Well they mentioned that they want all the tank classes to be equal good as MT and ST. But then from what i look at skill list now. Pla attack only have 10 potential increase on each in exchange for nerfed utility. Then all of Oath gauge skills are meant for reducing damage only. While War and Drk can spending their gauge for powerful/strong attack skill.
So i don\\'t think this will be like what they said. Pla still better at damage reduction, while lower dps as always anyway. I don\\'t see how pla new update will make equal dps tp Drk and War at all. Just saying.
I don't think pla will do enough dps as ST
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06-16-2017, 01:52 PMAliseEven after SB, Pla still has weaker dps than DRK/WAR as ST
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06-16-2017, 01:54 PMAlise
Sorry for little typo. Text this from mobile phone and there is no option for editing
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06-16-2017, 01:55 PMeagledorf
Are you trolling?
Because PLD got an entirely new caster phase to their rotation and Fight or Flight uptime was enhanced from 33% to 42%. The potency buffs to their combos are only one small part of the DPS increase.
PLD still is weak in AoE and has to do 0 DPS to self-heal, but in terms of maximum single target output they should be substantially ahead of the other two tanks unless something has been adjusted behind the scenes. -
06-16-2017, 01:59 PMAlise
Without gauge, they might be on pair but when DRK and WAR spending their gauge for high potency attack. They will still be better. Pla can only use gauge for damage reduction
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06-16-2017, 02:05 PMThoro39
PLD got:
- Higher natural potencies in 350 potency combo finisher & 670 potency dot finisher, while WAR is limited to 260~280 combo finishers and DRK'S 280~420 Combo finishers. The potency difference is massive.
- 61% buff uptime under a 20% damage buff between FoF + ResQ
- 5 times spammable magic nuke under 20% damage buff every 60 seconds, whereas WAR is limited to 9 Fellcleaves per 120 seconds(making it effectively 4.5~5 fellcleaves per minute) and DRK to 2-3 Bloodsplitters every 60 seconds
- Highest number of OGCD damage moves with 4 OGCDs while WAR only has 2 and DRK only 3
- On top of all that, PLD still retains SwordOath damage
It's really easy to see how PLD pulls ahead of DRK and WAR in pure damage. -
06-16-2017, 02:07 PMaqskerorokero
Going to be MT anyway, and pld no longer I dare say any weakness in damage mitigation. If OT the pld's job is to enchance the actuall MT's defence and dealing decent damage.
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06-16-2017, 02:08 PMAlise
@Thoro
^So you are saying that Pla has better dps than them both even without spending oath gauge for any dps at all? We will see in-game soon. I don't think that would be the case tho
Btw Pla nuke magic is base on ViT or base on INT? Because Pla has low INT -
06-16-2017, 02:10 PMThoro39It doesn't matter. Warrior's use their gauge for fellcleave. DRK use their MP&Bloodgauge for Bloodspiller. PLD uses their MP for 480 potency magic nukes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alise
All Tankclasses have their equivalent nukes gated behind resources whether it be the bar or MP, so they are equal in that regard.
Effectively it actually makes PLD better at stancedancing since the loss of bar means nothing to PLD's dps, whereas a WAR and DRK lose massive amount of DPS by switching Tankstances.
And all Tankattacks are based on Attackdamage (STR). It's NOT based on INT. It never has been that way in this game. Ninja's Magic attacks always scaled with DEX instead of INT for example. -
06-16-2017, 02:11 PMeagledorfPLD spells are all based on STR. They always have been since 3.0 D=Quote:
Originally Posted by Alise
Edit: Well, they're a hybrid of STR+VIT now I guess. -
06-16-2017, 02:14 PMThoro39
They'd never change a tanks damage to INT. There have been several classes like Ninja that use Magic attacks, yet their magic attacks scale to DEX. Even DRKs respective magic attack scaled towards its mainstats, not INT.
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06-16-2017, 02:14 PMFalar
It is based on ATK damage, with 4.0 going back to STR alone determining ATK damage.
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06-16-2017, 02:17 PMPori_DessuThing is, at least as a DRK (I haven't played WAR), our gauge based high potency attack is overall weaker than Scourge (Which we lost) and is harder to use as well. The buff to Souleater combo only puts it in equal footing with old Delirium combo, and as interesting as Dark Arts + Syphon Strike sounds, it's still isn't enough to make up for all the DPS we lost.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alise
Not mentioning the fact that at least on paper, the job just looks more boring to play than before. I'll still play it till 70 once Early access is up, but if it really ends up playing how it's looking on paper, I'll just switch to RDM and wait for the day they give us some love again. -
06-16-2017, 02:27 PMAlise
So mainly i think they buff Pla dps up a bit and then also reduce dps of other tank jobs a bit too in order to make them equal and far from real dps class. I don't think they consider it is good to have certain tanks with similar dps to real dps class at all. There were the case of good War who could parse with bad skills MNK before.
I guess people who play DRK might find that it is boring to do low dps which is the current main complaining right? Because they play DRK expected them to be Dps tank? But as SE mention, they want tank to be a tank and not a dps. And they want all tank to do about the same dps also. -
06-16-2017, 02:32 PMThoro39
Current potency value suggest that PLD will do 20% more than both DRK AND WAR, the supposed DPS tank, not only DRK
Surely you see the issue in the best defense Tank PLD also dealing the highest amount of Damage while offering the highest amount of Healing and Shield Utility. -
06-16-2017, 02:32 PMPori_Dessu
But the buffs to DPS in PLD actually put it ahead DPS wise of the other two tanks. Some theorycrafters estimated a 25% higher dps on PLD, back with info from media tour, which hasn't changed much.
Also, the job doesn't look boring to me because of lower DPS, but because of lower complexity (The reason I didn't like playing PLD).
Right now, I'm starting to believe it'd have been better if they released DRK as a DPS job like it has always been in FF games. -
06-16-2017, 02:33 PMFalarIf there was any "DPS tank" it was WAR, not DRK. We had some good AoE though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alise
Doing 60-70% of the damage of a DPS was nice, it made the class fun to play.
I am guessing we are gonna be in the 30-40 range now. No thanks. -
06-16-2017, 02:38 PMAliseCan't say. We don't know if all will have same STR from now on or not. And remember they seem doing thing with their value worthness also.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pori_Dessu
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06-16-2017, 02:43 PMPori_DessuWell, I hope you're correct and the damage calculation and stats system changed enough to make the raw potency difference in the job kits not be relevant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alise
But even if DRK remains good, if it's as boring as is looking to be, I'll be changing to RDM and take the endless queue time. -
06-16-2017, 02:52 PMAlise
Even main Pla, i want to change to RDM too. But i think dps population is too high and difficult to find pt, so i will continue with tank for now.
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06-17-2017, 02:23 PMDizzy_DerpWell you need a "dps tank" otherwise it's not balanced and you should just have one tank. Each tank has to bring something to the group different problem is right now pld has the most mitigation, the most party utility, And the most dps. Where as warrior, who use to be the highest dps tank, is no longer the highest dps nor does it have any party utility other than Slashing which two dps have now. Andit has the lowest mitigation of the three tanks. Also all of its moves dps are locked behind a gage that halves when stance swapping so it's clunky. So pld is I a great place right now tbh. War however is trash tier.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alise
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06-18-2017, 04:44 AMBughuntlv426
PLD literally out POTperGCDs WAR and DRK by almost 30 %.