Raid 260 gear being ninjaed looted by 270's in DS :(

I'm kinda tired TRYING to gear myself through DS and ended up getting ninja looted by high ilevel geared monk (270) even when i asked and told i'm trying to gear my Monk for SAM and they simply ignored me now this puts me off from playing this game and really should add personal loot instead (class only gear) ...

They may have wanted the gear for glamour purpose.

It's frustrating... still only have the pants. I'm thinking that it's better to just leave when there's another caster, did this when WoD was current and managed to complete the set without it taking too long.

did you run as a monk?

They have every right to roll greed or need on it. If you need the gear, go as that class and roll need so that you're only competing with people of the same job as you. Would it be nice if they let a person undergeared have the drops? Sure. Is that expected or required of them or are you entitled to the drops? No. So queue up again on the job you want gear for and run the content until you get it. Making a post like this does nothing to help your gearing goals.

What if they were trying to save gear for SAM too?

Ninjas can't roll need on monk gear though

Topic comes up again and again; if you have the option to NEED on an item in a party with no loot rules (like the DF), and you want it for whatever reason (glamour, use, complete the set, GC seals, retainer, whatever other reason you can think of), you are fully allowed to roll NEED. Same for rolling GREED.

One person's need for an item does not outweigh another's here, only whether RNG is in your favor or the person who you are rolling against.

You are allowed to ask that people pass certain gear, but they are also allowed to say that they are rolling on it or, if they give no answer, assume they will.

Only time this does not apply is in a pre-formed party where the loot rules are stated in the PF or in party chat before entering the instance. GMs will enforce loot rules spelled out this way if they are broken and reported.

You're in i250/255 crafted HQ gear which will suffice at 60SAM. Shut up and stop complaining.

I once was trying to get the gear in World of Darkness in 2.5 as a black mage, and said "Well I hope there aren't any other black mages", then got into a party with four other black mages.

That was fun though, because we bonded over us all being there for the exact same thing. Was super rad, we started chanting "GONNA BURN IT UP AND GET LOUD, TURN THAT BOSS INTO A MUSHROOM CLOUD". Worth more than the gear for sure.

I mean, if you really want SAM gear, go get some scripture.

Didn't read my main post i'm only complaining that 270's that already geared and rolling need over someone who's is 250/255 who wanted get 260 gear to help them get better ....

I ended up last night with 4 mnks in my party and me being a caster. I was thinking sh... not going to get any loot I could have greeded on and that's fine since I came as caster. Turned out, the mnk's wanted casting gear for upcoming rdm and since my main is fully geared, I passed in exchange for them passing the mnk gear. So it was win/win for everybody, however i can't assume because I want specific gear, even if I am lowered geared or not even on the correct class to begin with, that it will be passed along. It sucks we can all agree on that, but there's a reason it's called gear farming. Run it the whole week, pretty sure you end up fully geared at the end :)

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Originally Posted by Drakeos

Didn't read my main post i'm only complaining that 270's that already geared and rolling need over someone who's is 250/255 who wanted get 260 gear to help them get better ....

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Everyone read it. Even if you were wearing 120 you aren't entitled to any gear. If anyone rolls Need on gear THEY ARE PLAYING THE GAME EXACTLY HOW IT WAS DESIGNED. I run DS because I NEED 260 gear for my retainers.

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Originally Posted by Zodiar

Ninjas can't roll need on monk gear though

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Can confirm.... >.>

Next time you should tell them how you're more entitled to the gear than they are because you have lower ilvl. Why do you even care about 260 gear when you could just be a scrip scrub with proto mixings? That would put you at 270.

Wish they went the route of personal loot. Last i checked it did fix the whole issue WoW had back then. Like lets say the alliance A beats the boss, everyone in the group gets something. some get some gear, while others get extra tomes. but each person is guaranteed a piece gear even if you haven't received any from the prior bosses.

It is what is is unfortunately. FYI I know that you know that nobody is trying to attack you (hopefully), but what people are saying is true. Hopefully it won't deter you from enjoying the game. Doing Dun Scaith isnt a COMPLETE waste. You get i270 accs and some scripture. Were I you, I'd just meld my i250 gear to make up for the little stats that you gaint from i260 if it means that much. Instead of farming DS, I'd advise to to invest your time else where since scripture caps got raised. Just a suggestion though.

Maybe you'll get a better group later on.

If there was any restriction people would just wear 250 ilvl crafted gear or ilvl 245 dungeon gear in slots they want to have a specific piece for.

What if I'm a 270 DRG, but lacking acc because of alex pants and I actually wanna do something above Thordan Ex? So, do I have to buy the shire pants (well, prop gonna buy them anyway) or should I be allowed to roll on the DS pants with accuracy as well?

Hmm, I wonder if people would be more open to the idea of seals and glamour if they got it moving sooner - well obviously just adding the glamour log would open people's mind to it more /if/ you can access it sooner than later.

As for the seals, I feel like people don't really think about that till much later generally so perhaps:

I think it might be nice to help keep players moving through their leveling process be a bit stronger (particularly damage stats, maybe not so much on survival stats.. to keep the few dangerous zones still dangerous) against all the max capped players (extra helpful for new tank players) if GC gear was buffed. It could simply be the morale system except for PvE content -- or sweet new set bonuses rather than some of the sad ones I've seen lol. Then people can roll whatever the system gives them, because they'll want it for GC gear and glamour. GC Gear now = the best leveling gear, and you're encouraged to obtain items for their looks and then gobble them up for seals (well unless you're moving so fast that it doesn't matter, or in PotD).

Probably won't change the world lol, but maybe it would increase the amount of people who think "why you roll for you /you dont need it!/" except of course there are quite a few helpful reasons why someone would still roll, they just don't realize it yet.

Personal loot is looking better and better.

If someone 'steals' your 260 piece and have 270. Link their bad parse. They'll probably commit suicide since linking parses is the worst evilest thing you can do in this community.

Was it a MENTOR?

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Originally Posted by Kaethra

Personal loot is looking better and better.

If someone 'steals' your 260 piece and have 270. Link their bad parse. They'll probably commit suicide since linking parses is the worst evilest thing you can do in this community.

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great idea -> give someone a report reason just because you are pissed of the rng-system... i assume you are wearing a mentor crown ingame, don't you? .___.

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Originally Posted by Drakeos

I'm kinda tired TRYING to gear myself through DS and ended up getting ninja looted by high ilevel geared monk (270) even when i asked and told i'm trying to gear my Monk for SAM and they simply ignored me now this puts me off from playing this game and really should add personal loot instead (class only gear) ...

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Question? Why are you "wasting" your time, if you want the best gear for your SAM just save enough coins for upgrades items and keep farming tomes, cap should be remove at some point before expansion.

You were on a level playing field, and he rolled higher. That's all there is to it - you're not more entitled to loot for any reason. Rolling Need on gear for glamour or GC seals is as good a reason as any.

In a static situation, gearing up a lower ilvl member might make sense, but in a random 24m pug thing, it's of no benefit to anyone else to get you the gear first.
Gearing your monk alt up is no more important than any reason anyone else is running it for. You're both there putting in the work and time, why are you more entitled to the gear?
That other player might not see the gear for several more runs, and then lose it 3 times over or something, just because they passed it to you.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

cap should be remove at some point before expansion.

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All the cap are already removed

You simply can't do more than kindly ask in the beginning for specific parts - thats what I do for glam or retainer - my exp asking for a whole cls drop kit seems kinda greedy and less will be that kind to you but if you ask for one specific part per run, most of the grps are kind enough to hand that one over to you. Else like the others said go with a "need" cls and try your luck on rng - it's fair enough though... even I can feel ya pain as a raid-gear collector... I still miss ct1 tank headgear and 2-3 parts to complete the arc3 sets... yet I hate it to tank ct1... but this missing light warrior diadem kills me x'D

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Originally Posted by Arutan

All the cap are already removed

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think he meant the weekly cap at all... although it was increased to 900 farming for 2000 in a few days would be even easier to prepare sub-cls. ^^

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Originally Posted by Kaethra

Personal loot is looking better and better.

If someone 'steals' your 260 piece and have 270. Link their bad parse. They'll probably commit suicide since linking parses is the worst evilest thing you can do in this community.

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Not gonna touch on the parsing subject here, but I 100% agree on what you said about personal loot. If I had my way, the 24-man raids would drop a personal chest for everyone with 8 overall gear pieces in it, of which you could select one for your weekly lot or pass them all to try again in another run.

A 2-loot personal chest after each boss would also work but I feel like that would just encourage looting and scooting even more. Hence, my suggestion about having all the pieces backloaded onto the final boss of the raid.

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Originally Posted by Kaethra

Personal loot is looking better and better.

If someone 'steals' your 260 piece and have 270. Link their bad parse. They'll probably commit suicide since linking parses is the worst evilest thing you can do in this community.

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Originally Posted by Arutan

Was it a MENTOR?

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Follwing up on our forum memes here...

"So much toxicity!"

How is it "ninjaed" if they just used a system the game has in place for gear? If you want it, you need to queue so you can roll need on it as well.

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Originally Posted by Drakeos

I'm kinda tired TRYING to gear myself through DS and ended up getting ninja looted by high ilevel geared monk (270) even when i asked and told i'm trying to gear my Monk for SAM and they simply ignored me now this puts me off from playing this game and really should add personal loot instead (class only gear) ...

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Ninja Looting

http://i.memecaptain.com/gend_images/WFkrzw.jpg

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Originally Posted by Endeleon

How is it "ninjaed" if they just used a system the game has in place for gear?

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The original ninjas did just that as well - the systems at the time allowed for taking everything. The term has nothing to do with hacking, it's about using the system in place in a way deemed inappropriate.

If you are playing the job in question and there's another player in the party who could out-need you for the items, try asking politely if they will pass for you since it's an upgrade. Many players will be happy to do this.

If they decline, then not much you can do. They have just as much right to need an item as you do, regardless of whether they want it for seals, glamours, or fancy toilet paper.

To challenge this is basically petty entitlement.

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Originally Posted by Arutan

All the cap are already removed

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The cap for scripture is still there (900 atm).

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Originally Posted by Crysten

try asking politely if they will pass for you since it's an upgrade.

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this. It's so simple....this community isnt so bad and toxic that everyone will rightout refuse your request.
Yes, there may be someone who is also specifically looking for that piece, and in that case: too bad. But I sometimes do this, even if its just for meaningless glams and more often than not, people actually pass for me.



Other than that, I suggest, that for the future you decide what gear you need the most out of those 24 man alliances and try to get them while they're still on weekly lockout.
I've gotten a lot of gear that way, because people wont mindlessly greed everything.

For now: get the shire gear and upgrade it to 270? Or...just do some more runs and investigate if anyone else is after the mnk pieces youre looking for.

if you want 50 gear run final coil with people you know, or collect poetics, if you want 60 gear get the scripture for shire, it's gotten pretty easy to farm now, also dungeon gear at best will be crap at stormblood so you def dont want it, but it is a nice holding piece.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

The original ninjas did just that as well - the systems at the time allowed for taking everything. The term has nothing to do with hacking, it's about using the system in place in a way deemed inappropriate.

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No it was about breaking verbal agreements.

A group lead would set to master looter tell the group that items would be rolled for and go to highest roller. Most of the instance would work like that until the super rare item dropped, and the leader would immediately lot to himself and leave group, like a ninja dropping a smoke bomb to exit a room.

Much different then rolling need in a loot system that's only stipulation is that you can roll need if you can equip the item.

Could they implement a better loot system? Absolutely. No argument there.

Were you entitled to a piece of loot from another player who was running that job and rolled need?

No, you weren't. The Dun Scaith chest is the best MNK chest outside of the Alexander chest, if I recall correctly. Even if everything else on him was 270, he still may have needed the Dun Scaith piece for stat balancing.

Was it rude of him not to offer an explanation? Eh, maybe. But you weren't entitled to that gear.

How can ninja looting occur in a game that makes everyone roll for an item? There isn't DKP biddng on an open item that anyone can simply take, so ninja looting is impossible, right?

Am I missing an open loot mechanic where the gear simply sits on the mob or on the ground and anyone can just grab it? I thought every rollable item got a roll?

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Originally Posted by Venjenz

How can ninja looting occur in a game that makes everyone roll for an item? There isn't DKP biddng on an open item that anyone can simply take, so ninja looting is impossible, right?

Am I missing an open loot mechanic where the gear simply sits on the mob or on the ground and anyone can just grab it? I thought every rollable item got a roll?

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I can't remember the Nin cls release time. but this:

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Originally Posted by Zojha

The original ninjas did just that as well - the systems at the time allowed for taking everything. The term has nothing to do with hacking, it's about using the system in place in a way deemed inappropriate.

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...sounds that they messed up the distriction of Nin rules/rights in the loot system itself... if that's the case and they were able to "need" on every cls gear... I wouldn't be surprised of the term "ninjaed" xD

on the other hand "ninjaed" is a common term for something stolen right beyond your nose it's not related to the Nin cls itself... : o