nobody is concerned mages are losing half their spells?

On thm I count 33 unique spells and on con 44 (not counting multiple tiers) which will be cut down to 15 each. over half the spells gone. so we're losing about 47 spells from the game. Anybody concerned mages might be crippled?

Depends on which ones. I don't care if I lose Repose. I never used it.

The news is a bit surprising, but until we get the actual spell lists, it's a little early to be panicking.

well yes there's some under used ones that nobody will miss but I'm sure with 47 going out the door some of the ones you use might be affected.

It's the same story with DoW, though the numbers aren't quite that drastic. I'm going to assume that some useless abilities will be trashed, and some others might be combined to be made more efficient, etc. Some abilities might even be taken away altogether and given to that class's respective job. Either way, we really can't say anything until the next update that will "detail the concept behind each class and provide a list of the specific actions scheduled for adjustments" is released.

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Originally Posted by Anon

well yes there's some under used ones that nobody will miss but I'm sure with 47 going out the door some of the ones you use might be affected.

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We've known about the upcoming ability overhauls for a long time now. No one should be surprised if the abilities they've grown accustomed to get significant changes.

I have a feeling the elemental spells might be based on the weapon you are using atm, so if you are using a wind club your elemental action will be wind based. If you are a using a weapon with no elemental affinity then you'll fire off a non-elemental attack. The same goes with the DoT attacks like Burn and such, it might be based on the elemental affinity of your weapon though I"m not sure how it would work for a non-elemental DoT lol.

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Originally Posted by Airget

I have a feeling the elemental spells might be based on the weapon you are using atm, so if you are using a wind club your elemental action will be wind based. If you are a using a weapon with no elemental affinity then you'll fire off a non-elemental attack. The same goes with the DoT attacks like Burn and such, it might be based on the elemental affinity of your weapon though I"m not sure how it would work for a non-elemental DoT lol.

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SE should pay you not to give them ideas.

If I understand it correctly, the tiers will be gone from spells -- i.e. no more Fire I, Fire II, etc.
There will just be a single Fire spell and damage will be calculated based on your level.

I'd like to know how they plan to handle MP cost and cast time.
There are instances when I purposely choose to use the lower tier spells because they are slightly faster, use less MP, and are still enough for the situation. This goes for Cure spells as well.

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Originally Posted by Rau

SE should pay you not to give them ideas.

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lol learn to read, I said I have a feeling this is how they'll do it, not how I'd like them to do it. If you think of it logically that's the only way the elemental spells could work, unless you don't mind 6/15 of your spells being elemental damage, then there really isn't much diversity for a mage job now is there.

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Originally Posted by Anon

On thm I count 33 unique spells and on con 44 (not counting multiple tiers) which will be cut down to 15 each. over half the spells gone. so we're losing about 47 spells from the game. Anybody concerned mages might be crippled?

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Mildly concerned. I won't have an opinion until I see the official notes.

I'm pretty concerned about losing all those spells. but at the same time Yoshi-P and the team have been doing pretty good so far. I will wait to see what happens before I shout foul ball on this one.

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Originally Posted by Inaaca

The news is a bit surprising, but until we get the actual spell lists, it's a little early to be panicking.

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The real panic will start Monday or Tuesday when they release the info one which spells will be cut ^^.

You barely used half of your list anyway, in a serious fight, you will probably only use 6-10 actions regularly. Others are luxury.

well we have 30 slots and lv50 is not the final cap and they should not treat it as the final so your losing nothing just have to wait.

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Originally Posted by Anon

On thm I count 33 unique spells and on con 44 (not counting multiple tiers) which will be cut down to 15 each. over half the spells gone. so we're losing about 47 spells from the game. Anybody concerned mages might be crippled?

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Yes they are going to cripple us mages /sarcasm.

I would say that about half of the CNJ spells I don't even use, when was the last time you cast paralyna, silcena etc ?

I'm expecting elemental spells to be removed from CNJ completely, that includes tier 1 and 2, ancient magic, and dots, maybe even shockspikes as it was orginally a blackmage spell in 11 so not sure who will get that one.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Yes they are going to cripple us mages /sarcasm.

I would say that about half of the CNJ spells I don't even use, when was the last time you cast paralyna, silcena etc ?

I'm expecting elemental spells to be removed from CNJ completely, that includes tier 1 and 2, ancient magic, and dots, maybe even shockspikes as it was orginally a blackmage spell in 11 so not sure who will get that one.

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I'm thinking that the only things that really need to remain constant with CNJ and THM is that CNJ is based on the elements and THM is based on light and dark.

Far, far too much lore is wrapped up in those two facts, and these are also the foundations of each class. Supporting this is the fact that Yoshi said there would be ability changes, but the basic fundamentals of each class would remain the same.

meh if we lose anyhting good it'll just go to blm or whm so it'll be alright .... you guys do know jobs will be advanced version of the class yea? meaning the good skills yea? you honestly expect us to keep all our current skills per class and all NEW ones brought in for jobs? lol lol lol

The thing that concerns me is that it's not that we're getting 15 spells, we're getting 15 abilities total. So we still have stuff like Chainspell, Spiritsong, Soughspeak, Roaming soul, etc that I wouldn't like to lose, but just those 4 abilities would cut our number of spells down to 11.

The spells that I think will be a given that will be kept for CNJ are Cure, Curaga, Protect, Shell, Stoneskin, Raise, and Rebirth. That's 7 spells. That'd leave 4 more spells if we just got those abilities.

I just really hope that they don't do something like cutting down all of our abilities now then reintroducing the same abilities they cut as the "job-specific" abilities.

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Originally Posted by Sol_Aureus

The thing that concerns me is that it's not that we're getting 15 spells, we're getting 15 abilities total. So we still have stuff like Chainspell, Spiritsong, Soughspeak, Roaming soul, etc that I wouldn't like to lose, but just those 4 abilities would cut our number of spells down to 11.

The spells that I think will be a given that will be kept for CNJ are Cure, Curaga, Protect, Shell, Stoneskin, Raise, and Rebirth. That's 7 spells. That'd leave 4 more spells if we just got those abilities.

I just really hope that they don't do something like cutting down all of our abilities now then reintroducing the same abilities they cut as the "job-specific" abilities.

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Sadly I think this is what they may do. I could see them removing a hefty amount of the abilities deemed necessary for the main healer role and pushing them over into White Mage, leaving Conjurer in a role that focuses more so on its Elemental Attacks while still having maybe 3-4 abilities making it good enough as a back up healer at best. Although I'd personally like that, I know there are many that don't, so I'll keep my fingers crossed things turn out for the best.

"Fifteen actions and eleven traits will be made available for each class up to level 50" thats straight from the "class reforms" page.


I think CNJ will get: cure, curaga, protect, shell, stoneskin, raise (rebirth might be treated like a tier here). Now there are enough room for the nukes, but after that not enough room for the dot's attached to them, so I'm confused about where they will go with nukes, elemental dots, and AM. now abilities will have to go under reform too, i'm sure we'll at the very least keep exaltation/tranquility, they could take out a lot of spells, maybe even give cnj some spells from thm, split up bio or dia, but they probably won't much at least in my opinion, I don't have verification.

With thm: scourge and banish. Bio and dia. get rid of absorbs but keep drain and siphon mp. keep paralyze, slow, and silence, get rid of bind and blinds (make them better and give them to whm and blm)

for both thm and cnj they will at least retain 1 ws, hopefully give us a new one someday! I'm not sure if they will retain sac for thm either :/ i hope they do for the back up cures. I'd love to keep poison also. There's a lot of spells I'm on with them taking away for now though and trying to make more potent and then giving to blm/whm. Especially bind, blind, and other less used enfeebles and anti enfeebles like the "a's" ex: poisona, AM and the elemental dots could be taken off and give to blm, but I'd like for cnj to retain at least the original nukes.

traits. now i'd love to see traits get a total overall, be more like xi's with Fastcast having tiers traits please instead of just making up 11 traits with 6 of them being useless.

Woh that sounds queer as, glad I'm not a mage or I'd be PISSED! Still sucks big time tho because I would have liked to role mage as well but now I kinda don't feel like it reading about this....

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Originally Posted by Vandark

Woh that sounds queer as, glad I'm not a mage or I'd be PISSED! Still sucks big time tho because I would have liked to role mage as well but now I kinda don't feel like it reading about this....

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Jumping to conclusions much? We haven't even seen the changes that mages are getting yet. All this talk is largely speculation.

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Originally Posted by Sol_Aureus

The thing that concerns me is that it's not that we're getting 15 spells, we're getting 15 abilities total. So we still have stuff like Chainspell, Spiritsong, Soughspeak, Roaming soul, etc that I wouldn't like to lose, but just those 4 abilities would cut our number of spells down to 11.

The spells that I think will be a given that will be kept for CNJ are Cure, Curaga, Protect, Shell, Stoneskin, Raise, and Rebirth. That's 7 spells. That'd leave 4 more spells if we just got those abilities.

I just really hope that they don't do something like cutting down all of our abilities now then reintroducing the same abilities they cut as the "job-specific" abilities.

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thank you; somebody who reasonably shares my concerns.

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Originally Posted by Dalmore

meh if we lose anyhting good it'll just go to blm or whm so it'll be alright .... you guys do know jobs will be advanced version of the class yea? meaning the good skills yea? you honestly expect us to keep all our current skills per class and all NEW ones brought in for jobs? lol lol lol

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I find the problem with this, while I believe that abilities we have on our classes now might be on jobs, we'll have to wait another VU to get those abilities back. Depending on what those abilities are I wonder how things will roll in 1.20.

You know, he was speaking generally for battle classes. I honestly would not be surprised if any elemental spell series was considered one set of spells and learned on the same rank, just as it is now.

Thus all 6 elemental nukes would be 1 level, and all 6 elemental DoTs another level. 2/15.

I don't think nukes will count as 6 individual spells, they will just be categorized as 1. Because you get them all at once at the same level.

Trimming down the fat.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

You know, he was speaking generally for battle classes. I honestly would not be surprised if any elemental spell series was considered one set of spells and learned on the same rank, just as it is now.

Thus all 6 elemental nukes would be 1 level, and all 6 elemental DoTs another level. 2/15.

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Except that all of your main class abilities will be on your bar at all times, and you just took up 12 slots. >_>

It's pretty obvious that elemental spells will have something done to them, but they will still be in the game in some form, as they specifically used Fire as an example of a spell losing it's tiers.

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Originally Posted by Viridiana

Except that all of your main class abilities will be on your bar at all times, and you just took up 12 slots. >_>

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It is likely we will lose the DOTs

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Originally Posted by viion

It is likely we will lose the DOTs

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Okay, even if all 6 nukes count as one "spell," that's still 6 of your slots taken. Then add in the other 14 for the main class and you're at 20. Add in the 10 cross-class abilities and you have 30/30. . . Wait, where do the job abilities come in? >_>

I have a feeling that the spells we will lose will be given back to us in the form of job exclusive spells. I hope I'm wrong.

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Originally Posted by Dalmore

meh if we lose anyhting good it'll just go to blm or whm so it'll be alright .... you guys do know jobs will be advanced version of the class yea? meaning the good skills yea? you honestly expect us to keep all our current skills per class and all NEW ones brought in for jobs? lol lol lol

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This guy has it on the money. Jobs are being reduced to basics, your blm and whm will get the good stuff. Scenario: Well our whm just left, blm you got whm quests done? "Nope." Well guess we gotta look for a whm while we kill things one at a time. Switch to cnj so we can do this.

Everyone needs to quit freaking out, I really think Yoshi and team aren't gonna disembowel some things without knowing what is the intention of what they are producing for us. Really, ctfo.

Not sure entirely what I think yet, mainly because I haven't seen the list. Although I do indeed expect some spells to become job-related due to their party-only qualities, such as Curaga (and don't cry havoc over that - it's not like it actually gets used that often anyway due to the massive aggro it draws, so it's a plausible removal) and the stat-siphons.

Still, withholding judgement for now.

What if Yoshi is trolling us and by "There won't be Fire I II and III anymore!" he means "There will be Fire Firaja and Firagra!"

Either way, I'm not tripping too hard until we see the class list which I really hope we get Monday because it's bugging me to no end lol.


EDIT: I really hope the current "ancient magic" is scrapped, burned, and all records of its existence destroyed. All Youtube videos should also be taken down, those spells are an injustice and should be taken away until SE fixes them to became what ancient magic should be!

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Originally Posted by Airget

I have a feeling the elemental spells might be based on the weapon you are using atm, so if you are using a wind club your elemental action will be wind based. If you are a using a weapon with no elemental affinity then you'll fire off a non-elemental attack. The same goes with the DoT attacks like Burn and such, it might be based on the elemental affinity of your weapon though I"m not sure how it would work for a non-elemental DoT lol.

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I think the CNJ keep his basic elemental spells like fire, water, ice, ...
The elemental DoTs are going to THM
The ancient magic to BLM as quest skills

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Yes they are going to cripple us mages /sarcasm.

I would say that about half of the CNJ spells I don't even use, when was the last time you cast paralyna, silcena etc ?

I'm expecting elemental spells to be removed from CNJ completely, that includes tier 1 and 2, ancient magic, and dots, maybe even shockspikes as it was orginally a blackmage spell in 11 so not sure who will get that one.

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so basicaly your expective conjurers to be left completely defenceless with no real way of doing any damage should they be attacked?

crazy lalafell

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Originally Posted by Secret_Reeve

so basicaly your expective conjurers to be left completely defenceless with no real way of doing any damage should they be attacked?

crazy lalafell

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do you use fire when you solo a lvl 50 mob or instead use fire III?

hmmm i wonder... which one should i use!11!!111!!1111

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Originally Posted by Secret_Reeve

so basicaly your expective conjurers to be left completely defenceless with no real way of doing any damage should they be attacked?

crazy lalafell

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Replaced by a nuke or two with general uses instead of a million situationally used spells (at best).

A fast mediocre nuke, a stronger medium cast time/MP cost nuke, a DoT and a strongest high MP/enmity low cast time nuke ("AM"). There's your CNJ in four actions that will always have a use, to be comboed to create different effects.