16 hours of cross server zurvan extreme party finder: my thoughts

After completely mastering the fight in approximate 2 hours, I spent the rest of today using cross server party finder to get my zurvan ex clear. Now it is about 14 hours after I started doing this, and I am just in total shock. The skill level of players of Final Fantasy XIV is so extremely abysmal in every single way. DPS, BRAINDEAD SIMPLE mechanics, and other bare bones player ability required is simply non existent with the players of this game. Zurvan as a fight is incredibly boring and easy, and I initially thought that SE tuned it too low. How wrong I was. This is the perfect difficulty for the mass of players. Have to move 3 feet? Die. Have to run to center and stack? Die. Have to AOE a few mobs? Die.

Specifically the players who play the "dps" jobs. I probably played with about 35-40 damage dealers today...and in a party finder with the description of "clear party -- know entire fight and all mechanics" just nothing but deaths to southern cross, and breaking tethers. I am incredibly dumbfounded by this. I like this game a lot, but the players...they all ruin it.

If SE is going to make a game that requires skill then there should be heavy gating. Until then, this is the kind of crap we are going to have to deal with constantly. no gating ruins the game. you should have to clear every other ex primal to do the new one. you can argue against this, but in the end, it does nothing but make players better, and they should be 100x better at this stage in the game.

It...it hasn't even been 24 hours.....

I get that you want to clear it, but saying other players "ruin" the game is a bit harsh. Not clearing within the first day isn't a terrible loss on something that isn't even locked to a daily/weekly limit.

If you actually give it time, as usual with primals, people will get enough practice. Not everyone spent as much time learning as you did even if they got to the same spot in the fight as you so they may not have it as memorized as you have (like say it took you a bunch of runs and you practiced phases very many times over 16 hours, while another has been to last phase but only practiced each phase a few times in say 2-4 hours).

Some players unfortunately do ignore the PF requirements that you be knowledgeable up to a specific point in the fight but that would be the issue not "everyone is bad".

ok then. see you for 4.0.

While I can "partly" agree with your statement, I would have to say even normal mode proves too challenging for most groups.

I actually thought normal mode had a tank buster that could 1 shot the tank.
Every group i got with, the tank always died to the same attack, and so would i have, if i didnt use living dead (i still died though)

Then, after my 8th group, suddenly everyone was still alive.
Oh, here comes that tank buster! (pop living dead)
Im literally sitting at 95% of my HP... and im like, i didnt even pop a mitigation CD, and im not even hurt?!

I didnt even realize my other healers just wernt healing. Its not even a hard hitting move, they just let us die.
(Maybe because the DPS were all dieing to AoEs)

eitherway, the game is either impossible, or brain dead easy. never in the middle, because you need everyone else to be roughly similar in skill level to you.

Yeah, I can't get any real practice in when the team is half dead at the circle+line dash phase.

Well from what i see so far (lvling my first 60)so much people in this game can't do more that tank and spank.some times they cant even do this.

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Originally Posted by XSamsaraLotusX

Well from what i see so far (lvling my first 60)so much people in this game can't do more that tank and spank.some times they cant even do this.

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That's because they've dumbed down the level 60 dungeon difficulty so much. Even the leveling dungeons are harder than the "Expert" roulettes.

I did the 50 dungeons so far.
And good lots of lvl 60 thst just dont know what they do .

Players in FF 14 really low skilled in most of the part. Why?
1) Class quests don't teach anything
2) LEveling in Palace doesn't teach anything- how to play by your class
3) Content become MORE and MORE casual

In the end we have the situation-- the skill of players degrade more and more every each patch, SE think, that content is hard and make it more easy, skill degrade more, SE nerf more and so on and so on. It is an endless circle of nerfing. Soon the game will be the casual Sims about housing and glamours

Right now lots of players still wipes on OZMA!!! Easiest boss ever!

Dear SE, please, fix this situation, make the players to play better!

This will always be a problem, since it's new fight and FFXIV cators for the casual player since that is where the money is.

Now you are lucky that you get to play for sixteen hours or so, and commit to clearing that content ASAP, but for some they only have four hours or two so they are not going to have the time to have everything waxed.

This is just the way things are, if it is really that frustrating then you might be better off finding another game maybe, or just not bother.

Hope se understnd this.
So far i didnt see hard dungeons .

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Originally Posted by Xyno

Players in FF 14 really low skilled in most of the part. Why?
1) Class quests don't teach anything
2) LEveling in Palace doesn't teach anything- how to play by your class
3) Content become MORE and MORE casual
In the end we have the situation-- the skill of players degrade more and more every each patch, SE think, that content is hard and make it more easy, skill degrade more, SE nerf more and so on and so on. It is an endless circle of nerfing. Soon the game will be the casual Sims about housing and glamours

Right now lots of players still wipes on OZMA!!! Easiest boss ever!

Dear SE, please, fix this situation, make the players to play better!

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This cannot be emphasised enough. Heavensward has progressively gotten easier to the point of absurdity. Very little requires more than pressing a couple button, thus when they do release something of moderate challenge people can't do it. Now even the extreme primals have become pushovers. Although I do like Sophia, she's far from difficult. And Zurvan is laughable. Instead of gradually trying to improve player skill, the devs seem wholly content to baby. It's not entirely surprising people are getting bored.

In some cases the skill level for today's players are really low because they just don't seem to really try or even learn how to use their selected Jobs to it's full potential.

Tho with new content it does take some time to learn the mechanics and in alot of cases even when they do know the fight the problem is trying to remember the mechanics of the fight while focusing on the fight

Does nobody find it funny that the OP had 16 hours to dedicate to a fight first day and was mad that others weren't as trained as her?

I dunno, I think it's funny.

I havn't get a chance to try extreme yet because most cross-pf set minimum ilv at 265-268 for learning party and 270 to clear or farm.

Why is it always people from Gilgamesh with the "everyone's bad but me!" attitudes?

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Originally Posted by Kahnom

I havn't get a chance to try extreme yet because most cross-pf set minimum ilv at 265-268 for learning party and 270 to clear or farm.

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Yea I've noticed those kinds of things too, currently my highest job is my blm with an ilvl of 240. I don't have the time to spend on the game to get the kind of gear I would like to have to meet those kind of requirements. I used to have that time but due to changes in my life I don't have that kind if time anymore.

Not everyone is able spend tons of hours on the game because they have other responsibilities that have to come first. It's usually on the weekends I can do things on the game but normally I spend it trying to cap my scripture before the reset.

Actually with this thread I feel this could be relevant. I have recently read an article in the paper about the increase in the amount of people that just sit at home playing video games all day living off financial assistance (welfare) or something like that. The real question I think is how many of the people that complain the content is too easy or that there isn't enough new content to keep them busy or what ever else fall into the topic of that article I read?

As I believe I have said before yes the content is a little easy and could be a bit more difficult, but with everyone's busy lives not everyone is able to spend a lot of time playing the game so that needs to be considered to keep player numbers up so the game doesn't die out.

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Originally Posted by DinahDemiurge

I like this game a lot, but the players...they all ruin it.

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This why i only do stuff with friends tho i wouldnt say they ruin the game but they sure make it unesseserily hard for no reason. This is why we cant have nice things see: pharos pre-nerf(psst it wasnt hard, players just made it hard).

Did Zurvan NM last night, gonna try the EX tonight probably. Sophia was a cakewalk so I'm assuming this is similar, if not easier.

The NM was shocking, though - three people died to the floor falling down in the first phase. I mean, if the whole floor suddenly lights up... isn't that kind of a giveaway to move?

Still, I'm not surprised. I thought SE were onto something with the tuning of Pharos Sirius NM - harder dungeons would go a long way to make people think a little. Nowadays every single dungeon consists of me pulling as much as the dungeon will allow me to pull, and hope that the other three people know how to AoE. I definitely agree that the lack of teaching in the class quests are a significant shortcoming, though.

This fight is all about dps, really.

Soar is the most threatening mechanic and you can skip it with high dps. Most people don't have i270/275 weapons and have trouble skipping the 2nd phase's soar entirely. This also means they're going to deal with it a lot more in the last phase. Of course the fight is gonna be super easy if you already have weapons better than what it gives.

Yea the whole floor lighting up should tell people to move. As for pulling all the mobs the dungeon allows at one time that really depends on your ilvl, if you\\'ve got a higher ilvl it\\'s not bad but if your ilv is lower it can be rather hard. Back when neverreap was a expert dungeon when I unlocked that with my alt char my ilvl was just above 140 and I struggled to keep the tank and everyone alive because he was pulling it like everyone had an ilv of 170 rather than the 140

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Originally Posted by Greedalox

Does nobody find it funny that the OP had 16 hours to dedicate to a fight first day and was mad that others weren't as trained as her?

I dunno, I think it's funny.

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Tho, we are talking about Zurvan Ex. A fight that requires 20 to 40 minutes to learn.

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Originally Posted by oLLiCS

Tho, we are talking about Zurvan Ex. A fight that requires 20 to 40 minutes to learn.

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What he is trying to point out was that the OP was able to spend 16 hrs on the first day of the patch which is also a work/school day. That also relates to a previous post if mine about an article I read in the paper about the increase of people that stay home on financial assistance/welfare playing games all day by their own choice.

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Originally Posted by AmalonStar

What he is trying to point out was that the OP was able to spend 16 hrs on the first day of the patch which is also a work/school day. That also relates to a previous post if mine about an article I read in the paper about the increase of people that stay home on financial assistance/welfare playing games all day by their own choice.

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Was it a right wing "they took urrr jaaabs" rag you were reading? Certainly sounds like it. No offence but there's very, very few people who would actually *choose* to be on welfare, believe me.

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Originally Posted by Culfinrandir

Was it a right wing "they took urrr jaaabs" rag you were reading? Certainly sounds like it. No offence but there's very, very few people who would actually *choose* to be on welfare, believe me.

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It wasn't one of those gossip type papers for starters.

Secondly with the advances in gaming they are a lot more appealing these days, there has also been studies done and video games have been identified as an addiction for a lot of people in this day and age.

Thirdly I have actually met people that are doing that exact thing, living on welfare so they can stay at home all day and play video games.

The content is up for only 24 hours. Let's judge it again in some days ok?
That being said I do agree on some degree and the skill lvl of players of this game went lower.
It's not one thing to blame but a combination of:
We get constantly new players.
Job Quests doesn't teach you anything.
PotD is bad place to teach anything. PotD is nice alternative way to lvl up secondary jobs but it's terribly casual to teach anything to new players.
Content becomes easier and easier. We are getting fewer dungeons and they are shorter and easy. No real danger in the "lol Expert" roulette anymore.
Yoshi wants to introduce a jump potion. Imagine how much more bad players we are going to get in the future. Wallet warriors with no experience poking mobs around.
The game needs better and more engaging tutarials for Jobs. Those pop up help windows need to be revised and appear every time you get a new skill to teach you the rotations.

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Originally Posted by Riardon

The content is up for only 24 hours. Let's judge it again in some days ok?
That being said I do agree on some degree and the skill lvl of players of this game went lower.
It's not one thing to blame but a combination of:
We get constantly new players.
Job Quests doesn't teach you anything.
PotD is bad place to teach anything. PotD is nice alternative way to lvl up secondary jobs but it's terribly casual to teach anything to new players.
Content becomes easier and easier. We are getting fewer dungeons and they are shorter and easy. No real danger in the "lol Expert" roulette anymore.
Yoshi wants to introduce a jump potion. Imagine how much more bad players we are going to get in the future. Wallet warriors with no experience poking mobs around.
The game needs better and more engaging tutarials for Jobs. Those pop up help windows need to be revised and appear every time you get a new skill to teach you the rotations.

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Oh I agree

Im afraid, that the existence of the jump potion can cause a content disaster. Why? LEts see. How can play a novice, who just jumped to a 60 level and begin to grind fates or even GO TO THE DUNGEON? He cant play at all. Very soon he will decide, that the game with it's mechanics and battle rotations of classes is too hard to play and begin to ask to nerf, to make content more easy. SE looks at the statistics and see, that INDEED, very little amount of players have cleared the new primals and Savages. And nerf the next content. And it will continue and continue

If the SE will not make any skill-UP challenges, the amount of unskilled players will grow

Dont look like se willing to do so.the problem is that most of the mmo players now days are one of 2 .
1. I play how i want, dont tell me how to play .care for your game.
2. Give me all here and now.

Non of this 2 are good players or even people you want to have in the party.

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Originally Posted by AmalonStar

Yea I've noticed those kinds of things too, currently my highest job is my blm with an ilvl of 240. I don't have the time to spend on the game to get the kind of gear I would like to have to meet those kind of requirements. I used to have that time but due to changes in my life I don't have that kind if time anymore.

Not everyone is able spend tons of hours on the game because they have other responsibilities that have to come first. It's usually on the weekends I can do things on the game but normally I spend it trying to cap my scripture before the reset.

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It doesn't take tons of hours though? Cap tomestones to geat your 260 gear and join A9S party. Refurbishor is no more difficult than Sophia and he'll net you 270 accessories and/or pages to buy upgrades. In any event, people are purposely setting parties to those requirements because they want to skip the pug killer Soar. If you push Zurvan to 75%, you basically have little to no major mechanics to worry about for 50% of his health.

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Originally Posted by AmalonStar

As I believe I have said before yes the content is a little easy and could be a bit more difficult, but with everyone's busy lives not everyone is able to spend a lot of time playing the game so that needs to be considered to keep player numbers up so the game doesn't die out.

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There is a difference between content like Savage and wanting stuff that is above brain dead levels. I can only speak for myself, but I would rather more quality content I may not be able to run as frequently over tons of content I scarcely need to pay attention to.

....or, you could, you know, get with 7 people you know and just do it with them.

It's because of potd, new players all leveled with potd,you can never get a full rotation off before they die and the practical training you get from extensive use of your job doesn't jive well with "real "ff14 content. Potd created noobs

OP sounds like a really really fun person to play with.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

It doesn't take tons of hours though? Cap tomestones to geat your 260 gear and join A9S party. Refurbishor is no more difficult than Sophia and he'll net you 270 accessories and/or pages to buy upgrades.

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During the week I might have the time to get on and do the mini cactpot and a couple small things. On the weekends I do try to play catch up but my time is limited still because I have my daughter that I need to look after. I do know what you're saying tho, I've already been looking at sacrificing capping my weekly tombs now that my gear is mostly 160, Also I haven't even done A5 yet.

This post is absurd, 16 hours of evaluating people whom for many had few encounters with a new primal.

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Originally Posted by Kingkoz

It's because of potd, new players all leveled with potd,you can never get a full rotation off before they die and the practical training you get from extensive use of your job doesn't jive well with "real "ff14 content. Potd created noobs

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The problem with lving using potd is that you get matched with what ever unless they're doing it in a set party. So they don't always get a proper dungeon party thus really don't learn a lot.

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Originally Posted by DinahDemiurge

You haven't mastered a fight within hours of it being introduced to the game? YOU ARE RUINING THIS GAME!

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Same to you. It's this kind of elitism that discourages people from putting in more effort to learn, thus subsequently discouraging the devs from putting in more content that "Challenges Masters" like "You".

YOU are what is ruining this game.

Still only been like a day..as for getting in PF groups..I can't unless I buy every single Scripture piece..I'm still in BIS for machinist from when I used to raid. Would be better if parties actually set it for the item level of the actual fight...lol

You might have spent 16 hours doing the fight, but it sounds like you've been losing your patience with people and jumping from party to party. You no doubt keep ending up with players who are fairly new to the fight.

Stop rage quitting groups, and maybe you can stick with one long enough to beat it?