Job Level 1?

Howdy, simple thought for people to chew.

New jobs and such being added at level 30 and 50.

this is something i like but at the same time. i kinda wish i could choose to start
bare bones at level 1.

I enjoy the grind to 30, and it really helps me get a better feel for a class/job.

so i wanted to ask around,
- do you guys like expansion jobs being added at relevant levels?
- would you prefer they start at a lower level
- Would having some option to start at a lower level be cool?


please let me know

I particularily disliked the new jobs starting at 30. Much like you a good chunk of the fun I have from this game is levelling up a job or class.
I wish we could atleast have the option to start the job from level 1.

I wouldn't mind them starting at level one like Rogue/Ninja did cause I do like leveling but I know there lot of people that will throw a fit over it and sure plenty of them will give their displeasure with it here on this thread. I would personally like to see them start no higher then level 30.

High level all the way. Leveling itself isn't fun or engaging. It's just a time barrier to using the job at endgame.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

High level all the way. Leveling itself isn't fun or engaging. It's just a time barrier to using the job at endgame.

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To each their own, but I will point out that starting at lower level is also helpful for learning actions of the job before throwing a bunch of high level newbs that have no idea what actions do what into a dungeon....

As an example, take Final Fantasy XI, when people figured out they could power level folks from 30-99 in Abyssea. The people who got power leveled had no clue how to play their job and just caused grief and mayhem for the rest of us.

I wouldn't argue with starting at level 1, would also be a way for new people who join in to start on those classes by default, granted I also won't argue with 30 like what has been done. The idea of starting at 50 though just kinda bugs me and not a fan of it myself cus I agree, I feel I learn the class more getting skills slowly as I level and finding how they work best for me. Still kinda shocked no poll has be put up yet by anyone.

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Originally Posted by Vespar

To each their own, but I will point out that starting at lower level is also helpful for learning actions of the job before throwing a bunch of high level newbs that have no idea what actions do what into a dungeon....

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This is gonna sound mean, but what kind of idiot would pick up a class with 30 abilities and not go learn how to play it before going to group content?

If someone can't be bothered to read tooltips and figure out a basic rotation, maybe they should stick to Candy Crush.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

This is gonna sound mean, but what kind of idiot would pick up a class with 30 abilities and not go learn how to play it before going to group content?

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No offense taken at all, normally I'd share your sentiments, but sadly... it has happened. A lot more than I'd care to admit. In fact this is exactly what happened when folks got a hold of MCH, AST, and DRK. Granted its gotten better since HW's initial launch, but trust me, for a few days to weeks dungeon runs were hell. The only difference now, is they'll be starting at 50 and have even more actions....

And its not just idiots actually, it takes time to learn how to pair actions together in a more productive way. Practice makes perfect, and its generally a lot easier to learn something over time if you break it down into chunks and add-on to what you've learned, rather than handing someone a manual and expecting them to know it all off by heart from front to back after one read. That's where levelling comes in. You start out with a few actions and build your knowledge and skill slowly over time. by the time you reach max level, you should have a pretty darn good idea of what your doing.

Starting at 30 is a good compromise for me. If you still do not know your job by the time you are 70 then that's on you. No one says you have to power lvl and go from 30 to 70 in two days, take your time and learn your rotations and skill synergies.

I enjoy leveling and wouldn't mind starting the new jobs from 1.
However, I think that SE wants to make it reasonable for players to play through the Stormblood story on the new jobs without having a huge grind to reach the starting level.

There's always Palace of the Dead and queuing for low level dungeons and Guildhests for those that enjoy getting used to their abilities slowly.

I prefer starting closer to cap as it allows me to jump to the most recent endgame as soon as possible. Whether I learn my skills or not is not a result of the job level being closer to cap, but a result of my lack of understanding of said skills, combos and rotations. It's a common misconception that the issue with RDM being 50 is that people don't have enough time to learn their skills, that's incorrect.

Oh, the other thing I dont get is they are so gung-ho to bring out a jump potion. Why not just make people pay to jump to max level and give the rest of us who want the opportunity to start at level 1 the option.
Then there is atleast options available for both types.

(and yes, Im already aware the stingy folks will cry foul at my comment... thing is I don't really care, the point is, there would an option.)

I think they all should start at minimum level 30, even the starter jobs. Leveling at this point is a waste of time. If someone is not going to take the time to read tool tips then, they never will.

A slow grind from level 1 will never teach people their jobs better than starting them at 30 or even 50. If they aren't willing to learn the basics when they only have 5 skills, they won't when they have 1 either. Plus this would encourage people to explore more jobs. Sure that first job is quick and easy but dang the rest are frustratingly slow.

Also starting at lvl 30 is an easy way for them to get rid of classes like they want to as well.

I would like it if it started at lvl 1. And also available to new players day 1 and not locked behind expansions.

I wouldn't mind an option to start at lvl 1. I'm just crazy like that, though, I wouldn't want it to be mandatory for everyone. X)

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Originally Posted by Moomba33

I enjoy leveling and wouldn't mind starting the new jobs from 1.
However, I think that SE wants to make it reasonable for players to play through the Stormblood story on the new jobs without having a huge grind to reach the starting level.

There's always Palace of the Dead and queuing for low level dungeons and Guildhests for those that enjoy getting used to their abilities slowly.

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This. I don't really want to have to choose between levelling a new job or the MSQ come 4.0. I mean yeah, there will be a little grinding even if the new jobs start at 50, but won't be as bad as starting from 1.

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Originally Posted by Vespar

No offense taken at all, normally I'd share your sentiments, but sadly... it has happened. A lot more than I'd care to admit. In fact this is exactly what happened when folks got a hold of MCH, AST, and DRK. Granted its gotten better since HW's initial launch, but trust me, for a few days to weeks dungeon runs were hell. The only difference now, is they'll be starting at 50 and have even more actions....

And its not just idiots actually, it takes time to learn how to pair actions together in a more productive way. Practice makes perfect, and its generally a lot easier to learn something over time if you break it down into chunks and add-on to what you've learned, rather than handing someone a manual and expecting them to know it all off by heart from front to back after one read. That's where levelling comes in. You start out with a few actions and build your knowledge and skill slowly over time. by the time you reach max level, you should have a pretty darn good idea of what your doing.

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Unfortunately, those types of people are just as likely to get new abilities and not actually read what they do. They aren't going to be anymore arsed to learn than if you simply give them all their abilities. For those wanting to practice, nothing prevents them from going back into old content.

Start a not new job, those tend to start at level 1

People are saying leveling is boring but once u hit Max level ur Just leveling gear I'd much rather level my character than gear

People forget that it's supposed to be about the journey, not the destination. It's like starting a book at the last 2 chapters, or starting a new movie with 20 mins left... so lame

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Originally Posted by Zensho

People forget that it's supposed to be about the journey, not the destination. It's like starting a book at the last 2 chapters, or starting a new movie with 20 mins left... so lame

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And where is this manual of leveling that you've got that says it's about the journey? People have different playstyles, so it's one thing to say that everyone should play that way and question it, and another to say you prefer doing it that way.

I wouldn't argue if we were given a choice on starting level. I mean if it defaults to starting at 50 then just let us gain skills as we would in PotD till we hit 50 then pick it up from there. No story or anything till we hit where its suppose to begin, makes everyone happy I'd think, then perhaps a step further (if possible) then new players who have HW+SB would be able to start on the new jobs as well from 1 (perhaps make it a pre-req to have a character at 50 before you can start there?) but warn them that Redmage or any other job released with SB has no story till level 50.

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Originally Posted by Zensho

People forget that it's supposed to be about the journey, not the destination. It's like starting a book at the last 2 chapters, or starting a new movie with 20 mins left... so lame

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When you've done the journey like 10 times it starts to get old and you just want to get to the destination. It's not like we're brand new players soaking it all in for the first time.

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Originally Posted by Cyrusskorrey

Howdy, simple thought for people to chew.

New jobs and such being added at level 30 and 50.

this is something i like but at the same time. i kinda wish i could choose to start
bare bones at level 1.

I enjoy the grind to 30, and it really helps me get a better feel for a class/job.

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Will never happen for jobs.
Just ask the devs to let the 5.0 jobs start as classes.
Because if a job start at level 1, then where is the reason to skip the class quests?

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Originally Posted by Averax

Start a not new job, those tend to start at level 1

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Every job start at 30. And I still hope that the 4.0 jobs will also start at 30.

I want to point out that saying that jobs shouldn't start at level 1 for reasons that going from 1 to 30 (or 1 to 50) is a long and boring experience... it's an irrelevant point to bring up because time investment is tentative. To give a simplified example, let's say going from 30 to 70 requires 100,000 experience points. Now let's say going from 1 to 70 requires 100,000 experience. See what's being said here? The exp curve can always be adjusted so that the time investment remains roughly the same regardless of starting level. However, only one of these options gives the feeling of truly leveling your character from the ground up.

There is also the rule that "new jobs should start at 30 because all jobs start at 30." That is another point that could very well become irrelevant with their plans to eventually dissolve the class system in 5.0. That's going to mean either every single player starting the game will immediately jump to level 30, which I would rather not see, or we're going to start seeing jobs start at level 1.

Speaking truthfully, I think the real reason we saw Heavensward jobs start at level 30 was because they didn't want to take the time developing quests for those jobs from level 1 to 30 which would be expected. However, technically speaking they could still start at level 1 and SE could choose to not write quests anyway. Similar to how, despite progressing through level 50 as a new job, no quests were written for players to obtain their first set of signature job-specific armor, nor were the armor sets created at all for level 50. So while it is true that people would probably be annoyed by the lack of story content for these new jobs, that in itself isn't enough to justify completely skipping those levels when it isn't a necessity for them to create those quests regardless.

So these are just some logical counterpoints to foreseeable arguments against having jobs start at level 1. I have always been in favor of having the newer, class-less jobs start at level 1 because I consider it to be the proper way to grow your character.

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Originally Posted by Zensho

People forget that it's supposed to be about the journey, not the destination. It's like starting a book at the last 2 chapters, or starting a new movie with 20 mins left... so lame

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But if you have the msq done...the real journey usually tends to begin at level cap. The leveling process itself...that's just the place you wait until you board the plane and start the real adventure.

@ the three ppl that quoted me:

Then SE should sell a level jump 60 or 70 Potion so you don't have to grind, just pay for max level and enjoy. =)

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Originally Posted by Zensho

@ the three ppl that quoted me:

Then SE should sell a level jump 60 or 70 Potion so you don't have to grind, just pay for max level and enjoy. =)

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Or they could sell a level back potion and you could drop down and enjoy :D

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Originally Posted by Zensho

@ the three ppl that quoted me:

Then SE should sell a level jump 60 or 70 Potion so you don't have to grind, just pay for max level and enjoy. =)

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Or better yet! Only queue up for dungeons of the level you wish to play, and you can start way back at level 1 in potd if you wish and go from there. Then you get the content you want, I get the content I want and its a win/win. In this day and age leveling is just redundant and outdated, especially in a game where you can level every job on 1 character.

Or just let SE handle it as they have been doing this whole time.

Leveling from 1-70 should be an optional path that rewards players with a mount, exclusive to the job they've gone through the levels with. Like a nice lovely owl for Astrologian and Ho-oh for Red Mage, because I'm not the creative type.

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Originally Posted by Rennies

Leveling from 1-70 should be an optional path that rewards players with a mount, exclusive to the job they've gone through the levels with. Like a nice lovely owl for Astrologian and Ho-oh for Red Mage, because I'm not the creative type.

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Why does everything have to be rewarded with a mount in this game?

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Originally Posted by Zensho

Why does everything have to be rewarded with a mount in this game?

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What else are they gonna reward us with? Glamour is the only thing that remains relevant in this game. If it isn't an outfit, mount or minion, it's dead 3.5 months after it arrives.

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Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia

Or better yet! Only queue up for dungeons of the level you wish to play, and you can start way back at level 1 in potd if you wish and go from there. Then you get the content you want, I get the content I want and its a win/win. In this day and age leveling is just redundant and outdated, especially in a game where you can level every job on 1 character.

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I've actually done this with floors 20-30's PotD, lvl floor range and spammed fates in a certain level when I am trying out new classes to get the feel for all the abilities.

Why should there be a reward at all for something so silly?

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Originally Posted by Rennies

What else are they gonna reward us with? Glamour is the only thing that remains relevant in this game. If it isn't an outfit, mount or minion, it's dead 3.5 months after it arrives.

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FinalMountXIV

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Originally Posted by Vespar

To each their own, but I will point out that starting at lower level is also helpful for learning actions of the job before throwing a bunch of high level newbs that have no idea what actions do what into a dungeon....

As an example, take Final Fantasy XI, when people figured out they could power level folks from 30-99 in Abyssea. The people who got power leveled had no clue how to play their job and just caused grief and mayhem for the rest of us.

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Not really, from 1-30 and heck even 1-50 and honestly certain jobs change distinctly from 50-60, so to suggest that playing the job from lv 1 somehow teaches you the job better is honestly inaccurate.

From NIN 30-50 you learn how to use jutsu and weave in huton for the reduction in skillspeed meanwhile once you hit 54 you learn a new 3 step combo closer that refreshes 30 seconds to your huton buff as long as it's active up to 70 seconds max changing the way you now use your jutsu to focus more on being pure offensive once you got the first huton off.

BRD/MCH change pretty drastically with their stationary stances forcing them to have to be aware of their position when they attack and to move out of AOE's as needed while potentially losing DPS out of it.

BLM gets 2 new abilities leylines which gives them an extra reason to stay stationary in the location of their choice and enochain which gives them a "huton" like aspect of upkeeping a buff that allows them to use Fire IV as long as they weave back and forth with Blizzard IV to keep Enochain up.

Basically a lot of jobs change the way they play from 50+ and most jobs don't even start til 30+ but even then with NIN it's just "shuriken" every 30 seconds til you get 35 and even then it's a choice between raiton single target or Katon aoe dmg, and with the changes to katon and it's damage potency there is even less thinking if you have least 3 mobs or more in the group.

Overall, it honestly isn't that hard to learn X job and even then, if people reallly want that slow pace of learning the job, just do POTD, yes you level up faster but quite honestly, it's way better to learn the job like that ina quick pace to get a slow ease of each skill then to press 1 til level 5 and then press 1-2 and sometimes 3 til level 10 and then sometimes press 4 but not until 20+ where you might be doing 1-2-3, 4-5 and then back to 1-2-3.

The complexity of the game isn't there at lower levels and it is just smarter for them to cut that unnecessary fat out when introducing a new job. Players aren't learning anything other than how to excel at George Jetson's job of pressing one button.

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Also when it comes to XI, it's skill ceiling was highly different from XIV. in XI you had something called combat and magic skill, so even if you were power leveled to 50, unless you took the time to lv your combat/magic skill you were pretty much as worthless as half that level if not worse. Powerleveling worked with jobs that shared certain combat skills and allowed the player to bypass the long grind to get x job up but even then XI had another gap in skill that required farming and gil to obtain, magic scrolls. So ya, it's true that if I were to start new as a lv 1 WHM and get PL and only PLed to 99 and nothing else, i'd be far behind because I'd have the magic skill of a lv 1 WHM along with 0 spells to actually play my job.

XIV doesn't have this issue so the aspect of starting at X level doesn't effect the game in the same way it effected XI.

The problem with going to lower dungeons is that you'll still be leveling behind the scenes. Now you are learning the actions for levels 1-30 and have these "hidden" 30-40 actions that you'll have to learn when you get to the 30 dungeons. Then by the time you get to 40 dungeons you have level 50+ actions to learn later. Also, about reading tool tips, it's not about reading them. It's more about putting names to actions. You can read all the tool tips you want, but knowing if stun was feather tickle or clobberhead in the middle of a fight could be frustrating.

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Originally Posted by ErryK

I prefer starting closer to cap as it allows me to jump to the most recent endgame as soon as possible. Whether I learn my skills or not is not a result of the job level being closer to cap, but a result of my lack of understanding of said skills, combos and rotations. It's a common misconception that the issue with RDM being 50 is that people don't have enough time to learn their skills, that's incorrect.

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^ this
you really dont need to play 70lvls to learn a job
after all once you hit max level your rotation changes and you gonna learn it again

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Originally Posted by Dat_Jynx

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I think part of this issue is how people think of their abilities.

I couldn't tell you what most of the names are for the abilities on PLD without looking them up, or even describe their icons. But, I can tell you what hotkey on my bar does what, with remarkable detail. I couldn't tell you the name of the GCD stun or what it looks like on the bar, but I can tell you that it's Ctrl+1. People put a lot of effort into learning their spells the wrong way, I think.