Marauder Aggro?

Heya!

Just tanked my first dungeon, Copperbell mines. Had aggro issues throughout, a Black Mage for trash and for the bosses I dunno what class he was. Midway through I got Maim, which helped solve the BLM issue.

Opened with Tomahawk, maintained Maim when I got it.

For trash, I was using Heavy Swing -> Skull Sunder -> Overpower -> Overpower

For bosses it was just the HS -> SS combo with Brutal Swing on cooldown. At the final boss I struggled (and failed half the time) to keep aggro, so I added OP to the end of each combo and still struggled.

Gear used was the "Brand New" plate from the Hall of the Novice, Plundered belt, and Aetherial Iron War Axe.

Any tips?

How's your accessories look?
You may also want to rely on Overpower more often even fit a single target. Only fur these lower levels, of course. Enmity becomes much easier at higher levels.

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Originally Posted by Kulrig

Heya!

Just tanked my first dungeon, Copperbell mines. Had aggro issues throughout
Any tips?

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At your lower levels, overpower twice before you start your combo. You're going to be TP starved, so also pick up flash from PLD (this is a great tool at lower levels because it doesn't break your combo chain). Also be aware that often higher level players will be in these lower level dungeons running roulette. Their gear will be synced as HQ and will out-aggro you very easily. Check the gear on your party members and if they're badly out-gearing you; ask that they give you time to build aggro because your gear is a bit low. Things will really improve once you get defiance.

Starting with overpower is a must for any pull more than 1. Your DPS will pick whatever target they feel like and attack. You can mark a kill order to help, but they don't always follow that. Dragging those mark icons onto a skill bar makes marking easy. If you don't get solid agro on everything right away, your party will find a way to pull something off you. As Llus said, overpower at least twice at the start, sometimes more if you know this group likes to split DPS or later on when AoE gets heavy. Afterwards, use your heavy swing agro combo and make sure skull sunder lands on targets that are getting damaged the fastest. You can click around on the enmity list and interleave your targets, so if DPS splits, you split. Skull sunder generates a lot of enmity relative to what DPS can do at copperbell level, so making sure that alternates between the two split targets DPS might pick, will keep enmity easily.

You can also cross-class flash from paladin. I'm not sure if you can do that at copperbell levels or not though as a job class. I find flash is very useful when DPS isn't giving me time to line up overpower cones at the start, or a pull just has weird monster separation or late additions from an odd angle. It also helps conserve TP for a fast pull pace when heavy AoE dps is stellar.

Cana, my accessories are just the basic starter ones that give +1 all stats. Figured they would be just as useful compared to the +1 Str or Vit ones available around around the 18-ish level range. Kinda silly that every character starts off with stuff that crafted items and quest rewards can't beat until the mid to late 20's, now that I think about it...

Anyway, seems Overpower needs more spam and Flash is a good thing to get eh? Wikis say it's only a level 8 Gladiator skill so shouldn't take too long. And yeah, everyone else seemed to have matching sets of gear with more ornate weapons so definitely much higher level. Guess tonight I'll see if Flash can come to my rescue!

Thanks for the replies :D

Gladiator is mandatory for at least two of your Cross class skills. When you pick it up, you'll want to get it to at least level 22 in order to acquire provoke. It's possible to level your GLD quickly with a combination of fates, hunting log, guildhests, and even levequests without ever setting foot in a dungeon.

Bare minimum you'll want to get it to 15, because you need that to unlock the Warrior job at level 30.

When you have time, you may also want to pick up pugilist, because Inner Release is a must have for Warriors. Paired with Berserk it'll become a vital part of future rotations.

You're doing well. You've got good instincts. Keep it up!

You shouldn't need flash. Overpower will do the trick. Flash just helps in a pinch if you don't have time to line up a cone or are suffering from TP woes during fast paced pulling. You will eventually need provoke (lv 22 gladiator), but not until some full party / raid dungeons way later. Gear isn't very important for low level synched dungeons. Make sure you grab the lv 15 Hall of the Novice set though. It's easy to get, and very good compared to the normal quest loot. You also get a +3 stat ring with an XP boost up to level 30. You can get a gear set for each role (DPS, tank, healer), but only one ring.

I'm guessing your big problem is just not getting those two overpowers in at the start and watching to see which mobs DPS is targeting to land enmity combos on.

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Originally Posted by Kulrig

Cana, my accessories are just the basic starter ones that give +1 all stats. Figured they would be just as useful compared to the +1 Str or Vit ones available around around the 18-ish level range. Kinda silly that every character starts off with stuff that crafted items and quest rewards can't beat until the mid to late 20's, now that I think about it...

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Didn't used to be that way. People didn't really start with accessories at all. But they wanted to give new players a bit of help.

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Originally Posted by Rinari

Gear isn't very important for low level synched dungeons.

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That's only true if it's low level to you and therefore you're being synced down. This wasn't a low level run for him, though. He was running it on-level. (He mentioned getting Maim part way through, which meant he hit 18 during the run, so started it at 16 or 17. It's a level 16-18 dungeon.) Once you outlevel it by several levels and will be syncing down anyway, that's when your gear doesn't matter much any more. But particularly for an on-level tank trying to hold more aggro than his often over-leveled and over-geared teammates, gear is very important (weapon especially).

(In this case though, it sounds like he had good gear, BiS stuff for the level.)

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Originally Posted by Niwashi

That's only true if it's low level to you and therefore you're being synced down. This wasn't a low level run for him, though. He was running it on-level. (He mentioned getting Maim part way through, which meant he hit 18 during the run, so started it at 16 or 17. It's a level 16-18 dungeon.) Once you outlevel it by several levels and will be syncing down anyway, that's when your gear doesn't matter much any more. But particularly for an on-level tank trying to hold more aggro than his often over-leveled and over-geared teammates, gear is very important (weapon especially).

(In this case though, it sounds like he had good gear, BiS stuff for the level.)

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Can't stress enough how important the weapon level is, the weapon damage greatly increases your attack power and thus your enmity.

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Originally Posted by Niwashi

That's only true if it's low level to you and therefore you're being synced down.

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I'm not convinced. I tanked all through the low level dungeons as I was leveling without any issue, even when I was unsynced myself. Almost everyone I was grouped with was synched. The enmity multipliers for tank generators are just that generous! I learned pretty quick that a second overpower at the start was crucial, along with making sure every DPS target was getting hit with occasional enmity combos. FFXIV has been the most forgiving MMO I've ever played when it comes to enmity/agro generation for tanks. It's just a matter of figuring out which targets the DPS has decided to wail on and adapting to fit.

To be fair, I was prompt in equipping quest rewards, I grabbed that Hall of the Novice gear at 15, and level roulette kept me so high in GC seals that I could easily afford ranks and useful gear (particularly weapons) as they became available. Dungeons drops filled in nicely as well. There were often gaps where my weapon was 4 or 5 levels behind though... but never 6, since class quest delivers every 5!

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Originally Posted by Kulrig

Cana, my accessories are just the basic starter ones that give +1 all stats. Figured they would be just as useful compared to the +1 Str or Vit ones available around around the 18-ish level range. Kinda silly that every character starts off with stuff that crafted items and quest rewards can't beat until the mid to late 20's, now that I think about it...

Anyway, seems Overpower needs more spam and Flash is a good thing to get eh? Wikis say it's only a level 8 Gladiator skill so shouldn't take too long. And yeah, everyone else seemed to have matching sets of gear with more ornate weapons so definitely much higher level. Guess tonight I'll see if Flash can come to my rescue!

Thanks for the replies :D

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Go get "Brand-new Ring" from doing the novice hall. lvl 1 ring, +3 str +3 vit (also 3 piety for your flashing). http://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/wiki/Brand-new_Ring But, as much as you should do it for the +3 stats (and a +3 str/vit ring is technically acceptable thru lv 49 for a tank now) do it for the 30% exp bonus when lv 30 or under (or synched to those levels).

Also, overpower isn't best just for enmity, it's the best damage output you'll do on even 2+ mobs that level. Flash at start of a pull to get hate since you won't have maim up, then get maim up, then overpower spam.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

Flash at start of a pull to get hate since you won't have maim up, then get maim up, then overpower spam.

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I'll have to give that arrangement a try! Being able to delay overpower until after maim would be more TP efficient for those big AoE pulls where TP is an issue.