[Devs] Power leveling - abuse, please important

1.19 a fixed powerleveling where lvl 20 and 50 cant be in party. ( lvl 1 engages mob and 50 outside party kills it, this works and its ok).

However powerleveling still can be abused. Example ::

Party x/8, in this party there are low levels and lvl 50.
Lvl 50 will take 10 high lvl mobs. Now comes important part ot the flaw :

Party leader will oust Lvl 50 off from party. Lvl 50 kill all mobs ousted from party, however Exp belongs to all other lower levels. Now party leader will send invite to lvl 50 and circle goes on.

I am not against power-leveling if other tries and play someway too. In this case they dont move and stand afk while xp.

I see this as abuse of game mechanic, its not perfect and it should have been fixed in the near future. Thank you, for letting devs know.

I mind that you mind.

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Originally Posted by Sephrick

I mind that you mind.

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Its bugged and devs didnt plan it this way. They fixed it to what I mentioned, however its still flawed with party oust/invite.

Ahh, the good old days when you could't disband or invite people when engaged.
They were good ?

Sounds like a lot of trouble to exploit XP gain. If people want to go to those lengths, more power to them.

It's as Yoshi-P said, the 50's have to give up time they could spend doing other things to benefit themselves in order to PL others.

As long as they aren't breaking any of the rules set in game, and they gain every bit of XP needed to go from 1 to 50, is it really a problem?

REpost in the general discussion. I'm sure this will get more comments there. I think this should DEFINATELY get fixed.

Powerlevel should not even be in the game it's 1year old add it when the game is 5-8year old like FFXI where there not a lot of new players joining. I don't know how many time i said this but not even in wow you can;t level up this quick to 50 and talking about a person joining right now without link friend account or the gear that level up with you.

it's a joke people getting 50 not knowing how to play there class and getting ifrit and everything done get bored and quit i don't see how this help ffxiv at all.

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

Powerlevel should not even be in the game it's 1year old add it when the game is 5-8year old like FFXI where there not a lot of new players joining. I don't know how many time i said this but not even in wow you can level up this quick to 50 and talking about a person joining right now without link friend account or the gear that level up with you.

it's a joke people getting 50 not knowing how to play there class and getting ifrit and everything done get bored and quit i don't see how this help ffxiv at all.

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How many times are we going to have this discussion.

SE has allocated its resources in such a way that they can produce something every few months to occupy those that spent a year leveling to cap with zero content otherwise while they continue to build the foundation for 2.0.

Powerleveling and the brief grind to cap is a necessary evil because SE can't afford to make any mid level content for 1.x. It's the only way to be fair to everyone. This way the capped players have something to do and new players can catch up and experience it before the slate is wiped clean.

Due to its failed launch and crippling design, XIV wil never be a game of convention. Get used to it.

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Originally Posted by BlaiseLallaise

Sounds like a lot of trouble to exploit XP gain. If people want to go to those lengths, more power to them.

It's as Yoshi-P said, the 50's have to give up time they could spend doing other things to benefit themselves in order to PL others.

As long as they aren't breaking any of the rules set in game, and they gain every bit of XP needed to go from 1 to 50, is it really a problem?

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its actually not hard, people make oust and join macros so its instantaneous

Not an exploit.

Please don't post useless topics because you don't like something.

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Originally Posted by Serdapi

Not an exploit.

Please don't post useless topics because you don't like something.

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You do understand that the point of the forums to start with right? to complain and talk about stuff we don't like. I don't know why people keep forgetting that the point of having the forums to start with.

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Originally Posted by Serdapi

Not an exploit.

Please don't post useless topics because you don't like something.

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This is reply to not be taken seriously, imo. If people should not post topics because they dont like things, then there would be no threads @ all. Paradox, dont you think ?

I am fine with pwrlv and I like to pwrlvl ppl. however in the case that low party will engage and play, then I will help them to kill outside pt to gain extra and fast cheins.

This was actually the issue, why ppl were starting threads after 1.19 was out. And it was half fixed in 1.19a, I named only other half that wasnt in my first thread. If you dont like that then dont post useless replies.

Not a useless reply.

Your post shouldn't be taken seriously because you can't abuse something that is working as intended. Paradox, don't you think?

Thank you for your feedback on my posting but people should recognize the difference between useless complaining and competent complaints.

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Originally Posted by Serdapi

Your post shouldn't be taken seriously because you can't abuse something that is working as intended.

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Do you think oust / invite / oust / invite is what devs intended ? If you think it, then you may. Its unambiguously flawed mechanic.

I know how it works and have known within the first hour of patch 1.19a and yes they intended for PLing. How it is achieved is irrelevant if it is wrong they will fix it but some sort of PL will be in the game.

Though this is how they intended PLing to work because they said the problem in 1.19 was how xp was calculated with a lvl50 in the party. Not outside of it.

You think its an unambiguously flawed mechanic (useless complaining), which is not the case. It is a perfectly working as intended way of leveling up.

Now if you want to have a complaint about the animation lock, that would be a competent complaint. Animation lock hinders gameplay, PL does not.

Please try to comprehend the difference, would make these forums way more useful.

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Originally Posted by Serdapi

I know how it works and have known within the first hour of patch 1.19a and yes they intended for PLing. How it is achieved is irrelevant if it is wrong they will fix it but some sort of PL will be in the game.

Though this is how they intended PLing to work because they said the problem in 1.19 was how xp was calculated with a lvl50 in the party. Not outside of it.

You think its an unambiguously flawed mechanic (useless complaining), which is not the case. It is a perfectly working as intended way of leveling up.

Now if you want to have a complaint about the animation lock, that would be a competent complaint. Animation lock hinders gameplay, PL does not.

Please try to comprehend the difference, would make these forums way more useful.

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Lol why are you being such an ass? If people like YOU were gone, it would make these forums that much better.

PL does effect other people, it hinders how many parties they can get into since they are lower leveled than anyone else, no one will sell low leveled gear, no one will be shouting for low leveled parties, PL takes camps that are good for regular parties.... there is a big list of different things PL effects. Don't be ignorant to the situation.

You think the developers really expected people to leave the party after getting hate then joining up after they're killed? I honestly don't think so. PL was meant for that person to be outside of the party to begin with, and they can help kill mobs after the original party has claimed them. Now we have a system where people sit on their lazy asses and get free exp.

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Originally Posted by BlaiseLallaise

It's as Yoshi-P said, the 50's have to give up time they could spend doing other things to benefit themselves in order to PL others.?

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Doing what? Everyone is bored to death. Where is this imaginary content they could be working on?

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

Powerlevel should not even be in the game it's 1year old add it when the game is 5-8year old like FFXI where there not a lot of new players joining. I don't know how many time i said this but not even in wow you can level up this quick to 50 and talking about a person joining right now without link friend account or the gear that level up with you.

it's a joke people getting 50 not knowing how to play there class and getting ifrit and everything done get bored and quit i don't see how this help ffxiv at all.

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Agreed. A Final Fantasy game should never have a leveling curve that's faster than World of Warcraft. It's something the devs should be embarrassed of, frankly.

Instead of encouraging others to blow through the levels, maybe the devs should be creating meaningful content so that people will want to legitimately play through them.

Powerleveling is on the fast track to ruining FFXIV.

If they want to put a kybosh on it, its a pretty straight forward fix. (Well straight forward in terms of what needs to be done, I have no clue the difficulty on the back end)

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Doing what? Everyone is bored to death. Where is this imaginary content they could be working on?



Agreed. A Final Fantasy game should never have a leveling curve that's faster than World of Warcraft. It's something the devs should be embarrassed of, frankly.

Instead of encouraging others to blow through the levels, maybe the devs should be creating meaningful content so that people will want to legitimately play through them.

Powerleveling is on the fast track to ruining FFXIV.

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As I've said a few dozen times: power leveling and a short trip to cap are a neccassary evil in XIV.

If anything is the death of the game, it'll be the failed launch.

Yoshida and crew looked at what resources they had, and realized they only can afford to design high level content as they try to shape 2.0 into the game XIV should have been.

It's only fair to everyone involved that if, for the remainder of 1.x, all they can do is design level 50 encounters that everyone have a fair shot at getting to 50 before the calamity hits that beings 2.0 and wipes most of this content out.

XIV cannot afford many archaic MMO conventions.

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Originally Posted by Griss

If they want to put a kybosh on it, its a pretty straight forward fix. (Well straight forward in terms of what needs to be done, I have no clue the difficulty on the back end)

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they would just have to re-instate the old system of limiting party functions when in battle.

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Originally Posted by Rowyne

Instead of encouraging others to blow through the levels, maybe the devs should be creating meaningful content so that people will want to legitimately play through them.
Powerleveling is on the fast track to ruining FFXIV.

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wisdom. have some content where players can play and lvl up simulateously. instead of wanting to blow through levels, beating end game content, then become bored and play something else.

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Originally Posted by Sephrick

As I've said a few dozen times: power leveling and a short trip to cap are a neccassary evil in XIV.

XIV cannot afford many archaic MMO conventions.

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neccessary evil? /face palm.

@ OP i completely understand, during PL where players would have to be ACTIVE and not be afk. When players stand afk, and progress through the game, thats when this becomes abuse and exploitation.
constructive and insightful OP.

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neccessary evil? /face palm.

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That's right. Because when they start charging they want new players to feel welcome as long as possible. How good for the game do you think it'd be if they said "Come experience the one-time calamity event! But not really because it'll take you six months to get to any of the content we made to occupy people who already were 50."

That's what it's all about. Yoshida said we'll see the first 2.0 trailer at E3 2012. They're more likely to retain more subscriptions that it pulls in if those new players can actually experience what little content they're capable of providing over the next year.

/facepalmcuzthatswhatthecoolkidsdo

I guess people just need to weigh how little you care about people getting power leveled vs how much you like being able to invite someone on the fly, even in battle (or oust for that matter). Personally, I don't care if people power level this way, and why should I? Levels are not what make players good in this game, and the players getting power leveled and just standing there are going to be at a disadvantage in the long run because they do not know how to play their classes. I do, however, enjoy being able to invite someone that d/ced right away or add them to the party when they log in, etc. I could kind of care less what others are doing unless they're botting, and even then there isn't much anyone can do about that either.

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Originally Posted by Eldaena

I guess people just need to weigh how little you care about people getting power leveled vs how much you like being able to invite someone on the fly, even in battle (or oust for that matter). Personally, I don't care if people power level this way, and why should I? Levels are not what make players good in this game, and the players getting power leveled and just standing there are going to be at a disadvantage in the long run because they do not know how to play their classes. I do, however, enjoy being able to invite someone that d/ced right away or add them to the party when they log in, etc. I could kind of care less what others are doing unless they're botting, and even then there isn't much anyone can do about that either.

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I could understand a longer experience if it was done through storylines and epic quests.

But I just can't find the logic in grinding the same few months being seen as a "journey."

It's not at all. I did it in XI and it was insanity. If a developer isn't going to put gameplay in their game they shouldn't bother.

It doesn't even have to be a series of quests. Tell me I'm a private first class in a Grand Company and need to prove myself. Then give a system like Assault in XI accept the reward is mostly exp.

Save the open world fodder mobs for soloing and getting over the hump of "those last few exp" that sometimes happen. That's what I had hoped leves would be but, alas, SE pushed a fragment of a game to market.

XI-style Grind Parties are neither challenging or engaging. So that's why I believe Yoshida has it right. He had to make some tough decisions to achieve the most good. I hope the exp grind is a really journey in 2.0, so when they do raise the level cap (note: when they raise it to 60, with the current rate of exp curve growth, 51-60 will require as much exp as 1-48) we have an experience befitting the Final Fantasy name and not an XI-style staring contest with our screen.

My memories of Final Fantasy aren't of grinding. The leveling occured on the way to the next piece of the story. Just because it's an MMO doesn't mean it can't also be that way.

Darkhold is a good example. It'd be a great place to level from 45-50 if there was no time limit and we were encouraged to explore it. Then the leveling curve could be a hell of a lot longer because the player wouldn't be focused on leveling. They'd be playing the game while getting exp in the process.

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Originally Posted by Sephrick

I could understand a longer experience if it was done through storylines and epic quests.

But I just can't find the logic in grinding the same few months being seen as a "journey."

It's not at all. I did it in XI and it was insanity. If a developer isn't going to put gameplay in their game they shouldn't bother.

It doesn't even have to be a series of quests. Tell me I'm a private first class in a Grand Company and need to prove myself. Then give a system like Assault in XI accept the reward is mostly exp.

Save the open world fodder mobs for soloing and getting over the hump of "those last few exp" that sometimes happen. That's what I had hoped leves would be but, alas, SE pushed a fragment of a game to market.

XI-style Grind Parties are neither challenging or engaging. So that's why I believe Yoshida has it right. He had to make some tough decisions to achieve the most good. I hope the exp grind is a really journey in 2.0, so when they do raise the level cap (note: when they raise it to 60, with the current rate of exp curve growth, 51-60 will require as much exp as 1-48) we have an experience befitting the Final Fantasy name and not an XI-style staring contest with our screen.

My memories of Final Fantasy aren't of grinding. The leveling occured on the way to the next piece of the story. Just because it's an MMO doesn't mean it can't also be that way.

Darkhold is a good example. It'd be a great place to level from 45-50 if there was no time limit and we were encouraged to explore it. Then the leveling curve could be a hell of a lot longer because the player wouldn't be focused on leveling. They'd be playing the game while getting exp in the process.

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They are definitely adding more to help with this. Dungeons, strongholds, quests, primal battles with repeatable quests, etc. I wish I had a battle class I could level these days.

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Originally Posted by Eldaena

I guess people just need to weigh how little you care about people getting power leveled vs how much you like being able to invite someone on the fly, even in battle (or oust for that matter). Personally, I don't care if people power level this way, and why should I? Levels are not what make players good in this game, and the players getting power leveled and just standing there are going to be at a disadvantage in the long run because they do not know how to play their classes. I do, however, enjoy being able to invite someone that d/ced right away or add them to the party when they log in, etc. I could kind of care less what others are doing unless they're botting, and even then there isn't much anyone can do about that either.

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Level up does not make a good player you joking right? how many time i have to deal with players not even knowing how to play there class doing ifrit or dungeon. you learn a lot more in a party then you think but w/e i guess people think that you learn noting that ok :)

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

Level up does not make a good player you joking right? how many time i have to deal with players not even knowing how to play there class doing ifrit or dungeon. you learn a lot more in a party then you think but w/e i guess people think that you learn noting that ok :)

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What I said was simply leveling up (aka being powerleveled) does not help a player to become better at that class. Same with botting, etc. They may have the required levels for end game events, but not necessarily the skill.

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Originally Posted by Sephrick

I could understand a longer experience if it was done through storylines and epic quests.

{SNIP}

Darkhold is a good example. It'd be a great place to level from 45-50 if there was no time limit and we were encouraged to explore it. Then the leveling curve could be a hell of a lot longer because the player wouldn't be focused on leveling. They'd be playing the game while getting exp in the process.

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The first and last paragraphs of this post are where I find the most insight.

Why isn't the leveling process done this way? Why is it mindless grinding? Why are all instanced dungeons timed when they were meant to be one of the new leveling options? People can't feel free to explore or kill all the monsters (trash) if they're pressed for time, thus, it isn't really a viable leveling option.

This isn't the first time I've brought up this quote, but I can't help but citing its relevance:

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We still have some ways to go, but FINAL FANTASY XIV will gradually shift from being a grind-centric game to one that offers enjoyment for all playing styles and circumstances with its ever-expanding variety of content.

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When will we see this new mission statement come to fruition? 2.0?

Let the people who want to participate in PL do just that and the people who would rather take their time do just that. To each his own.

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

PL does effect other people, it hinders how many parties they can get into since they are lower leveled than anyone else, no one will sell low leveled gear, no one will be shouting for low leveled parties, PL takes camps that are good for regular parties.... there is a big list of different things PL effects. Don't be ignorant to the situation.

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lol.

I've had no trouble finding grind parties or PL parties. If people want to level up but can't get a grind party, they should get a PL party. If people are having trouble finding grind parties, then it simply means there aren't a lot of people who care so much as to purposefully avoid a PL party.

If there were more continuous content leading to level 50, then I'm sure PL wouldn't be so potent - however given the current state of the game the devs are clearly prioritizing level 50 content because there's a lot more players now with capped classes than not.

Does PL affect the game? Yes. Does it affect the current state of FFXIV in a negative way? Nope. People can do whichever they want.

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

Level up does not make a good player you joking right? how many time i have to deal with players not even knowing how to play there class doing ifrit or dungeon. you learn a lot more in a party then you think but w/e i guess people think that you learn noting that ok :)

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You don't need to level a class slowly from 1-50 to learn how to play it. You certainly can learn how to play the class this way, but you don't need to learn it this way. People learn in different ways.

I for one certainly didn't learn to play any of my 50s leveling them to 50. I learned more about them in 2 hours of endgame content than I did in a week+ of leveling.

If you determine a player is not good at what they do, then you don't play with them. Simple as that. Arguing, however, that leveling at a slow, active pace is necessary primarily so players can learn to play their classes is a horrible argument. It would make more sense, again, if we leveled through content instead of a mindless grind.

if ppl want to do oust / invite who cares ? I got no problem with pl'in , oustin is boring i'd much rather aggro mobs and bring them to the 50 , gives me something to do , but to each his own . If you like pl'in but dont like the ousting method , dont do it . if SE were to change pl'ing now and not put in any kind of " counter " for leveling our classes ( more content , more areas to explore ect ect , ) FFxiv would become a much emptier place than it already is IMO . Why dont we all start complaining about the shortage of things to do opposed to " what i dont like " about things we already have ?? I'm sure im not alone when i say " i'd rather have a couple new instances that are not timed and offer multi levels of bosses and mobs " over " please spend time and resources to fix such and such , because it isnt fair " when 2.0 comes i hope they "fix" alot of things , but until then give us some worthwhile things to do

/face to palm

I just see a sign of player-hating here.

To oust and to invite, w/e. The fact that someone brainstormed an idea using game mechanics could get you upset is immature. It's like real life, just because someone is making more of it than you, there's no need to be jealous and worry. You didn't design the game and I'm sure they can see what's going on because they're still testing it.

I can compare Exp with real Earth dollars and everyone wants more of it. You can exploit ways to make gil too, will you open a thread about that? We can all have a voice on the forums but fighting with someone with just as much of a right to voice their opinion about something is out of order.

SE should slap a mature label on their packaging before they market it again for PS3.