong.

---

I'm glad that all your groups wait for you to finish 2 full combo rotation before they go all out on your spawns. People I meet are not that patient. A single Steel Cyclone is awesome, if you already have the BG, but with the amount of damage DPS are doing, it's not enough and you are likely to have agro taken away from you before you finish a second round, forcing you to throw quite a few Overpowers, or tomahawks all over the place.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BluexBird

Warriors have Steel Cyclone. That's arguably the best AoE enmity generator in the whole game! In fact, it's BECAUSE you have Steel Cyclone, that you don't have to blow ALL your TP into generating agro.

If you're running out of TP as a Warrior, you're doing something wrong.

---

I don't run out of TP, and I do use Steel Cyclone...often. But our AE aggro generation requires closer management than PLD and DRK because they have their MP regen tied to a 1st combo button attack. I rarely run low on TP, but longer fights (dragon trash between 2nd and 3rd boss of Sohm Al is a good example) do stretch the budget. And I didn't say we cannot AE, I said "WAR must manage resources and stances closer" for AoE spam.

One thing to keep in mind is DRK starts at level 30 while PLD and WAR start at level 1.

I have played all 3 and like DRK best.

PLD main here but i played all of them during HW.

Pld is the one that teaches you tanking the best in dungeons and instances imo, and is in a very good spot rn so i def recommend it but the other tanks are not bad either even if they might lack raid utility rn, this will hopefully be fixed soon

My advice would be 'try out pld and see if you like the principle of being tank' (don't be discouraged if you lose aggro sometimes esp before u get tank stance) and if you see that you like doing it, you can try the other classes and play around with them

I don't have any issues with Steel Cyclone usage. The very first pack eats the initial SC from Infuriate, then after that I generally generate enough of it. Storm's Path generates this more quickly than the other 3rd combo skills do, and its selfheal helps a bit with keeping me up while taking several mobs, before switching to the Butcher's Block rotation after most of the mobs have eaten one Maim debuff each.

The loss of potency from not using BB is generally compensated by the increased damage the slasher-type DPS classes get out of AoEing SP'd mobs, and this gives more SCs to use for both the AoE emnity as well as damage (since the mobs the later ones hit are Maimed). In general I enter most fights with nearly 100 BG, then SC as necessary to avoid going over 100 or losing threat. If running out of SCs you're probably BBing a bit too much and SPing too rarely.

Overpower spamming is an emergency technique really. If the SC rotation is working normally it should be impossible for DPS to pull aggro off you. It's easier to pull aggro off a PLD since they don't normally use Flash that often being a zero damage skill, while SC is an integral part of the normal attacks. And using overpower drains TP, which limits how soon you can engage the next mob set without relying on either Goad or risking running out of TP (and having aggro cascade over your party).

WAR has more self-sustain, which can be good for running roulettes since you can keep yourself alive to finish off a boss even if everyone else dies. PLD on the other hand is more optimal nowadays if you're running with people you can trust to do their jobs properly.

Good thread. Not to hijack here but I did some low level marauder tanking before jumping into a healer and leveling. Just finished the SB story and am considering picking up tanking as an alt class. Since I skipped most of the dungeons with potd spamming (bad I know) any advice for starting to build that tanking confidence and not piss off too many groups?

Thinking DRK or War tank.

As a general rule of tanking, if someone else tried to pull ahead of you, let them tank it until they die and/or wipe the group. Death is the ultimate teacher for those derps.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

Easiest: DRK
Mild: PLD
Hardest: WAR

As for "Fun"
PLD and DRK.
PLD is a bit more of a challenge, but still plenty easy.
DRK is straightforward. (I actually find DRK boring as heck, but there's quite a few people who find the simplicity of DRK fun.)

PLD is the best in pretty much any situation, be it MT, OT, ease, fun, etc.

The only exception is lower levels, where maybe WAR is more fun, since it has berserk, and PLD lacks the fun abilities till closer to 50+

---

I really, really wouldn't call DRK easy at all. At endgame for a seasoned tank both PLD and DRK are fairly simple but DRK has a lot more options in regards to how they spend their MP and MP management. The only reason WAR is so difficult right now it because it's a little clunky and in all likelyhood we'll be seeing some changes in the coming month to make it both more fluid and more viable.
PLD has and always will be the simplest of the 3 tanks in the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SunAurel

PLD main here but i played all of them during HW.

Pld is the one that teaches you tanking the best in dungeons and instances imo, and is in a very good spot rn so i def recommend it but the other tanks are not bad either even if they might lack raid utility rn, this will hopefully be fixed soon

My advice would be 'try out pld and see if you like the principle of being tank' (don't be discouraged if you lose aggro sometimes esp before u get tank stance) and if you see that you like doing it, you can try the other classes and play around with them

---

Pretty much this. PLD is excellent at teaching how to tank as up to lvl 54 or so you only have one single target combo, and 2 aoe skills which have different functions. Meanwhile WAR is about managing the beast gauge and using Inner beast at the right time to mitigate stuff, and doing loads of damage when you can afford it. DRK is more about MP management which adds a great deal of complexity to the class.
Back in 3.x i would argue that DRK was the hardest of the 3 tanks but now i'd say that WAR has taken that spot as i mentioned because of its overall lack of fluidity which will likely be fixed. Again like i said in about a months time or so i'd wager that DRK/WAR will be the most complicated to a similar degree where as PLD will be the simplest, this is how it's always been and forcing people to swap which tank they play the most because they want to play the simplest for example is bad game design, it will be fixed. Ofcoure this is all about endgame and as far as leveling goes either of the 3 tanks are completely fine. i suggest OP just picks the one they like the look of most and look up some basic tanking 101 guides.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ogulbuk

I guess because even now I think it's weird that a combo that requires TP to execute refunds TP.

Maybe a much more realistic expectation would be to have Overpower have a Combo Action off Skull Sunder to cost half TP (similar to how DRG Ring of Thorns used to cost half TP if used as a Combo Action from Power Surge.)



I'm glad that all your groups wait for you to finish 2 full combo rotation before they go all out on your spawns. People I meet are not that patient. A single Steel Cyclone is awesome, if you already have the BG, but with the amount of damage DPS are doing, it's not enough and you are likely to have agro taken away from you before you finish a second round, forcing you to throw quite a few Overpowers, or tomahawks all over the place.

---

Isn't that the truth. Sometime you don't even get a chance to gather the mob and use overpower before the dps are exploding everywhere.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aescwhisky

any advice for starting to not piss off too many groups?

---

I mean this, there is NO way you can tank, and make everyone happy.

You WILL have people who complain you pulled too many mobs, and those who complain you pulled too few of mobs.
You WILL have people who complain you're not in tank stance enough, and those who complain ur not in DPS stance enough.
And so forth.


You're best option, is to turn party chat off, and pretend they arent there.

Spam ur AoEs, rotate ur CDs if ur high enough to do so. (otherwise 1 decent one at the start)
Then rotate ur single target threat for low levels, and single target DPS for higher levels.

Look at netflix, and dont look back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VenKitsune

DRK has a lot more options in regards to how they spend their MP and MP management.

---

ok, so every GCD that works with DA grants 140 potency with Dark Arts.
So Dark Arts can be seen as 25% of your MP should equate 140 potency or more.
Dark Passenger only does this in groups of mobs. So on single target, ignore dark passenger.
DA Dark Passenger has the same problem as above.

Now, the only move that generates more than 140 potency with DA is Carve n Spit, which is oGCD, so you'll always want to keep ur MP above 25%.
If you do mess up, you have better means to get the MP for it now, such as a syphon strike. (Waiting is still a DPS loss)

Thats your only means to mess up really.

Unless you count using Blackest Night, and the shield doesnt break, as that would be a DPS loss. Or hitting Dark Passenger Button.

Blackest Night is still a DPS loss for Blood Spiller, but something minimal as 1% or less, so technically u dont have to worry about it, just do it anyways, if u know the shield will break, helps the healers at least.

Unleash is terrible, unless the enemies are spread too far apart, where abyssal drain cant reach them.

So you just look at the priority for what to spend ur MP on.

Keep 25% Mp for Blackest Night on TB, or for CnS.
above 25%, hit Dark Arts, because sooner or later you'll syphon strike, soul eater, or blood spiller. (Soul Eater scales its heal downward if u use dark arts, so there is 0 reason to pick which move should be DAed.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mikazuki_Aura

It's easier to pull aggro off a PLD since they don't normally use Flash that often being a zero damage skill

---

Just wanted to mention, Flash might not do dmg, but its treated as if it does, as it has potency attached to it, that scales off attack power. (I think its 100 potency, if i remember correctly. It currently generates twice the threat Unleash does, but unleash might have had its multiplier raised to make up for it being cut in half, along with darkside raising it 20% more.)

EDIT: Bloodspiller potency went up, and is now a DPS increase with blackest night.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

snip

---

I feel thats a bit of an oversimplification but we're comparing DRK complexity to PLD. What you've said there is already vastly more complex than PLD which is litterally; You learn most of your rotation by the time you hit lvl 60, and the only addition going up to 70 is holy spirit spam. PLD is still objectively easier in every way.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aescwhisky

Good thread. Not to hijack here but I did some low level marauder tanking before jumping into a healer and leveling. Just finished the SB story and am considering picking up tanking as an alt class. Since I skipped most of the dungeons with potd spamming (bad I know) any advice for starting to build that tanking confidence and not piss off too many groups?

Thinking DRK or War tank.

---

I'm in a similar situation as well. What's a good recommendation for a "get your feet wet" sort of dungeon in the level 60 range? Or should I jump down to something lower?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camiie

I'm in a similar situation as well. What's a good recommendation for a "get your feet wet" sort of dungeon in the level 60 range? Or should I jump down to something lower?

---

I certainly feel like POTD might ease you into a tank role, but that might be my dumb opinion. As far as regular 60 dungeons go Balsaers Wall was one of my favorite places to expiriment in HW. Or you can go trial by fire and tank A8 Brute Justice solo. :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NosValk

I certainly feel like POTD might ease you into a tank role, but that might be my dumb opinion. As far as regular 60 dungeons go Balsaers Wall was one of my favorite places to experiment in HW. Or you can go trial by fire and tank A8 Brute Justice solo. :)

---

Thanks! I ended up just jumping into a PF for Sirensong Sea that welcomed new players and it went OK. Main problem I had was rounding up the jellyfish mobs in the first room. Ran a 50/60 roulette later and got Sohr Khai. That actually went a bit worse, but I learned a lot and we got through since the DPS could just melt everything.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VenKitsune

I really, really wouldn't call DRK easy at all. At endgame for a seasoned tank both PLD and DRK are fairly simple but DRK has a lot more options in regards to how they spend their MP and MP management. The only reason WAR is so difficult right now it because it's a little clunky and in all likelyhood we'll be seeing some changes in the coming month to make it both more fluid and more viable.

---

well, has all tank at level 70 and i really like to use DRK to do expert/50:60/leveling roulette, aside from mp manage (which you pretty much know 1 or 2 thing about it if you level up DRk normal through dungeon) DRk has some really great skill for AOE tanking which make trash pull in dungeon feel quite smoothe compare to PLD and WAR, also the blackest night is really the best defensive cd ever, can't say about other tank now because they increase enmity generate abit for all tank but as in 4.0 DRK really my favor for daily dungeon

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VenKitsune

I feel thats a bit of an oversimplification but we're comparing DRK complexity to PLD. What you've said there is already vastly more complex than PLD which is litterally; You learn most of your rotation by the time you hit lvl 60, and the only addition going up to 70 is holy spirit spam. PLD is still objectively easier in every way.

---

due to my post going boom, and too lazy to repeat it, PLD plays the same way DRK does with watching MP, as it has to try to get its MP to above 80%, while keeping it below 90%, as to maintain DPS, and switch between magic of phsyical dps buffs.
IMO PLD edges out DRK slightly in difficulty.
Its not by a lot, but enough to say DRK is the easier one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

due to my post going boom, and too lazy to repeat it, PLD plays the same way DRK does with watching MP, as it has to try to get its MP to above 80%, while keeping it below 90%, as to maintain DPS, and switch between magic of phsyical dps buffs.
IMO PLD edges out DRK slightly in difficulty.
Its not by a lot, but enough to say DRK is the easier one.

---

huh? sorry im going to have to disagree.
At lvl 70 PLD it's litterally Requiescat then spam Holy spirit basically until you're out of mana (you can usually safely bottom out on mana as switching stance is cheap on PLD), then its back to your lvl 60 rotation. boom thats lvl 70 PLD which is extremely easy in terms of actually doing your job and how they deal damage.
DRK on the other hand actually has a gauge to manage with a priority system all the while maintaining atleast 40%-50% MP for any surprise TBNs and stance switching that may be needed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VenKitsune

huh? sorry im going to have to disagree.
At lvl 70 PLD it's litterally Requiescat then spam Holy spirit basically until you're out of mana (you can usually safely bottom out on mana as switching stance is cheap on PLD), then its back to your lvl 60 rotation. boom thats lvl 70 PLD which is extremely easy in terms of actually doing your job and how they deal damage.
DRK on the other hand actually has a gauge to manage with a priority system all the while maintaining atleast 40%-50% MP for any surprise TBNs and stance switching that may be needed.

---

PLD raises its dmg when its MP is above 80%, and also fight or flight raises physical dmg, so you need to alternate bwteen magical and phsyical, depending on buff, while making sure u get the right amount of MP back before the buff is off CD, so as to maximize DPS.

in any prior savage content, there were no surprises, so u didnt need to save extra MP as DRK or anything, due to knowing what was going to happen.

you also dont need to maintain/watch the blood guage, because the moment u have bloodspiller, you use it like an oGCD getting off CD. There shouldnt be any more thought in it than that on single target.

In AoE, you just hit quietus when mobs spawn.

In leveling content, or new content, where you dont know whats going to happen, then i could agree than DRK requires holding its MP more than PLD, as ur not going to be maximizing ur DPS in content you dont know.