"can an ot take my time gate pls" - A12 question

So I'm joining probably some several hundred other procrastinators in farming A12N for my drop tonight and there's a SMN that brought up the title quote which made me scratch my head enough to make this thread.

Said SMN was in mix of Augmented Shire/Alex Savage gear, clearly outgearing me, so I'm wondering is there a reason he could ask for a pass on a supposedly dps-only mechanic? I've never heard of a strat where a dps passes on the timegates on purpose, but I don't spam A12 much either and I've never been in it's Savage counterpart. I know it's possible for OT or healer to jump in one if a dps is dead or whatever extraordinary case, but I've never heard of this.

So as SMN, do I still need to be doing time gates or is this guy/gal on to something I'm not aware of? Funny enough, his request went ignored so me and a monk had to double team the add that was left alone, much to my displeasure.

EDIT: This was brought up at the start of the run, so low MP/weakness/etc wasn't a factor.

Sounds weird. The only reason I could possibly think of off hand could be that said summoner may have been incredibly low on MP for whatever reason. Or recently raised or something to that effect.
outside of that I cant see any reason for them to stay out and deliberately send the off tank in.

There are times where as the off tank I have gone in deliberately. but that is usually for good reasons such as allowing a bard to stay out and toss a ballad on the heals for a minute or something like that. But that's a pretty rare occurance and wouldn't put it as part of a normal strategy.

Some groups have the OT/healer un into the timegate so that a dps can remain outside and continue to the main boss for a quicker kill.

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Originally Posted by Aillith

Some groups have the OT/healer un into the timegate so that a dps can remain outside and continue to the main boss for a quicker kill.

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That seems illogical. Sometimes the dps can be in and out those time gates so quick leaving one out would only result in the other 3 being in there longer.. which would then drag the fight rather than speed it up.

Depending on the timing of DoT refreshes/extensions and DWT, having a SMN go into Time-gate probably loses the least rDPS of any job... If it was a stacked-up Warrior he wanted to take his spot when those timings didn't align, killing it at least as quickly, then maybe, maybe there'd be a decent reason. If PB was down, I'd rather take one for the Monk though, or for a BLM if going in would kill his Enochian sync. But generally the added uptime for one person isn't about to balance out the added wait time for the other 3 time gate participants if the replacement is going to be any slower.

If the OT is Warrior he can and will probably down the add almost as quick as DPS, yes, summoner is pretty good at burst too with Dreadwrym trance but their main source of damage are still dots which still takes time to tick.

It's for dps, if you leave a dps outside the boss will die faster. A war can kill that add fast enough and leaving a dps outside is an overall dps increase.
If I run A12N with my FC or static for drops we will always do this.

Thanks for the replies; that seems to clarify what this SMN was getting at. It's a shame though things fell through and 2 of us had to pick up the slack. Seems like this would be better off as a pre-made/partial premade thing than shoving this off on some random DF group where not everyone would be familiar with this.

Agreed. In random groups I don't even bother with it, I just take my gate. It's really only worth doing this in a premade party, where all members are on the same page and know what to do.

I usually do the weekly a12 with friends and we usually have the 2 melees staying on boss like 100% of the fight, and me (whm) and the warrior go inside the big dark ssphere and spam stone3 like john f madden outta it :D the fight always fnishes quick

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aillith

Some groups have the OT/healer un into the timegate so that a dps can remain outside and continue to the main boss for a quicker kill.

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This is generally how I see it done. Especially when there's a BLM or something that appreciates not moving.

The OT can do that without problems but is it usefull in DF partys? In my oppinion not because when i go in there as OT i do more dps than the so called dps most of the time, if you have a premade group it is different if the people are able to deal dps.

It's a way to gain dps because it takes some time to move to the gate, wait for the teleport, (short) loading time, then doing no dps jumping from platform to platform and waiting to be teleported again.

Add that some jobs like DRG/BLM who need to frequently refresh a buff if they don't want to revert to a lvl 50 rotation, and will lose more dps handling it (think, reseting enochian with 50% MP because you'll lose it if you take the gate without refreshing it before).

So the point of doing that is having "low dps" roles losing dps instead of "high dps" roles, for a faster kill.

Now, that being said, it's something we do on premade (with OT and off-heal), not something I've seen done a lot in DF groups.

As off tank, I pretty much always jump in a timegate, since that would normally be faster over all.

Even as healer I easily do the gate so it is as other point out the DPS on boss and also the transition to into gate/ out of it costs you damage uptime which can matter if you look at your personal output. It really doesnt matter who goes in (or how many if halfway decent dps 2 ppl should suffice) as long as a tank and a healer stay outside.

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Originally Posted by Werhusky

Even as healer I easily do the gate so it is as other point out the DPS on boss and also the transition to into gate/ out of it costs you damage uptime which can matter if you look at your personal output. It really doesnt matter who goes in (or how many if halfway decent dps 2 ppl should suffice) as long as a tank and a healer stay outside.

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I was curious actually just how little it's possible to do the timegates with. That being said, am I "doing it wrong" if I take one of the gates? Generally when it comes to DF I play to the mechanics unless told otherwise, because I have trust issues. So in this case I always take a gate. I'm at ilvl 256 (iirc, mix of Shire and Proto Alex gear with ilvl 260 Sharpened anima weapon).