No Community

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Doing some housekeeping.
I can't delete this post so I'm going to delete the contents.

I guess I wasn't aware so many people were struggling to make social connections in Final Fantasy XIV; but I think that it may be that the game allows for a wider demographic of players that could be causing the issue with finding like-minded players.

In Final Fantasy XI, if you saw someone who had made considerable progress in the game, then you knew right off that it was their kind of game and you immediately had something in common with them in terms of play style.

Here, you have some players who are here long-term/hardcore raiders, but also plenty of players who have far less time/can't commit to a weekly schedule for a video game. Because of this, you can't tell if another player is like-minded until you've actually gotten to know them.

I see plenty of people chatting it up in /say in Limsa Lominsa, FCs inviting all ranges of players, and I've been in my current FC since roughly around ARR's launch (and apparently they were around while I was playing 1.0 as well, I just hadn't met them yet), and I'm not even on a locked population server like Balmung, but obviously my observations are limited to the 1 server, so perhaps my experience is an edge case.

-Free Company
-Linkshell
-Friend list
-Keyboard
-Hands

Done.

Honestly, the place where I've made the most friends recently in-game is ... The novice network. >.>

I guess newer players just aren't as jaded and generally have better attitudes towards the game.

There was one day where I actually hit the cap of how many people I can add to my friends list in one day, which honestly before that I didnt even realize there was a cap.

You are right OP. It's because this game is crossplay with PS4. Console players aren't meant to socialize (pretty casual they are), just do quests, dungeons and enjoy their little limited fun they have been enforced to. Then also there is no massive PVP which is very important thing for a MMORPG. Too casual i say, too much.

I disagree.

If you want to socialize with people, you do it yourself. Don't wait for others to come and talk to you.

Be active in your FC/LS. If you are doing daily roulettes ask if anyone wants to join you.
If you want to train or farm something speak/yell/shout. People will respond to you.

You'll eventually find a group of people always interacting with you.
I made friends though PF doing maps. It is that simple.

This game was designed to do things as a group. The only time you do things solo is some quests in MSQ.

I think, that TS just want people play with him all the time, just want to be carried everywhere

-I want to go to the dungeon!
-OK man, here we are, ready to go with you

-I want...!!!
-Ok, here we are. lets go

And so on. Dude, FF 14 have tons of social ways, but it doesn't mean, that your in-game interests must be the same as other people have

You say no community, except I've made countless friends via FFXIV, cross-data center too, as well as met my Fiancé through it. Don't go complaining on the forums that the game is supposed to do what YOU are supposed to do, that's not how socializing works. That's like saying an online food delivery app needs to know what kind of things you like and suggest based off that. It doesn't know you, so how is it going to know what you like and what you want to eat? On top of that, game difficulty has nothing to do with making friends, if you spend time together and have fun with whatever it is you do, you'll make friends.

This game is fine for Community, there's just so many people with social anxiety and fear of typing something beyond "Hello" at the start of a dungeon.

I came into this game at the recommendation of Two RL Friends who then ditched me for other games. Then server transferred to 2 more RL friends whom I had a falling out with over Raiding.

Fast Forward 2 years later I have 8 RL Friends from this game alone. We have RL meet ups and play multiple games together.

This game is harder on RL friendships than making new ones. You just have to find like-minded people and that doesn't mean just raid together. You will come across people with your sense of humor, outlook and play ethic if all you do is spend time with people on your friend list instead of treating it like A glorified Facebook Account assuming your friend list is some status symbol based on quantity.

And this is coming from someone who is considered "Not Well Liked" by others because of my views. If I can make eight friends IDK what's stopping the rest of you.

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Originally Posted by gastovski

You are right OP. It's because this game is crossplay with PS4. Console players aren't meant to socialize (pretty casual they are), just do quests, dungeons and enjoy their little limited fun they have been enforced to. Then also there is no massive PVP which is very important thing for a MMORPG. Too casual i say, too much.

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I'm sorry but I don't see how my being on ps4 makes a difference to wether people are social or not.

The game provides plenty of tools for being social, and I have a whole bunch of friendships that started in the game but now exist outside of it as well. The people are there, and the game lets you talk to them. The rest is squarely on the shoulders of the individual.

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Originally Posted by Parisstilton

I'm sorry but I don't see how my being on ps4 makes a difference to wether people are social or not.

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You would understand if you spend your entire childhood to adult since 90s with playing plenty of MMORPGs and MMOs on PC only.

I've had a full friendlist four months from when I started playing. This isn't a community issue, this is a "learn to talk to people" issue.

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Originally Posted by gastovski

You would understand if you spend your entire childhood to adult since 90s with playing plenty of MMORPGs and MMOs on PC only.

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You can plug in a usb keyboard to a ps4 just as easily as you can to a PC. Wireless keyboards work too.

If you wanted to, you can play on a PS4 exactly the same as you do on a PC. You can set up the UI to use the PC format and also plug in a usb/bluetooth mouse.

It also works the other way around. You can use the PS4 menu and use a controller on a PC.

So really the only difference between ps4 and PC in this game is a matter of slight performance enhancements and personal preference.

I disagree, there's so many ways to get to know people in this game. If you don't utilize those avenues, that's on you for not making friends or being social. Like others have said, in-game friendships have turned to RL ones for me as well - I had a friend come visit from out of state and stay with me and my hubby for a week, and we're going to see them for a week this year! So not really sure where the complaint is coming from.

Also...don't know why PS4 players gotta be dragged down like it's our fault OP isn't social >.> Doesn't really make a lot of sense.

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Originally Posted by gastovski

You would understand if you spend your entire childhood to adult since 90s with playing plenty of MMORPGs and MMOs on PC only.

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If you've been playing on PC only, how do you have any idea how console players socialize online?

I've been playing MMOs on consoles for nearly sixteen years, now, and I've had no difficulty socializing. I doubt I'm any kind of special exception.

I have friends, linkshells and static in the game. And I am not a social person. I make friends in this 3 years despite being unsocial. I can confirm you have plenty of tools too interact with others. Now we have cross server parties, only need now cross server Linkshells.

People who want to be social will aways find the way. Not only in the game, you have also Discord, TS, Facebook, or whatever.

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Originally Posted by gastovski

You would understand if you spend your entire childhood to adult since 90s with playing plenty of MMORPGs and MMOs on PC only.

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See now, here's where I'm tempted to link an image of the PS4, with focus on the USB ports, and ask what exactly is so different between PC and PS4 given how blurred the line differentiating the two is. PS4 has the exact same interaction options as the PC version. THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE. But it's ok, feel free to keep thinking that there is.

I haven't had any trouble finding little social groups to join up with in FFXIV. It's actually been the best social experience of every MMO I've played thanks to linkshells and a generally friendly community. Most of my friends were made just goofing around Limsa streets. Others I made through the novice network while I was in it.

That being said, I could see room for improvement. The novice network is great, but restricted to mentors and novices, which leaves a huge gap when you're booted out after finishing ARR MSQ. It would be great if the game had an optional social network you could join after graduating from novice network. I guess the problem would be moderation. The novice network seems to work well because it is moderated by mentors, who also self police somewhat. Without a little moderator, a large open social network would be pretty bad. I expect some 'good enough' solution could be found though.

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Originally Posted by gastovski

You are right OP. It's because this game is crossplay with PS4. Console players aren't meant to socialize (pretty casual they are), just do quests, dungeons and enjoy their little limited fun they have been enforced to. Then also there is no massive PVP which is very important thing for a MMORPG. Too casual i say, too much.

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Ignorance is bliss huh?.

I've made many real life friends from this game, even met up with a few of them. Probably 10 or so on facebook.

Look for an active fc to join. Play with them. Join voice chat. Ask them questions about their life. Volunteer info about yours.

This game works just like a real life party, if you sit secluded, chances are people will leave you alone.

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Originally Posted by gastovski

You would understand if you spend your entire childhood to adult since 90s with playing plenty of MMORPGs and MMOs on PC only.

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I get you guys are going to give this guy some flak for a broad generalization, but please understand, he does have a point. Just compare the community activity in Runescape or Ultima Online to that of Everquest II on the PS2.

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Originally Posted by Rinari

Without a little moderator, a large open social network would be pretty bad. I expect some 'good enough' solution could be found though.

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The reliance on moderation has ruined social interactivity in chat channels as well as RP communities; People need to be exposed to each other without fear of ban hammers. Not to mention trying to solve RP problems through reports? Come on guys, either commit to your RP or don't be in the RP community.

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Originally Posted by Seig345

I guess I wasn't aware so many people were struggling to make social connections in Final Fantasy XIV; but I think that it may be that the game allows for a wider demographic of players that could be causing the issue with finding like-minded players.

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What type of social connections we talking about here? Sure I have people I talk to in game on a regular basis, but nothing like when I played XI. When I played XI I made some good friends that I talked to outside of game and got to know quite well and talked to even after leaving XI. I have not found that type of connection while playing XIV.

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Originally Posted by gastovski

You are right OP. It's because this game is crossplay with PS4. Console players aren't meant to socialize (pretty casual they are), just do quests, dungeons and enjoy their little limited fun they have been enforced to. Then also there is no massive PVP which is very important thing for a MMORPG. Too casual i say, too much.

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Consoles have nothing to do with it, XI had players on PS2 and they still managed to talk just fine. But XI and XIV are too different as you said XIV too casual so I can see part of your point.

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Originally Posted by Stravioli

I get you guys are going to give this guy some flak for a broad generalization, but please understand, he does have a point. Just compare the community activity in Runescape or Ultima Online to that of Everquest II on the PS2.

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The difference is, XIV is not exclusive to a platform, unlike all three of those games you mentioned. On top of that, there is no reason to marginalize an entire group of people who play on PS4, they could just get a keyboard and mouse, attach it into their PS4, and be just as effective as a PC player, both socially and in skill.

For making lots of friends and interacting, for me the biggest period was when I -wasnt-
in any FC, but rather had a social linkshell instead. The 4 person party for regular content makes it a tad harder to inclide more than a couple friends, or FC mates. Anyway for making friends I personally feel like not being in a FC made it a lot easier because I abtually had to utilize things like PF etc while when in a FC I find myself only interacting with a small circle of friends no matter how big the FC is

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Originally Posted by Stravioli

I get you guys are going to give this guy some flak for a broad generalization, but please understand, he does have a point. Just compare the community activity in Runescape or Ultima Online to that of Everquest II on the PS2.

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Think about the difference between a PS2 and PC and the difference between a PS4 and PC. That's two generations of consoles that have shown consoles trending more closely to PCs than not (excluding Nintendo.) The difference between PC and PS4 at this point is minimal it may as well be similar to the difference between a Mac and PC but with a restricted private marketplace.

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

-Free Company
-Linkshell
-Friend list
-Keyboard
-Hands

Done.

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Also;

-Instance
-Keyboard
-Hands
-Hello

Done

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Originally Posted by gastovski

You would understand if you spend your entire childhood to adult since 90s with playing plenty of MMORPGs and MMOs on PC only.

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Granted I haven't played many mmo's but I have played many other games on many different platforms from my childhood (in the 70's!) And call me stupid if you want but I still don't understand how having ps4 playing with pc makes people less social.

I honestly dont really see the problem - the game is supposed to provide you with game-content, not with a friend.
OP is mentioning things like trust and hardship to build a friendship on and claims that the game isnt providing any of it - I would like to add that shared fun is also a good basis for friendship (and that the game provides that) aswell as that I dont share the feeling that the game doesnt provides us with means to overcome hardship together and build a certain trust. I have built very close friendships in this game excatly through those - several friends and I are pretty much in snych in content and know that we will look out for each other (granted often not because the creatures in the dungeons are so terrifying but because the other people are...), but still. (A WHM-friend and I perfected our hallowed ground-benediction-cmbo, by just pressing the buttons at the same time and laughing about it for the next 5 minutes, wiping the whole raid)

People who want to socialise, will. People who just want to play this game solo, will. Both are okay (as long as the solo-people are fine with having a bit trouble in savage etc.) - you cant force friendships after all.

I also dont understand what one would do to tackle this "problem"? Make content harder and less appealing to solo player and punish them for wanting just two hours of gaming in the evening after 8 hours at their job, surronded by people?
There are plenty options to engage and interact with people, if you choose to do that - if you dont, thats on you. And for the people suffering from anxiety... I dont want to be rude here and I know the pain from it, took me long to get over it, I dont think a game should hold your hand through that (and at the end of the day its still up to you either way - the game wont do the typing for you after all).

The only thing I can think of would be an advertisment board or so for linkshells and FCs, to make it easier for you to find a community to fit in, if you want that. Other than that, I really cant thing of a fix - probably because I cant see the real problem to begin with. Or well, rather how its SE job to fix people becoming less and less social...

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Originally Posted by ErryK

The difference is, XIV is not exclusive to a platform, unlike all three of those games you mentioned. On top of that, there is no reason to marginalize an entire group of people who play on PS4, they could just get a keyboard and mouse, attach it into their PS4, and be just as effective as a PC player, both socially and in skill.

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Indeed all of the PC master race vs Console generalizations are extremely unhelpful.

Just about any USB keyboard including the ones so cheap they could give them away in boxes of cereal, will work on PS4. And I would also have to point out that the use of a controller is not limited to console gamers, a lot of PC gamers use controllers as well. If you are playing on a 50-inch screen from your couch, a controller works better than a keyboard and mouse from a comfort point of view, and to my knowledge there is no skill difference between controller based players and those with keyboard/mouse.

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Originally Posted by FoxPaw

I think people spend the vast majority of their "free time" in game searching for social connections because the actual game doesn’t provide any. This game is suffering from a fatal lack of community. It sought thru mechanics to empower the solo gamer and in the process precluded them of ever making a real friend. Some of the prerequisites to a meaningful friendship are shared hardship, sacrifice, and trust - all of which have been meticulously removed from this game lest it be “too hard". I think in not forcing people to eat their veggies they've gotten fat, unhappy and restless - which does not bode well for XIV.

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One of my best in-game friends I've done practically no content with. I also didn't know her prior to playing the game (we live in different countries). We met in an FC and just enjoy talking to each other.

There are social connections out there. Go find them.

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Originally Posted by Stravioli

The reliance on moderation has ruined social interactivity in chat channels as well as RP communities; People need to be exposed to each other without fear of ban hammers. Not to mention trying to solve RP problems through reports? Come on guys, either commit to your RP or don't be in the RP community.

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Have you seen what happens without moderation in large channels? It will be an endless stream of ASCII art and toxic screaming, entirely useless for actual conversations. Of course, the report feature is a form of moderation... just a slow one, but that might work well enough since people have a lot invested in their characters and subscriptions where risking a ban is usually not worth it. The novice network is moderated by mentors, which has worked well to handle the 100+ people in the channel.... well enough to stamp down on the random ASCII spam waves at least. Used properly, moderation facilitates communication, rather than obstructing it!

Well it's the community's fault to blame too as well as the mechanism we have been given.

A linkshell can fit 128 players only, a free company can fit 5XX players yet on each server, how many players are divided into the 500+ FCs on each server, isolating each other in the process?
If each free company could host 300 players in each one and players bothered to go join those, you'll have your 'communities' and the house situation under control to a larger extent.

I used to feel the lack of community on my old server but since joining Tonberry, I haven't been happier. There are hundreds of us scattered still but our server hosts several strongly dominated sub groups which makes it feel more worthwhile.

I get what the OP is saying. And it's true in many ways.

While I have quite a lot of friends in XIV I'd honestly say most of them are pretty superficial... it's just how the game is. If You're around to run roulettes with then you go together sure no worries. If you aint around they just go without you or you go without them.. There's never much consideration for other people except when its convenient...

I'm still great friends with half of my endgame LS in XI see some of them every couple of months go out for drinks or pizza, Others I still play other games with. 4 of us played the division together for example start to finish... even 7 years or so after we stopped playing XI still great friends.. But in XIV I wouldn't say many of my friends are even close to that level... got 80+ people on my friendlist I could probably name 10 of them without actually looking at my friendlist that's how superficial the rest are....

In one form or another it's a fairly common opinion and has been for a long time.. The reason so many statics fall apart is because the bonds between its members are mostly superficial and easily broken once there's no self gain or a better opportunity comes along. No purpose in sticking with it and helping the others who helped you out once you're done.. This is something that has been said a lot in the forums regarding savage and stuff...

Some people say the same with relic and stuff. A group of people start out working on them together and then one of em ends up joining a light farm or something and is suddenly way ahead of his friends..

I think it's also why people have been asking for real content designed around free companies actually working together rather than just jumping in the duty finder individually and go... In some cases PotD 51-200 works for this. Because it requires a fixed group of players which means you typically form bonds with people. People have been asking for this kind of content ever since beta. because FCs are literally nothing more than a glorified chat channel.

Then when it comes to duty finder it's not necessarily social anxiety that stops people talking its just the feeling of it being worthless. I could have a great group of players in a party, crack a few jokes along the way, complete and leave the duty. Done!, I might never see those same players again, or if I did it might be weeks or even months later when I cant even remember there names or they mine.....

Or its why people feel they can act like a douche in content. Who cares if you p*** off someone in the party, Probably never meet them again so whats it matter....

The social element is pretty shallow for the most part...

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Originally Posted by Yeol

This game was designed to do things as a group. The only time you do things solo is some quests in MSQ.

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Yet at the same time everything is designed to be done "solo". got no friends? or connections at all? It doesn't matter just queue the duty finder and go.. You don't need a group of players or to build bonds or anything.
Yes you're doing content with other people but they could just as easily be ai and it wouldn't really matter because the level of connection between players is so superficial

Using relic as an example if I wanna get lights I don't need my friends or a group of players. All I need to do is hit the duty finder and go... I can do it on my own with no thought to the other people in my party nor them any thought to me. just 4 or 8 people all "soloing" even if they are in the same party. they're still "soloing"

I'd say this game is the best of both worlds. you can be soical but its not needed to pretty much do anything in the game unlike in mmos of old where a disagreement can cause your game life to become hell for example.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

cut for convience

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The thing is though: if your friends choose to do content without you because its possible it was still their choice to go ahead and do this content. They could have waited. Me and my friends are doing excatly that - we wait for each other. I could be running Dun Scaith right now, but a friend of mine wont be online for the next two hours and because I want to run it together, I wait. (Same in reallife: If you want to spend time with a group of friends, you choose a day when everyone has time - sure, you could go and see that movie alone, but if you want to see if with your friends, you can also wait two weeks - your choice, their choice.)
Not being forced to do the content with the same group everytime (and being screwed when someone doesnt shows up!) doesent seem like a bad thing to me?
If you want to form a bond you can do that - and you're doing it now because you want it rather than because you have to.

Right at this very moment there is a thread asking to open PotD a bit, so you're not forced to go in with a fixed group everytime anymore - and while I dont agree with that to preserve the difficulty of that content, I feel we need to have a look at both sides here. Not being forced to spend time with your friends, but having every option to do so, seems the better option to me. Its not the games fault if people rather get their stuff done asap instead of playing with their friends.

Eh, I've never been a fan of forced grouping mechanisms as social vehicles in games, so there's that. It's okay to be able to do a lot of basic things solo, or in DF.

That said, this game seriously lacks in flexible-size group content that's actually relevant. For the most part it's either 4 or 8 people or GTFO, and I'd like to see the game start to shift away from that a bit. Aquapolis is a good fun example of that, especially if the rewards keep being updated to be desirable. PotD is nice, but ideally you'll still want to go with 3 other people...I think mob scaling would do a lot to allow flexible group sizes to tackle it together.

So yeah. I don't want to be forced to group up for every little mundane thing, but it sucks not really being able to play with my friends in awkward group sizes like 5, 7, 10 people whatever.

Id like to see more things like an oden or a rare fate or hunts that took longer than ten seconds to finish , while you may not be talkin I like when alot of people get out and do stuff together in the game. The most active Ive ever seen the open world was when I first started during the yoki event people would just be waiting on fate to fate. Take it Im a bit burnt on fates now but It really made the game feel alive and like someone mention nn is where I met many of my friends, I dono maybe it would be nice to have something like that for players that arent mentors are new.

Hmm...

I met my long distance boyfriend (finally met irl after 2 years together!) and my best friends...just by joining one fc and talking. Perhaps I just got lucky. Either way, this game's community literally changed my life.

I have to disagree with the console thing. I've been playing this game on ps3/ps4 for three years without a keyboard and I get on just fine with making friends, being active in my fc and in a few linkshells. Not wanting to use the built in keyboard is not an excuse for not being part of the community, that's just laziness. And besides the keyboard thing, if you feel you can't communicate with the fc or linkshell you're in, move on and find a different one that suits you.